The return Of Christ in His own words and pauls

[followjesus]

It certainly does not cover and wash away a sinful lifestyle as modern false grace teachers imply and some come right out and say it matters not if we quit sinning or not:

Romans 6:1
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Some claiming to be Christian are continuing in sin because they simply deny what God's Word calls sin and claim it's all good such as gay marriage, drinking booze, smokin pot, sexual lust, etc, etc

They gonna be shocked to find out that workers of iniquity will be told to depart...

about 10 years ago i heard a tv pastor say sinning alot will make you Love God more.....because youll realize How good He is to keepo forgiving and then you will really know His grace this He was saying to christians based of course on mary and what He said about " he that is forgiven little loves little......of course He was a modern grace teacher so....im sure that doesnt suprise you

 

[followjesus]

Comparing people who were spiritually dead with no access to having the Holy Spirit living on the inside like we do now in Christ... is not comparing apples to apples.

its a comparison between their perception of God.

 

[Rockrz]

about 10 years ago i heard a tv pastor say sinning alot will make you Love God more.....because youll realize How good He is to keepo forgiving and then you will really know His grace this He was saying to christians based of course on mary and what He said about " he that is forgiven little loves little......of course He was a modern grace teacher so....im sure that doesnt suprise you

Luke 7:47
Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.

Those that are forgiven of much and realize how close they really came to burning in hell... should appreciate their salvation and desire to walk closely with the Lord

This obviously does not mean we should continue in sin by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[followjesus]

Luke 7:47
Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.

Those that are forgiven of much and realize how close they really came to burning in hell... should appreciate their salvation and desire to walk closely with the Lord

This obviously does not mean we should continue in sin by any stretch of the imagination.

exactly. and also she wasnt forgiven much until she was repenting......thats why she was weeping and broken she knew, thats a pisture of a broken, beat down, looked down upon by the religious leaders of that time the castaway realizing How sinful she had been and falling at Jesus feet....her tears were from Her heart thats one of the most beautiful stories in the word to me, i have been where she was. God wants our true heart, the depths of it every flaw and crack so He can Heal it woith mercy, and when its sincere on our part, it will convict us to follow Jesus all the way Home to the waiting arms of the father.

the prodia=gal has that moment as well when he breaks down and chooses to go home after He is beaten down By His sin . Hoping to beg His wat to sleep and work with the servants, to Huis suprise when He makes the decision to go home, he finds His Father was already waiting and watching in Hope in order to shower Him with Kisses and goos things of A son, those things He wasted on sin are restored....Just Like mankind

 

[followjesus]

exactly. and also she wasnt forgiven much until she was repenting......thats why she was weeping and broken she knew, thats a pisture of a broken, beat down, looked down upon by the religious leaders of that time the castaway realizing How sinful she had been and falling at Jesus feet....her tears were from Her heart thats one of the most beautiful stories in the word to me, i have been where she was. God wants our true heart, the depths of it every flaw and crack so He can Heal it woith mercy, and when its sincere on our part, it will convict us to follow Jesus all the way Home to the waiting arms of the father.

the prodia=gal has that moment as well when he breaks down and chooses to go home after He is beaten down By His sin . Hoping to beg His wat to sleep and work with the servants, to Huis suprise when He makes the decision to go home, he finds His Father was already waiting and watching in Hope in order to shower Him with Kisses and goos things of A son, those things He wasted on sin are restored....Just Like mankind

thats why its so destructive and counter productive to not acknowledge your sins, it will never reach the point of repentance. Paul teaches about Godly sorrow for sin, Just like Jesus did, Just like what broke down mary....and thats what it takes to reach true repentance to acknowledge the truth, to stop denying our sins, and actually lay them down at the cross and follow Jesus from the empty tomb

 

[willybob]

You seek to keep a law that was for Israel not the gentile church. Salvation is by grace not by keeping the law. Read Romans 14 and allow others who keep Sunday the same liberty they allow to you to keep Saturday.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

The Law of the Spirit is very much in effect, and is established by steadfast faithfulness to God, Romans 3. Grace (the empowerment of the Spirit) teaches us to do such, Titus 2:11-14...

