Which Delivered Us from the Wrath to Come. (1Th 1:10)

[crossnote]

The word "Tribulation in any verse is talking about afflictions, trials or temptations and the word "Wrath" when it comes to the wrath of god is always talking about the "Punishment of God". We are not appointed to suffer any of the Wrath/Punishment of God.
However we are instructed to count all trials as joy and to glory in all tribulations.
Rom 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
Jas 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Suffering the Tribulation to come is not the same event as the wrath to come. Wrath and Tribulation speak of 2 different events that will take place at 2 different times. The Tribulation first which will be implemented against us and then the Wrath of God comes to punish those left behind after the resurrection.

I realize the differences but I was referring to these type of events...

Matthew 24:21 (KJV) For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Revelation 8:7-13 (KJV) The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter. And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise. And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

So call it what you want (God's wrath/great tribulation etc.), I believe I have made it clear I am referring to the events described in much of Revelation...

 

[Dave-L]

Why in 2000 years have we not seen that wrath that we see in Revelation chaps 6-19?

Because you look for the symbol to appear. Instead of what the symbol represents.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Because you look for the symbol to appear. Instead of what the symbol represents.

There is no symbol. God spoke of literal events.

Prophecy is useless if it speaks of symbols. Because God can not use it to prove he is the one true God.

Prophecy is god telling us literal events will happen. When those events happen hndreds or even thousands of years after God said they would. It proves to those who witness those events, that God is the ONE TRUE GOD OF HEAVEN.

 

[massorite]

I realize the differences but I was referring to these type of events...

Matthew 24:21 (KJV) For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Revelation 8:7-13 (KJV) The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter. And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise. And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

So call it what you want (God's wrath/great tribulation etc.), I believe I have made it clear I am referring to the events described in much of Revelation...

It is not a matter of calling it what I want matter of what it is. Those events described in Rev 8:7-13 are the Wrath of God, they are the punishment of God. They are not any kind of Tribulation. Suffering for the name of Christ and the events spoken of in Rev. 8:7-13 are not that same thing. And we will not be here on earth when these events take place.
Rev 6:1-11 are speaking events that pen during a period great Tribualtion and we will still be here on earth while these events are taking place. The same applies to Matthew 24:9-10
Rev 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.
Rev 6:2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.
Rev 6:3 And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.
Rev 6:5 And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.
Rev 6:6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.
Rev 6:7 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.
Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellow servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
Mat 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

TheDivineWatermark said:
Yes, I do believe 1 Thessalonians 1:10's "the One delivering [participle] us out-from [ek] the wrath coming [participle]" speaks of "our Rapture" event.

I've mentioned in past posts that Paul refers to the event (what we call "Rapture") something like 10 times in these 2 epistles, not just the one most-commonly-referred-to verse of 1Th4:17 ('caught up/away').
So, the two other verses you cite from the 1 Thessalonian epistle refer to this also. Agreed. [1Th5:9]

Can you give a list for all the 10 times Paul refers to the Rapture?

I am excited to see your research.

Well, let's play a game... I challenge you to find just ONE MORE (that isn't the ones already mentioned from the above-quoted post), so that would make the FOURTH one, and I'll come back with another (the FIFTH)... how 'bout that.



[I've found that ppl either do not tend to believe it unless they "search it out" themselves, or they do not RETAIN it because they haven't cared enough to "search it out" for themselves, or they just "mindlessly REPEAT things" (even things that are FALSE) because they haven't "searched it out" for themselves to either confirm or deny said things--not saying YOU do any of these, it's just that I tire of handing things out "pre-chewed" just to have others "unable to SEE it [for themselves], once SHOWN," LOL... humor me ]

 

[Jimbone]

And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. (1Th 1:10)

I used to toy with the idea that 'the wrath to come' was a euphemism for hell.
Let's say it is, then what is all the destruction that goes on in Revelation and the sudden destruction that takes the world by surprise in 1Thess 5:3?

For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
(1Th 5:3)

Let's say it is not a euphemism for hell but a brief description of the Great Tribulation which is to fall upon this world at a time they are unaware.

Matthew 24:38-39 (KJV) For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Then would not 'which delivered us from the wrath to come' be referring to the rapture of the Church?

No I'm sorry but this is so much more simple than you're making it. The "wrath" here is referring to what each and every one of us is born with hanging over our heads. We are born in sin to sinners, and outside of Jesus we all rightfully have it coming. This is the "wrath to come" that those born again are delivered from. Everything else you put with it is really just added. With respect, in my opinion.

 

[Kolistus]

Well, let's play a game... I challenge you to find just ONE MORE (that isn't the ones already mentioned from the above-quoted post), so that would make the FOURTH one, and I'll come back with another (the FIFTH)... how 'bout that.



