where does it say in bible Jesus said hes God???
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To answer your first questions I show you first chapter of Gospel of John. That is in Bible. I suppose to this the next chapter is good to consider for this question.
John 2
1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew
the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
[SUP]21 [/SUP]But he spake of the temple of his body.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
John 2
1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew
the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,[SUP]10 [/SUP]And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
[SUP]21 [/SUP]But he spake of the temple of his body.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
Jesus came to pay the price for sin. Islam believes that you earn your own way into eternal life, but Christianity believes that we are all guilty of sin and no one can keep all the law and earn their way into eternal life. That is the basic difference between the religions, Christianity is the only religion that has a Savior, and it is only by our faith in Jesus that a person can have eternal life.
Jesus was killed, but we believe he rose from the dead and lives. Your right, people can't kill God. Jesus was God manifested in the flesh in order to pay for the sins of everyone who sins in the flesh. Believers are redeemed through his suffering and sacrifice for our sins.
When the devil tempted Jesus, he told the devil "You shalt not tempt the Lord thy God" (Matthew 4:7). In saying this, Jesus confirmed that he was God.
The trinity is not 3 Gods, but 3 different aspects of the same God. Some Christians also have a difficult time understanding this. The trinity or tri-unity just describes the 3 attributes of a single Godhead, the 3 work and have always existed as one entity.
God the Father is the unseen, omnipresent Source of all being, revealed in and by God the Son, experienced in and by God's Holy Spirit. The Son proceeds from the Father, and the Spirit from the Son. With reference to God's creation, the Father is the Thought behind it, the Son is the Word calling it forth, and the Spirit is the Deed or Power making it a reality.
Just as a person thinks, speaks, and acts, God is all knowledge, Christ is the expression and manifestation, and the Spirit is the action and deed. The 3 are united persona's of one entity that best describe a single Godhead.
Jesus was killed, but we believe he rose from the dead and lives. Your right, people can't kill God. Jesus was God manifested in the flesh in order to pay for the sins of everyone who sins in the flesh. Believers are redeemed through his suffering and sacrifice for our sins.
When the devil tempted Jesus, he told the devil "You shalt not tempt the Lord thy God" (Matthew 4:7). In saying this, Jesus confirmed that he was God.
The trinity is not 3 Gods, but 3 different aspects of the same God. Some Christians also have a difficult time understanding this. The trinity or tri-unity just describes the 3 attributes of a single Godhead, the 3 work and have always existed as one entity.
God the Father is the unseen, omnipresent Source of all being, revealed in and by God the Son, experienced in and by God's Holy Spirit. The Son proceeds from the Father, and the Spirit from the Son. With reference to God's creation, the Father is the Thought behind it, the Son is the Word calling it forth, and the Spirit is the Deed or Power making it a reality.
Just as a person thinks, speaks, and acts, God is all knowledge, Christ is the expression and manifestation, and the Spirit is the action and deed. The 3 are united persona's of one entity that best describe a single Godhead.
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S
@Bowman,
There is some overlap between the Qur'an and the Bible. I agree with this.
However, I don't think the Qur'an teaches the biblical truths regarding the items you mentioned.
If you would like to refer to sound Christian scholars who hold the same position, and the names of the Muslim scholars you've debated on this issue, I would like to see them.
I am not an expert in Islam or the Qur'an, however I have heard debates between sound Christians and Muslim apologists and have not been exposed to these sorts of assertions. I am sure that Christian apologists would be all over this if there was a rational basis to use the Qur'an to refute Islam if this was possible.
It could be that you are privy to some special knowledge that they are not, but I would need to see independent verification from sound sources to ascertain that.
A friend of mine who is much more knowledgeable about Islam than myself looked at your posts and said he's never run across those sorts of claims.
Regards,
Robert
There is some overlap between the Qur'an and the Bible. I agree with this.
However, I don't think the Qur'an teaches the biblical truths regarding the items you mentioned.
If you would like to refer to sound Christian scholars who hold the same position, and the names of the Muslim scholars you've debated on this issue, I would like to see them.