 

[followjesus]

The Law of the Spirit is very much in effect, and is established by steadfast faithfulness to God, Romans 3. Grace (the empowerment of the Spirit) teaches us to do such, Titus 2:11-14...

yeah the law of the spirit is the gospel, the Law of moses is the flesh law, to restrain sin in man. 2 different things. Grace and truth is the gospel it isnt saying Grace grace that teaches us anything. Im 100 percent for Gods Grace, but theres also a distortion of it that omits everything else trying to exalt something God gives to us from His heart, into God Himself. God has already shown mankind His wrath when we continually rebel and He hasnt changed 1 iota Just Like noah was saved By Grace, then instructed and obeyed and was saved, so are we.

Grace is Good if its taken within Jesus gospel thats where it exists. paul cant give anyone grace, nor can He save a single soul, its Jesus in paul thats why His epistles are all the same Gospel principles repentance rewuired and go to work when you are saying " im in christ" were not serving Him to be saved, yet, if someone Gives thier Life for you, to save yours, and leaves a living will for you to honor.......sincerity Honors the will of the One Who suffered and died for your sins.

the grace that teaches ro live upright is only found in the gospel of Jesus Christ, paul was telling people "Go to Jesus , trust in Jesus, serve Jesus , Believe Jesus, he didnt teach eternal security even for Himself, He says it more than once that He was working hard so that He wouldnt be a castaway, He says He has a clear conscience, but that didnt make Him innicent, but that all will face the Lords Judgement and he was waiting to see on that day.

if saying Grace grace taught anything wed simply have an account of the death and resurrection and paul saying everyine now is saved the end. all of the Bible works together, it Just all has its proper order and Place

 

[willybob]

The teachings of Jesus were not for everyone, this is why He spoke in parables, hoping to stir up those of a carnal mind enslaved to sin, then hopefully awakened and blessed are those that mourn over their sin, Matt. 5-4 and depart from such activities with a vigorous zeal and an extreme determination in a season of godly sorrow (with an inward readiness to avenge all disobedience no matter how long it takes) coming out purged and cleansed and a vessel fit for the Master's use 2 Cor 7,10,11 >hence forth hungering and thirsting for righteousness, Matt 5-6..The Carnal Professing Christians despise such teachings and they are not meant for them, but rather the humble and teachable only..

2 Cor. 7-1Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Those walking after the flesh cannot address these scriptures, therefore they suppress the truth in unrighteousness, and to such are not the plain and simple teachings of Christ given, such as "go and sin no more", because it is foolishness to them and a stumbling block of offense.

 

[followjesus]

The teachings of Jesus were not for everyone, this is why He spoke in parables, hoping to stir up those of a carnal mind enslaved to sin, then hopefully awakened and blessed are those that mourn over their sin, Matt. 5-4 and depart from such activities with a vigorous zeal and an extreme determination in a season of godly sorrow (with an inward readiness to avenge all disobedience no matter how long it takes) coming out purged and cleansed and a vessel fit for the Master's use 2 Cor 7,10,11 >hence forth hungering and thirsting for righteousness, Matt 5-6..The Carnal Professing Christians despise such teachings and they are not meant for them, but rather the humble and teachable only..

2 Cor. 7-1Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Those walking after the flesh cannot address these scriptures, therefore they suppress the truth in unrighteousness, and to such are not the plain and simple teachings of Christ given, such as "go and sin no more", because it is foolishness to them and a stumbling block of offense.

