What 3 verses say that a lost man cannot believe the gospel?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,129
3,689
113
If the heart of the unbelieving is hardened by God can they become believing?
So is this example of the lost who cannot believe the gospel. Christ does tell them in chapter 8 that because they are not of God they "cannot" hear Him.
A person's heart becomes hardened first by unbelieving.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,129
3,689
113
Call me what you like.....excuses aren’t Good enough in my book.

Quite a few on here don’t like the lower case g..when referring to GOD!.

Get a magnifying glass!
I don't like you capitalizing the entire word God.:)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
if someone wants to complain about what I say or discuss it I have no problem. But to judge a person for capitalization is just plain legalistic,
 
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,275
113
If the heart of the unbelieving is hardened by God can they become believing?
So is this example of the lost who cannot believe the gospel. Christ does tell them in chapter 8 that because they are not of God they "cannot" hear Him.

Of course,God can harden or soften hearts.......after all He is God......He can do whatever He chooses to do.
 

soggykitten

Well-known member
Jul 3, 2020
2,322
1,369
113
Lawlessness is about doing it your way, because you still belong to yourself (left error)
Lordship is about doing what you are told to do, because of who you belong to. (narrow path)
Under Law is about doing it good enough because you still belong to yourself. (right error)
What Denomination are you member of?
 

soggykitten

Well-known member
Jul 3, 2020
2,322
1,369
113
Jesus once said to those who did not believe him, was because his words have no place in them.

That is the deciding factor.
And how does that comport with the notion of the Tulip doctrine?
 

soggykitten

Well-known member
Jul 3, 2020
2,322
1,369
113
what about our own actions ? Do we have control over those ? Not total control of our lives and everything but just our part ?
Consider the serial killer that makes news having slaughtered untold numbers of innocent women, children, or men.
If that person didn't act of their own free will and we accept nothing we do is our own, but of God, what then does it say of God when we read about a serial killer?

Deuteronomy 30:19-20 I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse. Therefore choose life, that you and your offspring may live, loving the Lord your God, obeying his voice and holding fast to him, for he is your life and length of days, that you may dwell in the land that the Lord .
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
Consider the serial killer that makes news having slaughtered untold numbers of innocent women, children, or men.
If that person didn't act of their own free will and we accept nothing we do is our own, but of God, what then does it say of God when we read about a serial killer?

Deuteronomy 30:19-20 I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse. Therefore choose life, that you and your offspring may live, loving the Lord your God, obeying his voice and holding fast to him, for he is your life and length of days, that you may dwell in the land that the Lord .
yes I agree man has free will and can serve good or evil
 
Jul 6, 2020
905
328
63
What Denomination are you member of?
Denominations -- i like 100's and 1000's but im not gonna turn my back on 20s 10s 5s and 1s. ;)

Such a loaded topic.
Denominations replace the recognition of the body of Christ according to the Spirit.
Membership replaces fellowship in the holy spirit.

My background
baptist as a kid (9 years, declared my faith and was baptized at age 8)
Parents helped plant the Church that is at about 1k now
non denom as a youth, following with mom and dad (5 years)
Street mission outreach Church as a young man at 14 Left with my Dads blessing (6 years)
international fellowship. (3 years)
Chinese Church (2 years)
College church planting 0 to about 40 in 6 months "Go Mighty Mike!"
Korean Church (4 years)
Another non denom (5 years) started by a pastor who brought it to like 50 handed it off to the junior pastor and left to the worst part of CA to do it again. (respect Daniel)
Filipino Church (1 year)
visited many others (Seeker,Apostolic, Pentecostals, synagogues)
Bible studies with cemetery students and ex satanists.
Some street preaching.
Sitting and talking with the homeless.
Reading my bible at the local bar
Reading my bible at the local coffee shop
But mostly I would say if you had to try and put where all that ended up in a little box.
If i had to choose a Denominational label it would just be
"Holiness"
in the vain of - Keith Green, David Wilkerson, Leonard Ravenhill, William J. Seymour, Charles Finney, John Wesley.

Perhaps more then you expected but your cant really reduce some ones faith to a label and actually still be dealing with an individual.
 

soggykitten

Well-known member
Jul 3, 2020
2,322
1,369
113
Denominations -- i like 100's and 1000's but im not gonna turn my back on 20s 10s 5s and 1s. ;)
I always liked the look of a $50 myself. ;)

Such a loaded topic.
Denominations replace the recognition of the body of Christ according to the Spirit.
Membership replaces fellowship in the holy spirit.

