The Parable of the Ten Virgins Explained

[Lafftur]

You seem to forget that the real Apostle - Paul - who wrote "there is no male or female" also wrote:
Now I praise you, brethren, that you remember me in all things and keep the traditions just as I delivered them to you.
3But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. 4Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonors his head. 5But every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head, for that is one and the same as if her head were shaved. 6For if a woman is not covered, let her also be shorn. But if it is shameful for a woman to be shorn or shaved, let her be covered. 7For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man.
For man is not from woman, but woman from man.
Nor was man created for the woman, but woman for the man.
For this reason the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.


The LORD never chose a woman to be a 'Apostlet' - this would be contrary to Scripture from Genesis to Revelation.
Women are never to ursup authority over a man in the Church as this would be a repeat of the Serpent in the Garden.
When we put off these bodies there will be no male and female - but not until then and only then.
There is no such thing as a woman Pastor - this is sin and confusion.
A woman can be a Shepherdess and a Prophetess and is always to be clearly known as a woman/female affirmation in title.

The fact that there is such rebellion in Christianity today is another clear sign of the spirit of antichrist and the falling away.

For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.

Satan knew exactly who to target in the Garden and we see her again riding the Dragon in Revelation.

Stay close to your husband - he is your protection and Christ is well pleased with this.

Tell me what the Holy Spirit has shown you concerning….

For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:26-28 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Galatians 3:26-28&version=NKJV

 

[Amanuensis]

I have already proven that the two trumpets written about are the one and only last trump. "last trump" is as last of 7 trumps, when sounded signals the second coming. It's obviously two references to the same trumpet. Your disagreement is irrelevant.

And please understand. I am not trying to attack you or be mean or argue. I am trying to engage you in intellectual break down of the possible interpretation of what Paul would have expected the Corinthians to have understood him to be referring to.

It is more natural, intuitive idea that we would expect this to be something referenced in the OT and not a brand new never before heard of "last trumpet" revelation that was Paul's personal understanding but not known to his readers or he would have explained where he got the information and what it meant. Without that explanation most people who read it would think.. "they must know what he is referring to" and if so.. "it is probably something well known in prophecy" and then we should look back at the OT and see if we can find it.

I will present some ideas that he was probably referencing later if I think it will do any good. I won't waste my time if no one cares to hear it.

 

[iTheophilus]

And please understand. I am not trying to attack you or be mean or argue. I am trying to engage you in intellectual break down of the possible interpretation of what Paul would have expected the Corinthians to have understood him to be referring to.

It is more natural, intuitive idea that we would expect this to be something referenced in the OT and not a brand new never before heard of "last trumpet" revelation that was Paul's personal understanding but not known to his readers or he would have explained where he got the information and what it meant. Without that explanation most people who read it would think.. "they must know what he is referring to" and if so.. "it is probably something well known in prophecy" and then we should look back at the OT and see if we can find it.

I will present some ideas that he was probably referencing later if I think it will do any good. I won't waste my time if no one cares to hear it.

Are you saying that the 7th trumpet is not the last?

 

[Amanuensis]

Are you saying that the 7th trumpet is not the last?

I am saying that it would impossible for Paul to have had that in mind. Revelation would not be written for another 40 years. (or 20 if you believed in an earlier date for Rev) Therefore it is not possible that Corinthians when they read the letter would have had any knowledge of the Revelation trumpets and therefore could not have understood it this way. Paul had something else in mind when he said Last Trump and not the trumpets of Revelation yet to be written.

 

[ewq1938]

It is more natural, intuitive idea that we would expect this to be something referenced in the OT and not a brand new never before heard of "last trumpet" revelation that was Paul's personal understanding but not known to his readers or he would have explained where he got the information and what it meant.

What Paul wrote about is only relevant to who will be alive when that last trumpet sounds. The people his day were not going to ever hear that trump while alive so they didn't need to understand it. Paul wrote of man we commonly call Antichrist long before John wrote of same figure in book of Revelation. Writing about the 7th trump by itself as the "last trump" is not odd in the slightest. In fact, many things found in Revelation were actually written about before that book was written. The great tribulation, saints being killed, the AC, rapture, resurrection and last trump...

