THIRD TEMPLE NEWS

[Bladerunner]

Bladerunner more or less told me I wasn't saved. He suggested to ask Jesus to send me the Holy Spirit to teach me. One thing I was taught is that you receive the Holy spirit when you are saved. I said the sinners prayer in front of a Minister in 1971 and was Baptised in water a year later which was witnessed by about 100 people. Now I am being told that Im not saved because I dont believe in Darbys pre trib nonsense. He was thrown out of the Plymouth Brethren because of it and formed his own group. I was also told that it is not a salvation issue. I have heard this before. How come I am then told that I need the Holy Spirit because I dont believe in it and then that it is not a salvation issue?

No, because of the hatred you wear on your sleeve.

It seems you like to play word games lit another on this thread.WHY would you do that?

 

[VCO]

Firstly my statement about them not building one is correct unless its hidden away somewhere.

This is a quote from the Temple Institute website.....

''The Institute seeks to disseminate this knowledge, rekindle the desire and yearning for the rebuilding of the Holy Temple and prepare as much as possible for the actual rebuilding''

In order to rekindle the desire and yearning it logicaly follows that the desire and yearning was no longer there otherwise the statement makes no sense.

In Wilkipedia under the temple Institute there is a section headed Controversies. In it various Jewish Scholars are at loggerheads as to whether only the Messiah can build it or whether anyone can. I believe that one will be built during the tribulation under the rule of antichrist. No one knows when that will be but it is hardly cause for celebration.

Israel is a Secular state. Synagogue based Judaism has been practiced since the destruction of the old Temple. Many Jews have only a nodding acquaintance with that and many others range in belief from Atheists to Buddhists

I have been to Israel and have seen first hand what Israeli society looks like.

ONLY THOSE WITH BLOODLINE TIES TO ISRAEL AND HAVING THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM ARE CONSIDERED OF ISRAEL BY GOD.

MESSIANIC JEWS OF TODAY, CERTAINLY ARE THE REMNANT OF ISRAEL IN THIS CHURCH-AGE.

THAT FAITH OF ABRAHAM WAS THE UNQUESTIONING TYPE OF FAITH. YOU QUESTION EVERYTHING, SO MY GUESS IS YOU DO NOT HAVE THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM.

 

[VCO]

. . .
There is only one second coming. This has been taught by the church
for centuries and still is. When he returns the resurrection will occur and
those alive will meet him in the air and escort him to earth. In Jude it says
that he will come with thousands of his saints. These are the righteous dead
who receive immortal bodies at his coming and are now with him in heaven

That first statment is absolutely true. BUT AN APPEARING IN THE CLOUDS DOES NOT COUNT AS A COMING. JUST LIKE APPEARING TO PAUL AT LEAST 3 TIMES DID NOT COUNT. iT IS NOT A COMING, UNTIL HIS FEET TOUGH THE GROUND. THE RESURRECTION OF THE DEAD IN CHRIST IS AT THE APPEARING TO CALL OUT THE BRIDE, AND THE RESURRECTION OF THE TRIBULATION SAINTS IS AT THE SECOND COMING.

Take it back to the Rapture Thread, this is for THIRD TEMPLE NEWS.

 

[trofimus]

ONLY THOSE WITH BLOODLINE TIES TO ISRAEL AND HAVING THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM ARE CONSIDERED OF ISRAEL BY GOD.

So you admit that there is no real Israel in the state of Israel and therefore their plans or actions are irrelevant?

Judaism - 75% (but mostly culturally, they are atheists with the highest density of gay bars in the world)
Islam - 17.5%
Christianity - 2% (but these are mostly non-Jews living in Israel)
Unknown and others - 5.5%

Now guess how godly can their temple or any plans about it be. And also guess what group wants to build a jewish temple.

MESSIANIC JEWS OF TODAY, CERTAINLY ARE THE REMNANT OF ISRAEL IN THIS CHURCH-AGE.

Messianic Jews or just and simply Christians from Jews in various Churches?

Messianic Jews live under the old covenant, do not eat unclean food, keep sabbath and you would surely do not want to be with them. They take the Law as still valid.

 

[VCO]

So you admit that there is no real Israel in the state of Israel and therefore their plans or actions are irrelevant?

