What does sanctification have to do with salvation?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Apr 12, 2019
97
8
8
The only one that walked this earth who was sinless was Jesus Christ. No one else has reached perfection yet.
if not perfect then one is not son of God

all sons of God perfect becoming in short time
if one cannot reach the perfection this means never been born from God


from 70 by 7 sins per day to one per year /if one of you used to make sin / and to ZERO sins - don't see anything behind me

in the church all members of her - apostles prophets teachers -are perfect and stand to make perfect everyone

otherwise wrong church
nobody perfect and perfection cannot be reachable -that's wrong doctrine
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,001
13,008
113
58
The only one that walked this earth who was sinless was Jesus Christ. No one else has reached perfection yet.
Amen! And those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. (1 John 1:8-10)
 
Apr 12, 2019
97
8
8
Amen! And those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. (1 John 1:8-10)
you are not in Christ

because -
New International Version
Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.
 
Apr 12, 2019
97
8
8
as soon one makes a sin - he is dead
if one was born again

and again there's needed rebirth - returning the life of God

if nothing happening then one never been born
when dead making sin he just reproducing death and does not see the difference before making sin and after sin has been done
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
if not perfect then one is not son of God


You're not perfect, you still fail. If we were perfect this would be heaven. Last time I checked, it ain't.



all sons of God perfect becoming in short time
if one cannot reach the perfection this means never been born from God


If you speak English, please use proper sentences. Very hard to understand if you don't. No, we do not have perfection this side of heaven. You are not perfectly sinless. If those that walked with Christ, His apostles, didn't achieve perfection, you haven't.


from 70 by 7 sins per day to one per year /if one of you used to make sin / and to ZERO sins - don't see anything behind me

I haven't the foggiest idea what you are saying. If you're trying to say God doesn't see our sin because of Christs shed blood, I'd agree. Still doesn't mean we're sinless and perfect.


in the church all members of her - apostles prophets teachers -are perfect and stand to make perfect everyone


No not even close. We are human, we still fail. It doesn't matter who we are.

otherwise wrong church
nobody perfect and perfection cannot be reachable -that's wrong doctrine

No one in any church is without sin and perfect, has nothing to do with the church. It's you who has the wrong doctrine. You are not sinless. You need a Savior just like everyone else here.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,001
13,008
113
58
you are not in Christ

because -
New International Version
Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.
1 John 2:6 - the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked. (NASB)

Are you saying that only those who live a sinless, perfect life 100% of the time are in Christ? According to your logic, that would exclude these babes in Christ in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, in which the apostle Paul said there was envy, strife, and divisions among them and they were acting carnal/behaving like mere men. Is that living as Jesus did according to your standards? :unsure:

These babes in Christ needed to grow up/mature which is a process. Also, in Galatians 2:11-15, we read that the apostle Peter withdrew and separated himself from the Gentiles, fearing those who were of the circumcision (Jews) and the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy. They were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel. Is that living as Jesus did according to your standards? Was the apostle Peter not in Christ as well? :unsure:
 
Apr 12, 2019
97
8
8
1 John 2:6 - the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked. (NASB)

Are you saying that only those who live a sinless, perfect life 100% of the time are in Christ? According to your logic, that would exclude these babes in Christ in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, in which the apostle Paul said there was envy, strife, and divisions among them and they were acting carnal/behaving like mere men. Is that living as Jesus did according to your standards? :unsure:

These babes in Christ needed to grow up/mature which is a process. Also, in Galatians 2:11-15, we read that the apostle Peter withdrew and separated himself from the Gentiles, fearing those who were of the circumcision (Jews) and the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy. They were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel. Is that living as Jesus did according to your standards? Was the apostle Peter not in Christ as well? :unsure:
what about such babes having 33 and 55 years old ?
you have seen around such babes in flesh ?

how much time do you believe already ?

10 20 30 40 50 years ?

by the time you have to be teachers - teacher is perfect

if not perfect -cannot be teacher of perfection
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,001
13,008
113
58
what about such babes having 33 and 55 years old ?
you have seen around such babes in flesh ?

how much time do you believe already ?

