The Holy Spirit convicts of sin

[Willie-T]

Yes, I agree. I don't hold it against them. I don't hate them, even though I have had to avoid them for now.

Do you know, you've hit on what my problem is in not being able to say, I am the righteousness of God. It sounds and seems to me like I would be equating myself with God. Reading where you said you don't equate yourself with Jesus made it clear to me why I couldn't say it...

Yes, I think the key is in real and understanding all the words in that passage.

"I AM the righteousness of God".... WHY? because I have chosen to be....... "in Christ Jesus." On my own, by the 'works' some of these guys are convinced are the way.... it could NEVER happen.
Jesus invited me to come join Him, and to "be, in this world, as He is." That's pretty cool. I don't have a prayer of ever achieving anything like that on my own. I just ride His coat-tails because He asked me to.

 

[Ariel82]

Lol though I love our story time, I need some sleep. God bless and keep you.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I have just...been so happy to talk with you guys here tonight!
It is always a blessing to talk without anger and viciousness and to be blessed so much by you guys!
Bedtime here. Thank you all!

 

[Willie-T]

Yeah, shower time for me, too.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Gosh, how MUCH of Heaven you could have right now..... if only you would let yourself.

That's the problem with mystical/gnostic approaches to GOD. They are based on personal experiences that cannot be communicated to other people to show them the way. Only vague appeals to do something they are not doing. That's why doctrine is so important. Combined with the witness of the spirit, it shows the way. The word is a lamp.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

BTW, don't hold it against some of these guys for the vile things they call me. Ten years ago, I would have been right beside them, throwing rocks at someone who said some of the things that I do.

They don't understand, and I understand that they can't, and won't, unless the Holy spirit leads them out of that same religious prison I was in. I certainly don't equate myself with Jesus, but He explained it well when He said, "They don't know what they are doing."

I doubt the ones that you are referring to are in the religious prison you were in. I know I never have been.

 

[fredoheaven]

John 16:8And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
John 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
John 16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.
John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
John 8:9 And they which heard it, being convicted [SUP]G1651[/SUP] by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst
Ephesians 5:13 But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.

Nothing is said that the Holy Spirit convicts a believer of his sins. The Holy Spirit does the reproving to the unbelieving world or ppl, Reprove or reproving simply means “to bring to light”(Ephesians 5:13) or “shew things” as in John 16:13.

Thus, the Holy Spirit “brings to light” the sin in the unbelieving world as in John 16:9 and are “brought to light” through the enlightening of Christ’s words and “convicted by their own conscience” as in John 8:9. Next, the believers are also brought to light of righteousness of Christ on how to walk their talk, obey and fulfill Christ’s words. The Holy Spirit now works to the believers through comfort rather than convict. Also, the Holy Spirit, “brings to light” the works of Satan. The works of the prince of this world is thus judged when it is exposed to light.

 

[ladylynn]

Why do you have to continually do this proselytizing with copy/pastes from that website? Why don't you communicate from what's inside you?

LOL When someone shares their "personal experiences" too much., others say "you don't use Scripture!!"
Can't win for tryin! I think personal testimonies are great at times and are appropriate too., but everyone has a personal story.

I do hope Grace777 does not stop posting the resources since they offer the MANY verses and attack the topic with the hard questions we ask as well as the MANY Bible answers we need and are looking for. The websites allow time to read the whole question along with the other related questions all in one place and the reason for the answer they give.

I've read (many) of Grace777's personal testimonies and appreciate them. But I appreciate more the hard questions asked and the solid Bible verses in answer on these copy/paste websites. Also, it is extremely interesting that these hard and major questions that are coming up on CC are the very questions that are being tackled out there beyond these "boarders of CC" I just wish more people would read the answers given and not just skim quickly without really reading.

Not only that, but I also appreciate the time it takes to research these sites that when people like Grace777 do put them up., they know what they put up here will be picked apart to the detail and they must know what they are putting their stamp of approval on before posting it. So it takes a lot of time to put up the website since research had to be done before doing so.

If the site gets looked at and found to be unreliable., than the one who posted it will be less trusted the next time he or she says something. Also, the word "proselytizing" is not what is being done here. That sounds "Catholic" (were you once a Catholic HRFTD?) Sharing Bible truth is not "proselytizing" ...pllleeeaasssee.

Thank You Lord for cutting and pasting!!