Judaism - 75% (but mostly culturally, they are atheists with the highest density of gay bars in the world)
Islam - 17.5%
Christianity - 2% (but these are mostly non-Jews living in Israel)
Unknown and others - 5.5%

Now guess how godly can their temple or any plans about it be. And also guess what group wants to build a jewish temple.



Messianic Jews or just and simply Christians from Jews in various Churches?

Messianic Jews live under the old covenant, do not eat unclean food, keep sabbath and you would surely do not want to be with them. They take the Law as still valid.

Doctrinal Statement -
Congregation of SHEMA YISRAEL

WE BELIEVE:
1. THE HOLY SCRIPTURES
That the Bible consists of the Tenach (the Torah, the Prophets, and the Writings) and the writings commonly known as the Brit Chadasha, the New Covenant. It is the only infallible, inerrant, and authoritative word of God. We recognize its divine inspiration and accept its teachings as our final authority in all matters of faith and practice.
2. GOD
That the unity of God is taught in the Shema. God is one – echad: a united one, a composite unity, eternally existent in plural oneness. He is a personal God who created us; and He exists forever in three Persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
A. God the Father is the King of the Universe, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, without beginning and without end. He is Spirit. He sent His Son, Yeshua the Messiah, and draws people to Him.
B. God the Son is Yeshua – Jesus, the Messiah. He possesses both Divine and human natures. He was born of a virgin. The Son is God and is worshiped as God. He has always existed. He is the Passover Lamb who takes away the sin of the world. We believe in His sinless life and His perfect obedience to the Torah; His atoning death, burial, and bodily resurrection; His ascension into heaven; and His personal return in power and glory to this earth in order to consummate the prophesied purposes concerning His kingdom.
C. God the Holy Spirit is a person, possessing all the attributes of Deity. He was active in the creation of the universe and continues to be active through His providence. He convicts the world of sin, righteousness, and judgment; He regenerates, sanctifies, immerses, indwells, seals, empowers, illumines, guides, teaches, and gives gifts to all believers.
3. MAN
That man was created in the image of God but through disobedience fell and became separated from God. All men are born with a sinful nature. Man’s only hope for redemption is by having faith in Messiah Yeshua. This results in salvation and regeneration by the Ruach HaKodesh, which is the new birth. We believe that Yeshua died for our sins; that all who believe in Him are made right with God, not by any of their own works of righteousness, but by Messiah’s perfect righteousness and atoning blood, and that there is no other name under heaven by which we must be saved. Salvation has always been by faith; and that works of law, or righteous acts, have never saved anyone.
4. RESURRECTION AND JUDGMENT
A. In His promised coming in the air to receive Messianic Believers to Himself.
B. In the bodily resurrection of both the just and the unjust: the just to everlasting life, and the unjust to eternal death and separation from God.
5. ISRAEL
That the election of Israel is irrevocable. We believe in the physical and spiritual restoration of Israel. A great miracle in our day has been the re-establishment of the state of Israel according to prophecy.
6. MESSIANIC JUDAISM
That Jewish people (physical descendants of Abraham through Isaac and Jacob, whether through patrilineal or matrilineal descent) who place their faith in Messiah Yeshua, continue to be Jewish according to the Scriptures. Gentiles who place their faith in Yeshua are grafted into the Jewish Olive Tree of faith becoming spiritual sons and daughters of Abraham.
That all of God’s word to Israel is still valid. We believe that “Biblical Judaism” is the faith of first-century believers, which we seek to practice. We believe that the Holy Days given by God to Israel with their fulfillment in the Messiah Yeshua are still valid and are worth observing.
We acknowledge that the New Covenant Messianic Community (the Church) is composed of both Jews and Gentiles who have received Yeshua the Messiah as the promised Redeemer. The “middle wall of partition” has been broken down, and now we worship the God of Israel together.

Doctrinal Statement - Congregation Shema Yisrael

WRONG, There are quite a few MESSIANIC JEWS in ISRAEL, even in their Military.


Israel - Messianic Jewish Bible Institute

Messianic Jews - Maoz Israel

https://www.charismanews.com/world/46304-messianic-judaism-gaining-momentum-in-israel

Messianic Jews - Israel Today | Israel News


THERE ARE 120 MESSIANIC CHRISTIAN CONGREGATIONS IN ISRAEL and they are GROWING RAPIDLY.

