What is Scripture?

[posthuman]

By other he means all of the scriptures. He didn’t say the other letters. Paul’s letters aren’t referred to as scriptures anywhere so I don’t think that’s good enough to lump Paul’s letters into the scripture category.

I see what you’re saying. You’re trying to deduce or infer based off of one word that Peter said Paul’s letters are scriptures. Honestly that really isn’t clear. There aren’t any other verses that even hint at what you’re saying.

It doesn't make sense for Peter to say "other" if he really meant "all" or "the only" - he would have just said, "just as they do with the scripture"


This is a very well known verse that's very commonly used to show Paul's writings are scripture. It's not my interpretation but a pretty much universally accepted one - so I was bringing it up because if you're right, it's a point that needs to be addressed: what's the word "other" doing there?

Your answer so far isnt dealing with that word tho. Other doesn't mean all. Other implies an equivocation.

 

[peldom10]

It doesn't make sense for Peter to say "other" if he really meant "all" or "the only" - he would have just said, "just as they do with the scripture"


This is a very well known verse that's very commonly used to show Paul's writings are scripture. It's not my interpretation but a pretty much universally accepted one - so I was bringing it up because if you're right, it's a point that needs to be addressed: what's the word "other" doing there?

Your answer so far isnt dealing with that word tho. Other doesn't mean all. Other implies an equivocation.

This was assembled for another purpose...but, you get the point;

2 Timothy 3:16 ESV / 301 helpful votes
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
Romans 15:4 ESV / 158 helpful votes
For whatever was written in former days was written for our instruction, that through endurance and through the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.
Romans 10:17 ESV / 144 helpful votes
So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.
Matthew 24:35 ESV / 106 helpful votes
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.
Isaiah 55:11 ESV / 94 helpful votes
So shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it.
Joshua 1:8 ESV / 89 helpful votes
This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night, so that you may be careful to do according to all that is written in it. For then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success.
Psalm 119:105 ESV / 86 helpful votes
Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path.
Hebrews 4:12-14 ESV / 84 helpful votes
For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account. Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.
Psalm 19:7-11 ESV / 80 helpful votes
The law of the Lord is perfect, reviving the soul; the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple; the precepts of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart; the commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes; the fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever; the rules of the Lord are true, and righteous altogether. More to be desired are they than gold, even much fine gold; sweeter also than honey and drippings of the honeycomb. Moreover, by them is your servant warned; in keeping them there is great reward.
Matthew 4:4 ESV / 73 helpful votes
But he answered, “It is written, “‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”
Psalm 119:9 ESV / 68 helpful votes
How can a young man keep his way pure? By guarding it according to your word.
Jeremiah 23:29 ESV / 66 helpful votes
Is not my word like fire, declares the Lord, and like a hammer that breaks the rock in pieces?
Matthew 22:29 ESV / 61 helpful votes
But Jesus answered them, “You are wrong, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God.
Isaiah 40:8 ESV / 55 helpful votes
The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever.
Hebrews 4:12 ESV / 53 helpful votes
For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
John 17:17 ESV / 48 helpful votes
Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.
Hebrews 2:1 ESV / 47 helpful votes
Therefore we must pay much closer attention to what we have heard, lest we drift away from it.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 ESV / 46 helpful votes
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.
Jeremiah 15:16 ESV / 45 helpful votes
Your words were found, and I ate them, and your words became to me a joy and the delight of my heart, for I am called by your name, O Lord, God of hosts.

 

[Polar]

I guess I'll just bore everyone and ask for the third time what we do with the NT if it isn't scripture?

I'm talking to the op especially but anyone agreeing with him, might care to take that on.

WHAT DO WE DO WITH THE NEW TESTAMENT IF YOU DO NOT CONSIDER IT INSPIRED BY GOD?

That needs to be answered.

 

[peldom10]

I guess I'll just bore everyone and ask for the third time what we do with the NT if it isn't scripture?

I'm talking to the op especially but anyone agreeing with him, might care to take that on.

WHAT DO WE DO WITH THE NEW TESTAMENT IF YOU DO NOT CONSIDER IT INSPIRED BY GOD?

That needs to be answered.

Suggest you change the question wording.
It is a dangling participle.

