Who Justifieth the Ungodly

[reneweddaybyday]

your notion of "human faith" and "natural mans faith out of his flesh" and "faith is law" is just more of your vain imagining in your continued attempt to support your erroneous dogma.

Yes it is the law, the flesh

Your erroneous dogma only affects you ... your erroneous dogma does not affect the truth of Scripture, nor does it affect me.

This applies to the regenerated

So now you're saying that Ephesians 1:13 applies to the believer after he/she is born again????

Under your erroneous dogma, how many times must a person be born again before he/she is truly "born again"???


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!


Ephesians 1:13 In whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise


After you heard, you believed.

After you believed, you were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise (regenerated / born again)
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[reneweddaybyday]

The point is that the keeping of the law was never intended as a means of salvation. Again, salvation is wholly by grace through faith.

And yet you are trying to do just that with your natural human faith. Human faith is law keeping Matt 23:23

your "human faith" fallacy has been proven to be in error as there is only one faith (Eph 4:5).

your "faith is law keeping" fallacy has been proven to be in error as Scripture is clear that faith ≠ works (Rom 4:5).

Your erroneous dogma does not hold up under the scrutiny of Scripture.

You have built your house upon the sand ...

Matthew 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
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[reneweddaybyday]

Yes, 1 Jn 5:1 teaches being born again is before Faith/believing.

nope ... click
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[brightfame52]

renewed

Due to your erroneous limited atonement dogma, you are unable to comprehend the point stated in Scripture.

Limited atonement is the doctrine of God and the Gospel, His Death was limited to the Elect, and effectual in saving them. Its too bad you are in the dark on that friend.

The Lord Jesus Christ took not on him the nature of angels because He came to save mankind ... He did not come to save angels.

Not so, it was because He came to save, help take hold of the Seed of Abraham which is an elect people out from mankind Heb 2:16

16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Took on is epilambanomai :

1. to take in addition, to lay hold of, take possession of, overtake, attain, attain to
   1. to lay hold of or to seize upon anything with the hands, to take hold of, lay hold of
   2. metaph. to rescue one from peril, to help, succour

He came to rescue, deliver, help succor, lay hold of the seed of Abraham, not all mankind.

Again Jesus relates His Salvation to the seed or children of Abraham here Lk 19:9-10

9 And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.

10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost. The Lost seed of Abraham Heb 2:16

another example of your poor workmanship in rightly dividing the word of truth.

The only other verse in Scripture in which the word hilaskomai is used is Luke 18:13:

Luke 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful [Greek hilaskomai] to me a sinner.

Too bad you cant see that truth, and that causes you to flip it off like nothing. You been witnessed to however. The whole world of 1 Jn 2:2 is Justified, so you know it cant be all without exception.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Rom 12:3

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

I have no problem with Romans 12:3 ...

Since it is you who does not believe Romans 12:3, then it is you who has the problem with God.
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[reneweddaybyday]

God Justifieth the ungodly.

God justifies those who believe on Him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead for we are justified by faith. Those who reject God will find themselves rejected come judgment day.

Romans 4:

20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
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[reneweddaybyday]

Justification has been applied to them

righteousness is imputed when a person believes

Romans 4:

20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ

all for whom Christ died are Justified

John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
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[reneweddaybyday]

Thats because Faith is a doing of the Law

Your feeble attempts to make faith a "doing of the Law" are nothing but the musings of your erroneous dogma.

The whole purpose of the law is to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith:

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

To be justified by faith is one of the weightier matters of the law the scribes and pharisees failed to comprehend ... and it appears you are following in their steps in your "faith is law keeping" fallacy.

ones own faith is works or doing the law

Romans 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Rom 4:5 clearly states faith ≠ works.


Romans 3:

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe


Rom 3:21-22 clearly states the righteousness of God without the law is unto all and upon all them that believe.