WATCH THE VIDEOS AND LEARN, watch the Last Video for SURE, it is less than 6 minutes.


[video=youtube;tpzjT2GuX3A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpzjT2GuX3A[/video]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMf2hrGbmxU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sIgom16ekQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdnPThZvf_g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIgG1Z7dY9Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQVcyP8A0uQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zvpq3OIT_pM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mmD5BId2kE

NOTICE the Star of David on the Paratrooper's pin, if there was any doubt this was a Israeli Soldier.

The IDF issues Christians Soldiers BIBLES.



My advice is that you tear away any anti-semetic sentiments you may have, and BURY THEM.

 

[tanakh]

No, because of the hatred you wear on your sleeve.

It seems you like to play word games lit another on this thread.WHY would you do that?

So according to you warning fellow Christians including yourself about a false and potentially dangerous system of teaching is wearing hate on my sleeve. I have warned you and others so now its up to you if you heed the warning or not.

I am not playing word games with anyone. You made a statement that amounts to doubting my salvation. That doubt appears to be based on the fact that I dont believe or agree with dispensationalism There is not one post where I have doubted a Pre tribbers salvation. I dont agree with Preterism either but so far no one has doubted my salvation on that basis, and it is a minority view in any case

 

[Muzungu256]

ONLY THOSE WITH BLOODLINE TIES TO ISRAEL AND HAVING THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM ARE CONSIDERED OF ISRAEL BY GOD.

MESSIANIC JEWS OF TODAY, CERTAINLY ARE THE REMNANT OF ISRAEL IN THIS CHURCH-AGE.

THAT FAITH OF ABRAHAM WAS THE UNQUESTIONING TYPE OF FAITH. YOU QUESTION EVERYTHING, SO MY GUESS IS YOU DO NOT HAVE THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM.

how does anyone know if they have bloodline ties to israel today??????? nobody has the dna of the patriarchs............


why cant they call themselves christians?????? christ said we are ONE in Christ no jew nor gentile why still do the difference?????? in the old days when someone converted to christianity they used the name christian

i think u are wrong on this mon because paul tells us that Christ is abraham's seed....... and if we are in Christ then we also are of that seed........... so i dont see how race still plays a part in it????? im not advocating for replacement theology either just going by what paul said there. no reason to get mad......

 

[Muzungu256]

So according to you warning fellow Christians including yourself about a false and potentially dangerous system of teaching is wearing hate on my sleeve. I have warned you and others so now its up to you if you heed the warning or not.

I am not playing word games with anyone. You made a statement that amounts to doubting my salvation. That doubt appears to be based on the fact that I dont believe or agree with dispensationalism There is not one post where I have doubted a Pre tribbers salvation. I dont agree with Preterism either but so far no one has doubted my salvation on that basis, and it is a minority view in any case

ey mon im too lazy to read this entire thread, what have u been warning us about???????

 

[trofimus]

VCO, some "marketing" pictures and videos cannot change any facts.

Statistics is not antisemitism. There are virtually no Christian Jews in Israel. Even 2% of population can make some few soldiers or some few big churches, but it is nothing relevant to population.

BTW Kiev is in Ukraine, not in Israel.

Mesianic Jews are keeping the Law. I hope you believe we are not under the Law anymore and that Christ is the end of the Law.

I think that it is not even the Mesianic Jews who want to build a temple (at least I hope they have so much of wisdom), but only unbelieving Jews.

 

[Muzungu256]

VCO, some "marketing" pictures and videos cannot change any facts.

Statistics is not antisemitism. There are virtually no Christian Jews in Israel. Even 2% of population can make some few soldiers or some few big churches, but it is nothing relevant to population.

BTW Kiev is in Ukraine.

Mesianic Jews are keeping the Law. I hope you believe we are not under the Law anymore and that Christ is the end of the Law.

I think that it is not even the Mesianic Jews who wants to build a temple (at least I hope they have so much of wisdom), but only unbelieving Jews.

yes but my friend if no temple how can the prophecies be fulfilled in matthew 24:15????????? and things......
but i agree with u on tehm getting special treatment its weird........ if i say keep the sabbath im a heretic and under the law but if messianics do it, its just fine because of their ethnicity.......... i thought it was one people under Christ and not two different camps????????

