THE LIE IN LORDSHIP SALVATION THEORY

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Mar 14, 2011
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I think people need to realise that there are moderates and extremes from all sides. (One could say there are moderate calvinists and extreme?) If you try to put a whole group of people because a few of them seem or appear to say something, you risk endangering your own believability, and if you insist on continuing, then even when the moderates who do not say or even think of what your accusing of tells you so, you can not believe it, because you are so sure you are right,

whats funny is we now have a calvinist making this mistake About non calvinists, and a non Calvinist making this mistake about calvinist,

it’s like a big circle. When you think your right, and are proud. No one can convince you, you know what the other person believes better than they do, then get mad when people try to point that out to you
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
I just meant in terms of sanctification. That its not just passive effort is required . /_/
Regeneration is a momentary act, bringing a person from spiritual death to life. It is exclusively God’s work. Sanctification is an ongoing process, dependent on God’s continuing action in the believer, and consisting of the believer’s continuous struggle against sin. God’s method of sanctification is neither activism (self-reliant activity) nor apathy (God-reliant passivity), but human effort dependent on God ///
R c sproul.
Then we could ask what if a person does not do the above ? They will have to say they were never truly saved .[/QUOTE
Yes I see what you mean.... R C Sproul one of the greats of Calvinism
Interesting, R C Sproul highly revered for sure...he sure does not understand sanctification.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I just meant in terms of sanctification. That its not just passive effort is required . /_/
Regeneration is a momentary act, bringing a person from spiritual death to life. It is exclusively God’s work. Sanctification is an ongoing process, dependent on God’s continuing action in the believer, and consisting of the believer’s continuous struggle against sin. God’s method of sanctification is neither activism (self-reliant activity) nor apathy (God-reliant passivity), but human effort dependent on God ///
R c sproul.
Then we could ask what if a person does not do the above ? They will have to say they were never truly saved .
we may ask it. But if we assume it to be true without actually knowing we are in error and trying to place on an individual something which is not true

If our hatred of a group is that deep. I suggest we walk away because
Nothing good can come if it. We Will
Continue to see things that are not there and Make up things which are not there in turn making our own reputation in question
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
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we may ask it. But if we assume it to be true without actually knowing we are in error and trying to place on an individual something which is not true

If our hatred of a group is that deep. I suggest we walk away because
Nothing good can come if it. We Will
Continue to see things that are not there and Make up things which are not there in turn making our own reputation in question
We should rather teach the truth of the bible and not hate the person who may be deceived. Of course I believe Calvinism is unbiblical but I don't hate anyone .
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
We should rather teach the truth of the bible and not hate the person who may be deceived. Of course I believe Calvinism is unbiblical but I don't hate anyone .
Amen .... accusing of hate is a spurious false accusation.
And yes Calvinism is wrong ... a thin veneer of what sounds right covers up all that is wrong from start to finish.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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We should rather teach the truth of the bible and not hate the person who may be deceived. Of course I believe Calvinism is unbiblical but I don't hate anyone .
Then why would you accuse them of something that most do not believe in? I can not fathom any other reason

Just because you THINK they all do does not make it true and to call them deceived? Well who is decieved? Would it Not be the one who galaxy accuses?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
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Then why would you accuse them of something that most do not believe in? I can not fathom any other reason

Just because you THINK they all do does not make it true and to call them deceived? Well who is decieved? Would it Not be the one who galaxy accuses?
Thats not hating . That would be a misunderstanding .
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Thats not hating . That would be a misunderstanding .
It’s a misunderstanding when you are unsure
when you are told by a few people and even one who you are accusing yet still insist. Then it’s more that just a misunderstanding
 

throughfaith

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Aug 4, 2020
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It’s a misunderstanding when you are unsure
when you are told by a few people and even one who you are accusing yet still insist. Then it’s more that just a misunderstanding
Your kinda being slightly dramatic here my friend . The topic was about Lordship salvation and thats my take on it . Its ok to disagree .
.
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Your kinda being slightly dramatic here my friend . The topic was about Lordship salvation and thats my take on it . Its ok to disagree .
.
Calvinism is very divisive another person mentioned this on a different thread.
It is indeed and I read up on why and now see it is true.
JW's and Mormons do not infiltrate our churches... the teachers of Calvinism do.
 