My background
baptist as a kid (9 years, declared my faith and was baptized at age 8)
Parents helped plant the Church that is at about 1k now
non denom as a youth, following with mom and dad (5 years)
Street mission outreach Church as a young man at 14 Left with my Dads blessing (6 years)
international fellowship. (3 years)
Chinese Church (2 years)
College church planting 0 to about 40 in 6 months "Go Mighty Mike!"
Korean Church (4 years)
Another non denom (5 years) started by a pastor who brought it to like 50 handed it off to the junior pastor and left to the worst part of CA to do it again. (respect Daniel)
Filipino Church (1 year)
visited many others (Seeker,Apostolic, Pentecostals, synagogues)
Bible studies with cemetery students and ex satanists.
Some street preaching.
Sitting and talking with the homeless.
Reading my bible at the local bar
Reading my bible at the local coffee shop
But mostly I would say if you had to try and put where all that ended up in a little box.
If i had to choose a Denominational label it would just be
"Holiness"
in the vain of - Keith Green, David Wilkerson, Leonard Ravenhill, William J. Seymour, Charles Finney, John Wesley.

Perhaps more then you expected but your cant really reduce some ones faith to a label and actually still be dealing with an individual.
I don't see Denominations the way you do I guess, per the last sentence in your post above. Someones faith when entered into the Denominational scope becomes linked or woven in with the Denominational doctrine. Therefore, as I see it, the individual aligning with a Denominational doctrine while holding faith in Christ becomes a two fold person. They have faith in Christ and yet the Denomination they've affiliated themselves with has set forth a precept with regard to that broad first label of, believer in Christ. And that individual has made an accord with that Denomination as one of its members.

Holiness doctrine is interesting. Lots of definitions for that path. Lots of paths too. Thank you for sharing about yourself. :)
 
Jul 6, 2020
905
328
63
I always liked the look of a $50 myself. ;)


I don't see Denominations the way you do I guess, per the last sentence in your post above. Someones faith when entered into the Denominational scope becomes linked or woven in with the Denominational doctrine. Therefore, as I see it, the individual aligning with a Denominational doctrine while holding faith in Christ becomes a two fold person. They have faith in Christ and yet the Denomination they've affiliated themselves with has set forth a precept with regard to that broad first label of, believer in Christ. And that individual has made an accord with that Denomination as one of its members.

Holiness doctrine is interesting. Lots of definitions for that path. Lots of paths too. Thank you for sharing about yourself. :)
I dont see many $50's anymore
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
1,213
113
Yes,I agree.....also with out God regenerating me,filling me with His Spirit../ testifying to my Spirit,that I am his adopted child,...I could not understand scripture as a natural human being,..my ex brother in law was a born again,as a non believer I hadn’t a clue what he was talking about.....as the Lord hadn’t regenerated me,....we become spiritual when we are born again,I understood what it was to be born again,....

But there has been a lot i also had to understand,which took time,the Lord showed me what scripture means,

My belief is.only God can lead you through scripture and open it up to you.

You are a very mature Christian,FGC,it shows in your posts,I have a lot of catching up to do,to get to your level in Christ.

That is my belief.....I’m not saying I’m right....
I am 85 years young.
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
490
83
69
and ye will not come to me .
Notice they will.....not come . John 5.39

How can ye believe, who receive glory one of another, and the glory that is coming from the only God, ye seek not?
Again their 'recieving glory from one of another... was the issue and they are not seeking God . John 5.44

mat 13 . Read the accounts of why the temporary blindness is upon ISRAEL they were disobedient first. Then God judges after . This is not a gnostic idea about some election where some special chosen ones would be selected in eterninty past and others would be born without hindu enabelment not able to be awakened at the appropriate time . Doomed from the womb ,banished at birth as Calvin put it .
You said, "
and ye will not come to me .
Notice they will.....not come . John 5.39

How can ye believe, who receive glory one of another, and the glory that is coming from the only God, ye seek not?
Again their 'recieving glory from one of another... was the issue and they are not seeking God . John 5.44"

It would seem to me you did a great job, of showing just a couple of ways in which a depraved spirit, does not seek after God.

Could not do better myself.
 

awelight

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2020
1,629
490
83
69
I always liked the look of a $50 myself. ;)


I don't see Denominations the way you do I guess, per the last sentence in your post above. Someones faith when entered into the Denominational scope becomes linked or woven in with the Denominational doctrine. Therefore, as I see it, the individual aligning with a Denominational doctrine while holding faith in Christ becomes a two fold person. They have faith in Christ and yet the Denomination they've affiliated themselves with has set forth a precept with regard to that broad first label of, believer in Christ. And that individual has made an accord with that Denomination as one of its members.

Holiness doctrine is interesting. Lots of definitions for that path. Lots of paths too. Thank you for sharing about yourself. :)
Every time I come across one of your posts, like this one, I am amazed at your insights. This time, into your understanding of prejudices that are built into ones subjective understanding over time. There is no way, that an individual, who was raised in a family of church goers, can easily get out from all the baggage that they were originally taught. That is to say, if they had been taught the wrong things in Scripture. If they were taught correctly, those things should become convictions, quickly, after they come to know the Lord.

I have never seen denominations as a good thing. Like them even less, as they move more and more towards a world church. Denominations and there conventions, voting on how they can compromise one truth after another, just so they can get along. Makes me ill.

I thank the Lord everyday, that until I was called out, I had no previous Bible teaching. Like a sponge, just soaked up Scripture as I studied. No baggage to let go of and no preconceived notions of the Truth.

Sorry, to much about me. Take care.