What is standart of Holiness?

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Dec 9, 2011
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#21
Exodus 20:17
Thou shall not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

No it's still in the OT do not covet aka lust/desire.
Just curious,do you believe that since the same GOD that spoke In the Old Testament Is the same GOD that speaks the New Testament and since GOD doesn’t change,we should try and keep the law?because If you believe that you should try and keep the law then you have fallen from grace and back Into the merit system and your works will be tested to see what manner It Is.

ALL glory to GOD,not GOD did It all and I helped.

The Issue now Is faith.
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John 3:16
King James Version(kJV)

16.)For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
 
L

LPT

Guest
#22
Just curious,do you believe that since the same GOD that spoke In the Old Testament Is the same GOD that speaks the New Testament and since GOD doesn’t change,we should try and keep the law?because If you believe that you should try and keep the law then you have fallen from grace and back Into the merit system and your works will be tested to see what manner It Is.

ALL glory to GOD,not GOD did It all and I helped.

The Issue now Is faith.
+++
John 3:16
King James Version(kJV)

16.)For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Then your free to murder are you not? Unless your faith tells you thou shall not murder.

Is the same God that gave the commandments in OT the same God who said obey these two in the NT. DId Jesus obey the OT commandments.
 
Dec 9, 2011
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#23
Yep, in other word, NT standart of holiness is Holy spirit, not law.
Yes,the only way to be perfect the way our FATHER In heaven IS PERFECT Is by grace through faith.Under law anyone born with the seed of adam will come short of the glory of GOD.
 
L

LPT

Guest
#24
Yes,the only way to be perfect the way our FATHER In heaven IS PERFECT Is by grace through faith.Under law anyone born with the seed of adam will come short of the glory of GOD.
Does your Grace through faith tell you, thou shall not murder?
 
Dec 9, 2011
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#25
Then your free to murder are you not? Unless your faith tells you thou shall not murder.

Is the same God that gave the commandments in OT the same God who said obey these two in the NT. DId Jesus obey the OT commandments.
I’ll just say that the Issue now Is faith and not sin AND we are HIS workmanship created IN JESUS unto good works.

By The Way grace doesn’t teach a person to live unGODly and every man that has this hope In them seeks to purify themselves even as they are pure.
 

DustyRhodes

Senior Member
Dec 30, 2016
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#26
You are correct. Not under the law doesn't mean break the law. We not under the law, but under Christ influent, because Christ in our heart.

The fact we not murder is not because we are under the law, but because Christ own us. He purchace us with his blood. So we do not have the right to have our own Will anymore. His Will in us, his love in us. And If his love in us, we not kill other

We not kill, not because we are under the law, we not kill because He change our heart.
well unfortunately you misunderstood my entire post...but so be it
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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#27
The born Again Christian Is no longer judged by the law which Is GOD's perfect standard of righteousness but now they have received Grace through faith,JESUS fulfilled the law as a man and paid for our sins with HIS blood on a cross satisfying the demand of the law which meant death.
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The law was added because of Adam's disobedience to GOD's WORD choosing to listen to the devil and because of Adam's sin,man would now have to be perfect In his own strength but man was not able to fullfil the law perfectly and needed a savoir.JESUS took back the power Adam gave to satin and once again gave all those who believe HIS WORD Eternal Life.
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Hebrews 1:1-10
King James Version(KJV)


1.)God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2.)Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

3.)Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

4.)Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

5.) For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6.)And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7.) And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8.)But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9.)Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10.)And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
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Yep we are not under the law. We not kill because love Christ in us, we not breaking the law, not because we are under the law. We not breaking the law because we are under the grace, that free us from sin.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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#29
Yes, when Christ in us, the love of Christ in us, It tell us to love other, not kill.
and if we let Scripture tell us how this is done:

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”

Ezekiel 11:19-21, “And I shall give them one heart, and put a new spirit within you. And I shall take the stony heart out of their flesh, and give them a heart of flesh, so that they walk in My laws, and guard My right-rulings, and shall do them. And they shall be My people and I shall be their Strength. But to those whose hearts walk after the heart of their disgusting matters and their abominations, I shall recompense their deeds on their own heads,” declares the Master יהוה.”
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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#30
and if we let Scripture tell us how this is done:

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”

Ezekiel 11:19-21, “And I shall give them one heart, and put a new spirit within you. And I shall take the stony heart out of their flesh, and give them a heart of flesh, so that they walk in My laws, and guard My right-rulings, and shall do them. And they shall be My people and I shall be their Strength. But to those whose hearts walk after the heart of their disgusting matters and their abominations, I shall recompense their deeds on their own heads,” declares the Master יהוה.”
Yep, but some law in OT, has been fulfilled, Example animal sacrifice. When we really and totally surender and invite Jesus in our heart, the law maker is in us. So we are No longer under the law, but under law maker.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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#31
I hear a sermon, this pastor say : live a Holy life is to do the Will of God.

