Who Justifieth the Ungodly

[reneweddaybyday]

Thats what you believe.

that's what you believe I believe.

You said yourself Faith is a requirement for getting saved.

Since you have a problem with the faith issue, you need to go to God because it is God as the Author of Scripture Who said:

Romans 10:

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.

brightfame52 if the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord in your life and if you do not believe God raised Jesus from the dead, you are not saved ... you are ashamed.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Justification of the ungodly isnt about what a person must do, its about what a Person has done

You are deluded if you believe you are the only one at this site who believes that.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

you find scripture truths within the context of scripture. Duh

yeah ... you should try it sometime.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

thats who Paul is writing of in Colossians judging from Col 3:12

... oh yes, let's skip to a remoter context than Col 2:6-11 which I submitted in Post #1598 and Post #1610

Since you insist on the remoter context of Col 3:12, let's not skip over Col 3:8-10:

Colossians 3:

8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him


Those who have received (Greek paralambanó) Christ Jesus the Lord are born again believers ... those who have had faithful ministers come alongside (Greek para) to teach them the gospel which they received (Greek lambanó – aggressively took hold of). It is born again believers who are instructed to put off the old man (vs 9) and put on the new man (vs 10).


Now read verse 12 ...

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering

The elect of God are born again believers who put on the new man (Who is the Elect of God) ... the verse does not include your so called "elect unbeliever".


Again, it is clear that your statement that Col 2:13-14 "speaks to Justification before faith or believing" is not true. Your erroneous dogma of which we are warned in Col 2:8 we must beware has again been revealed as error when scrutinized under the light of Scripture.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

You condition Justification on works

I believe you believe that.

you said man is required to believe, exercise Faith before he is Justified. Thats works

Not according to Romans 4:

Romans 4:

2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it [Abraham's faith] was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.


Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Im still waiting on the scripture that says man must meet or do a requirement for Salvation. Thats law preaching.

Now you're saying faith = law????

Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

That those Christ died for dont have to believe, obey, or repent, in fact do anything in order to be Justified from all sin and pronounced Righteous before God, that Truth is seen in Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Read the verses just before and just after Romans 4:25, brightfame52:

Romans 4:

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ


Romans 4:25 is sandwiched between two verses which make clear God's perspective on faith/believing. God makes clear the error of your dogma.

Now in the text they are said to be Justified when Christ rose for their Justification !

According to Scripture, Abraham was justified when he believed:

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it [Abraham's faith] was counted unto him for righteousness.

Wonder if one that comes to believe on Him did so in 1981, did Christ raise from the dead for their Justifcation before 1981 ? Of course He did !

And the one who "comes to believe on Him" in 1981 is justified in 1981 when he or she believes ... just as stated in Scripture:

Romans 4:

20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it [Abraham's faith] was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ

So all for whom He died and rose again for

John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.


John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.


1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

So all for whom He died and rose again for are both acquitted and pronounced Righteous before God, before they believe a thing, or even before they even know about it, it will be a Gospel revelation to them Rom 1:16-17. However, it was a fact before the Gospel revelation, and so their coming to believe it had absolutely nothing to do with it, for the fact were a reality[before God because of Christ] before they were even born sinners ! This is a Truth the antichrist followers cannot receive !

It is a fact that the Lord Jesus Christ is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. That is truth even if some do not believe.

It is not a fact that those who are "pronounced Righteous before God" are made righteous "before they believe a thing"
.

 

[brightfame52]

All that believe are or have been Justified !

Even though false religionists dont believe it, wont accept it, nevertheless it must be preached, but only those who have been Justified, by the Merits of Christ's blood shed for them, do and can believe ! The reason why the masses of people dont believe and will not believe on Christ, its simply this ,They cannot because they were never of His Sheep Jn 10:26

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

So they cannot believe Jn 12:37-39

37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not

38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

God gives only them Christ actually died for the ability to believe on Him, for His sake Phil 1:29, those only for whom He suffered and died, and by that, did satisfy all His Law and Justice FOR THEM ! All for whom He died He made them declared Righteous Rom 5:18-19

18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

And to them this Righteousness and Justification of Life is revealed to God given Faith Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Understand, The Gospel makes known to them that Christ died for, the results of His death, Righteousness to them and or Justification of Life, For they had been freely Justified by His Grace through the Redemption [its efficacious value] that is ni Christ Jesus Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

 

[brightfame52]

that's what you believe I believe.





