My goodness popeye, I better not reply to you. It seems you ................. well, that doesn't seem good.
But I'll try to help you by addressing your last reply to me.
You wrote that the Lord Jesus "ascended to take his blood to the father. ..(has to do with the priesthood)."
I don't think that was in the spirit of your original question to me. So I wll try to turn it back, and ask you:
Then why didn't He return yet? How long did that take?
I have no idea what "sky grab" is supposed to mean. Sorry.
In regard to Jesus' "secret" ascension, He told the first person to see Him in resurrection,
in the morning: "Do not touch Me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to My
brothers and say to them, I ascend..." Jn 20:17.
Shortly thereafter, on the same day, Matthew records that Jesus met her again, with His
mom ("the other Mary"), "And they came to Him and took hold of His feet" Mt 27:1, 9.
They touched Him. So, in the brief intervening time, He must have ascended to His Father.
If you have another, coherent, explanation of this, I'd be honored to read it.
In regard to your comment "Hogwash," I then have to question you:
When the Lord Jesus either gets on His white horse, or comes to the clouds,
or comes back to the earth physically; is He still physically on the throne of God
in the heavens simultaneously? For that matter, do you understand from the Bible
that Jesus Christ will physically come back to the earth at all, and live and walk here,
(starting from the time of Armageddon)?
In regard to Mattthew 26:29, "I shall by no means drink of this product of the vine from now
on until that day when I drink it new with you in the kingdom of My Father,"
one text to show (to me) that this transpires on earth is Luke 22:29-30
"I appoint to you, even as My Father has appointed to Me, a kingdom, that you
may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom; and you will sit on thrones judging
the twelve tribes of Israel." Of course the kingdom is wherever the Lord is,
"the Kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, Look,
here it is! or, There! For behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst [Jesus] of you"
Lk 17:20-21. Essentially................Jesus Christ IS the kingdom of God, Lk 17:20-21.
As well is His church, His Body, Rm 14:17; Rv 1:6. But I've been taught that the
"Kingdom of [His] Father" is a particular Scriptural phrase that refers to His rule
with His co-kings during the Millenium, before the new heaven and the new earth.
Which, I understand, begins once He takes possession of the earth with, and after,
the battle of Armageddon.
I understand you to be interpreting that Jesus Christ will share wine with His disciples
in the heavens after He raptures them pre-tribulation. First I'd have to admit to anyone
else reading this that such a discussion of Mt 26:29 is trivial. Though it's alright to have
our opinions. Secondly I'll say that it looks like you're basing your idea (in part) on your
opinion that the John 2 record of the real wedding in Cana is also (or is primarily???!!!)
an allegory or symbol of the end times sequence of events, including rapture?
No offense, but to me that is not Jesus' or John's message at all. Instead that (real)
wedding served as a sign (Jn 2:11), an allegory, of the Lord's changing our "death"
into life. Changing the empty water of peoples' lives into the wine of the Spirit of
Himself, by coming into, and mingling with us, the "earthen vessels" He made in
His image, to contain (and live by) Him. Jn 2:6; Gen 1:26; 2 Cor 4:7; Rm 9:23.
This is His purpose for human life. This is the meaning of our existence. I should say,
He is the meaning of our life. Any other, additional, "message"---that this somehow
prefigures the end times, to me is a) distracting from the primary theme and message
of John and this portion; b) Superfluous and unnecessary---the Bible speaks plainly
about the raptures elsewhere and when necessary; and c) contrary to the principle that
the word of God is "plain" and direct and accessible and straightforward and orderly.
In other words, there's both no need to find, and no need to look for, the rapture in
John 2 (among other places). In fact, it is ascribing an importance to the topic of the
rapture which it (the raptures) do not have, and doing so at the expense of God's economy,
His heart's desire and eternal life, which is His overriding message in Scripture.
Lastly, you return to the (degraded) Christianity preoccupation with "heaven" with your
post #2461 (at least that is how it is numbered as of now). If you (or anyone else)
wants to talk about it seriously with me, I recommend we can go slowly, so that we remain
loving, and that we remain "on the same page" and not distracted, and also learn. I am willing
to learn, if you feel there is anything true or Scriptural to Christendom's (wrong) fixation on
"heaven" as God's eternal goal or His believers' eternal, physical, dwelling place.
I feel that your question about "coincidence," for example, in #2461, is out of order.
And I can try to start such a hopefully serious conversation about heaven by pointing out
that that word is nowhere in John 14, 15, 16..............or 17 except for John 17:1.
Much less did He "refer...to heaven as where he would build the mansions."
Pardon my Lol.
Thank you.