 

[trofimus]

yes but my friend if no temple how can the prophecies be fulfilled in matthew 24:15????????? and things......
but i agree with u on tehm getting special treatment its weird........ if i say keep the sabbath im a heretic and under the law but if messianics do it, its just fine because of their ethnicity.......... i thought it was one people under Christ and not two different camps????????

Matthew 24:15 was before the destruction of the temple. It already happened. The temple is destroyed as Christ said.

There is no need for another one to be built and destroyed again.

 

[Muzungu256]

Matthew 24:15 was before the destruction of the temple. It already happened. The temple is destroyed as Christ said.

There is no need for another one to be build and destroyed again.

i see....... so 70ad?????? but Jesus was supposed to return then too no??????? where is sky splitting open and son of man coming on the clouds u see?????? im not arguing with u i just ask questions ok because i dont know where u stand...... u are my friend

 

[Muzungu256]

trofimus if u dont wanna talk it here and kinda distract the topic u can pm me ok?????

 

[trofimus]

i see....... so 70ad?????? but Jesus was supposed to return then too no??????? where is sky splitting open and son of man coming on the clouds u see?????? im not arguing with u i just ask questions ok because i dont know where u stand...... u are my friend

Yes, this is very old problem. Christians in the first century believed He will return during their lifes, one generation passed, second one passed.. and now its 2000 years.

He is delayed But for our good. We would not exist.

 

[tanakh]

ONLY THOSE WITH BLOODLINE TIES TO ISRAEL AND HAVING THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM ARE CONSIDERED OF ISRAEL BY GOD.

MESSIANIC JEWS OF TODAY, CERTAINLY ARE THE REMNANT OF ISRAEL IN THIS CHURCH-AGE.

THAT FAITH OF ABRAHAM WAS THE UNQUESTIONING TYPE OF FAITH. YOU QUESTION EVERYTHING, SO MY GUESS IS YOU DO NOT HAVE THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM.

You challenged me on my statement that most Israelis are not that concerned about building another temple. I replied to it using the temple Institutes own words. You or anyone else can see the statement by googling the Temple Institutes site.

A third temple will not be built by a faithful remnant of Jews. It will be built by those who believe that the Antichrist is the Messiah. Whether I have the faith of Abraham or not is between myself and God alone.

 

[VCO]

yes but my friend if no temple how can the prophecies be fulfilled in matthew 24:15????????? and things......
but i agree with u on tehm getting special treatment its weird........ if i say keep the sabbath im a heretic and under the law but if messianics do it, its just fine because of their ethnicity.......... i thought it was one people under Christ and not two different camps????????

The two will be one FLOCK at the Rapture:


John 10:14-16 (HCSB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] “I am the good shepherd. I know My own sheep, and they know Me,
[SUP]15 [/SUP] as the Father knows Me, and I know the Father. I lay down My life for the sheep.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But I have other sheep that are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice.
Then there will be one flock, one shepherd.


The Birthday of the Church is AFTER HIS ascension on the Day of Pentecost. That means HE is not talking to a group of Church-age Believers in the MESSIAH, but rather He is talking to a group that is part of the Last of the Old Testament Believers in MESSIAH.

The Church-age Believers has to be COMPLETE before the Then can happen. THEN the two folds become ONE FLOCK at the Calling Out of the Bride of Christ.

Matthew 16:18 (YLT)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] `And I also say to thee, that thou art a rock, and upon this rock I will build my assembly, and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it;

 

[Muzungu256]

but paul said its already one in Christ 2000 years ago not in the future?????????
other than that i buy ur explanation VCO i think its good mon...... thanks...... so they are separate now but will become one in the rapture

 

[tanakh]

That first statment is absolutely true. BUT AN APPEARING IN THE CLOUDS DOES NOT COUNT AS A COMING. JUST LIKE APPEARING TO PAUL AT LEAST 3 TIMES DID NOT COUNT. iT IS NOT A COMING, UNTIL HIS FEET TOUGH THE GROUND. THE RESURRECTION OF THE DEAD IN CHRIST IS AT THE APPEARING TO CALL OUT THE BRIDE, AND THE RESURRECTION OF THE TRIBULATION SAINTS IS AT THE SECOND COMING.

Take it back to the Rapture Thread, this is for THIRD TEMPLE NEWS.