Our capacity to do the Will of God are varises dep ending of the maturity of our faith.

A mother tell her 5 years son to take a bag from the table, he does, this is Said to do the Will of mother.

If a mother tell his 5 years son to move 100 pound cement from the storage and he does'nt do It, can we call he doesn't do the Will of mother? Yes but because he doesn't strong enough to do the Will of mother.

That what happen to the spiritual maturity.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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#32
Yep, but some law in OT, has been fulfilled, Example animal sacrifice. When we really and totally surender and invite Jesus in our heart, the law maker is in us. So we are No longer under the law, but under law maker.
I agree we are not to sacrifice animals but any who have accepted the Messiah;s sacrifice are indeed accepting shed blood that ratifies a covenant...

and if the Messiah is in someones heart they would accept HIS words:

John/Yahanan 6:63, “It is the Spirit that gives life; the flesh is useless. The words (Instructions) that I (Yahshua/Jesus) speak to you, they are Spirit, and they are life everlasting.”

John 14:23-24, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

John 14:23-26, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our stay with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me. These Words I have spoken to you while still with you. But the Helper, the Set-apart Spirit, whom the Father shall send in My Name, He shall teach you all, and remind you of all that I said to you.”

Matthew 28:19-20, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

He taught us t he way to follow YHWH's Law and said it will not pass away, I trust Him nobody can tell me different than He has told:

Matt 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away…"

John/Yahanan 10:16, "And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice. So there will be one flock, one Shepherd (4166 - poimén)."
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
7,231
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#33
I agree we are not to sacrifice animals but any who have accepted the Messiah;s sacrifice are indeed accepting shed blood that ratifies a covenant...

and if the Messiah is in someones heart they would accept HIS words:

John/Yahanan 6:63, “It is the Spirit that gives life; the flesh is useless. The words (Instructions) that I (Yahshua/Jesus) speak to you, they are Spirit, and they are life everlasting.”

John 14:23-24, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

John 14:23-26, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our stay with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me. These Words I have spoken to you while still with you. But the Helper, the Set-apart Spirit, whom the Father shall send in My Name, He shall teach you all, and remind you of all that I said to you.”

Matthew 28:19-20, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

He taught us t he way to follow YHWH's Law and said it will not pass away, I trust Him nobody can tell me different than He has told:

Matt 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away…"

John/Yahanan 10:16, "And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice. So there will be one flock, one Shepherd (4166 - poimén)."
Yes, If the law maker in one heart, one is under the law maker, not under the law and under law maker not breaking the law.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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#34
Yes, If the law maker in one heart, one is under the law maker, not under the law and under law maker not breaking the law.
I like to say His way His will!
 
L

LPT

Guest
#35
I’ll just say that the Issue now Is faith and not sin AND we are HIS workmanship created IN JESUS unto good works.

By The Way grace doesn’t teach a person to live unGODly and every man that has this hope In them seeks to purify themselves even as they are pure.
So what your saying is you would rather avoid the ten, and presume there are meaningless today.
I gather you don't want to even say thou shall not murder.
I’ll just say that the Issue now Is faith and not sin AND we are HIS workmanship created IN JESUS unto good works.

By The Way grace doesn’t teach a person to live unGODly and every man that has this hope In them seeks to purify themselves even as they are pure.
Gee Heaven forbid you honor a commandment, seems that way ( you will just say this its faith not sin )
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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#37
So standart of holiness is to do His way or His will
To simplify it I would say yes. "holiness" means: set apart...

set apart for what tho?

Set apart for His use.

To do that one would have to follow His Instructions that are written and the guidance He gives in ones life.

Leviticus 20:26 ‘And you shall be set-apart to Me, for I יהוה am set-apart, and have separated you from the peoples to be Mine."

Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”

John 12:25-26, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it remains alone. But if it dies, it bears much fruit. He who loves his life shall lose it, and he who hates his life in this world shall preserve it for everlasting life." Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”

This is an example of not being set apart for His use:

Yirmeyahu/Jeremiah 13-1-10, “Thus יהוה said to me, “Go and get yourself a linen belt, and put it on your loins, but do not put it in water. So I bought a belt according to the word of יהוה, and put it on my loins. And the word of יהוה came to me the second time, saying, Take the belt that you have bought, which is on your loins, and arise, go to the Euphrates, and hide it there in a hole in the rock.” And I went and hid it by the Euphrates, as יהוה commanded me. And it came to be after many days that יהוה said to me, “Arise, go to the Euphrates, and take from there the belt which I commanded you to hide there. So I went to the Euphrates and dug, and I took the belt from the place where I had hidden it. And there was the belt, ruined. It was completely useless. And the word of יהוה came to me, saying, Thus said יהוה, ‘Thus I ruin the pride of Yehuḏah and the great pride of Yerushalayim. This evil people, who refuse to hear My Words, who walk in the stubbornness of their heart, and walk after other mighty ones to serve them and to bow themselves to them, is like this belt which is completely useless.”

