Where are the sun, moon, and stars?

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GaryA

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What would be the purpose of that layer such that God would make sure we knew it was there?
I think this is significant.

Why would God include [specific] knowledge about the "upper" water in scripture? Why would He want us to know about the separation of the "waters" into the "upper" and "lower" waters?
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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I think this is significant.

Why would God include [specific] knowledge about the "upper" water in scripture? Why would He want us to know about the separation of the "waters" into the "upper" and "lower" waters?
Why did God say "the evening and the morning was the first day"?

Flat earth defines "one day" as sunrise to sunrise.
The SUN DID NOT EXIST on the first day.
That alone proves that flat earth is a lie.

"The evening and the morning was the first day" was the day that God caused the EARTH TO START SPINNING.
That means that the bible defines "one day" as one complete revolution of the earth on it's axis.

It takes ONE DAY, 24 literal hours, for the earth to make a complete revolution.
This blows Flat Earth and Gap Theory straight out of the water.

Have the flat earth Christians been taught how to handle this argument?

Probably not because I have never ran across another person on this planet who could explain how "the morning and the evening was the first day" is even possible BEFORE the sun had been created. I didn't know either until God showed me a few minutes ago. So in that respect I'm thankful you started this thread. :)
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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I think this is significant.

Why would God include [specific] knowledge about the "upper" water in scripture? Why would He want us to know about the separation of the "waters" into the "upper" and "lower" waters?
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
  • In the beginning God created the HEAVEN (the universe), a CONTAINER.
  • He also created the earth and placed it INSIDE the container (heaven).

Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

A description of the earth.
  • The earth had no form (no visible shape).'
  • The earth was void, completely empty. No plants, no animals, no creeping things and no light.
  • The earth was covered with water.
  • Then God did something to the water.

Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
God created light (the electromagnetic spectrum) INSIDE the darkness that covered the earth.

Gen 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
God separated the electromagnetic spectrum from the darkness.

Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
  • God called the electromagnetic spectrum light and the darkness he called night.
  • The first revolution of the earth was called the first day.

Gen 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
Gen 1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

  • God created an open space above the earth.
    • This IS NOT the heaven of verse 1 that the earth was placed in.
    • That container had already been created.
  • He put some of the water on the earth above the open space - this the firmament (open space) above of the earth.

Gen 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
  • God called the FIRMAMENT OF THE EARTH - heaven.
  • The second revolution of the earth was called the second day.

Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
Gen 1:15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.

  • God placed lights in the FIRMAMENT OF THE HEAVEN.
  • God DID NOT place them in the FIRMAMENT OF THE EARTH.

CONCLUSION

There is no dome in those verses.
There is no flat earth in those verses.
There is no water "above the firmament of heaven", the waters are above the firmament of the earth which is also called heaven.

The truth is, Genesis teaches a round earth with literal 24 hour days.
A firmament of the earth and a firmament of the heaven.
The sun, moon and stars were placed exactly where we all know they were placed... in the FIRMAMENT (open space) OF HEAVEN, not the firmament of the earth.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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Nope. You are just being impatient. :p

Go examine the timestamps of the related posts and "do the math"...

Also - I don't always get my posts written as fast as other people do.

:)

EDIT: And - today - I have been dealing with a headache and a toothache - while trying to get some laundry done, etc.
I can agree with that laundry is a headache to do hahaha.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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I am not against using a telescope. I hope that one day I will use one for flat earth research.

Why can't you even imagine that what you are looking at could be thousands of miles away instead of millions or billions...?


You don't want to believe it because you have already accepted that "stars" are "suns" that are huge in size, etc.
Yes cool checked out the universe through a telescope one day.

I have imagined earth in a little snow globe and that’s about it imagine.

It’s not that don’t want to believe it’s to bazaar to accept through my sphere eyes, brain and head, and I have accepted the shining objects in the sky are either suns, moons, planets, galaxies and nebulas are far away million and billions of miles away.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Yes cool checked out the universe through a telescope one day.

I have imagined earth in a little snow globe and that’s about it imagine.

It’s not that don’t want to believe it’s to bazaar to accept through my sphere eyes, brain and head, and I have accepted the shining objects in the sky are either suns, moons, planets, galaxies and nebulas are far away million and billions of miles away.
Look at the earth from the moon, how small it is, i think there are even pictures from the voyager missions, which show it as a little dot in the cosmos
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I think this is significant.

Why would God include [specific] knowledge about the "upper" water in scripture? Why would He want us to know about the separation of the "waters" into the "upper" and "lower" waters?
Maybe he is not talking about the atmosphere?
 
Jun 10, 2019
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there are some bondings, Covalent bonds and hydrogen bonds.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
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I have an answer for you Rob, but I will have to post it later...
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
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Rob - your "logic" is faulty and post #122 is moot.

The SUN DID NOT EXIST on the first day.
So...???

The light and darkness set the day cycle. No matter what the shape of the earth, the sun still did not exist on day two - yet God created light and dark - and the first day had occurred.

... who could explain how "the morning and the evening was the first day" is even possible BEFORE the sun had been created.
Yet - that is what God did.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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Rob - your "logic" is faulty and post #122 is moot.


So...???

The light and darkness set the day cycle. No matter what the shape of the earth, the sun still did not exist on day two - yet God created light and dark - and the first day had occurred.


Yet - that is what God did.
I'm out of this Gary, flat earth isn't biblical.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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You say the earth spins and orbits.

The Bible indicates that it is stationary and does not move.
The evening and the morning is one revolution of the earth on it's axis, it can't be any thing else.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
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You say the earth spins and orbits.

The Bible indicates that it is stationary and does not move.
If I were to show you verses in the Bible that indicate that the earth is stationary and does not move (will have to look them up) -- are you going to believe it - because the Bible says it?
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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If I were to show you verses in the Bible that indicate that the earth is stationary and does not move (will have to look them up) -- are you going to believe it - because the Bible says it?
Sure, I really don't care if the earth is round or flat. I'm just giving you what I see from scripture in Genesis.
 
Jun 27, 2019
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The firmament ("raqia") refers to the (supposed) solid dome of the sky in ancient near eastern cosmology which was largely shared by the ancient Hebrews. Thus, the sun, moon, and stars were placed on this solid surface. (See diagram)

This is the worldview that Genesis 1 is describing.
 

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SoulWeaver

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Oct 25, 2014
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The firmament ("raqia") refers to the (supposed) solid dome of the sky in ancient near eastern cosmology which was largely shared by the ancient Hebrews. Thus, the sun, moon, and stars were placed on this solid surface. (See diagram)

This is the worldview that Genesis 1 is describing.
No. That is what people imagined at the time based on Genesis 1. Nowadays people imagine different things based on the same text. In the Medieval age they also had imaginations. The Word doesn't change, but people's perceptions are influenced by the information they start with. Cultures always read into what is said in the Bible at all times in history including ancient Hebrews... Just saying... I am not against you, you were simply bringing up information.
I believe one should look at what is written in the Bible, and try hard just to take what the Bible says without adding mental images to it. I honestly feel like I am way closer to the true perception when I paint creation in a fractal way without trying to comprehend it, than when I try to imagine it cerebrally. Especially Genesis 1 describes Creation on levels that are hard to comprehend even today, lest thousands of years ago. We suffer from creating imaginations, and slapping them onto what is actually said in the Word. This is why people argue and have different perceptions all the time. They start off the assumption-charged text.
I will give you that how they imagined it has some preeminence over how it was imagined later, because it's likely closer to the truth (there was less info to un-learn and a more accepting it as it is). I do not believe this is the full understanding though.