Since you have a problem with the faith issue, you need to go to God because it is God as the Author of Scripture Who said:

Romans 10:

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.

brightfame52 if the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord in your life and if you do not believe God raised Jesus from the dead, you are not saved ... you are ashamed.
.

As long as you believe Faith is a requirement for men in order to Justification before God, you teach Justification by works, and deny Justification by Grace and the Blood of Christ.

 

[brightfame52]

You are deluded if you believe you are the only one at this site who believes that.
.

You must be deluded if you believe you believe it, since you adamantly teach that Faith is a qualifying condition man must meet in order to Justification before God. You flat out deny it !

 

[brightfame52]

yeah ... you should try it sometime.
.

I do it all the time and you reject them, and say Im taking them out of context ! Duh whenever you highlight a certain text from its context, you are lifting it out of its context to see whats highlighted ! Jesus did it, Paul did it, Peter did it and any sound bible teacher does it.

 

[brightfame52]

... oh yes, let's skip to a remoter context than Col 2:6-11 which I submitted in Post #1598 and Post #1610

Since you insist on the remoter context of Col 3:12, let's not skip over Col 3:8-10:

Colossians 3:

8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him


Those who have received (Greek paralambanó) Christ Jesus the Lord are born again believers ... those who have had faithful ministers come alongside (Greek para) to teach them the gospel which they received (Greek lambanó – aggressively took hold of). It is born again believers who are instructed to put off the old man (vs 9) and put on the new man (vs 10).


Now read verse 12 ...

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering

The elect of God are born again believers who put on the new man (Who is the Elect of God) ... the verse does not include your so called "elect unbeliever".


Again, it is clear that your statement that Col 2:13-14 "speaks to Justification before faith or believing" is not true. Your erroneous dogma of which we are warned in Col 2:8 we must beware has again been revealed as error when scrutinized under the light of Scripture.
.

It doesnt matter, Paul is writing to Gods Elect. Hes not writing the epistle of Colossians to the entire world of men. Thats foolish thinking.

And yes believers were Justified, forgiven, had their sins blotted away way before they believed. If a believer is born in 1957, and Christ died for their sins and blotted them out in 33 ad, when were that believers sins blotted out by the cross ? A. In 33 ad, B in 1957 or C when the believer became a believer lets say in 1987

 

[brightfame52]

Now you're saying faith = law????

Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.
.

Im still waiting on the scripture that says man must meet or do a requirement for Salvation. Thats law preaching.

 

[brightfame52]

Read the verses just before and just after Romans 4:25, brightfame52:

Romans 4:

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ


Romans 4:25 is sandwiched between two verses which make clear God's perspective on faith/believing. God makes clear the error of your dogma.





According to Scripture, Abraham was justified when he believed:

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it [Abraham's faith] was counted unto him for righteousness.





And the one who "comes to believe on Him" in 1981 is justified in 1981 when he or she believes ... just as stated in Scripture:

Romans 4:

20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it [Abraham's faith] was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness] was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ





John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.


John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.


1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.





It is a fact that the Lord Jesus Christ is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. That is truth even if some do not believe.

It is not a fact that those who are "pronounced Righteous before God" are made righteous "before they believe a thing"
.

According to Rom 4:25 Jesus rose again because of what ?

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Even though false religionists dont believe it, wont accept it, nevertheless it must be preached, but only those who have been Justified, by the Merits of Christ's blood shed for them, do and can believe !

Not true, brightfame52. Unbelievers "do and can believe !"

The issue is not that natural man can't believe. The issue is that they believe lies.

The born again one believes the truth of the gospel ... the unbeliever believes anything and everything but the truth.

Some unbelievers believe there is no God ... some believe in buddha ... some believe in allah ... some believe in paganism ... etc., etc.