 

[crossnote]

The holy spirit convicts the world of sin

And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: John 16:8​

Jesus through the holy spirit convicts believers of their sin

As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Revelation 3:19​

Reprove and rebuke in the verses above are the same word. Sometimes it's translated convict, convince...

Reprove/Rebuke
G1651 ἐλέγχω elegcho (el-eng'-kho) v.
1. to confute, admonish

Reprove? Rebuke? Chasten? Repent? Oh, that wasn't followed up with, "remember your righteous in me"?

 

[ladylynn]

You guys did more than I thought you would, with only *Stunnedbygrace* getting close. LOL

In your rush to show the pretty damning legal derivative of convicting, rebuking, and refuting, etc., you totally missed the fact that that same, one, single word is used in that passage to describe how "righteousness" is also handled. Are we, then, "rebuked" and "refuted" for being the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus?

It would seem so Willie.

 

[crossnote]

Personally, I don't like it because it's unending spamming. It's just the same things over and over and over again every day for the past 6 months. And they're not your ideas - they're someone elses.

Agreed. This is Bible Discussion Forum not Bible Video Forum...But hey, everyone else does it, so why not me?

 

[Magenta]

It would seem so Willie.

God chastens and scourges those He loves. Is that what you mean?

 

[ladylynn]

Hi Ariel,

It's ok if you don't read them - I understand. I have had many people Pm me and thank me for those articles and videos as it has helped them to grow in the Lord. Because of that I will continue to post them but I do understand if some people do not want to read them. No problem!....

I read many of them so please don't stop posting them! I understand some people don't read them but I do and so do other people. The verses and the context are both together and the message hasn't gotten lost in all the arguing that goes on here. I can get a good answer to one question at a time without them going off into 10 other questions that have not been answered to my satisfaction. So the different websites you post have helped me and given me a resource to re use when I'm not here on CC.

 

[crossnote]

I think people know why you don't like them because they do often refute your beliefs and it bothers you and I do understand how that can be troubling.

It's ok....just don't look at them and ignore them. It's really no problem. They are really not for you as you well know but for those viewers that are interested in them as they have a grace-based view of different subjects. As I say - many have PM-ed me to thank me for them so they are helping others.

You keep saying this, proves little...

Matthew 5:11 KJVS
[11] Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you , and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Luke 6:22 KJVS
[22] Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company , and shall reproach you , and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.



Luke 6:26 KJVS
[26] Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.

 

[crossnote]

1 Corinthians 5:1-6 KJVS
[1] It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. [2] And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. [3] For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, [4] In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, [5] To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. [6] Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?

The above would never be dreamed of in most 'tolerant' Churches today. Such mean spirited is Paul.(vs. 4&5)

But wait, below we see God's heart and purpose for conviction and chastisement...to restore such a one into fellowship.

2 Corinthians 2:6-9 KJVS
[6] Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many. [7] So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him , and comfort him , lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow. [8] Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him. [9] For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things.

I'm sorry for those of you that have had a highly legalistic religious upbringing.(I had none.) But the caution is don't swing the pendulum to the opposite extreme by pushing for unbridled permissiveness by a made up Santa Claus type God.

 

[JennaLeanne]

Hey everyone, Just had a read through and again it's another battle over grace vs sin.. One thing I cannot understand is why why why are you so "sin" focused? It's almost like some of u love to preach chastisement.. Love to preach about the father being a harsh task master.. Love to preach sin sin sin.. I mean why ? We are either dead to sin and alive to God in Christ or we are not? We are either born anew into Christ with the gift of his righteousness or we are still the sons of disobedience? Can we be half sin by nature and half Jesus by nature or is it one or the other? What else could we with our righteousness ad filthy rags possibly "do"?

Ya know if you have a mindset that says u must u must u must then you will definetly have a spirit of criticsm towards others.. I used to more than anyone on here.. If we have the revelation of his righteousness the the spirit of humility is visible.. I pray each one of us on this thread will know the truth that sets them free.. Bless u all xx

 

[PeterJens]

A lot of discussion - that is a good thing.

The reason I wrote this op, was a simple one. EG had said I was lying about hyper-grace people believing the Holy Spirit does not convict about sin. He claimed grace7x77 had refuted this.

As I suspected people hold different views on the subject, and Paul Ellis is sure the Holy Spirit does not convict about sin.
For me its like saying a parent never tells a child off. What is always true is levels of correction happen, but things like "never" are absolutes which mainly are inappropriate and provocative.

