Why does the Christian not have a licence to sin?

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john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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I have spoken to a few seventh day Adventists. I have not found any yet who understand what it means to have the law written on your mind and placed on your heart. Doug Bachelor believes that has happened under the new covenant, so does a visiting minister at a seventh day Adventist church near where I live, but the minister of the church says it is untrue that has happened under the new covenant.
But though some do believe it has happened they do not understand what it means in reality for the born again Christian
The personal accusations and aspersions you cast reveal a little something about you and some personal hang-up you have with the SDAs.

(I hear an axe grinding...)
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,363
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For those of you that are bent on obeying Christ's commandments as a signature statement of following after righteousness, please give a specific real life NT example of the believer obeying a commandment given in the NT that does not relate to a sin of the flesh. I also have a question or two. When obeying the commandments given in the NT, are we to obey all of them or just some of them selectively? Can we omit certain commandments that Christ gave, including those given to his disciples, or are we to love God and obey all the commandments? If we do not obey all the commandments by putting them into action by faith, would that be considered omitting what we have been commanded to do under grace in the NT and not loving God the way that we should? Are we to be driven to obey his commandments to reveal that we love God or are we lead of the Spirit to obey because we are filled up and motivated with the love of God by that same Spirit? Is our faith only duty bound to keep the commandments or is our faith energized by love to do those things that are pleasing in His sight?
FYI only............. :) not arguing anything

John 13:34 .) A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
35 .) By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Matthew 22:36 .) Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 .) Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 .) This is the first and great commandment.
39 .) And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 .) On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.


Commandments having to do with the heart........spiritual.........yes?
 
Feb 5, 2015
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The personal accusations and aspersions you cast reveal a little something about you and some personal hang-up you have with the SDAs.

(I hear an axe grinding...)
Just giving honest comments. I could give some more on this subject if you would like, just let me know
 
B

BradC

Guest
FYI only............. :) not arguing anything

John 13:34 .) A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
35 .) By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Matthew 22:36 .) Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 .) Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 .) This is the first and great commandment.
39 .) And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 .) On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.


Commandments having to do with the heart........spiritual.........yes?
Jesus told his disciples to 'Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature', are you doing and obeying that commandment or are you tied up with other things in this life?"
 
Feb 5, 2015
1,852
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No, I don't need any more. Post scripture, not accusations.
If you insist, facts and scripture.

hat shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me. Rom 7:7-11

Paul was slain by sin when the commandment camr to him. All manner of concupiscence was aroused in him by sin through the commandment. 'Thou shalt not covet.' As you know, at that time Paul believed if he could not obey the commandments he was condemned.

The same was true of the Pharisees(of whom Paul had been one prior to his conversion) They stressed the law must be upheld to attain eternal life, but were as Jesus said full of hypocrisy(they could not practise what they preached) and everything unclean on the inside.

It is just the same today sadly. I know of an elder in a church, they take the service until the minister speaks some weeks, they insist all unclean foods must be avoided, and Saturday is the day to go to church and rest from your works, but at the same time they have sex ouside of marriage with their long term partner. Then there are others who insist on the same beliefs and laugh as they irreverently take the Lords name in vain.

You asked for facts, I gave them to you. It has always been the same, for nothing has changed since Jesus walked this earth. Those who infer, or demand the literal letter is followed to inherit eternal life have the most problems with the law relating to the inner man.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
The facts are this;

Do we still have a standard given to us on how we are to walk as born again believers ? YES

Does all the 613 Mosaic laws still apply to us under the new covenant ? NO
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
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The facts are this;

Do we still have a standard given to us on how we are to walk as born again believers ? YES

Does all the 613 Mosaic laws still apply to us under the new covenant ? NO
Scriptures please.
 
M

MyLighthouse

Guest
The Law of Moses has a lot more commands then just the 10 Commandments. If the Law of Moses is still binding, then why has the temple veil been torn? Why are we not seeking to rebuild the temple to reinstitute the temple sacrifices? Why did Jesus change the OT Law of an eye for an eye and say turn the other cheek instead? Why did God change OT Law and command Peter to eat unclean animals in a vision? Seems to me like the Law of the Old Testament is no longer binding. I am not talking about the moral law or the commands given in the New Testament. Clearly there are commands we are given in the New. However, only 9 out of the 10 Commandments (Given to Moses) was repeated in the New Testament. The Sabbath Command was not re-stressed as a command as a part of the New Testament. Romans 14 some regard every day alike. Paul is not judging this type of person. For we are not to judge anyone in regards to the Sabbath. Meaning, it is no longer a binding command. Yes, it is good to worship God and remember the Sabbath. But worshiping on the Saturday Sabbath versus say Sunday or Monday is our liberty in Christ. Yes, the Saturday Sabbath is still the Sabbath day. That will never change. But we are not going to be condemned anymore for laboring on the Sabbath. We have a liberty in Christ.
The Law of Moses is 613 laws I believe, Moses wrote and spoke these. They were added after the 10 Commandments God wrote and spoke. The Law of God is the 10 Commandments which is summed up in the 2 Jesus said. The Sabbath isn't restressed because it was establish since the beginning of time just as the other 9 commandments were. Jesus said pray your flight not be the Sabbath and Isaiah says in the new heaven and earth we will come to worship every Sabbath. The Sabbath is a blessing and is a part of the 4 commands on loving God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
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Paul states:

Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness for everyone who believeth Rom 10:4

If a Christian is not made righteous/justified in God's sight by observing the law, they cannot be made unrighteous in God's sight by their failure to obey the law. That is not possible.

Why does this not give the Christian a licence to sin?
Well, I suppose rather than it being a license to sin, it frees us from its dominion. "Sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but grace." In reality, we don't need a license to sin because we are all already sinners. Would you give a license to eat all you want to a glutton(at a restaurant)? No, its redundant. They already do so, and so do humans. Grace isn't a license to sin but frees us from its dominion but make a note that our sinning less or more has no effect whatsoever on our salvation. It is Jesus Christ who is our Savior, not ourselves.

Its interesting to note that only in a grace Gospel can the accusation and question be raised of whether or not we can sin all we want. A preacher who speaks bad of sin and throws the Law in people's faces to show its against God and if we sin we can lose salvation will not have the question raised, "Well, then why can't I sin all I want!?" That preacher would face palm so hard, his words just went in one ear and out the other. But, to a grace preacher and to Paul, who preached grace, such a question could be raised. Why? Why is that so? Is it because the blood of Christ cleanses us from ALL sin? Past, present and future? Not in a works-based, earn/keep your salvation gospel. It is true in the Gospel of Grace however.
 
T

The_highwayman

Guest
Well, I suppose rather than it being a license to sin, it frees us from its dominion. "Sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but grace." In reality, we don't need a license to sin because we are all already sinners. Would you give a license to eat all you want to a glutton(at a restaurant)? No, its redundant. They already do so, and so do humans. Grace isn't a license to sin but frees us from its dominion but make a note that our sinning less or more has no effect whatsoever on our salvation. It is Jesus Christ who is our Savior, not ourselves.

Its interesting to note that only in a grace Gospel can the accusation and question be raised of whether or not we can sin all we want. A preacher who speaks bad of sin and throws the Law in people's faces to show its against God and if we sin we can lose salvation will not have the question raised, "Well, then why can't I sin all I want!?" That preacher would face palm so hard, his words just went in one ear and out the other. But, to a grace preacher and to Paul, who preached grace, such a question could be raised. Why? Why is that so? Is it because the blood of Christ cleanses us from ALL sin? Past, present and future? Not in a works-based, earn/keep your salvation gospel. It is true in the Gospel of Grace however.
well said Ben