 

[ewq1938]

I am saying that it would impossible for Paul to have had that in mind. Revelation would not be written for another 40 years.

This makes no sense. Christ taught Paul about future events and Christ also would do the same for John. Of course Paul could know something about the trumps, especially his focus on last trump, before John did.

 

[Amanuensis]

What Paul wrote about is only relevant to who will be alive when that last trumpet sounds. The people his day were not going to ever hear that trump while alive so they didn't need to understand it. Paul wrote of man we commonly call Antichrist long before John wrote of same figure in book of Revelation. Writing about the 7th trump by itself as the "last trump" is not odd in the slightest. In fact, many things found in Revelation were actually written about before that book was written. The great tribulation, saints being killed, the AC, rapture, resurrection and last trump...

Yes many things in Revelation are references from the prophets of the OT. If Paul had an understanding about a last trump he probably got it from the same place he got the revelation about the Voice of the Archangel. Something from the OT prophets.

And Paul did expect his readers to understand what he was referring to and Paul did expect his readers to possibly be among those who were alive at the parousia and possibly even himself since he said "we which are alive... will be changed" It did not turn out that way but nevertheless we also live in expectation that we will be "we which are alive" and every generation is to live in expectation.

However, the Voice of the Archangel and the Last Trump will be heard by all those raised from the dead and also those changed in the twinkling of an eye who are alive. Both groups will hear. They will also hear the Voice of the Son of God. John 5:28“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29and come out

So it is not just for those who are alive that the reference of a Voice of an Archangel and a Last Trump is made in connection with the second coming, it is a promise for the dead in Christ AND those who are alive when it occurs. It is not with just physical ears that they will hear it but even the dead will hear it and be raised.

 

[Amanuensis]

This makes no sense. Christ taught Paul about future events and Christ also would do the same for John. Of course Paul could know something about the trumps, especially his focus on last trump, before John did.

We should be paying attention to what Paul said he knew not what we imagine that he might have known.

To imagine that Paul had the same visions of 7 trumpets before John did is an imagination that has no scripture to support it. It is not even fair to Paul to suggest it.

We can only know what revelation Paul had received by what he tells us. Paul was quite articulate and verbose about teaching the revelation that God had given him. Paul referenced OT scriptures constantly and interpreted them in the light of Jesus. Using all of the other examples of referencing OT scriptures that Paul gives we should be looking for this one about the "Last Trump" in the OT and not in Revelation which was yet to be written. As I already mentioned, it will probably be found in the same book where the voice of the Archangel is referenced. Wouldn't that make better sense? This would be something that the Corinthians who read the scriptures would be able to understand.

 

[ewq1938]

It is not with just physical ears that they will hear it but even the dead will hear it and be raised.

Yeah, I already covered that.

"The people his day were not going to ever hear that trump while alive so they didn't need to understand it. "

 

[ewq1938]

To imagine that Paul had the same visions of 7 trumpets before John did is an imagination that has no scripture to support it. It is not even fair to Paul to suggest it.

I didn't say he was given knowledge of first 6 trumps. He was given knowledge of 7th trump which is last trump and what Paul said about what happens is exactly what happens at the 7th trump.

John's 7th trump is exactly the same trump as Paul's last trump.

The second coming, the resurrection of the dead, and the rapture all happen when that trump sounds.

 

[Amanuensis]

Yeah, I already covered that.

"The people his day were not going to ever hear that trump while alive so they didn't need to understand it. "

I think at this point... when you suggest that Paul wrote something to the Corinthians that they were not supposed to understand.. .you have made a complete train wreck out of your methods of interpretation and have violated all agreed upon rules of hermeneutics accepted by intellectually honest biblical scholars from the dawn of Christendom.

If that is the path you plan to stay on (Paul wrote things to churches that he did not expect them to understand) then there is really no way for you to ever use the rule "what did his readers understand when he wrote that" as a method of discovering correct authorial intent which is the brass ring of exegesis.

You are lost in a sea of making up your own ideas as to the intent since you cannot use the rule "what did they think when they read it rule" Really any interpretation you imagine could be used because Paul never expected anyone but you to get it anyway. See where this leads?

