What's the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant?

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Ariel82

Guest
#101
#101
Drcraig1 said:
Yeah, every time Jesus broke bread and wine he was eating the Passover.
Matthew 26:17-18 & Luke 22: 15. This is one of God's appinted feast. And in 1 Corinthians 11:24-29 it says "on the night Jesus was betrayed" he took bread and wine.... But what night was Jesus betrayed? It was the night of the Passover. So even the apostles kept Passover at its appointed time because they believed in the promise it contained (forgiveness of sins and eternal life). Since that's the case, which one is unworthy, communion or Passover?
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I think we have a failure to communicate.

Perhaps you missed my other responses or you have mixed everyone responses together, but I thought I clearly stated that Passover was a shadow and communion is a remembrance...both point to Christ redeeming work on the cross. The sacrifice of His body and the pouring out of His blood.

One was done before His death and resurrection and one done after...one for the old covenant, the other for the new. One for salvation of the flesh from Egypt, other salvation of souls from sin.


Sorry had to cook breakfast for the kids...


Would you like more scriptures on the topic?

I apologise if I only listen to half this conversation thread...the whole right about law and grace makes me sad.

I only stay because of the title...I like discussing old and new covenant and how God reveals His plans through scriptures.

However if this become a nasty debate, I will have to bow out. I would rather read my Bible and pray.

So if you have already decided that you have all the answers and understand scripture perfectly, please tell me so I can add you to my ignore button because I would rather not waste my time with delusional folks.

Sorry if that sounds harsh but I still talk to you because you seemed genuine in your questions. I have often been wrong because I tend to think the best of people's intentions and am made to look foolish and naive more often than not.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#102
#102
Importance of the cross for salvation

Mark 8:34 - And when he had called the people [unto him] with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Matthew 10:38 - And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

Galatians 2:20 - I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

1 Corinthians 1:18 - For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#103
#103
How do you understand these verses?

*****
Colossians: 2. 12. Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. 14. Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to the cross; 15. And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16. Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17. Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
 
V

valiant

Senior Member
#104
Mar 22, 2015
8,025
126
63
#104
Drcraig1 said:
Yeah, every time Jesus broke bread and wine he was eating the Passover.
Matthew 26:17-18 & Luke 22: 15. This is one of God's appinted feast. And in 1 Corinthians 11:24-29 it says "on the night Jesus was betrayed" he took bread and wine.... But what night was Jesus betrayed? It was the night of the Passover. So even the apostles kept Passover at its appointed time because they believed in the promise it contained (forgiveness of sins and eternal life). Since that's the case, which one is unworthy, communion or Passover?
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Jesus Christ was more than the Passover sacrifice. He was more than the Day of Atonement, with its sacrifices. His blood replaced and covered ALL sacrifices. That is why the Lord's table was not limited to once a year but was celebrated every week.

Through His sacrifice for us we are justified/accounted legally righteous (Rom 5.9),continually cleansed (1 Joh 1.7), sanctified in God's sight (1 Cor 6.11) and glorified (Rom 8.30). It is far, far greater than one particular feast. It covers ALL feasts. And we partake of Him daily.
 
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valiant

Senior Member
#105
Mar 22, 2015
8,025
126
63
#105
Ariel82 said:
How do you understand these verses?

*****
Colossians: 2. 12. Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. 14. Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to the cross; 15. And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16. Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17. Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
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Every written ordinance in Scripture which stands against us.
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#106
#106
disciplemike said:
The law of God is not bondage.
Did God bring the children of Israel out of bondage in Egypt, only to put them back in bondage at Mt. Sinai?

Sin is the bondage.
The rules and traditions of men are bondage.

The law of God is not bondage - It is liberty!
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You must know that makes absolutely no sense, right? Why would we need to, or even want to, die to and be released from that which is liberty??


"But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter” (Rom 7:6).
 
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jaybird88

Guest
#108
#108
FreeNChrist said:
That's kinda the point. The Law does not ask you for your best effort, it demands of you perfect compliance. If you do not water down the Law to make yourself feel good about your "keeping" of it, you will see yourself as the failure that you are. And the hope is that seeing yourself as you really are will lead you to see your need for a Savior. The Law leads the humble to Christ, it does not lead you back to itself.
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if we slip up one time, we make one little mistake and commit a sin, we are punished forever and ever in hell? where is this taught?
 
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FreeNChrist

Guest
#109
#109
jaybird88 said:
if we slip up one time, we make one little mistake and commit a sin, we are punished forever and ever in hell? where is this taught?
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"Whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point, he has become guilty of it all” James 2:10
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#110
#110
jaybird88 said:
if we slip up one time, we make one little mistake and commit a sin, we are punished forever and ever in hell? where is this taught?
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The law..

