What is Amillennialism? By Michael J. Vlach, Ph.D.

[Lifelike]

the ONLY thing Rev 20 says satan is bound from doing is :

TO DECEIVE THE NATIONS.
(to gather them to battle against Christ's church).

it does NOT say he is unable to do a whole list of others things.

there's one thing he is unable to do until he is released: DECEIVE the NATIONS (to make war with Christ and destroy the church).

that's it.....so there's just no need to list all the things he IS ALLOWED to do, he's still allowed to do them, and does.

Mmm being grabbed by a massive angel and thrown into a bottomless pit, and chained, and having the door slammed shut and sealed, wouldnt allow for you to do much at all I would imagine. At this point also many were raised from the dead (The first ressurection), to reign with Christ for the 1,000 years.

 

[zone]

Mmm being grabbed by a massive angel and thrown into a bottomless pit, and chained, and having the door slammed shut and sealed, wouldnt allow for you to do much at all I would imagine. At this point also many were raised from the dead (The first ressurection), to reign with Christ for the 1,000 years.

huh.
i wonder how he gets out eventually since the pit is bottomless (?)
oh well.

we'll be sure to recognize him since he is red and has 7 heads.

 

[Lifelike]

good job.
you've shown the two passages that describe the same event.
satan is only restrained from stirring up the unsaved to persecute and kill the saints at the very end of the age (during his short space).

see 2 Thessalonians 2 also ('and now you know what witholdeth that he might be revealed in his time')....same binding, describes his short space.

he was "bound" from wiping out the church at the Death Burial, Resurrection and Ascension of Christ....and will not be able to stir up the final war until he is realsed to do so, just at the end.

So he has been bound for over 2,000 years now?

 

[zone]

So he has been bound for over 2,000 years now?

why don't you look into it yourself?

 

[Lifelike]

well, it is given to him BY GOD to make war with the saints, and to overcome them.

the whole point is that we have already overcome him and the world, by what Christ Our Righteousness has done for us, and by our testimony of Jesus. when we are killed by the world, this works their judgment, and our reward.

Jesus has overcome the world, we are still yet to overcome, and must perservere til the end. Then those than overcome will be crowned. Jesus has made it a sure thing, in that He has already overcome, but we are in the process of overcoming, and it is by the word of our testimony of Jesus. Hence the battle is still in progress.

most will be killed, though as Paul told us in 1 Thess, not all will die, some will be alive at the Second Coming...

"not all will die" here explains that every man is appointed to die, and in natural course all do die (currently). But in the end time those that are living when Christ returns will not taste natural death but will be changed, and those that have died will be raised from the dead. It does not imply that most will die in this period but not all. The bible explains that through the wrath God will preserve His saints (Through much of the judgement - this judgement is for the wicked) - although there will be a period where the anti christ will be given power to kill many christians, and saints that are martyred through this period will be raised to a higher reward.

 

[zone]

Jesus has overcome the world, we are still yet to overcome, and must perservere til the end. Then those than overcome will be crowned. Jesus has made it a sure thing, in that He has already overcome, but we are in the process of overcoming, and it is by the word of our testimony of Jesus. Hence the battle is still in progress.



"not all will die" here explains that every man is appointed to die, and in natural course all do die (currently). But in the end time those that are living when Christ returns will not taste natural death but will be changed, and those that have died will be raised from the dead. It does not imply that most will die in this period but not all. The bible explains that through the wrath God will preserve His saints (Through much of the judgement - this judgement is for the wicked) - although there will be a period where the anti christ will be given power to kill many christians, and saints that are martyred through this period will be raised to a higher reward.

oh ok.
thanks for just rephrasing what i said.

 

[Lifelike]

i believe in the tribulation and all those lying signs and wonders, EG.
amillennialism doesn't deny the eschaton.

its just that the trib won't be 7 years long...at least, if it is, it won't be because the 70th week has been severed and placed at the end.

i can't be certain, haven't spend enough time on it yet, but Rev suggests two different possible time frames: 3 and 1/2 years, and there's another reference to 5 months.

I have heard the 70th week preached to mean: The first 3 1/2 years is from the time Christ began His ministry until His crucifixion resulting in the sacrifices ceasing (officially before God) and that the other 3 1/2 years continue straight on from that and relate to the gospel being preached to the jews until they had fully rejected it, and at this time the revelation was given to Paul and Peter that the message was to now to go to the gentiles. The 'time' of the jews had ended completing the '70 week' prophecy and the time of the Gentiles had begun. Makes sense.

 

[Lifelike]

there's the BINDING/RESTRAINING RIGHT THERE.

Paul said satan is restrained (its the very same as the 'bound' in Rev 20, and Jesus's "binding" of the "strongman" while his house is plundered). Paul says he will be released...this chapter concerns the eschaton.