10 20 30 40 50 years ?

by the time you have to be teachers - teacher is perfect

if not perfect -cannot be teacher of perfection
Regardless of time lines on maturity, do you believe that ONLY those who live a sinless, perfect life 100% of the time are in Christ? :unsure:
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,259
431
83
what about such babes having 33 and 55 years old ?
you have seen around such babes in flesh ? how much time do you believe already ? 10 20 30 40 50 years ?

by the time you have to be teachers - teacher is perfect if not perfect -cannot be teacher of perfection
Perfect:
Matt 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
we are said to be perfect, as he is perfect

Perfect, Thayer's Greek #5046 [ teleioi ] 'complete,'

Perfect, Strong's #5049 teleios "having reached its end" (telos), "finished, complete, perfect

Perfect, Mounce's Definition perfect, mature, finished, complete

Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
(NOTE: All believers, IN HIM, are complete/perfect. Not because of how great & sinless perfect we are. But, because of how great & sinless perfect He is. It's called imputed righteousness. Read Romans chapter 4. Pay special attention to verses 22-25)
 
Apr 11, 2019
65
43
18
What a great salvation we have been brought close to. Summed up in three words, Salvation, sanctification, and glorification.

Salvation is free, glorification is also a gift. What of sanctification in the life of the believer?
Many who make the claim that they are saved by Grace through Faith when confronted with the question of sanctification say it is to get them ready for Heaven. This however is not the purpose of sanctification. There are also many arguments as to what Sanctification is. One says it is also only a gift and another says it is from obedience.
Sanctification is to be set apart by obedience through faith. Just as Salvation comes by way of grace through faith.

Sanctification is the process of being made Holy through the Word of Elohim. What does scripture say about Holiness? It says no-one can see the Kingdom without Holiness. Also it says that in the end days people who have an appearance of Holiness but reject the power of the word to make them holy.
So what advantage does living a life of sanctification do for the believer? It is proof that they are saved and working towards the good goal and promise of glorification. Does it only do this? No. The over all purpose I believe is for our neighbors and friends. That is the example of Messiah lived out through the life of the sanctified believers has shown others what life we are to live today. A person is not saved through sanctification, rather if a person does set their needs, wants, and desires aside for the Kingdom they most assuredly are saved already. These "Good Works" are the only good works because they come from the Father who is the only Good One.
Shalom in Messiah
John Talmid
We ARE sanctified!

1 Corinthians 6:11 KJV
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

We are saved (if we trust Christ) yet we are being saved in this life. We are sanctified in Christ however we are to still sanctify things and be sanctified.

1 Peter 3:15 KJV
[15] But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
We ARE sanctified but we are I also sanctify the Lord God in our hearts.

Folks who are born again are sanctified with “his own blood”.

Hebrews 13:12 KJV
[12] Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

We have a soul, a spirit, and a body which makes us “whole”. God wants us sanctified “wholly”.

1 Thessalonians 5:23 KJV
[23] And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

What does sanctify mean according to scripture! Make certain to provide scripture for your teachings.
The Lord Jesus Christ uses his words to “sanctify and cleanse”

Ephesians 5:25-26 KJV
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; [26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

We are sanctified by Gods words; which is the TRUTH! The words of God are for sanctification not good works nor anything else. It’s a heart issue!

John 17:17 KJV
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

God blessed the seventh day and “sanctified” it. This is the first usage of the word in any form (sanctify, sanctified, sanctification, etc) in scripture. Sanctification has to do with cleansing and washing! Both testaments testify of this.

Genesis 2:3 KJV
[3] And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Christians are sanctified and commanded of God.

Isaiah 13:3 KJV
[3] I have commanded my sanctified ones, I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, even them that rejoice in my highness.

God “commanded his SANCTIFIED ones”. They ARE presently sanctified.

John 17:17-19 KJV
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. [18] As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. [19] And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

Our Savour says we are “sanctied” through the truth and Gods “word is truth”! There’s no way around these passages.

Acts 20:32 KJV
[32] And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.

Again, we (saved folks) are sanctified presently, right now!!!

Acts 26:18 KJV
[18] To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Folks have wrote long extensive paragraphs teaching the “Bible” on this forum, yet most NEVER give scripture references for the doctrines they teach. A great example would be this post in sanctification! Who gave scripture for what they are teaching?

If it ain’t coming from Gods words then it is (Col 2:8) “philosophy and vain deceit” and it’s after “the rudiments if the world and not after Christ”. I’m amazed at how many Christians claim all this faith in God yet they know very little scripture that supports these beliefs. “Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God” our faith is in “the holy scriptures” (of course the gospel is part of his words) rather than our own understanding. NEVER follow your heart.