Just because unbelievers don't believe God, or don't believe the gospel, does not mean they do not believe.

Heck, God gives us good warning that even believers can be led astray ...

2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

So they cannot believe Jn 12:37-39


37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not

38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again

From Clarke's Commentary:

Therefore they could not believe - Why? Because they did not believe the report of the prophets concerning Christ; therefore they credited not the miracles which he wrought as a proof that he was the person foretold by the prophets, and promised to their fathers. Having thus resisted the report of the prophets, and the evidence of Christ's own miracles, God gave them up to the darkness and hardness of their own hearts, so that they continued to reject every overture of Divine mercy​

God gives only them Christ actually died for the ability to believe on Him, for His sake Phil 1:29

I believe God has given faith to all mankind ... and some reject God Who has given everything mankind needs in order to come to Him.

What we are told in Philippians 1:29 is that just as God provided everything we need in order to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, God shall supply everything we need in order to remain steadfast and not be terrified by [our] adversaries (Phil 1:28) so we are able to withstand when we suffer for His sake (Phil 1:29):

Philippians 1:

27 Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;

28 And in nothing terrified by your adversaries: which is to them an evident token of perdition, but to you of salvation, and that of God.

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake

Understand, The Gospel makes known to them that Christ died for

The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... the world ... the whole world.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

As long as you believe Faith is a requirement for men in order to Justification before God

According to Romans 5:1, how are we justified ?

Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ

you teach Justification by works

nope ... that your erroneous dogma claims that faith equals works does not mean I "teach Justification by works".

You refuse to believe Scripture and God allows you to reject truth ... just like God allows unbelievers to reject the truth of the gospel.

Here is the truth of Scripture you reject:

Romans 4:

2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it [Abraham's faith] was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.


Align your erroneous dogma to Scripture. Do not attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.

and deny Justification by Grace and the Blood of Christ.

more nonsense from brightfame52 (aka accuser of the brethren).
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

You must be deluded if you believe you believe it, since you adamantly teach that Faith is a qualifying condition man must meet in order to Justification before God. You flat out deny it !

ahhh-hahahahahahaha!!!

Here's what I submitted in Post #1333 over a month ago ...

Romans 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.​

​

it is not faith that saves. It is the OBJECT of faith Who saves ... the on Him that justifieth the ungodly is Who saves. Him that justifieth the ungodly imputes righteousness on those who believe when they believe ... not before they believe.​

.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

you find scripture truths within the context of scripture. Duh

yeah ... you should try it sometime

I do it all the time

No you don't. you rip single verses from their context and then go off on an erroneous dogmatic tangent in your attempt to align Scripture to your dogma.

Then when I submit a post with the full context within which the verse sits, you claim "evasion" and/or "rabbit trail", and refuse to consider the context.

I've even explained to you the difference between eisegesis (your approach to studying Scripture) and exegesis (the proper approach to studying Scripture):

Exegesis and eisegesis are two conflicting approaches in Bible study. Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. The word exegesis literally means “to lead out of.” That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.​

​

The opposite approach to Scripture is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.​

​

Obviously, only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis is a mishandling of the text and often leads to a misinterpretation. Exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, respecting its grammar, syntax, and setting. Eisegesis is concerned only with making a point, even at the expense of the meaning of words.​

https://www.gotquestions.org/exegesis-eisegesis.html​

.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

... oh yes, let's skip to a remoter context than Col 2:6-11 which I submitted in Post #1598 and Post #1610

It doesnt matter

r-i-g-h-t ... we don't need the full context of the verse when you peddle your erroneous dogma ... sneaky sneaky

All who have posted on this thread know why you do not like immediate context ... and now, apparently, remoter context ... all because when the light of God's Word shines on your dogma, your error is exposed.
.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

According to Rom 4:25 Jesus rose again because

context context context

Romans 4:

24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ


Romans 4:25 is sandwiched between two verses which make clear God's perspective on faith/believing.


It is a fact that the Lord Jesus Christ is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. That is truth even if some do not believe.

It is not a fact that those who are "pronounced Righteous before God" are made righteous "before they believe a thing"

God makes clear the error of your dogma.
.