The NT

You think you can break the law and get away with it without any consequences. Think again!

Adam committed one sin, One mistake,(he ate a peace of fruit) and mankind and all of creation has suffered because of it. You think your little sin is any less damning?
 
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FreeNChrist

Guest
#111
#111
jaybird88 said:
He followed the laws of His Father.
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Jesus did nothing of His own initiative. Repeatedly He explained the source of what He did. "The Son can do nothing of Himself; ...the Father shows the Son all things that He Himself is doing" (John 5:19,20). "I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge..." (John 5:30). "I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself has given Me...what to say, and what to speak" (John 12:49). "The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works" (John 14:10).

He lived by trust and dependency upon the indwelling Father, and the Father worked through Him. Likewise we now are to live by trust and dependency upon Him, the indwelling Christ, and He will work through us.
 
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jaybird88

Guest
#113
#113
FreeNChrist said:
"Whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point, he has become guilty of it all” James 2:10
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thats not teaching dont follow the law. James is saying you cant cherry pick the law. you have to follow all the laws. breaking one law is no different than breaking another.
 
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FreeNChrist

Guest
#114
#114
jaybird88 said:
thats not teaching dont follow the law. James is saying you cant cherry pick the law. you have to follow all the laws. breaking one law is no different than breaking another.
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It's the answer to the question you asked.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#115
#115
jaybird88 said:
thats not teaching dont follow the law. James is saying you cant cherry pick the law. you have to follow all the laws. breaking one law is no different than breaking another.
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.....hesitate to type...but just wanted to insert that

Jesus is talking about following the Spirit of the law and not the Letter of the law.

If people learn to follow the Holy Spirit, they will naturally fulfill the Letter of the law.

However if people are like the Pharisees that teach only,the letter of the law and condemn people who do not have white tombs like them ...., Then it is death for there is no life, without the Holy Spirit. People must be born again to be saved....not eat some bread or drink some wine in a "new" Passover way..,.,

(my attempt to tie conversation back to OP and his questions)
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#116
#116
jaybird88 said:
thats not teaching dont follow the law. James is saying you cant cherry pick the law. you have to follow all the laws. breaking one law is no different than breaking another.
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And breaking one brings upon you the curse of the law.

It means if you say a little white lie. Your just as guilty as if you commited adultry, murder or blasphemy (idol worship) and the penalty is the curse of the law. Which Christ removed with his death, when he became to curse for us.
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#117
#117
eternally-gratefull said:
The law..

The NT

You think you can break the law and get away with it without any consequences. Think again!

Adam committed one sin, One mistake,(he ate a peace of fruit) and mankind and all of creation has suffered because of it. You think your little sin is any less damning?
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Exodus 34:5-7
5 And the Lord descended in the cloud and stood there with him as he called upon the name of the Lord. 6 Then the Lord passed by in front of him and proclaimed, “The Lord, the Lord God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in lovingkindness and truth; 7 who keeps lovingkindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished, visiting the iniquity of fathers on the children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations”.

our Lord was forgiving way back when they were in the desert. IMO He always was.

also there is a difference between committing a sin and disobeying a direct command (like Adam) from the Lord.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#118
#118
Verses about old Covenant formed on Mount Sinai and the new covenant formed on Mount Zion.

Galatians: 4. 22. For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. 24. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. 25. For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27. For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. 28. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. 29. But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now. 30. Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#119
#119
jaybird88 said:
Exodus 34:5-7
5 And the Lord descended in the cloud and stood there with him as he called upon the name of the Lord. 6 Then the Lord passed by in front of him and proclaimed, “The Lord, the Lord God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in lovingkindness and truth; 7 who keeps lovingkindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished, visiting the iniquity of fathers on the children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations”.

our Lord was forgiving way back when they were in the desert. IMO He always was.

also there is a difference between committing a sin and disobeying a direct command (like Adam) from the Lord.
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You highlighted the wrong part. Read the part I highlighted, the guilty will not go unpunished.

then, so it is ok to sin, you have no consequence?

God said to moes, anyone who does not obey and confirm all the words, will be cursed. Did God not mean it?

I must ask, Why are you trying to excuse your sin as inconsequential and not an act deserving of death?

The wage of sin is death is it not?
 
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lastofall

Senior Member
#120
Aug 26, 2014
609
38
28
#120
[for me anyway] it is much simpler: The Old was for judgment without mercy; whereas the New is mercy without judgment, and mercy rejoices against judgment. (James 2:13)
The law rendered to judgment and punishment without mercy; whereas grace renders mercy with forgiveness.
 
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