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
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[brightfame52]

renewed

Your claim that faith = works does not line up with Scripture. Romans 4 tells us faith ≠ works:

You teach faith as a condition man performs to get Justified, thats works all day. When you make anything a condition to do, in order for God to respond and Justify you, its works. Plus by creation man is bound by law to have Faith in God, which is a law of creation Matt 23:23

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Romans 4:

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Good passage which I agree with, you dont, because you make faith, believing a condition to get Justified, this passage doesnt do that.

Those whose sins God has been propitiated for, those people are yet Justified.
nope ... it means the sin issue has been dealt with.

Uh oh, you short changing the saving virtue of the blood of Christ.

Since sin has been dealt with, what is the issue???

There is no issue, Christ put sin away, made a end to it, for His Elect

Heb 9:26

For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

Dan 9:24

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Those whose sins have been put away, made an end to, are saved, Justified !

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ:

for it [the gospel] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Agreed, this is referring to the regenerate, only the born of God believe.

Rom 1:18 applies to all who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

It applies to the reprobate, who Christ didnt die for. People who Christ died for, God will have mercy on their unrighteousness Heb 8:12

12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

See Christ died for the sin of suppressing the truth, thats what lost sinners do naturally.

Please note that the verse does not state they cannot believe. The verse clearly states that what may be known of God is manifest in them; for God shewed it to them.

But that cant believe the Gospel, no lost person can. And God has already predestinated them vessels of wrath and fits them for destruction, those folks are condemned, and Gods wrath abideth on them.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

yes and notice how the words are written in Scripture ... whoever believes that Jesus is the Messiah is born of God.

however, brightfame52 manipulates the order of the words ... "born of God before they believe" ... to change the meaning of the verse to align with erroneous dogma.

iow brightfame52 claims one is born again before believing the truth by which one is born again. I have asked brightfame52 how many times must a person be born again before he/she is born again. brightfame52 will not answer ... just posts more erroneous dogma.

Yes 1 Jn 5:1 proves that one has been born of God and thats the reason why they believe, and love

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

It can read

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Due to your erroneous limited atonement dogma, you are unable to comprehend the point stated in Scripture.

Then you HAVE to believe all the verses that plainly say that Jesus died for everyone is a lie.

Don't be foolish.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Limited atonement is the doctrine of God

nope ... it is a construct of the doctrine of calvinism.

limited atonement is the third letter of the acronym TULIP which is commonly known as the five points of calvinism.

The Lord Jesus Christ took not on him the nature of angelsbecause He came to save mankind ... He did not come to save angels.

Not so, it was because He came to save, help take hold of the Seed of Abraham which is an elect people out from mankind

The same truth concerning the Lord Jesus Christ having taken on Himself the likeness of men is stated in Phil 2:

Philippians 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men

The difference between what is written in Heb 2 and what is written in Phil 2 is the audience to whom the letters were written.

Hebrews was written to Jewish believers (physical descendants of Abraham) ... Philippians was written to gentile believers.

Took on is epilambanomai

So? The words "and took upon Him" in Philippians 2:7 are translated from the Greek word lambanó.

Please note that the word epilambanomai is derived from two Greek words (epí and lambánō).

Again Jesus relates His Salvation to the seed or children of Abraham here Lk 19:9-10

Luke 19:

9 And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.

10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

newsflash for you brightfame52 ... all descendants of Adam (not just descendants of Abraham) were "lost" when Adam and Eve fell.

The Lord Jesus Christ called Himself a son of Abraham because Abraham appears in the genealogy of the Lord Jesus Christ.

In the gospels, the Lord Jesus Christ is also referred to as:

Son of God
Son of David
Son of man
Son of Mary
Son of Joseph

The whole world of 1 Jn 2:2 is Justified, so you know it cant be all without exception.

Justified? Really? Is that what is written in the text?

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

The word "justified" is translated from the Greek word dikaioō. If the Bible you read has the word "justified" (Greek dikaioō), you should toss it because the word dikaioō does not appear in the text.
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[reneweddaybyday]

Your claim that faith = works does not line up with Scripture. Romans 4 tells us faith ≠ works:

You teach faith as a condition man performs to get Justified, thats works all day.

nope ... I read Scripture just as the Author wrote it:

Scripture clearly states we are justified by faith:

Romans 4:

20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ


You have a problem with therefore being justified by faith? Take it up with the Author of Scripture.

