When are we saved ?

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OIC1965

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A believer will not face Judgment at the great white throne . The Gospel is good news .
Amen to a believer will never be condemned. Our works will be judged to determine rewards, but we will never face condemnation. John 5:24.
 

OIC1965

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Wow! I found one of your posts that I agree with. The elect are judged by God's chastening, as they sojourn here on earth.
And also Jesus bore the penalty of our sins, which is the basis of our full and complete justification.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Our faith secures eternal salvation based on Jesus’ faithfulness.
Jesus's faithfulness in going to the cross to pay for the sins of God's elect secured their eternal deliverance. Our faith in what Jesus did is credited to us as being righteous.
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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Jesus's faithfulness in going to the cross to pay for the sins of God's elect secured their eternal deliverance. Our faith in what Jesus did is credited to us as being righteous.
Not only what He did at the cross, which is glorious indeed, but also in His perfect obedience in life, and also in His present work as our Faithful High Priest and Mediator, and even more.
 

GraceAndTruth

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Sep 28, 2015
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As I have told you many times, I have never read the writings of John Calvin, but have heard you, and others, make statements about what he believes. I believe, from what I have heard, that he misinterprets some of the scriptures. I have also told you that the scriptures are my only source of gleaning the truth of what Jesus taught. and that scripture proves scripture.
1 Pet 1:15, be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear.
Forest, so much false information about 'calvinism, ........This is a short version of nearly everything that is 'calvinism......ready to have an answer in season and out! And just ya know.......Truth7t7 is upside down on calvinism....I have yet to figure him out tho some others have.
For your information only, I am not here to change anyone.......(except Truth7t7;))

Doctrines that Calvinists/Reformed share with other bible believers
There are doctrines that all believers share, be they reformed or ‘other’ (not to offend, but not all mainlines honor the Trinity)

1. The Trinity “The ONE true God eternally exists as three distinct Persons, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. These three are co-equal, co-eternal, and one in essence.
2. Scripture alone is the sole authority on faith and morals, in so far as it is correctly translated.

Then we come to the ones that might divide us, but I’m sure not all of them would:
3. Probably a couple of points on the TULIP
T - total depravity of man – the sin nature of the natural man/spiritual death came by Adam/original sin
U – unconditional election – God does not choose man according to His works but by His grace alone
L – the atonement by Christ was made for believers only, therefor limited
I – Irresistable grace – God’s will is not thwarted
P – Preservation of the saints – once saved always saved/eternal security

The five solas
Sola scriptura – scripture alone
Sola fide – faith alone
Sola gratia – grace alone
Solus Christos – Christ alone
Soli deo Gloria –glory to God alone

As for Eschatology, there are mixed minds, but general agreement that either all prophecy has been fulfilled or that all but the second coming of Christ is fulfilled. They fall generally into the categories of Amillenianism, Preterist and Partial-Preterist.

You cannot vanquish a Calvinist
You may think you can, but you cannot. The stones of the great doctrines so fit into each other that the more pressure there is applied to remove them, the more strenuously do they adhere. C. H. Spurgeon
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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Our faith delivers us here in time. Jesus's faith delivers us eternally.
It’s interesting that the word “pistis” can be translated faith or faithfulness. With Christ, I think it’s His faithfulness that saves us, and our faith merely rests on His Faithfulness in what He has done, what He is doing, and what He will do.
 

OIC1965

Well-known member
Sep 19, 2020
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Forest, so much false information about 'calvinism, ........This is a short version of nearly everything that is 'calvinism......ready to have an answer in season and out! And just ya know.......Truth7t7 is upside down on calvinism....I have yet to figure him out tho some others have.
For your information only, I am not here to change anyone.......(except Truth7t7;))

Doctrines that Calvinists/Reformed share with other bible believers
There are doctrines that all believers share, be they reformed or ‘other’ (not to offend, but not all mainlines honor the Trinity)

1. The Trinity “The ONE true God eternally exists as three distinct Persons, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. These three are co-equal, co-eternal, and one in essence.
2. Scripture alone is the sole authority on faith and morals, in so far as it is correctly translated.

Then we come to the ones that might divide us, but I’m sure not all of them would:
3. Probably a couple of points on the TULIP
T - total depravity of man – the sin nature of the natural man/spiritual death came by Adam/original sin
U – unconditional election – God does not choose man according to His works but by His grace alone
L – the atonement by Christ was made for believers only, therefor limited
I – Irresistable grace – God’s will is not thwarted
P – Preservation of the saints – once saved always saved/eternal security

The five solas
Sola scriptura – scripture alone
Sola fide – faith alone
Sola gratia – grace alone
Solus Christos – Christ alone
Soli deo Gloria –glory to God alone

As for Eschatology, there are mixed minds, but general agreement that either all prophecy has been fulfilled or that all but the second coming of Christ is fulfilled. They fall generally into the categories of Amillenianism, Preterist and Partial-Preterist.

You cannot vanquish a Calvinist
You may think you can, but you cannot. The stones of the great doctrines so fit into each other that the more pressure there is applied to remove them, the more strenuously do they adhere. C. H. Spurgeon
I agree with the Tulip points as you state them, except for the L

I believe Christ died for all men, but His death only saves those who believe

The way you described the other four points I can agree with. But most Calvinists I’ve read use much stronger definitions.