Proverbs 28:26 KJV
[26] He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool: but whoso walketh wisely, he shall be delivered.

Your heart WILL DECEIVE YOU!

Psalm 7:9 KJV
[9] Oh let the wickedness of the wicked come to an end; but establish the just: for the righteous God trieth the hearts and reins.

God “trieth” our hearts because they are “desperately wicked”.
Jeremiah 17:9 KJV
[9] The heart is deceitful above all things , and desperately wicked: who can know it?

Our OWN heart will deceive us and defile us!

Matthew 15:18-20 KJV
[18] But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. [19] For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: [20] These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

Mark 7:20-23 KJV
[20] And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. [21] For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, [22] Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: [23] All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

Like Job, our hearts walk “after mine eyes”




Job 31:7 KJV
[7] If my step hath turned out of the way, and mine heart walked after mine eyes, and if any blot hath cleaved to mine hands;

Jeremiah 7:24 KJV
[24] But they hearkened not, nor inclined their ear, but walked in the counsels and in the imagination of their evil heart, and went backward, and not forward.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
if not perfect then one is not son of God

all sons of God perfect becoming in short time
if one cannot reach the perfection this means never been born from God


from 70 by 7 sins per day to one per year /if one of you used to make sin / and to ZERO sins - don't see anything behind me

in the church all members of her - apostles prophets teachers -are perfect and stand to make perfect everyone

otherwise wrong church
nobody perfect and perfection cannot be reachable -that's wrong doctrine
The spirits of just men were made perfect by GOD.A person gets saved and then after that because of the mercy GOD showed us by making the spirits of just men perfect we should present our bodies a living sacrifice and not conform to this world but be transformed by renewing our minds to that perfect will of GOD.
+++
Ephesians 2:10
King James Version

10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
+++
So then perfection that you are talking about when It comes to those that are In the body of CHRIST would be talking about our walk while on earth In this body or progressive sanctification.

Ephesians 4:11-13
King James Version


11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
piroma, post: 3904296, member: 283449"]why you need to follow me ?
why do you not need to follow Scripture ?

votre compréhension de ce que j'ai dit est faux.
suivre ici signifie comprendre. Je ne vous suis pas du tout.




is it not the Holy Scripture says that who is born from God cannot sin ?

what's wrong and what is not English ?
bible text not English enough ?
Yes- it is translations


sans blague
J'ai utilisé Google Translate et ce n'est pas parfait.


i have studied the bible in ancient Greek
the other languages not important for the truth- only to repeat and pass it through
but the understanding first from the Ancient Greek

to read the biblical texts one needs to think being compelled by spiritual logic -it is not novels but spiritual language

i just repeated the Scripture in some manner not distorting the sense of what is being cited

-------------

which God is not without sin ?
the devil ?
yes

i was speaking about God which created the heavens and the earth


vous êtes trop sarcastique pour quelqu'un qui ne parle même pas anglais profiter du forum

but perhaps you do not speak French...so many migrants :unsure: the translated English does not sound like the thinking of a French person..could be wrong...but
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
What does sanctification have to do with salvation?

I really didn't understand what you meant In post 108 when you said are they going to ask?I'm thinking somebody might ask that question,pretty simple.

well what did you think of the words of Christ remaining in the Vine...that is what you said you disgreed with

my eyesight is very good. giant letters do not improve it
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
well what did you think of the words of Christ remaining in the Vine...that is what you said you disgreed with

my eyesight is very good. giant letters do not improve it
I think the scripture about remaining In the vine Is talking about salvation AND not sanctification.
IE
It's a thunderstorm outside and there Is somewhere someone Is telling you to be when the thunderstorm shows up.
Go there and remain there.

Not go there and work but go there where you will be safe.
+++
The big words are just there so when I'm looking at a post,I will know the name of the thread,I didn't mean to offend anyone by It.If I'm offending anyone by doing that,I apologize.
 
Apr 12, 2019
97
8
8
No,wrong way around, Christ enters us.
following the commandments -this is entering into Him

and may be He will enter if successful fulfillment of commandments happened

to know that He is inside - by HoSP


but these are fragments

to be opened for the mystery of Christ in somebody - there is process of building the new creature - in new creature Christ will appear

first -crucifixion of old one