I am not an expert in Islam or the Qur'an, however I have heard debates between sound Christians and Muslim apologists and have not been exposed to these sorts of assertions. I am sure that Christian apologists would be all over this if there was a rational basis to use the Qur'an to refute Islam if this was possible.
It could be that you are privy to some special knowledge that they are not, but I would need to see independent verification from sound sources to ascertain that.
A friend of mine who is much more knowledgeable about Islam than myself looked at your posts and said he's never run across those sorts of claims.
Regards,
Robert
Most people think as you....but then again, most people have not spent 20 years exegeting Koranic Arabic like I have.
Its a slam dunk...
I am not alone in my discoveries, brother.
There are others that have since come forth with the same findings, such as the term 'Muhammad'…years after I independently made this connection to the Biblical Jesus Christ.
That the Koran is an early Christian work is independently supported by the following book:
The Hidden Origins of Islam: New Research into Its Early History
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1591026342/internetinfidels
Book description:
And Gabriel Sawma...
My exegesis does not revolve around Syriac or Aramaic, but draws some similar conclusions, in some areas, none the less...
My exegesis is copyrighted....so I would be surprised if you see it floating around mainstream.
Eventually, yes, but most of what I'm uncovering is so diametrically opposed to the typical stereotype that people reject it out of hand immediately, without looking into it.
No surprise...
All of my renderings are fully backed by extensive exegesis....try and find a tafsir of any quality that satisfactorily explains an ayah, its simple not there....and the reasoning behind the popular English Koran translations? Nope...can't be had....
Again...
Familiarity with Islam won't be of any value whatsoever in understanding the Koran.
Just like familiarity with Judaism wont hold any value in understanding why Jews reject Jesus as God - even though Christians share the very same scriptures...
Scriptural exegesis is where it is at...
Eventually, yes, but most of what I'm uncovering is so diametrically opposed to the typical stereotype that people reject it out of hand immediately, without looking into it.
No surprise...
All of my renderings are fully backed by extensive exegesis....try and find a tafsir of any quality that satisfactorily explains an ayah, its simple not there....and the reasoning behind the popular English Koran translations? Nope...can't be had....
Again...
Familiarity with Islam won't be of any value whatsoever in understanding the Koran.
Just like familiarity with Judaism wont hold any value in understanding why Jews reject Jesus as God - even though Christians share the very same scriptures...
Scriptural exegesis is where it is at...
Maybe someone already noted this, anyway: Many times people of Islamic faith say that the bible is corrupted, but this is what the Qu'ran is telling them, speaking of 'the Book' which is the bible.
Quran 6: 114-115 - Shall i then seek a judge other than Allah? And He it is who was revealed you the book (which is) made plain; and those whom we have given the Book know that is is revealed by your Lord with truth, therefore you should not be of the disputers. And the word of your Lord has been accomplished truly and justly;
there is none who can change His words, and He is the Hearing, the Knowing.
Quran 6: 114-115 - Shall i then seek a judge other than Allah? And He it is who was revealed you the book (which is) made plain; and those whom we have given the Book know that is is revealed by your Lord with truth, therefore you should not be of the disputers. And the word of your Lord has been accomplished truly and justly;
there is none who can change His words, and He is the Hearing, the Knowing.
R
However, in other translations you will see in the scriptures that says, there are tree that testify. The king James outline those 3. In the niv and other translations they have a habit of missing out important scripture meanings, and even though the writers of the niv, rsv and other translations has admitted the scriptures were written, they found it nesessary to have them in there version of the bible. in a sense they are admitting they are taking away from the bible to suit there profit needs. and you know what it says in the bible about taking or adding to his word?
So many people has argued till blue in the face whether King James has added the outline of 1 John 5: 7,and it all stems from the argument with then the Roman catholic church. Although what King James written in that verse was originally written in the Greek Manuscripts. Until the Roman catholic church took over it. Here is a good site for you to read of the history about this verse that's causing many people to fight and argue over. https://www.chick.com/ask/articles/1john57.asp
So i'm more likely to believe and read more of the King james version than other translations. Even though in other versions of the bible it still says there are 3 that testify. if that's not the meaning of trinity, then who am I to believe in a lie?