throughfaith

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Aug 4, 2020
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I see his queen is right by his side praising everything he does

Lol. It’s preacher and JR in reverse
Calvinism is very divisive another person mentioned this on a different thread.
It is indeed and I read up on why and now see it is true.
JW's and Mormons do not infiltrate our churches... the teachers of Calvinism do.
Absolutely. They are up front about being different to christians .
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Absolutely. They are up front about being different to christians .
Thank you ... I was immersed in it so I know, mostly the "T" and the "P" of the dogma

And quite honestly the doctrine of "perseverance of the saints" and how they expound on it, is the most harmful because it reads okay until one really understands the doctrine of Justification and Sanctification.
 
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lenna

Guest
Of course they are . Have you listened to John Piper?
I'm waiting for the Calvinist to say otherwise ?
you do come across as somewhat arrogant and I am probably not the first person to tell you that

I don't care, actually, how much you think you know. What Calvinists teach here is that you cannot be lost and that is what you find when you do research on the TULIP acronym


P - Preservation of the Saints
The last of the five points of Calvinism teaches that God preserves His people so they can never be lost. To put it simply, it means this: "Once you are saved, you are always saved."

God's Word is full of proof for this beautiful truth. And though many deny it, and tell you that you can be lost and saved many, many times, and therefore can never be sure of your salvation, the Bible says otherwise. Talking about His elect sheep, Jesus said: "And I give them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand" (John 10:28). See John 6:39, 17:2, 11,12; Romans 8:37-39; II Tim. 1:12; 4:18, etc. etc.

Some object to this doctrine because it supposedly makes men "carnally secure" in their salvation. That is, if I know nothing can make me go to hell once God has saved me, I will "live like the devil." There have been some who have used this beautiful truth as an excuse to live like the devil. But they are not Christians. Nor do they understand this truth. Because this truth also implies "PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS." Those who never fall away are saints. They are holy. And they are given power to live holy lives. They "continue in well-doing." Anyone who says he can "live like the devil" has not experienced the saving power of Christ and does not know the meaning of Philippians 1:6, "He that hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ." God will continue working good works in us until Christ returns. Don't think otherwise.

Is there any hope for Christians without this doctrine? We don't need to be "scared to heaven." We need comfort. Because we know that if it were up to the Christian to remain saved, he would never be able to do it. You know yourself!!!! There is no power in me apart from God's grace. Rev. Barry Gritters


Even when the P is interpreted as perseverance rather than preservation, it is STILL meant as OSAS. Following is from THE CALVINIST CORNER, written by and for Calvinists.


Perseverance of the Saints:
You cannot lose your salvation. Because the Father has elected, the Son has redeemed, and the Holy Spirit has applied salvation, those thus saved are eternally secure. They are eternally secure in Christ. Some of the verses for this position are John 10:27-28 where Jesus said His sheep will never perish; John 6:47 where salvation is described as everlasting life; Romans 8:1 where it is said we have passed out of judgment; 1 Corinthians 10:13 where God promises to never let us be tempted beyond what we can handle; and Phil. 1:6 where God is the one being faithful to perfect us until the day of Jesus’ return.
 
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lenna

Guest
yup they are . Then why is Lordship salvation mostly connected to Calvinism. I don't think the penny's dropped for you yet . Think about it . why is Calvinism banging on about perseverance if they are the 'elect '..The elect a
Show me a Calvinst who doesn't believe that they have to endure to the end to be saved . What do you think Perseverence of the saints is ? ( or preservation of the saints as some prefer )

Grandpa is a Calvinist and he agreed with my statement

You are so busy telling people what they believe you don't listen when they tell you what they actually believe

maybe close the mouth and open the ears. yeah. that is me being sarcastic and no wonder at this point with your ridiculous replies