Acts 9:3-4

And as he journeyed he came near Damascus and suddenly there shined round him a light from heaven
and he fell to the earth and heard a voice saying unto him Saul Saul why persecution thou me?

Acts 3:19-21

Repent therefore and be converted that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing
shall come from the presence of the Lord and he shall send Jesus Christ which before was preached
unto you whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things which God before
had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets that Christ should suffer he hath so fulfilled

Paul saw a light from heaven and heard a voice. There is no mention of Christ floating in the air he was still in heaven.
This is confirmed by Peter who said he must remain in heaven until the restitution of all things. That rules out any
possibility of him coming back secretly to collect anyone before the second coming. Also in Revelation there are
only two general resurrections mentioned one is that of the righteous and the other is at the great white throne
judgement. There is also no use of the term 'tribulation saints' anywhere this is a term invented to justify a false
teaching.

You object to my posting and then prolong the rapture discussion yourself. In your other reply you hint that i am not saved by doubting my having Abrahams faith. There is only one kind of faith a Christian can have. This is the second time its been
insinuated. I do wish those who think that way had the guts to come straight out with it.

 

[Zen]

Just found this hilarious video. It's kind of relevant.

[video=youtube;A94smJ9QJ5g]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A94smJ9QJ5g[/video]

"Anti-semitism" lol what a joke.

 

[VCO]

You challenged me on my statement that most Israelis are not that concerned about building another temple. I replied to it using the temple Institutes own words. You or anyone else can see the statement by googling the Temple Institutes site.

A third temple will not be built by a faithful remnant of Jews. It will be built by those who believe that the Antichrist is the Messiah. Whether I have the faith of Abraham or not is between myself and God alone.

You might want to ask them for their opinion, before you "open your mouth and insert foot" as the expression goes.


MESSIANIC JEWS Believe Yeshua Ha Mashiach (Jesus the Messiah) CANNOT RETURN, until the Third Temple is Built, and many of them Believe the 70th Week of Daniel happens AFTER THE CHURCH-AGE.


Luke 21:24 (HCSB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]. . . and Jerusalem will be trampled by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

[h=3]The Messianic Idea in Judaism[/h] Belief in the eventual coming of the mashiach is a basic and fundamental part of traditional Judaism. It is part of Rambam's 13 Principles of Faith, the minimum requirements of Jewish belief. In the Shemoneh Esrei prayer, recited three times daily, we pray for all of the elements of the coming of the mashiach: ingathering of the exiles; restoration of the religious courts of justice; an end of wickedness, sin and heresy; reward to the righteous; rebuilding of Jerusalem; restoration of the line of King David; and restoration of Temple service.
. . .

Judaism 101: Mashiach: The Messiah

. . .
Such a validation process as this is similar to the judgment of Ezra about the family of Barzillai (Ezra 2:62-63), and there are doubtless other possibilities as well. The verification of heredity by no means takes the place of each Cohen's inner purification by receiving the Ruach HaKodesh from Messiah Yeshua, but the New Covenant transformation makes them yet more suitable for service in the Mikdash {Sanctuary of the King or Temple}. In any case, nothing prevents Yeshua from undertaking the process of verification of Cohanim {Crown of the Priests}, today, if he does indeed desire the Temple's reconstruction. This line of thinking again leads to the idea that a remnant of Israel will both be servants of Yeshua the Messiah, and will be involved in rebuilding and serving in the Mikdash.


When My Mikdash {Sanctuary of the King or Temple} is With Them Forever (Ez. 37:28)
This article has surveyed Avrahamic heritage related to worship at Hashem's Makom, exegesis of the book of Hebrew that supports the Messianic Jewish community's participation in the Temple, and Yeshua's Messianic credentials. Yeshua-believing Jews are challenged to formally engage the Temple question, and in that light, Yeshua-believing non-Jews are challenged to seriously engage the Israel question. The wider Jewish community is challenged to consider the question of Yeshua as Israel's Messiah, who is promised to restore the Mikdash.


Increasing numbers of Israelis are laboring to see the Mikdash rebuilt. The Messianic Jewish community cannot fail to respond to this crucial issue known to be a perpetual mitzvah, and that so deeply involves our Messiah and his great sacrificial work.

Does Messianic Judaism Have a Part in Rebuilding the Temple?

The Crown of the High Priest has been made by the Temple Institute.