 

[Amanuensis]

I didn't say he was given knowledge of first 6 trumps. He was given knowledge of 7th trump which is last trump and what Paul said about what happens is exactly what happens at the 7th trump.

John's 7th trump is exactly the same trump as Paul's last trump.

The second coming, the resurrection of the dead, and the rapture all happen when that trump sounds.

Unless..... The Trump Paul is referring to is not the same kind of Trumpet John saw in his vision. You are assuming that it is. What if Paul was talking about something different. A definition of the Trump Paul is referring to is in order. What is this "Trump" and what is the original Greek, where is it referenced in the OT and what did it mean in that setting. What is the voice of the Archangel and where is that in the OT. What did God say about the coming of Christ in the OT that matches these things? That is where I would look first before I would assume he was talking about the trumpets in the book of Revelation or before I would assume that what John saw when he saw trumpets was applicable to what Paul meant when he said Last Trump. Johns Trumpets were in a series with bowls, seals, etc. and seem to be of a different sort that what Paul was talking about.

Could this be what he was talking about?...
Isaiah 27:12,13

12 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall beat off from the channel of the river unto the stream of Egypt, and ye shall be gathered one by one, O ye children of Israel. 13 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the great trumpet shall be blown, and they shall come which were ready to perish in the land of Assyria, and the outcasts in the land of Egypt, and shall worship the LORD in the holy mount at Jerusalem.

 

[ewq1938]

I think at this point... when you suggest that Paul wrote something to the Corinthians that they were not supposed to understand.

They wouldn't live to see it so how can they understand it? It wouldn't ever apply to them. I infer you are suggesting he was speaking of some kind of trumpet they would understand in lives but that isn't the kind trumpet he is talking about. Stop talking about trainwrecks when you don't even understand that last trump is the 7th trump.

 

[Amanuensis]

I didn't say he was given knowledge of first 6 trumps. He was given knowledge of 7th trump which is last trump and what Paul said about what happens is exactly what happens at the 7th trump.

John's 7th trump is exactly the same trump as Paul's last trump.

The second coming, the resurrection of the dead, and the rapture all happen when that trump sounds.

Daniel 12:1,2

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.


Could this be what he was talking about?... Along with many other verses such as the ones below. So that he was talking about the fact that the scriptures reference a trumpet blast in the day of the promised resurrection?

Not the same subject as the individual trumpets of Rev which are equal to seven seals, bowls etc as a means of revealing a series of judgments upon the earth in the final day of wrath.

Isaiah 27:12,13

12 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall beat off from the channel of the river unto the stream of Egypt, and ye shall be gathered one by one, O ye children of Israel. 13 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the great trumpet shall be blown, and they shall come which were ready to perish in the land of Assyria, and the outcasts in the land of Egypt, and shall worship the LORD in the holy mount at Jerusalem.

Psalm 50:3-5

3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him. 4 He shall call to the heavens from above, and to the earth, that he may judge his people. 5 Gather my saints together unto me; those that have made a covenant with me by sacrifice.


Psalm 47:5
5God has gone up with a shout,
the LORD with the sound of a trumpet.
6Sing praises to God, sing praises!
Sing praises to our King, sing praises!
7For God is the King of all the earth;
sing praises with a psalm!a

8God reigns over the nations;
God sits on his holy throne.
9The princes of the peoples gather
as the people of the God of Abraham.
For the shields of the earth belong to God;
he is highly exalted!

Zeph 1:16
14The great day of the LORD is near,
near and hastening fast;
the sound of the day of the LORD is bitter;
the mighty man cries aloud there.
15A day of wrath is that day,
a day of distress and anguish,
a day of ruin and devastation,
a day of darkness and gloom,
a day of clouds and thick darkness,
16a day of trumpet blast and battle cry
against the fortified cities
and against the lofty battlements.

Zech 9:14
14Then the LORD will appear over them,
and his arrow will go forth like lightning;
the Lord GOD will sound the trumpet
and will march forth in the whirlwinds of the south.
15The LORD of hosts will protect them,
and they shall devour, and tread down the sling stones,
and they shall drink and roar as if drunk with wine,
and be full like a bowl,
drenched like the corners of the altar.
16On that day the LORD their God will save them,
as the flock of his people;
for like the jewels of a crown
they shall shine on his land.