There can be great debate, and is, over what this chapter concerns. It relates to the daniel prophecy concerning powers (nations), and relates to the restraining of the anti christ power that was to arise from the roman empire at the time that it divided into 10 kingdoms, causing 3 of the 10 kingdoms to be uprooted and destroyed. This has already happened in history, and the anti christ power is already in operation, from what I can see.

 

[Lifelike]

AMEN!

exactly!!!

if we are TOLD this will happen why is it so hard to remain vigilant and resist those things (running after false prophets etc)?

Just because there will be false teachers and prophets in the end time doesnt mean there wont be true. There was false teachers, apostle and prophets at the time of the true in the early church.

 

[Lifelike]

huh.
i wonder how he gets out eventually since the pit is bottomless (?)
oh well.

we'll be sure to recognize him since he is red and has 7 heads.

He gets released...

 

[zone]

Just because there will be false teachers and prophets in the end time doesnt mean there wont be true. There was false teachers, apostle and prophets at the time of the true in the early church.

well, i know you believe yourself to be an Apostle, so naturally you would have to leave this door open.

the office ended with Paul, and John was the last one alive that we are aware of.

and there are no more prophets.

sorry.

 

[zone]

There can be great debate, and is, over what this chapter concerns. It relates to the daniel prophecy concerning powers (nations), and relates to the restraining of the anti christ power that was to arise from the roman empire at the time that it divided into 10 kingdoms, causing 3 of the 10 kingdoms to be uprooted and destroyed. This has already happened in history, and the anti christ power is already in operation, from what I can see.

oh i see. right.
satan is fully in operation right now.
right.

its during the future 1,000 years he is in the abyss.

what happens in the millennium exactly? can you tell me? anything at all?

 

[Lifelike]

well, i know you believe yourself to be an Apostle, so naturally you would have to leave this door open.

the office ended with Paul, and John was the last one alive that we are aware of.

and there are no more prophets.

sorry.

Im not an Apostle lol.

 

[Lifelike]

oh i see. right.
satan is fully in operation right now.
right.

its during the future 1,000 years he is in the abyss.

what happens in the millennium exactly? can you tell me? anything at all?

Well thats what the bible says...

 

[phil36]

27 And if I drive out demons by Beelzebul, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. 28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I drive out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. 29 “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house.

 

[zone]

Im not an Apostle lol.

sorry. a prophet then?

you do sit under/fellowship with Apostles, though?

how is they do not know the eschaton in full detail, having it fallibly revealed to them? they are receiving new revelation, correct?

according to official NAR policy, it is the modern office of Apostle working with modern prophets to correct the doctrines of the church and admonish and establish leadership.

do they have any authoritative epistles out yet? i really need to see them.

 

[zone]

Well thats what the bible says...

ok. then could you tell where in the bible i can find disclosure of the events and purpose of the future millennium please?

 

[Scotth1960]

lol how do u guys rite all these man

While not specifically using the terminology "amillennial", the Eastern Orthodox Church holds the view "of His [Christ's] Kingdom there is no end (there shall be no end)". Nicene Constantinopolitan Creed of 381 AD.
Premillennialism rejected by the Second Ecumenical Council in 381 AD, Of the EOC.
God bless you.
In Erie PA Scott R. Harrington

 

[Lifelike]

sorry. a prophet then?

you do sit under/fellowship with Apostles, though?

how is they do not know the eschaton in full detail, having it fallibly revealed to them? they are receiving new revelation, correct?

according to official NAR policy, it is the modern office of Apostle working with modern prophets to correct the doctrines of the church and admonish and establish leadership.

do they have any authoritative epistles out yet? i really need to see them.

Yes I'm called as a prophet. Yes I believe that the office of apostle did not cease with the early church and that it is for today. Im not sure what you mean by "new revelation" I believe the word of God, the whole word of God, and that should be the basis of all revelation. God does not contradict Himself, and God still speaks today. You have a warped idea of what an apostles is, and an extremely religious mindset. A modern day prophet or apostle would, as should any leader in the church, confront falsity and error, including doctrinal error, if it does not line up with the word of God. Many in the churches still adhere to doctrines of men, doctrines of demons, doctrines that have made their way into the church and are extra biblical, and have no foundation in scripture or have been introduced due to compromise, or selfish ambition, these should be removed from our lives because the mixture is not pleasing to God and does not represent Him correctly. Likewise many of the beliefs and teachings of the early church apostles and Christ Himself been minimized today and we are in many ways off track (I include the charismatic and pentecostal expressions in the assertion). It is the purpose of God during our lifetime to return correct order to His church, and to have a people that are single-hearted in devotion toward Him, and that are free from oppression of the enemy and healed, full of Him and demonstrating the kingdom like He did.

 

[Lifelike]

ok. then could you tell where in the bible i can find disclosure of the events and purpose of the future millennium please?

Just because the bible doesnt go into finite detail about what will take place in the millenium does not mean its not a future event.. It doesnt go into that kind of detail with the eternity we will spend with Christ in heaven either, does that mean its happening now and its not a futuure event?