I can agree that the fall of Adam produced spiritual death, seperation, and sinfulness in all that are in Adam

I agree that God saves based on grace and on His good pleasure, not because of our works. Amen

I agree that God’s will cannot be thwarted.

I believe that we are eternally secure in Christ

But total depravity and irresistable grace are stated in much stronger terms in Calvinism than the way you stated them.

I am also fully in agreement with the 5 solas. I think all Protestant evangelicals agree with those. Those who don’t, I think do not hold to Protestant/ evangelical or biblical principles.
 

OIC1965

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Nope. They were covered but not ' redeemed until the cross .
Rom 3.25
25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
Very correct understanding of Romans 3:25.
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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The key to this verse is; every man that hath heard, and learned. The only people that can hear and understand are God's sheep (his regenerated children). Not every man of the human race, and especially, not of the natural man, who thinks the things of the Spirit are foolishness.
That only sheep believed Jesus is definitely true in the context of Jesus earthly ministry. John 10:26.

He did not say they were notHis sheep because they didn’t believe, He said they didn’t believe because they were not His Sheep.
 

GraceAndTruth

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Sep 28, 2015
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I agree with the Tulip points as you state them, except for the L

I believe Christ died for all men, but His death only saves those who believe
actually you DO agree with it....it simply states that Christ atoned ONLY for believers so is limited to that group alone.
The way you described the other four points I can agree with. But most Calvinists I’ve read use much stronger definitions.
My explanations are the same today as they have been for nearly 50 years. I hate to see people wage war over words.
I can agree that the fall of Adam produced spiritual death, seperation, and sinfulness in all that are in Adam
Yes and physical death
I agree that God saves based on grace and on His good pleasure, not because of our works. Amen
amen
I agree that God’s will cannot be thwarted.
never
I believe that we are eternally secure in Christ
soli deo gloria..........He alone is worthy to be praised.
But total depravity and irresistable grace are stated in much stronger terms in Calvinism than the way you stated them.
I have been attached to these doctrines of grace for many years and have found no fault with any of them
I also see a whole lot of false teaching on web sights and in forums....I think it comes from either ignorance of the doctrines or hatred of anything calvinist.

I am also fully in agreement with the 5 solas. I think all Protestant evangelicals agree with those. Those who don’t, I think do not hold to Protestant/ evangelical or biblical principles.
I put my notes to you in blue so easier to locate.
I am a happy camper when a believer comes to acknowledge these great truths.
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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I put my notes to you in blue so easier to locate.
I am a happy camper when a believer comes to acknowledge these great truths.
I do agree that Calvinists are accused of believing things that they don’t believe. This is due to the fact that people are ignorant of their actual positions.

Anti Calvinists should not talk about Calvinism unless they actually read their writings. What they often do is merely read and quote anti Calvinist writers.

I think these people need to stop attacking things they haven’t read. I don’t attack Calvinism, because I do not have an adequate understanding of it, and I have a pretty good grasp of it, but not enough for me to properly represent it.

I just try to stick with only the Bible. If the Bible agrees with a Calvinist belief, I accept it. If not. I dont

It’s ludicrous for people to say I have Calvinist leanings. I was saved, reared, and trained in an anti Calvinist church. Deeply anti Calvinist. I came to my beliefs through decades of Bible study

I am currently in church that is neither Calvinistic nor do they attack it. I consider Calvinists my brethren, and I don’t feel inclined to attack my brethren.
 

GraceAndTruth

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Sep 28, 2015
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I do agree that Calvinists are accused of believing things that they don’t believe. This is due to the fact that people are ignorant of their actual positions.

shortened by me for space

I am currently in church that is neither Calvinistic nor do they attack it. I consider Calvinists my brethren, and I don’t feel inclined to attack my brethren.
I started my spiritual journey in a solid Conservative Baptist church. Not exactly a hotbed of calvinism. But I learned good basics which we all need before we do deep study (had to learn how to do that too). The first time I ever saw or heard the word TULIP was in an Christian AOL chat room.....two people arguing over it (how novel). I asked what TULIP is.....one of the debaters was a pastor so we private messaged while he took me through it........and as he went through each letter I gave him the affirmative that I agree. I stayed in my Bap church because of friends but I also was their full-charge bookkeeper. In time we had a new pastor whose first efforts on sermons was to go through Romans, line by line (he took over a year to finish). Not being a full-fledged calvinist I had some questions about the predestination stuff, etc. Went against my ego to think I was not in charge. We were in Roman 9 and literally half of our members LEFT when he got to those pesky vessels. Not to worry because within weeks our membership tripled. People were so hungry to hear exegesis teaching. Anway I literally confronted the pastor about vessels of mercy and vessels of wrath........the only thing he said to me was: Is God sovereign or not? After that I was hooked, I read the bible with new eyes to see God's sovereignty everywhere and it has been an exciting journey ever since.

God bless you on your journey
 

throughfaith

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Aug 4, 2020
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Who is the "all" in Gal 3:26? Paul is talking about himself and unto the churches of Galatia.

If you are still trying to include the unregenerate natural man into this scripture, he will not fit.
Your point is irelavant here because Paul is affirming how these believers were saved . By their faith .