[I've found that ppl either do not tend to believe it unless they "search it out" themselves, or they do not RETAIN it because they haven't cared enough to "search it out" for themselves, or they just "mindlessly REPEAT things" (even things that are FALSE) because they haven't "searched it out" for themselves to either confirm or deny said things--not saying YOU do any of these, it's just that I tire of handing things out "pre-chewed" just to have others "unable to SEE it [for themselves], once SHOWN," LOL... humor me ]

Okay then, how about

1 Thess 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

 

[oldethennew]

the wrath of God is plainly explained over (30) times in the OT. -
it's called, 'The Great Day of The Lord, 'not to be confused with the Great Tribulation'...

it is also mentioned in REV. 6:17.
'For the great day of His wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?'
the 'context' is the 'four horsemen of the Tribulation are 'complete'... and then,
comes 'The great day of His wrath', (that's when He is 'really going to put the hammer down'...

 

[crossnote]

It is not a matter of calling it what I want matter of what it is. Those events described in Rev 8:7-13 are the Wrath of God, they are the punishment of God. They are not any kind of Tribulation.

Why then do you suppose they are called 'tribulation'?...
Matthew 24:21 (KJV) For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

 

[Blade]

I agree no great white throne and saved from the wrath to come.. I see it as the great tribulation. He made it clear we will never see Gods wrath which comes on the whole world. I believe the Church will not be here. I try not to get stuck here. Well pre mid post stuff. I live today. I was not promised tomorrow. So.. I am watching ready now.

Jesus talked about Lot & Noah. Now we know how they lived in both times and can see it happening today. Lot had to be gone and safe or "I can do nothing" God said. Noah.. please.. Noah had to still be on the earth we should know why lol. Yet was safe. Jesus seemed clear to me, it was about how they lived during that time. I do not believe He was ever talking about "caught up".

With the power God gave His Church, the authority over all the power of the enemy. The things happening in Rev by not some man which we have no power over. But this one.. lawless one is no mere man. And the wrath.. its not on a few cities but the world and we know there is no place to hide this time. And then us in heaven.. when would that happen?

Pfft every generation believed they were in the end times. Yes yes granted they did not see Israel come back to the land God promised. And seem to be really blooming. And a verse.. well a word "falling away". It does in fact also mean "departure". And before 1611 .. how many verses, bibles had "departure" written not fallen away"? Hmm strange. For me does not prove pre trib.

If I have to guess speculate.. then I let it go. I look for Him watch for Him NOW. Now is all I have. And I have no problem being wrong.. not my word

 

[crossnote]

No I'm sorry but this is so much more simple than you're making it. The "wrath" here is referring to what each and every one of us is born with hanging over our heads. We are born in sin to sinners, and outside of Jesus we all rightfully have it coming. This is the "wrath to come" that those born again are delivered from. Everything else you put with it is really just added. With respect, in my opinion.

I know condemnation hangs over everyone's heads until coming to Jesus but do you think this verse is simply referring simply to "what each and every one of us is born with hanging over our heads" as applied to the unbelievers who remain when Jesus returns?
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
(1Th 5:3)

 

[crossnote]

Noah.. please.. Noah had to still be on the earth we should know why lol.

In a sense would you say Noah was 'caught up' above the tribulation below on the earth?

 

[garee]

In a sense would you say Noah was 'caught up' above the tribulation below on the earth?

Noah prior to the last day suffered a great tribulation. None like ever before or ever again by flood . Death by water . Noah lived in a body of death but was strengthened by the Spirit that dwelt him to finish the work.

The last day brought the final tribulation the wrath of God being revealed daily "death" never to rise to new spirit life. . In the twinkling of the eye . That burden Noah shared with Christ who lived in him. It must of felt like a thousands years to Noah .Men and woman and children mocking him for 120 years

When Christ said it was finished the time of reformation had come the great "last days" tribulation began when the veil was rent. opening the resurrection gate it will be shut on the last day.

The thousand year metaphor represents a unknown.

Christ will come as a thief in the night in the twinkling of the eye to those who do not have the help of him watching . It will still come as thief as it did with Noah in a time no one expects. We walk by faith. The unseen, eternal

 

[crossnote]

Noah prior to the last day suffered a great tribulation.

Persecution is not the wrath of God.

When Christ said it was finished the time of reformation had come the great "last days" tribulation began when the veil was rent.

the 'last days tribulation' (whatever that means, in no way compares to that great and terrible day...
Joel 2:31 (KJV) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

The thousand year metaphor represents a unknown.

Only if it is counted as a metaphor.

It will still come as thief as it did with Noah in a time no one expects.