 

[Polar]

Suggest you change the question wording.
It is a dangling participle.

What is dangling, is the answer to the question I asked.

 

[Polar]

The Old Testament never refers to the New Testament as scripture

The depth of this statement is beyond comprehension.

 

[Live4Him3]

Scripture is written by “inspiration of God.”

Yes, it most certainly is.

Here's a question for you:

Was the book of Revelation, for example, "written by inspiration of God"?

Let's see now...

Revelation chapter 1

[1] The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
[2] Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
[3] Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
[4] John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
[5] And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
[6] And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
[7] Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
[8] I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
[9] I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
[10] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
[11] Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

For crying out loud, man, God the Father gave Jesus Christ a revelation after he was risen from the dead, and Jesus, in turn, sent the same to John via an angel. John was clearly instructed by Jesus Christ to write the same in a book and to send it to the churches.

Does THIS match the definition of what "scripture" is or not?

I'm almost afraid to see your reply...

 

[JohnDB]

A LOT of people slice and dice scriptures to their own liking just because they want God to transform to their thoughts instead of the other way around.

Popular trends today are to include religious fiction works as authoritative and divinely inspired writings.
Then there is the ignoring of certain sections of scripture like prophesy because they are "divisive".
Then there's the ever popular "conspiracy theories" about how we came up with the New Testament Scriptures.

But the truth be told...I have read the "Lost Letters of Paul" that never made it to the level of Scripture...and they are a conglomeration of things said in other letters of Paul except worded very differently as the popular ones today...and so much of what people do with the scriptures Paul wrote are ridiculous.

But the answer is the same as always...
People like to invent their own God.
Always have.
I tend to think they always will.

 

[Live4Him3]

I guess I'll just bore everyone and ask for the third time what we do with the NT if it isn't scripture?

I'm talking to the op especially but anyone agreeing with him, might care to take that on.

WHAT DO WE DO WITH THE NEW TESTAMENT IF YOU DO NOT CONSIDER IT INSPIRED BY GOD?

That needs to be answered.

Kind of makes you wonder who is inspiring the people who claim the same, doesn't it?

Sounds just like "that old serpent" to me.

You know, "Yeah, hath God said..."

I wouldn't stand too close to these people on the day of judgment if I were you.

 

[Live4Him3]

What is dangling, is the answer to the question I asked.

I'll go a step further.

The people who are questioning the authority of God's word are "dangling" over hell.

Yeah, I said it, and fully meant it.

 

[Polar]

I wouldn't stand too close to these people on the day of judgment if I were you.

I've never been pushy. I like to leave space between myself and whoever/whatever in case I need a quick exit

The people who are questioning the authority of God's word are "dangling" over hell.

Well, there is the fact they already consider that it is not God's word.

I just came across some guy, Keith Giles, who heads up something called The Patheos Progressive Christian and he makes the op look like a good Christian Apologist. I was thinking I've pretty much come across all the weirdness but I was wrong. Very wrong.

 

[Live4Him3]

And what about Paul's epistles?

Were they "inspired by God"?

Galatians chapter 1

[10] For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.
[11] But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
[12] For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Did Paul consider his gospel to be the word of God?

Let's see:

I Thessalonians chapter 2

[13] For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.

 

[Live4Him3]

Are the written commandments of the Lord scripture or not?

I Corinthians chapter 14

[37] If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
[38] But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

 

[Runningman]

amen that’s how the Bible is designed the old testsment is prophetic , the new testament is fulfillment of those prophecies

the New Testament To us now is scripture like the apostles epistles whether Peter or Paul they were filled with the holy ghost speaking by the spirit more revealed than the scripture in the ot

the New Testament is revelation of what the Old Testament was talking about all along

to us now the gospel has become what the Books of Moses we’re to the Israelites the beginning of thier relationship with God d a record of what God has said and the terms he has set d promises he’s offered


if you ask yourself “ was Jesus speaking by the holy spirit “ we’re the apostles speaking by the spirit ? The. We’re the prophets speaking by the same spirit ? Was the law by the same spirit ?

it’s all scripture To us now is my point to the Jews of those days and even gentile converts the new testsment scriptire hadn’t been written yet they were living it out

so correct when scripture is referenced the new testsment is always referring to the old testsment writings . But for us today it’s all god inspired scripture

Absolutely agree with everything you said. You seem to really know the Bible and respect the facts in it. I see there are a lot of people who seem to have a problem with that. Oh well, I guess the truth hurts sometimes. Thanks for being real as always.