So many people has argued till blue in the face whether King James has added the outline of 1 John 5: 7,and it all stems from the argument with then the Roman catholic church. Although what King James written in that verse was originally written in the Greek Manuscripts. Until the Roman catholic church took over it. Here is a good site for you to read of the history about this verse that's causing many people to fight and argue over. https://www.chick.com/ask/articles/1john57.asp
So i'm more likely to believe and read more of the King james version than other translations. Even though in other versions of the bible it still says there are 3 that testify. if that's not the meaning of trinity, then who am I to believe in a lie?
R
The problem is the modern translations come from a different Greek underlining manuscript than the King James Bible. The KJV uses the Greek Textus Receptus, while the modern scholars reject this manuscript. This results in the modern translations missing the equivalent of the Book of Ephesians and changing words like "only begotten Son" into "one and only Son". One of the missing verses is 1 John 5:7.
I believe the modern translations have tampered with the very word of God, which is beyond serious. I want to take a look at the internal evidence that 1 John 5:7 is indeed the very word of God and belongs in the Bible, just as it is found in the tried and true King James Bible.
I was recently studying 1 John 5 and came across some interesting information that I never realized. I had never actually studied verse 7, but just looked at it as one of the proofs of the Holy Trinity. The first time, I actually studied it and asked myself what is the RECORD that the Father, Word and Holy Ghost are bearing record in heaven? To my amazement, I did not know. The following is a brief study to show what is this record and how important it is to our salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ.
Scriptural proof for the inclusion of 1 John 5:7
1John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. (In heaven the Godhead bears record but with just this verse it is not clear what is the record. In context, it has to do something with the Lord Jesus Christ.)
1John 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one. (On earth, the Holy Spirit agrees in one with the water and the blood. Again, this has to do with the Lord Jesus' ministry but exactly what is not mentioned.)
1John 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. (The witness of the Holy Spirit is greater than any witness of men. The witness has to do about the ministry of the Lord Jesus here on earth.)
1John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. (This is a very strong verse. It states that anyone who does not believe the record that God gave of His Son makes God a liar! I cannot imagine a verse stronger than this. This is so serious that the record is settled in heaven between the Godhead! But, we still do not know what is this record, but only that the Godhead bears witness to it in heaven.)
1John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
(Now the record is revealed. The record that the Godhead agrees in heaven is that WE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE IN THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD! Our salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ is secure because the Godhead is in total agreement and the blood and water of the Lord Jesus on earth bear witness to the record in heaven.)
I believe the modern translations have tampered with the very word of God, which is beyond serious. I want to take a look at the internal evidence that 1 John 5:7 is indeed the very word of God and belongs in the Bible, just as it is found in the tried and true King James Bible.
I was recently studying 1 John 5 and came across some interesting information that I never realized. I had never actually studied verse 7, but just looked at it as one of the proofs of the Holy Trinity. The first time, I actually studied it and asked myself what is the RECORD that the Father, Word and Holy Ghost are bearing record in heaven? To my amazement, I did not know. The following is a brief study to show what is this record and how important it is to our salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ.
Scriptural proof for the inclusion of 1 John 5:7
1John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. (In heaven the Godhead bears record but with just this verse it is not clear what is the record. In context, it has to do something with the Lord Jesus Christ.)
1John 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one. (On earth, the Holy Spirit agrees in one with the water and the blood. Again, this has to do with the Lord Jesus' ministry but exactly what is not mentioned.)
1John 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. (The witness of the Holy Spirit is greater than any witness of men. The witness has to do about the ministry of the Lord Jesus here on earth.)
1John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. (This is a very strong verse. It states that anyone who does not believe the record that God gave of His Son makes God a liar! I cannot imagine a verse stronger than this. This is so serious that the record is settled in heaven between the Godhead! But, we still do not know what is this record, but only that the Godhead bears witness to it in heaven.)