Well, yes...
1 Thessalonians 5:3,8-9 (KJV) (3) For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. (8) But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. (9) For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

 

[garee]

Persecution is not the wrath of God.

the 'last days tribulation' (whatever that means, in no way compares to that great and terrible day...
Joel 2:31 (KJV) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Only if it is counted as a metaphor.

Well, yes...
1 Thessalonians 5:3,8-9 (KJV) (3) For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. (8) But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. (9) For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

I would agree it is a representation of the wrath of God . The father poured out the cup of wrath working with the Son.

In that way it is a metaphor the sun and moon the two corruption times keepers will be under the feet of the bride. Its the end of the corrupted creation death never to rise again

The Satan inspired mob is not accredited with the wrath of the father.

In the garden the father purposely put the disciples asleep so that they could not suffer and work.

Prayer is work prompted by the unseen spirit that works in us aiding in prayer crying out to be strengthened . The disciples did not suffer with Jesus. After the 3rd time he woke up the nappers and they continued the three day demonstration ..

Mankind has no part of salvation to include the three days of suffering unto death (not dead) .

The wrath of God is being revealed suffering the result of corruption all the days of their lives , having rest sabbath if new creatures making the load lighter . We can suffer as we make are requests known . No greater tribulation than death ,
Suffering is not divided into dispensations .That a Catholic doctrine . The now dispensation and purgatory the later as another unknown . They teach the pew sitters only Mary received full grace .Everyone else a unknown remnant. . Mary is said to visit men in that suffering. They say she comforts other religions also in purgatory the extension dispensation .

Colossians 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

The poisonous arrows from the father of lies are directed at the believers .In a hope of killing the messengers (law and the prophets) Hoping the spirit of error will kill the spirit of faith as it is written

No need to divide the wrath of God into tribulation dispensations . Its all the same wrath being revealed from the day .(you will no die) the glory (Icabod) has departed. It will reappear on the last day under the Sun

 

[crossnote]

No need to divide the wrath of God into tribulation dispensations . Its all the same wrath being revealed from the day .(you will no die) the glory (Icabod) has departed. It will reappear on the last day under the Sun

So are you saying that the wrath poured out in Revelation is the same wrath being revealed day to day?

 

[massorite]

Why then do you suppose they are called 'tribulation'?...
Matthew 24:21 (KJV) For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

You still don't get it. There isn't any they. Both words are singular. One is Tribulation and the other is Wrath and both words speak of two different events that are not related and they do not occure at the same time. The Wrath of God is brought on specifically by God Himself to punish those who rejected the Gospel after the resurrection. Not one single man on the face of the earth can bring on the Wrath of God because why??? BECAUSE MEN ARE NOT GOD AND ONLY GOD CAN INFLICT MEN WITH HIS WRATH BECAUSE HE IS GOD. Tribulation is inflicted by men against other men by the unction of Satan upon those who have embraced the Gospel of Christ and live their lives accordingly. Since I can't get you to see your mistake in confusing the word Wrath and Tribulation as being one in the same word and speak of the same event, I will explain it to you like I would a child. The difference between the Wrath of God and Tribulation is like apples and oranges. The don't look the same, they don't taste the same, they don't grow on the same tree, they are not the same color but they are both considered to be a form of fruit.
The same applies to Wrath and Tribulation. They both consist of suffering but the only people who will suffer the Wrath of God/punishment of God will be those who have rejected the Gospel of Christ. But those who will suffer great tribulation at the hands of other men will be those who have embraced the Gospel of Christ.
Here are some examples of the Wrath of God.

Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Rev 8:10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;
Rev 8:11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.

Rev 9:3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
Rev 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
Rev 9:5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
Rev 9:6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.
Rev 9:10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.

Rev 9:17 And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
Rev 9:18 By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.

Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
The above scriptures are examples of the Wrath of God and we will not be here on earth to suffer the Wrath of God.

Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Notice here in Rev 16:6 how it says "For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy." These men who are given blood to drink because they have shed the blood of the Saints ARE THOSE WHO WILL REJECT THE GOSPEL OF CHRIST.
Now here are some examples of the great tribulation the saints/we will suffer in the future.
Dan 7:21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
Dan 7:22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

Mar 13:12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
Mar 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
Mat 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The other part you are ahving a hard time with is that there is NO SUCH A THING AS SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION AND THERE IS NO SCRIPTURE THAT TELLS US THAT THERE WILL BE SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION OF SEVN YEARS OF THE WRATH OF GOD.
There is going to be a period of seven years as is mentioned in the book of Daniel but within that seven years both a period of Tribulation against the Saints of Christ will happen and a period of the Wrath of God against those who rejected the Gospel during the seven year period. The ressurrectio will take place BETWEEN THE EVENT OF A GREAT TRIBULATION AGAINST THE SAINTS OF CHRIST AND THE EVENT OF THE WRATH OF GOD IMPLIMENTED BY GOD AGAINST THOSE LEFT HERE ON EARTH AFTERT THE RESURRECTION REMOVES ALL OF THE SAINTS FROM THE EARTH. All three events will happen within that seven year period.