I am not into point scoring, but when someone calls me a liar, and liar will not enter heaven, I think it is important to show the truth. People often talk about grace, yet are not prepared to give someone the grace that they do have integrity and are speaking the truth.

I am not saying any of you have or have not a valid experience of God. That is not my place or wisdom.
All I can do is point out sin, real sin, sin that breaks relationships and is a stain on someones life.

So thankyou for your blessing, Amen and Praise the Lord

 

[PeterJens]

BTW, don't hold it against some of these guys for the vile things they call me. Ten years ago, I would have been right beside them, throwing rocks at someone who said some of the things that I do.

They don't understand, and I understand that they can't, and won't, unless the Holy spirit leads them out of that same religious prison I was in. I certainly don't equate myself with Jesus, but He explained it well when He said, "They don't know what they are doing."

This may sound wrong, I hope not. Emotions are strange things. We can get an insight into something, think the world is a particular way, get the emotional rush that confirms we have got it 100% correct.

The problem is it is just in our own world. It might be true or just an LSD trip. As soon as we start limiting everybodies elses experience and understanding to our own, we have lost it.

Meet someone who has been attacked and almost murdered by their partner. Meet a soldier suffering from PTSD. Meet a psychopath who has no empathy but can manipulate. Meet an autistic person trapped in their routine. Meet a bipolar sufferer when they are high or low. Meet a psychotic person with an episode of persecution. The balance of perceptions and experience are unique to that individual. You can with time get to mimic some of what is going on, but it is just that, a mimic.

If you spend a lifetime trying to please God in everything you do, it becomes who you are. One day you wake up and realise God loves you. It does not mean everyone is like you were, and the only true perspective is where you are now. It is just another episode in your life. I am no different. What is happening to me is the best thing ever, and I have seen the universe and it will change everything. Except it is just another step on the walk, and it is important, but only in the eternal context of everything which is far larger and wonderful that I can grasp.

In all relationships we hurt each other and encourage each other. Without sensitivity there is no relationship. And with God the Holy Spirit guides us and convicts us, but mainly encourages us. Why does it need to be more complex or distorted?

 

[JennaLeanne]

A lot of discussion - that is a good thing.

The reason I wrote this op, was a simple one. EG had said I was lying about hyper-grace people believing the Holy Spirit does not convict about sin. He claimed grace7x77 had refuted this.

As I suspected people hold different views on the subject, and Paul Ellis is sure the Holy Spirit does not convict about sin.
For me its like saying a parent never tells a child off. What is always true is levels of correction happen, but things like "never" are absolutes which mainly are inappropriate and provocative.

I am not into point scoring, but when someone calls me a liar, and liar will not enter heaven, I think it is important to show the truth. People often talk about grace, yet are not prepared to give someone the grace that they do have integrity and are speaking the truth.

I am not saying any of you have or have not a valid experience of God. That is not my place or wisdom.
All I can do is point out sin, real sin, sin that breaks relationships and is a stain on someones life.

So thankyou for your blessing, Amen and Praise the Lord

Okay.. I understand what you are trying to say.. But it isn't our job to point out sin but point people to the one who died for it.. The more we know our righteousness in him the less sin is.. dya know what I mean ?

The focus of sin is death.. The focus on Jesus is life and peace Bless u xx

 

[PeterJens]

"Yeah, Bible College had me "believing" so much foolishness, that I almost lost sight of what "belief" really is." Willie-T on thread WOF heresy

I wanted to make a simple point. I am sometimes tempted to call people foolish. I have used the word stupid, because for me that means they ignore some simple relationships that they should not.

Once you call follower of Jesus foolish or teaching foolishness you have forgotton the words of Jesus

But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.
Matt 5:22

No brother or sister is a fool, else you make yourself an enemy of Christ. People are miss-guided though with a good heart. I have met many like this. As someone pointed out we are not called sheep for no reason. There is a trick of the enemy to confuse people into rebellion but dress it up differently.

Why did the people of Israel get rejected when they did not respond in faith to spies who said the country was full of giants? Once they realised they had sinned they got up and went to war, but it was too late.

In all your lives God will ask you to follow Him and put you in situations where there is a road. This road is life and death.

Do not think this is a minor issue, or something that is just a slip here or there. It defines who you are and your allegiance.
What value are you if you only think it is a club you can join or jump out of whenever the fancy takes you?

You are not earning salvation but you claim you love God above everything. But do you? Do you know who and what you are and who and what God is?