1John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
(Now the record is revealed. The record that the Godhead agrees in heaven is that WE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE IN THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD! Our salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ is secure because the Godhead is in total agreement and the blood and water of the Lord Jesus on earth bear witness to the record in heaven.)
The truth is that 1 John 5.7 does not appear in any Greek manuscripts earlier than the sixteenth century AD. That is a huge number of manuscripts. To suggest that it has been removed from them ALL can only be seen as absurd. It would have been impossible. It is found in the Latin Vulgate (the Roman Catholic Latin version)..
When Erasmus omitted it from his Greek text on the basis that it appeared in NO Greek text, he said that if a Greek text could be found which contained it he would include it. Six moths later a recently 'copied' Greek text was produced by the church that contained it.
You can believe all the stories and inventions that you like. The facts are overwhelmingly against its inclusion.
When Erasmus omitted it from his Greek text on the basis that it appeared in NO Greek text, he said that if a Greek text could be found which contained it he would include it. Six moths later a recently 'copied' Greek text was produced by the church that contained it.
You can believe all the stories and inventions that you like. The facts are overwhelmingly against its inclusion.
S
Regarding the KJV only remarks, this topic is explained clearly in the KJV Only Controversy by James White. I realize some here will demonize James White because of his opposition to their position, but who cares.
I find it comical that the major proponents of the KJV Only controversy include Peter Ruckman, who believes all sorts of outlandish things including that the government is operating alien breeding facilities and implanting transmitters in the brains of the aged and black people, and Gail Riplinger, who has no academic credentials whatsoever with regards to theology, let alone original languages. Her reasoning behind the KJV controversy is comical. Listen to her "debate" on radio with James White. It will give a sound thinker a giggle.
Steven Anderson would be another one, and his remarks that no one can be saved without words from the KJV are equally strange, let alone his prayers that all gay people would die and that Obama would die of brain cancer.
Just judging from the fruits of the major proponents of the KJV Only position is enough for me. Their credibility is beyond lacking..it is abysmal.
I find it comical that the major proponents of the KJV Only controversy include Peter Ruckman, who believes all sorts of outlandish things including that the government is operating alien breeding facilities and implanting transmitters in the brains of the aged and black people, and Gail Riplinger, who has no academic credentials whatsoever with regards to theology, let alone original languages. Her reasoning behind the KJV controversy is comical. Listen to her "debate" on radio with James White. It will give a sound thinker a giggle.
Steven Anderson would be another one, and his remarks that no one can be saved without words from the KJV are equally strange, let alone his prayers that all gay people would die and that Obama would die of brain cancer.
Just judging from the fruits of the major proponents of the KJV Only position is enough for me. Their credibility is beyond lacking..it is abysmal.
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These ayat do not say that that the Holy Bible is corrupted.
In fact, the authors of the Koran have nothing but kudos for the Biblical material that they copied.
The supposed 'Biblical corruption myth' emanates from ignorant followers of islam as they attempt to compensate for their illiteracy of their very own Koran...
B
Jesus Christ says in the book of Revelation 22:13 the folllowing:
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
This being said, He states that He is God. Of course, He is not God the Father who no one can see, but He is God made flesh, He has shown us Who the Father is. There are hundreds of verses that show Jesus Christ is God. Check out my blog (Is Jesus Christ really God? )where I have listed the Scripture passages, so you can read for yourself in the Bible.
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
This being said, He states that He is God. Of course, He is not God the Father who no one can see, but He is God made flesh, He has shown us Who the Father is. There are hundreds of verses that show Jesus Christ is God. Check out my blog (Is Jesus Christ really God? )where I have listed the Scripture passages, so you can read for yourself in the Bible.
John 1:1
king James version(kjv)
1.)In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
+++++++++
John 1:14
king James version(kjv)
14.)And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
king James version(kjv)
1.)In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
+++++++++
John 1:14
king James version(kjv)
14.)And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.