What exactly is faith?

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KelbyofGod

Senior Member
Oct 8, 2017
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#41
Faith is a noun Belief is a verb. To say you have faith and not demonstrate the faith you claim to have is no faith at all.
Wow. I like that!

I hesitate to call it "no faith" but rather would call it dead faith. Like a dead seed vs. a viable seed. A dead seed is still a seed...It's just never going to produce fruit. That's what faith without works is... dead faith. (James 2:20)

Love in Jesus,
Kelby
 

Runningman

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2020
997
873
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#42
What is the difference between faith and believing?

Hebrews tells us...

1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

By faith the elders obtained a dood report.

We also know in Romans 10...

17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Faith begins with the hearing of God’s word.

Thoughts?
I think the difference between belief and faith has to do with trust. I know people who believe Jesus was a real person but they don't trust what He said. They are believing He existsed, but are not having faith that what He said is entirely accurate.

The disciples of Jesus were given supernatural Holy Spirit gifts to exercise in their ministry. Why? Because being shown that something is real is a lot more powerful than simply being told it is real. It isn't a party trick, this is about getting God some glory.

The written word of God, the Bible, is useful for the Holy Spirit to convict people of sin, righteousness, and judgement.

So how is it even possible believe that Jesus was crucified, rose from the dead, then ascended to heaven? Because faith is a gift from God.

1 Corinthians 1:18-31 says the message of the cross is the power of God to salvation for all who believe and that through the the wisdom of the world we cannot know Him.

30It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption.
 

KelbyofGod

Senior Member
Oct 8, 2017
1,275
499
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#43
Faith is a noun Belief is a verb. To say you have faith and not demonstrate the faith you claim to have is no faith at all.
I may tend towards over-analysis so please forgive my clarification(s) on my earlier reply.

1) I love the fact of noun vs. verb.

2) On the second part it's not that you have to demonstrate for anyone who says you have to... (otherwise Jesus would have needed to jump when Satan told him to cast himself down) BUT... when God calls the person to put their faith into action (which he will do) that's where the tares are separated from the wheat. (Think 3 Hebrew children in Daniel,-or-King Saul when called to destroy the Amalekites -and- Israel facing Goliath vs. David facing Goliath) Just sharing that for additional thought, not argument

Love in Jesus,
Kelby
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
2,174
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#44
Faith is a noun Belief is a verb. To say you have faith and not demonstrate the faith you claim to have is no faith at all.
Yes, but I can believe something without demonstrating that I believe it. Yes?
 

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2018
6,600
6,325
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#45
'Now Faith is ......'
Faith brings belief to the present. 'I believe I am healed' is indefinite. Jesus said 'your Faith has made you whole' is now. This is acting, if you will, like God's Word is absolutely true w/o any doubt. That is my goal as we are told 'to fight the good fight of Faith'.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
6,474
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#46
Yes, but I can believe something without demonstrating that I believe it. Yes?
the context of "belief"/ Believe: biblically, is not an intellectual acknowledgment, or acceptance. it is acting on what you faith have in.
When some says I believe in God so do devils, to accept the exsistance of a deity is not biblical faith. the faith that cause one to Belive is to become, belong , and assimilate to the very nature of the Living God.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
17,208
1,729
113
#47
What is the difference between faith and believing?

Hebrews tells us...

1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

By faith the elders obtained a dood report.

We also know in Romans 10...

17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Faith begins with the hearing of God’s word.

Thoughts?
I think this is a very amazing topic to discuss. I think you are spot on about this and honestly lately I have been pondering the word of faith movement which as I am sure you know relies solely on faith not just believing but expecting.

Now as for faith itself I understand that it is not a wish granting currency and lack faith is often used for not receiving but in essence faith is recieving the unseen and the hoped for believing is not the same thing.