 

[Runningman]

Even though you are given a scriptural reference that shows your conclusion is incorrect, you remain embedded in your own opinion.

I see this more and more in people who offer scripture they have hand picked to create, as it were, some kind of aha moment that they have to share, and it turns out it is simply their own opinion and they fully intend to reside in it come what may. shrugs

Hmmm I don’t think so. You were given scripture that showed you were incorrect and decided not to change your mind.

You showed me a single verse that says Paul’s letters are letters and that there are scriptures that aren’t his letters. Do you have anything else to help your false theory?

 

[Runningman]

I am currently wondering what denom does not accept the New Testament as scripture? Anybody know?

Be careful because Jesus only recognized the Old Testament as scripture. You’re walking a fine line on blasphemy.

 

[fredoheaven]

Scripture is written by “inspiration of God.”

Once you understand that, when you read 2 Timothy 3:16,17 it’s clearer what scripture actually is:

2 Tim. 3:15,16 KJV
15And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

When the New Testament writers wrote something about doctrine, reproof, correction, and instruction in righteousness they didn’t just make something up and call it scripture. They were using Old Testament literature, the holy scriptures, as the basis for everything they said.

The Bereans searched the Old Testament holy scriptures to see what Paul said was true because everything Paul said was taken from the scriptures (Old Testament) to make doctrine from.

Runningman, while by the context scripture refers to the Old Testament, it doesn't mean, Pau's writing and the other gospel writers are not scripture. You may have to look at the holy scriptures in 2 Timothy 3:16, that it "is (present) given by inspiration" so what Paul and other gospel writers wrote during their time is called scripture. If Peter said something of the "other scripture" which refers to the Old Testament, the reference to Paul's letter is obviously the other part of the scripture. The writings of the many New Testament are authoritative and circulated with major doctrines in it during their time. Notice that Peter in 2 Peter 3:15-16 speaks of Paul's writing is, of course, Paul's letter, then said to be scripture being scrutinized by Peter and some have wrested it.
Col.4:16
And when this epistle is read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans; and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.


1 Peter 1:1

King James Version

1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

 

[Runningman]

It doesn't make sense for Peter to say "other" if he really meant "all" or "the only" - he would have just said, "just as they do with the scripture"


This is a very well known verse that's very commonly used to show Paul's writings are scripture. It's not my interpretation but a pretty much universally accepted one - so I was bringing it up because if you're right, it's a point that needs to be addressed: what's the word "other" doing there?

Your answer so far isnt dealing with that word tho. Other doesn't mean all. Other implies an equivocation.

what doesn’t make sense is cherry picking a single word from a verse and making a grand sweeping assumption that it makes Paul’s letters scripture. Peter called his letters just letters

I already answered your question that the “other scriptures” refers to all of the scripture and you seem unsatisfied with that.

If you want to somehow make Paul’s letters turn into scripture then you’re going to need more than circumstantial evidence. You’re projecting meaning into passage. The burden of proof is on you here to prove what you’re saying the Bible says.

 

[Polar]

Hmmm I don’t think so. You were given scripture that showed you were incorrect and decided not to change your mind.

You showed me a single verse that says Paul’s letters are letters and that there are scriptures that aren’t his letters. Do you have anything else to help your false theory?

Well you are in good company these days. There are some people way ahead of you who think half the NT is spurious. I know 'you don't think so', but your thoughts are not God's thoughts.

Thanks for admitting you did see the post wherein PETER, not little ole me, defies you and says what Paul writes is considered scripture.

Be careful because Jesus only recognized the Old Testament as scripture. You’re walking a fine line on blasphemy.

I can't even.

There was no New Testament yet. Yes thank you. I am being careful while watching the delusion being expressed in this, your op.

 

[Live4Him3]

Be careful because Jesus only recognized the Old Testament as scripture. You’re walking a fine line on blasphemy.

Jesus gave John and Paul their revelations which they wrote down as scripture.

You are the one who is presently in big trouble with the Lord.