Nowif you don't get it after reading this post, your not capable of getting it.

 

[crossnote]

You still don't get it. There isn't any they. Both words are singular. One is Tribulation and the other is Wrath and both words speak of two different events that are not related and they do not occure at the same time. The Wrath of God is brought on specifically by God Himself to punish those who rejected the Gospel after the resurrection. Not one single man on the face of the earth can bring on the Wrath of God because why??? BECAUSE MEN ARE NOT GOD AND ONLY GOD CAN INFLICT MEN WITH HIS WRATH BECAUSE HE IS GOD. Tribulation is inflicted by men against other men by the unction of Satan upon those who have embraced the Gospel of Christ and live their lives accordingly. Since I can't get you to see your mistake in confusing the word Wrath and Tribulation as being one in the same word and speak of the same event, I will explain it to you like I would a child. The difference between the Wrath of God and Tribulation is like apples and oranges. The don't look the same, they don't taste the same, they don't grow on the same tree, they are not the same color but they are both considered to be a form of fruit.
The same applies to Wrath and Tribulation. They both consist of suffering but the only people who will suffer the Wrath of God/punishment of God will be those who have rejected the Gospel of Christ. But those who will suffer great tribulation at the hands of other men will be those who have embraced the Gospel of Christ.
Here are some examples of the Wrath of God.

Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Rev 8:10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;
Rev 8:11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.

Rev 9:3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
Rev 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
Rev 9:5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
Rev 9:6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.
Rev 9:10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.

Rev 9:17 And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
Rev 9:18 By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.

Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
The above scriptures are examples of the Wrath of God and we will not be here on earth to suffer the Wrath of God.

Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Notice here in Rev 16:6 how it says "For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy." These men who are given blood to drink because they have shed the blood of the Saints ARE THOSE WHO WILL REJECT THE GOSPEL OF CHRIST.
Now here are some examples of the great tribulation the saints/we will suffer in the future.
Dan 7:21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
Dan 7:22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

Mar 13:12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
Mar 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
Mat 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The other part you are ahving a hard time with is that there is NO SUCH A THING AS SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION AND THERE IS NO SCRIPTURE THAT TELLS US THAT THERE WILL BE SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION OF SEVN YEARS OF THE WRATH OF GOD.
There is going to be a period of seven years as is mentioned in the book of Daniel but within that seven years both a period of Tribulation against the Saints of Christ will happen and a period of the Wrath of God against those who rejected the Gospel during the seven year period. The ressurrectio will take place BETWEEN THE EVENT OF A GREAT TRIBULATION AGAINST THE SAINTS OF CHRIST AND THE EVENT OF THE WRATH OF GOD IMPLIMENTED BY GOD AGAINST THOSE LEFT HERE ON EARTH AFTERT THE RESURRECTION REMOVES ALL OF THE SAINTS FROM THE EARTH. All three events will happen within that seven year period.

Nowif you don't get it after reading this post, your not capable of getting it.

I have read enough views to know there are other views than your own, and I have lived long enough to know a condescending attitude when I read one. Thanks for your opinion, I happen not to fully agree.

 

[massorite]

Well, let's play a game... I challenge you to find just ONE MORE (that isn't the ones already mentioned from the above-quoted post), so that would make the FOURTH one, and I'll come back with another (the FIFTH)... how 'bout that.



[I've found that ppl either do not tend to believe it unless they "search it out" themselves, or they do not RETAIN it because they haven't cared enough to "search it out" for themselves, or they just "mindlessly REPEAT things" (even things that are FALSE) because they haven't "searched it out" for themselves to either confirm or deny said things--not saying YOU do any of these, it's just that I tire of handing things out "pre-chewed" just to have others "unable to SEE it [for themselves], once SHOWN," LOL... humor me ]

Come on people. The word "Rapture" is not written anywhere in the Bible. It is written in the Latin Vulgate and is means to "take up"
In my opinion the Rapture and the Resurrection are the same event.

 

[massorite]

I have read enough views to know there are other views than your own, and I have lived long enough to know a condescending attitude when I read one. Thanks for your opinion, I happen not to fully agree.

I have read enough views to know there are other views than your own, and I have lived long enough to know a condescending attitude when I read one. Thanks for your opinion, I happen not to fully agree.

Oh well. Some folks simply never learn.