Luke 6:46, “But why do you call Me ‘Master, Master,’ and do not do what I say?”
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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561
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#38
To simplify it I would say yes. "holiness" means: set apart...

set apart for what tho?

Set apart for His use.

To do that one would have to follow His Instructions that are written and the guidance He gives in ones life.

Leviticus 20:26 ‘And you shall be set-apart to Me, for I יהוה am set-apart, and have separated you from the peoples to be Mine."

Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”

John 12:25-26, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it remains alone. But if it dies, it bears much fruit. He who loves his life shall lose it, and he who hates his life in this world shall preserve it for everlasting life." Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”

This is an example of not being set apart for His use:

Yirmeyahu/Jeremiah 13-1-10, “Thus יהוה said to me, “Go and get yourself a linen belt, and put it on your loins, but do not put it in water. So I bought a belt according to the word of יהוה, and put it on my loins. And the word of יהוה came to me the second time, saying, Take the belt that you have bought, which is on your loins, and arise, go to the Euphrates, and hide it there in a hole in the rock.” And I went and hid it by the Euphrates, as יהוה commanded me. And it came to be after many days that יהוה said to me, “Arise, go to the Euphrates, and take from there the belt which I commanded you to hide there. So I went to the Euphrates and dug, and I took the belt from the place where I had hidden it. And there was the belt, ruined. It was completely useless. And the word of יהוה came to me, saying, Thus said יהוה, ‘Thus I ruin the pride of Yehuḏah and the great pride of Yerushalayim. This evil people, who refuse to hear My Words, who walk in the stubbornness of their heart, and walk after other mighty ones to serve them and to bow themselves to them, is like this belt which is completely useless.”

Luke 6:46, “But why do you call Me ‘Master, Master,’ and do not do what I say?”

Good Example. Seem to me the instruction above is for certain people. What is writen for Israel may not for us, but He give us instruction, love God and your neigbors Holy spirit Will guide us to know what instruction is for us.

Let say God want you to be missionary in africa. Not a verse in the bible that say shammah must become a missionary in africa, some time the instruction is specific for you.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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#39
Good Example. Seem to me the instruction above is for certain people. What is writen for Israel may not for us, but He give us instruction, love God and your neigbors Holy spirit Will guide us to know what instruction is for us.
As far as Scriptual Instructions go there is not different Instructions for different people, one set of Instructions for all the people of YHWH:

Numbers 15:15-16, “One law is for you of the assembly and for the stranger who sojourns with you – a law forever throughout your generations. As you are, so is the stranger before יהוה. One Torah and one right-ruling is for you and for the stranger who sojourns with you.”

Exodus 12:47-49, “All the congregation of Israel shall keep it. And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the Passover to יהוה, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof. One law shall be to him that is nativeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourns among you.”

Isaiah 56:1-7,, “Thus said יהוה, “Guard right-ruling, and do righteousness, for near is My deliverance to come, and My righteousness to be revealed. Blessed is the man who does this, and the son of man who becomes strong in it, guarding the Sabbath lest he profane it, and guarding his hand from doing any evil. And let not the son of the foreigner who has joined himself to יהוה speak, saying, ‘יהוה has certainly separated me from His people,’ nor let the eunuch say, ‘Look I am a dry tree.’ For thus said יהוה, “To the eunuchs who guard My Sabbaths, and have chosen what pleases Me, and are holding onto My covenant: to them I shall give in My house and within My walls a place and a name better than that of sons and daughters – I give them an everlasting name that is not cut off. Also the sons of the foreigner who join themselves to יהוה, to serve Him, and to love the Name of יהוה, to be His servants, all who guard the Sabbath, and not profane it, and are holding onto My covenant, them I shall bring to My set-apart mountain, and let them rejoice in My house of prayer. Their ascending offerings and their sacrifices are accepted on My altar, for My house is called a house of prayer for all the peoples.”

If the guiding Spirit does not line up with the written word it is not His Spirit:

Isaiah 59:21, “As for Me, this is My covenant with them,” said יהוה: “My Spirit that is upon you, and My Words that I have put in your mouth, shall not be withdrawn from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your descendants, nor from the mouth of your descendants’ descendants,” said יהוה, “from this time and forever.”

Let say God want you to be missionary in africa. Not a verse in the bible that say shammah must become a missionary in africa, some time the instruction is specific for you.
Yes this would be His guidance for the indivigual person and to be followed.
 

EmilyFoster

Well-known member
Jul 10, 2018
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#40
We are called to live a holy life just as Jesus did. And, there are many scripture references to encourage and guide us:

Romans 12:1 and 2 I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.

Psalm 119:9 How can a young man keep his way pure? By guarding it according to your word.