Why do some people believe and some do not?

[Pilgrimshope]

Well here is the original post I responded to earlier today:


So you were mentioned in relation to saying faith is superfluous.

Which is why I asked if it is what you think or not.

Because I want to make sure if you do, or if you don't.

Because unlike others here I do not like to make assumptions.

Yes I don’t really follow everything I didn’t even know what that word meant to be honest had to look it up . I might used to have known but lol i think a lot of us here have different ideas about everything really sister every term like “ faith “ or like “ sealed with the spirit “ what’s that really mean ? To one person it’s a guarantee of eternal salvation I’ve seen many use it as such in a discussion ,but to another person …it’s just in accordance with Jesus promising the holy ghost would come be present with those who believed the gospel and it doesn’t change anything else the New Testament says about judgement or anything

i don’t think we spend enough time explaining what we think those terms mean individually because there’s obviously a disconnect here in this place

i think alot of people use a line to try to erase a chapter

 

[Magenta]

“Choose sin and then we become a slave of sin. Yes, that is what Jesus said. SLAVE.”

well actually it depends on what version of the Bible you read sister

“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:31-32, 34-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

my point is though look at what he’s saying before and after him that single line

“said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

He isn’t making then free first then they’ll keep his word he’s telling them to keep his word and then they’ll know the truth and be set free from serving sin

But according (it seems like ) to some of you guys no one can ever do that I til God specially enables them by making then a new person but only he oredestinested who he’s going to do thie for and o my those folks are enabled to hesr and believe and be saved ect

i honestly don’t know sister seems like another wonderful bi ke talk here in the twilight zone

Someone cannot continue in something if they have not made a start. So people who already believe are being spoken of. Do you think that upon becoming a believer a person knows the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth all of a sudden and right away and bign bang boom all their problems are solved? It seems to me most people consider sanctification a life long process and the more we dedicate ourselves to the Word of God the more free we become. Do you 100% disagree with that view?

 

[Magenta]

Yes I don’t really follow everything I didn’t even know what that word meant to be honest had to look it up . I might used to have known but lol i think a lot of us here have different ideas about everything really sister every term like “ faith “ or like “ sealed with the spirit “ what’s that really mean ? To one person it’s a guarantee of eternal salvation I’ve seen many use it as such in a discussion ,but to another person …it’s just in accordance with Jesus promising the holy ghost would come be present with those who believed the gospel and it doesn’t change anything else the New Testament says about judgement or anything

i think alot of people use a line to try to erase a chapter

Yeah people throw that whole chapter of Romans 7 out. Bam. Gone.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yeah people throw that whole chapter of Romans 7 out. Bam. Gone.

mmhm other begin at chapter 1 where Paul’s letter begins to see what led to chapter 7s situation

i eas up late tonight visiting at the hospital sister I’m tired gonna get some rest ! I hope your morning is wonderful there this new year !!!!

 

[Magenta]

mmhm other begin at chapter 1 where Paul’s letter begins to see what led to chapter 7s situation

i eas up late tonight visiting at the hospital sister I’m tired gonna get some rest ! I hope your morning is wonderful there this new year !!!!

I hope you have a good sleep and let me know when you have considered all the verses I mentioned earlier that you asked about.

Also it would be nice to know what you actually disagree with.

You mention a line to erase a chapter, I agree, and you come back with disagreeing. Makes not much sense to me. I am
left not know what if anything you disagree with or why you cannot acknowledge my agreeing and giving an example.

 

[Melach]

"But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned"

This is no by any means a stand alone verse or a summation, read the entire letter and understand the audience to whom the letter was written.

whats in the context that makes this mean something else

 

[Melach]

Here you go genius....
Now that you know the truth, are you going to hide it like the guy that hid the talent?

Now we have received G2983 , not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

Outline of Biblical Usage

1. to take
   1. to take with the hand, lay hold of, any person or thing in order to use it
      1. to take up a thing to be carried
      2. to take upon one's self

================================================================================

[2Ki 6:5 KJV]
But as one was felling a beam, the axe head fell into the water: and he cried, and said, Alas, master! for it was borrowed.