Matt 24:31
31And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

And so Jesus is also declaring something referenced in the prophets but Jesus gives a clearer proclamation.
I believe Paul was talking about a general understanding of final Trump in the day of the Lord and a Shout that included Michael standing up and that these ideas that they were taught were familiar to them and had nothing to do with the 7 trumpets in Revelation which was yet to be written and which trumpets are used in the same way as the vials/bowls, and seals to reveal judgments being released on the earth and not a reference to the Final Trump of the resurrection that Paul was getting from OT verses.

That to me is a safer hermeneutic than referencing the 7th trumpet in Revelation as being what Paul intended when he said the Last Trump.

 

[ewq1938]

Unless..... The Trump Paul is referring to is not the same kind of Trumpet John saw in his vision. You are assuming that it is. What if Paul was talking about something different. A definition of the Trump Paul is referring to is in order. What is this "Trump" and what is the original Greek, where is it referenced in the OT and what did it mean in that setting. What is the voice of the Archangel and where is that in the OT. What did God say about the coming of Christ in the OT that matches these things? That is where I would look first before I would assume he was talking about the trumpets in the book of Revelation or before I would assume that what John saw when he saw trumpets was applicable to what Paul meant when he said Last Trump. Johns Trumpets were in a series with bowls, seals, etc. and seem to be of a different sort that what Paul was talking about.

Could this be what he was talking about?

No. The last and 7th trump is when the second coming happens, and the dead rise and the living are changed and raptured.

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Appearing the second time is what happens at the 7th trump. One must familiar with and be able to take all these scriptures to form a complete picture of what happens at what timeframe.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

All that is in red are the same things being described.

 

[DavidTree]

Tell me what the Holy Spirit has shown you concerning….

For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:26-28 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Galatians 3:26-28&version=NKJV

One of my favorite scriptures is 1 John 3:1-3
Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called sons of God! Therefore the world does not know us, because it did not know Him. Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.

Right now you are a woman and as a woman there are protective parameters for you that God established in Genesis and confirmed throughout the Scripture including the Gospels, the Letters and Revelation.

In our spirits, in Christ,there is no male or female = in our spirits that was made in the Image of God.

i am a man and as a man there also are protective parameters that God established in Genesis and thru to Revelation.

Keep yourself protected under your husband's covering in Christ. Enjoy fellowship in the Holy Spirit in obedience to Christ.
Satan singled out Eve to undermine God's established/irreversible Order. Satan succeeded and brought the entire world under sin and death.

Follow the clear teaching of the Apostle Paul who was chosen and anointed by Christ for us - 1 Timothy 2

I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting; 9in like manner also, that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with propriety and moderation, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly clothing, 10but, which is proper for women professing godliness, with good works. 11Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. 12And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence. 13For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression. 15Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness, with self-control.

Now with this said, if you knew my wife and i, you would rejoice in our freedom that we have in Christ and the Holy Spirit.
For we are not of those that promote religion or impede the move of the Holy Spirit in peoples lives. Quite the contrary.
Yet this Freedom is not a license to parade ourselves around outside of the protective parameters set forth by God in Christ.

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Pay close attention to the words of Christ spoken to the seven churches in revelation - especially the last one.

Peace and Blessings from Christ be upon you, your husband and family - Amen

 

[DavidTree]

I am saying that it would impossible for Paul to have had that in mind. Revelation would not be written for another 40 years. (or 20 if you believed in an earlier date for Rev) Therefore it is not possible that Corinthians when they read the letter would have had any knowledge of the Revelation trumpets and therefore could not have understood it this way. Paul had something else in mind when he said Last Trump and not the trumpets of Revelation yet to be written.

Not necessarily Brother,
i am not arguing with you at all, but Paul knew of many things that he did not right down.

It is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord: 2I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or whether out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a one was caught up to the third heaven. 3And I know such a man—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows— 4how he was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5Of such a one I will boast; yet of myself I will not boast, except in my infirmities. 6For though I might desire to boast, I will not be a fool; for I will speak the truth. But I refrain, lest anyone should think of me above what he sees me to be or hears from me.
2 Cor 12

ALSO

I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire. 2He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land, 3and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices. 4Now when the seven thunders [a]uttered their voices, I was about to write; but I heard a voice from heaven saying to me, “Seal up the things which the seven thunders uttered, and do not write them.”