Those walking after the flesh cannot address these scriptures, therefore they suppress the truth in unrighteousness, and to such are not the plain and simple teachings of Christ given, such as "go and sin no more", because it is foolishness to them and a stumbling block of offense.


i can agree with this part completely. its actually very insightful to me thank you man i needed to Hear that.

i like How you put that " they cant address His teachings" thats whyu a person can show 100 scriptures so clearly and simply stated that are everything to a believer, and it doesnt even phase them like as if you never showed the scriptures to them. in almost every single discussion ive ever had with a gog believer they never even address what you have pointed out, they simply go grab an out of context verse and make it sem as if that one verse over rules Jesus Word.

its strange, but what you said there really helped me understand why that is, thanks again wb and God bless you for imparting that understanding !

 

[followjesus]

The teachings of Jesus were not for everyone, this is why He spoke in parables, hoping to stir up those of a carnal mind enslaved to sin, then hopefully awakened and blessed are those that mourn over their sin, Matt. 5-4 and depart from such activities with a vigorous zeal and an extreme determination in a season of godly sorrow (with an inward readiness to avenge all disobedience no matter how long it takes) coming out purged and cleansed and a vessel fit for the Master's use 2 Cor 7,10,11 >hence forth hungering and thirsting for righteousness, Matt 5-6..The Carnal Professing Christians despise such teachings and they are not meant for them, but rather the humble and teachable only..

2 Cor. 7-1Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Those walking after the flesh cannot address these scriptures, therefore they suppress the truth in unrighteousness, and to such are not the plain and simple teachings of Christ given, such as "go and sin no more", because it is foolishness to them and a stumbling block of offense.

can i have you elaborate a little on that if you can whenever you have time, are you saying that they need Grace without any real teaching from the gospel firt and then eventually they will be able to see?

 

[followjesus]

The teachings of Jesus were not for everyone, this is why He spoke in parables, hoping to stir up those of a carnal mind enslaved to sin, then hopefully awakened and blessed are those that mourn over their sin, Matt. 5-4 and depart from such activities with a vigorous zeal and an extreme determination in a season of godly sorrow (with an inward readiness to avenge all disobedience no matter how long it takes) coming out purged and cleansed and a vessel fit for the Master's use 2 Cor 7,10,11 >hence forth hungering and thirsting for righteousness, Matt 5-6..The Carnal Professing Christians despise such teachings and they are not meant for them, but rather the humble and teachable only..


wow man that is really helpful too lol that is already unlocking some things that have frustrated me to no end in places Like this forum. That right there was Gods spirit meant for me i been praying Hard for that understanding !!! very appreciated that you took the time to stop in

 

[beta]

They gonna be shocked to find out that workers of iniquity will be told to depart...

We can already know that NOW - but they refuse to see or hear the warning.

 

[followjesus]

We can already know that NOW - but they refuse to see or hear the warning.

willy bobs comment really really made sense on why that is , to me anyways.

 

[followjesus]

Friend , I am no better than anyone else....just as hurt and impatient, so much so I said to God I would give up - and He said we are to be patient as HE is patient with us ! so like you....every now and again I keep trying....yet at the same time asking God to turn me if I am wrong. We are in a battle my friend that requires 'enduring to the end ! Be of good courage - God knows what He is doing !love you !

I Love you too !!

wow i missed this earlier, i could have written that myself. i ask daily for God to keep His word active and let it be rooted in Truth, i also ask in situations like this one if im wrong to continue trying also because i Know alot of scriptures deal with the difference between someone who is ignorant of truth, and someone who continually rejects it when they are shown. to me the gog is just an echoe from eden saying " Dont listen to God, listen to me, ill explain the real truth of it" i honestly cant get that relationship between the gog and genesis 3s deception out of my thinking. it has been the basic pattern for deception from then until now all through scripture the prophets did it, the priests before them, Jeus warned of it, and the apostles deal with the warning of false prophets and teachers as well.

I think alot of folks dont grasp that those warnings are so important, because it was ignoring Gods first warning that caused all of this and eventually the suffering of Jesus. we fell all because of a lie, because of words that God did not say to mankind. the power of words integrity are underestimated by many as if correct doctrine isnt important, but thats the thing when grace is defined as they define it, nothing else applies but five Letters because anything else just is not grace in thier minds. in my own belief, its because thier hearts are filled with what God didnt say, and what He did say then becomes "wrong" all because of false doctrine, or words that God did not ordain or authorize.

if we just could grasp that Gods Word though a harsh warning may appear as oppresive like its keeping us from something thats " good" to our flesh, every one is actually for the good of our spirit and our Life and blessing. those warnings are the best because they are meant to keep us safe from the enemies grasp. if we are abiding in Gods word, the enemy cant get us.