[2Ki 6:6 KJV]
And the man of God said, Where fell it? And he shewed him the place. And he cut down a stick, and cast [it] in thither; and the iron did swim.

[2Ki 6:7 KJV]
Therefore said he (the Man of God aka the God-Man), Take [it] up to thee. And he put out his hand, and took it.

no radio silence. i dont see how this verse would be a trouble for calvinists? born again people have received God's spirit?

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

But hunger etc are longings of the flesh and according to you they are the sinful nature.

I don't believe I said longings are sin. I said longings are the other law that causes man to sin when he loves the world more than God, which comes from the heart

It's not sin to satisfy the physical longing to have sex, but it is sin to have sex with the wrong person.

Its not sin to admire something's physical beauty and desire it, but it is sinful to let that become desire that causes one to act in ungodly ways that hurts self and other people.

It's not sin to feel satisfaction for doing a good job, but it is sin to be a man-pleaser, ie receive praise from other men, and to esteem one's self better than other people.

 

[studier]

Its not sin to admire something's physical beauty and desire it,

Clarify please?

NKJ Matthew 5:28 "But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

You also said that the natural man is the soulish man, so once again you are placing the sin nature in the soul and I have already shown you it is impossible for the sin nature to be in the soul otherwise we could not desire good. It would be in constant opposition to the Spirit who is good. You are effectively saying there is a battle between the mind and the mind, tearing itself apart, but you don't seem to realise that.

Just because the soul loves worldly things doesn't mean it is totally incapable of also loving spiritual things; that's a gnostic idea, ie total depravity/inability. It can also love godly things. That's called being double-minded and that is the struggle Paul is talking about with the law of fleshly longings warring against the law of the spiritual mind, ie desire to do good. You're under the influence of the gnostic idea that physical substance is evil, ie sin nature resides in the flesh.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Clarify please?

NKJ Matthew 5:28 "But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Obviously Jesus is talking about uncontrolled inordinate longing that causes godly love to be displaced by the desire for sexual satisfaction. Feeling sexual attraction for others is not sin; it's what we let our minds do with that desire that determines if it's sin or not. It's like Barney Fife said: "Nip it! Nip it in the bud!"

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Clarify please?

NKJ Matthew 5:28 "But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

This is the holy spirit when feeling sexual longing for a person that is not your spouse

 

[mailmandan]

YOU MUST BE BORN AGAIN otherwise reading the bible is like reading someone else's mail.

I call it "textbook theology" for the natural man reading the Bible. (1 Corinthians 2:11-14)

 

[mailmandan]

The very heart of the reason why people don't believe the gospel:

2 Corinthians 4:3 - But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

 

[studier]

t's what we let our minds do with that desire that determines if it's sin or not. It's like Barney Fife said: "Nip it! Nip it in the bud!"

Fife wisdom seems to say it all. At some point of practical training in Christ in Spirit it seems to me that nipping it is even less and less necessary as the inordinate desire becomes less and less.

Thanks for the response.

 

[studier]

This is the holy spirit when feeling sexual longing for a person that is not your spouse

Programming has changed quite a bit, hasn't it...

 

[studier]

Anybody got five minutes to de-Calvinize this "old man new man" business?

It's gonna go down as effortlessly as that "natural man" thing did. Easy peasy.

I'll read as you take it down. Context seems to make the "natural man" issue pretty clear. So does elaborating on the word translated as "natural".

Please begin.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

it seems to me that nipping it is even less and less necessary as the inordinate desire becomes less and less.

This is so true. The old dies away and godly behavior becomes our predominant nature

 

[studier]

This is so true. The old dies away and godly behavior becomes our predominant nature

Laws in minds & written on hearts. The developed and trained new man in Christ. Conformed to His likeness...... So much good stuff to ponder and pursue in Christ in Spirit.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Programming has changed quite a bit, hasn't it...

You know the thing with an angel on one shoulder and a devil on the other shoulder telling us what to do. From now on this clip of Barney is going to be the angel on my shoulder.