 

[Amanuensis]

They wouldn't live to see it so how can they understand it? It wouldn't ever apply to them. I infer you are suggesting he was speaking of some kind of trumpet they would understand in lives but that isn't the kind trumpet he is talking about. Stop talking about trainwrecks when you don't even understand that last trump is the 7th trump.

Of course it applied to them. The dead in Christ are raised when that Last Trump and the Voice of the Archangel is heard. That means that if they were not alive at the time they would be dead and still hear it and be raised. It had to apply to them whether they were alive or dead.
And the trainwreck in hermeneutics would occur when asking the question "how would they have understood him" has no value in determining authorial intent. Your saying that they did not understand him and could not. Because they died? If you die before this final trumpet then does that mean you can't understand what Paul meant? I am not following your logic. Paul expected those he wrote to, to be able to understand his sentences. He did not write as a gnostic with secret riddl

No. The last and 7th trump is when the second coming happens, and the dead rise and the living are changed and raptured.

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Appearing the second time is what happens at the 7th trump. One must familiar with and be able to take all these scriptures to form a complete picture of what happens at what timeframe.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

All that is in red are the same things being described.

Yes, and so the point is still the same. The Last Trump Paul was talking about was an established concept concerning the day of the Lord. This description in Rev 11 is repeating that. So now we are on the same page.

What many have been saying is that Paul was referring to the 7th trumpet in Revelation as if Paul had the idea of number 7 in a series of 6. And they use this to somehow say that the pretribulation theory cannot be correct. This muddies the waters. The pretribulation theory is not ruled out by Pauls use of the phrase "Last Trump"

I am open to both views, as I see logic for both interpretations and lean toward pretrib because it seems to be the best hermeneutic for all of the eschatological verses as a whole, but I am not dogmatic and realize I could be mistaken.

 

[Lafftur]

Tell me what the Holy Spirit has shown you concerning….

For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:26-28 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Galatians 3:26-28&version=NKJV

@DavidTree

The five fold ministry of Apostle, Evangelist, Prophet, Pastor and Teacher is OPEN to ALL that are IN CHRIST - there is no longer Jew or gentile, slave or free, male or female….there is ONLY the many membered Body of Christ.

Each member supplying what the Body needs according to the working of the Holy Spirit in us.

Who is an Apostle, Evangelist, Prophet, Pastor and Teacher is GOD’s choosing not ours. It’s not about male or female….how does God choose?

God chooses the least, not the greatest…the weak, not the strong…the humble, not the proud.

It is good to know scriptures but it is also good to know God’s ways…

 

[Amanuensis]

Not necessarily Brother,
i am not arguing with you at all, but Paul knew of many things that he did not right down.

It is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord: 2I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or whether out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a one was caught up to the third heaven. 3And I know such a man—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows— 4how he was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5Of such a one I will boast; yet of myself I will not boast, except in my infirmities. 6For though I might desire to boast, I will not be a fool; for I will speak the truth. But I refrain, lest anyone should think of me above what he sees me to be or hears from me.
2 Cor 12

Greetings brother. I do not write in a spirit of arguing either. I enjoy provoking one another to careful exegesis to determine correct interpretations. I appreciate the spirit of your response.

I agree that Paul had many revelations. Some of which he would not share with his readers because they were not ready to receive it for various reasons. My point was that in hermeneutics we cannot make an argument that Paul was thinking about the 7th trumpet in Revelation with knowledge of it being the 7th in a series with 6 before it because God gave him a special revelation because that would be just an imagination of ours and nothing we could prove with scripture including the one you posted.

We can however make a case for Paul referring to something out of the Old Testament or even something that Jesus taught. If we can find the references which I have already posted now.

But to say that Paul had revelations some of which he was forbidden to write will not support that he was referring to the 7th trumpet of Revelation as a 7th in series of 7. This type of hermeneutic cannot be supported. It is just a "maybe he did and didn't tell us" type of hermeneutic and too doubtful to seriously consider.