 

[willybob]

can i have you elaborate a little on that if you can whenever you have time, are you saying that they need Grace without any real teaching from the gospel firt and then eventually they will be able to see?

Greetings followjesus

In Matthew 13 in the beginning of the parable of the sower Jesus speaks to them in parables and said " Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand". All they can understand is carnality, so Jesus speaks on that level to activate their natural reasoning ability that He placed into all men that they might humble themselves and hear the message and begin to spiritually ponder upon such matters of the Spirit.
14 And in them (the rebellious who are focused on earthly things)is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

Because the heart is in rebellion/sin they hear not, see not, and understand not..

15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, (a callused heart in need of circumcision)and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

they hear not the gospel of holiness and righteousness because of the stubbornness/rebellion of the heart. Paul says what is known of God's wrath and His judgement against sin is already revealed to them, however they suppress the truth in unrighteousness. In fact Paul went on to say Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. (the light of conscience is by grace and has been given to every man, John 1-9) Also this grace of God that brings salvation hath appeared to ALL MEN teaching us to live godly, soberly, and righteously IN THIS PRESENT WORLD. Titus 2-11,12

If they humble themselves in repentance and receive the engrafted word that is able to save their souls THEN Jesus should heal them...It all begins with Matthew 5-4,5 a morning over sin in a season of godly sorrow through repentance, meekness, and humility, in that they should inherit the new earth,AND THEN 6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. Many do not hunger and thirst for righteousness, but rather argue at all points in favour of sin because they are in rebellion to God and His commandments, thus they cannot inherit, nor be filled..


However to the obedient from heart purity >>>16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

 

[followjesus]

Greetings followjesus

In Matthew 13 in the beginning of the parable of the sower Jesus speaks to them in parables and said " Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand". All they can understand is carnality, so Jesus speaks on that level to activate their natural reasoning ability that He placed into all men that they might humble themselves and hear the message and begin to spiritually ponder upon such matters of the Spirit.
14 And in them (the rebellious who are focused on earthly things)is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

Because the heart is in rebellion/sin they hear not, see not, and understand not..

15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, (a callused heart in need of circumcision)and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

they hear not the gospel of holiness and righteousness because of the stubbornness/rebellion of the heart. Paul says what is known of God's wrath and His judgement against sin is already revealed to them, however they suppress the truth in unrighteousness. In fact Paul went on to say Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. (the light of conscience is by grace and has been given to every man, John 1-9) Also this grace of God that brings salvation hath appeared to ALL MEN teaching us to live godly, soberly, and righteously IN THIS PRESENT WORLD. Titus 2-11,12

If they humble themselves in repentance and receive the engrafted word that is able to save their souls THEN Jesus should heal them...It all begins with Matthew 5-4,5 a morning over sin in a season of godly sorrow through repentance, meekness, and humility, in that they should inherit the new earth,AND THEN 6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. Many do not hunger and thirst for righteousness, but rather argue at all points in favour of sin because they are in rebellion to God and His commandments, thus they cannot inherit, nor be filled..


However to the obedient from heart purity >>>16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

Thats really awesome stuff man thanks for elaborating, so the parable of the Lost son connects to this and really every teaching about repentance. the prodigal never had a reason to repent while he was wrapped up in wasting His possesions on wild living and prostitutes, he was in the "flesh" and the flesh enjoys sin and creates a mis perception of happiness and of fulfillment because the flesh is being satisfied. in other words Why would someone want to repent if they wont accept they are doing wrong.


That above goes to your point of a "season of sorrow" it took the prodigal being broken before He ever turned toward Home. and he was enjoying his wild life until he reaped its harvest and brokedown remembering His Father.