I admit that the word of faith is a cult if it ever was a true production of faith it has lost it's way long ago but I did experience something when I was in the hospital for eight days I had no clue when I could leave and was experiencing panic attacks because of my history with cancer hospitals terrify me but i met a man there who I bonded with almopst instantly and he told me about the word of faith and how he has seen it work many times in his experience except he told me the false doctrines of the wpord faith are evil and occult perverted by satan and told me that the word of faith is exactly what faith is the product of the unseen and hoped for and that the word of faith is not a wish granting thing but rather a product of living in his promise only using the word of faith when he places it in your spirit as to not abuse it

He then wanted me to try it and since I had no clue when I could leave the hospital and had to continuously do breathing ezxercises to not let my panic attacks get the better of me I began having one starting seeing stars couldn't breath my heart was in severe pain and I said to God ok Father if this is real then I will trust you this one time on this and said that I would be leaving today and ten minutes later the doctor came in and said I was finally leaving I looked to the man both wildered and skeptical and as I was getting ready to leave the speakers were calling all the nurses about a code blue which means a patient has stopped breathing I was so scared for this person and it was so heavy on my heart and I could only say Father please.... hoping he would intervene again using the word of faith and as soon as I did suddenly the code blue was called off and all the nurses were really confused.

Now I am not saying I believe in the word faith but it did peak my interest about it and by denifition faith is exactly what the word of faith is supposed to represent

I apolagize for making this thread about the wof I just read your p[ost and all this flooded my mind
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
8,275
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#48
Yes, but I can believe something without demonstrating that I believe it. Yes?
James 2:23

“And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Is that this part ?

And here ?
Romans 4
3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
but then he was justified by his works . Which for us is just 'believe ' ?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
8,275
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#50
Our faith doesn’t have to be “made perfect” by anything you do or don’t do . You have already received “the END of your faith, even the salvation of your souls” (1 Pet. 1:9).
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
8,275
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#51
Wow. I like that!

I hesitate to call it "no faith" but rather would call it dead faith. Like a dead seed vs. a viable seed. A dead seed is still a seed...It's just never going to produce fruit. That's what faith without works is... dead faith. (James 2:20)

Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Do you think Lot’s WORKS matched his FAITH? Like what? How many “works” did David have to have to prove he had “live faith”? What if they had not been enough to “offset” his lack of WORKS (pretending to be crazy, lying to the high priest, running from Saul, refusing to punish Absalom, killing an innocent man, taking that man’s wife from him, firing Joab in anger, making a military alliance with the Philistines, refusing to execute Joab (who earned two capital punishments according to the Law—Abner and Amasa, etc.). Is that “living faith”?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
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#52
When some says I believe in God so do devils, to accept the exsistance of a deity is not biblical faith. the faith that cause one to Belive is to become, belong , and assimilate to the very nature of the Living God.
The verse actually says that the devils believe there is one God. That belief won’t get you anywhere.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
2,174
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#53
James 2:23

“And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Is that this part ?

And here ?
Romans 4
3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
but then he was justified by his works . Which for us is just 'believe ' ?
His faith was justified by works. Abraham’s faith was completed or made perfect whe he offered up Isaac.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
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#54
Was Abraham Justified after approx 10 years after his imputed righteousness?
James 2
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
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#55
Our faith doesn’t have to be “made perfect” by anything you do or don’t do . You have already received “the END of your faith, even the salvation of your souls” (1 Pet. 1:9).
And actually, we are justified by the faith of Jesus Christ. His was obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
6,474
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#56
His faith was justified by works. Abraham’s faith was completed or made perfect whe he offered up Isaac.
Abraham Obeyed God it was account to him as righteousness. Abraham had faith inGod which he did what God said to do.
 

NOV25

Active member
Nov 23, 2019
463
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43
#57
What do you see as the difference between having faith and believing?
Even the demons believe, but this is t saving faith obviously James 2:19. Saving faith is a gift Ephesians 2:8
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
6,474
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#58
The verse actually says that the devils believe there is one God. That belief won’t get you anywhere.
Actually it doesn't say that. james 2:19-223 says :

19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called the friend of God.

the point made yes the lord God is ONE, devil knows this, but faith and belief is not just knowing and accepting it is real or God is one God,

it is as Abraham did, He obeyed God because HE believed HE is God and offered his son in obedience to God That is faith in action which is Biblical belief.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
6,474
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#59
Even the demons believe, but this is t saving faith obviously James 2:19. Saving faith is a gift Ephesians 2:8
read on. james 2:19 doesn't give you the whole context .
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
11,748
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#60
Abraham Obeyed God it was account to him as righteousness. Abraham had faith inGod which he did what God said to do.
Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.