Plus by creation man is bound by law to have Faith in God, which is a law of creation Matt 23:23

The "law" to which the Lord Jesus Christ referred in Matt 23:23 was the law of Moses.

Romans 4:

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Good passage which I agree with

Then you finally agree fath ≠ works.

Those whose sins God has been propitiated for, those people are yet Justified.

nope ... it means the sin issue has been dealt with.

Uh oh, you short changing the saving virtue of the blood of Christ.

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

The word "justified" is translated from the Greek word dikaioō. Please show me where the word dikaioō appears in the verse.
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[reneweddaybyday]

yes and notice how the words are written in Scripture ... whoever believes that Jesus is the Messiah is born of God.

however, brightfame52 manipulates the order of the words ... "born of God before they believe" ... to change the meaning of the verse to align with erroneous dogma.

It can read

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

What the verse does not state is that a person is "born of God before they believe", which is what you claimed in your Post #2129.

As FreeGrace2 pointed out in Post #2165:

1 Jn 5:1 clearly doesn't say what he claims. It says those who are now believing have been born again. That's all.​

​

It says nothing about the order of belief and regeneration.​

Quit manipulating Scripture to align with your erroneous dogma. You are to align your dogma to Scripture and where your dogma is in error, let go of the error.


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
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[brightfame52]

renewed

Provide the posts, brightfame52.

Prove up your claim that I have ever stated "Christs death was worthless".

Whenever you claim that people Christ died for wind up in hell for their sins, that equates to saying Christs death was worthless to save them from sin and going to hell. Now dont you say that sinners Christ died for, shed His precious blood for, shall yet die in their sins and unbelief ? Yes or No ?

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

The only person on this thread who has made such a blasphemous statement is you ... so that lie can be laid at your keyboard

.

Oh really, please provide that statement !

No, those He died for do not have to believe it, accept it or do anything but continue being ungodly sinners
Yeah I said that, but in what context ?
hahahahahaha!!!! good thing I was sitting down when I read that line from the one who rips verses from the context within which they have been placed by the Author of Scripture ...

That statement is True, those Christ died for are Justified by His Death, they dont have to do one thing for that to be True. They dont have to believe, repent, fast, be baptized or anything. Christs Blood did it for them. Now later in their lifetime, they will be given Faith to believe that they are Justified by the Blood if Christ, but that's after the fact, and has no causation of the fact. They shall repent, have a change of mind, but that's no cause of their Justification before God, Christs blood did that, their repentance shows that they now change their mind on having based their acceptance with God on their doings or not doings, on their meeting conditions, but now understand by revelation, they were Justified by the doings of Jesus Christ. The elect were Justified before God while being ungodly sinners ! Thats the context, God be a judge between you and i in this matter.

See when you make a blanket statement like this without providing the context in which it was stated, its being deceitful and dishonest .
glad you finally admit to your deceitful and dishonest handling of Scripture.

You are the deceitful one, just to win an argument.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

it doesnt matter who hides it, its hid ! So while in a lost state, the Gospel is hidden to a person, so they cannot possibly believe it.
yes, it does matter who tries to hide it.

No it doesnt matter, because the fact remains, the Gospel is hidden to the Lost.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

As long as you continue to teach that it is God Who hides the gospel, you are preaching the lie of satan as it is satan who will stop at nothing to keep the gospel hid.

God does hide the Gospel Matt 11:25-26


25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.

God sends men strong delusion in order for them to believe a lie 2 Thess 2:11

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

The true believer preaches the gospel (it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe – 1 Cor 1:21).

i know, I am preaching the Gospel to you, how that Christ died and Justified the ungodly, and you see your response !

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Yes they all were imprisoned by God in unbelief, thats being in a lost state, no way out.
God provided the "way out". There is only "one" escape ... the Lord Jesus Christ.

John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

Yet you preach the false gospel that people Jesus Christ died for, die spiritually blind and in their sins and unbelief.