I have never looked at the beattitudes that way, it makes perfect sense now the hungering and thirst for righteousness, we cant Hinger for righteousness if we already think were righteous << ( the self righteous who come to christ cant Hear Jesus telling them of righteousness, they are convinced theres nothing to learn from Him. and the One who thinks sin is acceptable, would never thirst for righteousness, because only the flesh would make provision for sinful desires such as , a man of Lust watching porn or commiting fornication or adultery and then saying through thier mind to themself, No one can really repent we just trust in the "finish work of the cross"


thanks for taking the time that was helpful, God bless

 

[tanakh]

Yet another hijacked thread. One reason why I rarely start them

 

[followjesus]

Yet another hijacked thread. One reason why I rarely start them

ive never seen one that stays on course or subject I find that some do come to threads to add to the topic, and that others come to oppose the entire idea presented whether a person has good clear scripture or not, its the theology in us that disagrees....the doctrines we become comvinced of dont agree, unless they are founded in the 4 gospels.


I would like to read one you start you seem to have good insight in many areas

 

[willybob]

Thats really awesome stuff man thanks for elaborating, so the parable of the Lost son connects to this and really every teaching about repentance. the prodigal never had a reason to repent while he was wrapped up in wasting His possesions on wild living and prostitutes, he was in the "flesh" and the flesh enjoys sin and creates a mis perception of happiness and of fulfillment because the flesh is being satisfied. in other words Why would someone want to repent if they wont accept they are doing wrong.


That above goes to your point of a "season of sorrow" it took the prodigal being broken before He ever turned toward Home. and he was enjoying his wild life until he reaped its harvest and brokedown remembering His Father.

I have never looked at the beattitudes that way, it makes perfect sense now the hungering and thirst for righteousness, we cant Hinger for righteousness if we already think were righteous << ( the self righteous who come to christ cant Hear Jesus telling them of righteousness, they are convinced theres nothing to learn from Him. and the One who thinks sin is acceptable, would never thirst for righteousness, because only the flesh would make provision for sinful desires such as , a man of Lust watching porn or commiting fornication or adultery and then saying through thier mind to themself, No one can really repent we just trust in the "finish work of the cross"


thanks for taking the time that was helpful, God bless

thank you for the kind words followjesus, very good teaching about the prodigal son, be blessed always


I would like to also add that the prodigal son never went back to the pig pin of sin (vile sins of the flesh, and riotous living) because the old man was dead...the prodigal son is an example that scarlet sinners have the natural ability to repent and forsake their ways of iniquity and reason with God (come let us reason together Isaiah 1-18), (grace given to all men) just as God told Cain he could do the same...Is the Spirit their also convicting and strengthening? Absolutely...Therefore man is a worker together with God, just as the apostle Paul declares...

the natural light of conscience is the presence of God in everyman/woman. John 1-9

 

[followjesus]

thank you for the kind words followjesus, very good teaching about the prodigal son, be blessed always


I would like to also add that the prodigal son never went back to the pig pin of sin (vile sins of the flesh, and riotous living) because the old man was dead...the prodigal son is an example that scarlet sinners have the natural ability to repent and forsake their ways of iniquity and reason with God (come let us reason together Isaiah 1-18), (grace given to all men) just as God told Cain he could do the same...Is the Spirit their also convicting and strengthening? Absolutely...Therefore man is a worker together with God, just as the apostle Paul declares...

the natural light of conscience is the presence of God in everyman/woman. John 1-9

"I would like to also add that the prodigal son never went back to the pig pin of sin (vile sins of the flesh, and riotous living) because the old man was dead."


amen, and why would He after He learned the result of it, i have been in the mire myself and im never ever going back. its strange when you really repent those things that had such a pull in your life, turn to those things that you hate even remembering....God is good to change the things we cant, I cant imagine asking for more inheritance to go squander it in the mud, when the promise of the one in whom i believe is worth so much to every man