Why the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is not for Today

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
3,672
1,446
113
That is not correct The " In my name" is talking about the Authority by which they preach and were baptizing . Baptism in water was done well before the catholic church aka RCC
If you look it up there’s quite a bit of talk about that verse though I have found out this was started by a guy named Eusebius
 

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
3,672
1,446
113
I am interested in knowing why so many verses in acts talks about baptism in one name yet in that verse Jesus says to mention three not one. To say well the three are one so there is no need to mention three yet Jesus words speaks on mentioning three. was Paul doing it wrong
 

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
3,672
1,446
113
I’ve reposted them, no mentioning of three as per Jesus words to do so.

Acts 2:38 “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 8:12 “But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:16 “For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 10:48 “And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 19:5 “When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 22:16 “And now why tarriest you? arise, and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

And it doesn’t seem water was used in some of these, to be honest they all just say baptize, acts 1:5 mentions two different baptisms so which is which above.
 

JamOn

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2019
3,672
1,446
113
After John was be headed we know he didn’t baptize anybody anymore, when Jesus and disciples left the area after some days, there is no mentioning of people coming out to Jesus to be baptized, the mentioning of baptism is pretty much none existent after John is beheaded. Other then the one mentioning Jesus baptizing more but John was still alive, but after John dies that is it as far as water is concerned
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
3,163
576
113
Where do you come up with these strange ideas? Christ's ministry to Israel was for approximately 3 1/2 years, which accommodates this parable. But this has nothing to do with CHRISTIAN BAPTISM. And John's baptism was at the beginning of Christ's ministry. Shortly thereafter John was beheaded.

Ever since the resurrection of Christ, believer's baptism has remained a COMMANDMENT of Christ.
Many churches preach that the body of Christ, the church where Jews and Gentiles being equal, began at Pentecost.

If you belong under that teaching, you will naturally find this revelation strange
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
I’ve been reading up on Matthew 28:19 from what I’ve read in the current form of the passage and It doesn't appear that way in any manuscript of Matthew before the third century A.D if it was original then how come all these only mentions one.

Acts 2:38 “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 8:12 “But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:16 “For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 10:48 “And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 19:5 “When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 22:16 “And now why tarriest you? arise, and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Romans 6:3 “Know you not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

1 Corinthians 1:13 “Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

Galatians 3:27 “For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Are you saying the scriptures referenced do not pertain to water baptism?
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
I know but the verse says what it says in the name of all three yet in acts it’s not mentioned as such that is what I scratch my head on.
The biblical record in which all water baptisms are done in Jesus' name points to the truth of what Jesus states in Matthew 28:19. He says to baptize in the "name" not names. What is the name? Upon consideration of the entire record one realizes that Jesus is the name of the Father, and the Son and the Holy Ghost.

The disciples were taught all things pertaining to the Kingdom of God by Jesus. Surely they would not have administered water baptism differently than He had instructed.
 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
Fair enough so what did baptism mean before Jesus was Crucified, buried, and rose again? if it meant something else
the context of baptism was that of John's baptism, which was one of repentance. Remember John was the forerunner , he was to prepare the Way of the Lord how do we come to Jesus ? WE must repent.
 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
I am interested in knowing why so many verses in acts talks about baptism in one name yet in that verse Jesus says to mention three not one. To say well the three are one so there is no need to mention three yet Jesus words speaks on mentioning three. was Paul doing it wrong
When Jesus is speaking " GO and preach and baptize " paraphrasing here, He is giving commandments to who? The disciples right?

Jesus is the one who is sending them and HE is the one who has given them authority to do so. Now fast forward, Peter now empowered by the Holy Spirit is going to baptize people in water and what authority did he have to do so? HE was doing so " IN the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, which is a old English phrase meaning in the name of = In the Authority of Jesus the Messiah" which was given to me to baptize you.
 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
The biblical record in which all water baptisms are done in Jesus' name points to the truth of what Jesus states in Matthew 28:19. He says to baptize in the "name" not names. What is the name? Upon consideration of the entire record one realizes that Jesus is the name of the Father, and the Son and the Holy Ghost.

The disciples were taught all things pertaining to the Kingdom of God by Jesus. Surely they would not have administered water baptism differently than He had instructed.
the name is the Authority by which one does. Jesus is saying I send you in Matthews 28:19 preach and baptize all by the Authority God has called you to.

Just as Jesus was Baptized We have the The Son, who John baptized in the River Jordan, we see the Holy Spirit who came in the form of a dove, and the Voice of the Father who spoke. All three were present AS all three with be with the Believer who is sent to Preach the Gospel.
The word , The Holy Sprit , and the Father are with us always.
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
It is said the original said in my name, some say the catholics got a hold it 3rd century and changed it to conform to their trinity doctrine.
There is an abundance of historical records concerning, that, in fact the change was made around 325 a.d. Even today's Catholic catechism publications state this truth as well.

The name of Jesus was actually used. This truth is seen throughout scripture and can be seen specifically in Paul's exchange with the Corinthians (1 Cor 1:13) and the Ephesus disciples. Acts 19: 2-5) It is also apparent when reading about the Samaritan peoples conversion. (Acts 8:12) There is not one instance in the word where the phrase, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost was used.

A way of checking if something is an established concept is via at least 2 - 3 scriptures witnessing to one another. (Deut 19:15, Matt 18:16, 2 Cor 13:1) Since there is only one occurrence where the phrase is used investigation is required. Upon investigation of all of the recorded instances of water baptism one realizes Jesus was not saying something different than what the disciples did. He said to use a name. That name is Jesus and was used in every recorded water baptism after Jesus' resurrection.

1 Cor 1:13
Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 19:5
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
There is an abundance of historical records concerning, that, in fact the change was made around 325 a.d. Even today's Catholic catechism publications state this truth as well.

The name of Jesus was actually used. This truth is seen throughout scripture and can be seen specifically in Paul's exchange with the Corinthians (1 Cor 1:13) and the Ephesus disciples. Acts 19: 2-5) It is also apparent when reading about the Samaritan peoples conversion. (Acts 8:12) There is not one instance in the word where the phrase, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost was used.

A way of checking if something is an established concept is via at least 2 - 3 scriptures witnessing to one another. (Deut 19:15, Matt 18:16, 2 Cor 13:1) Since there is only one occurrence where the phrase is used investigation is required. Upon investigation of all of the recorded instances of water baptism one realizes Jesus was not saying something different than what the disciples did. He said to use a name. That name is Jesus and was used in every recorded water baptism after Jesus' resurrection.

1 Cor 1:13
Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 19:5
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Yes the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth was used in baptism one one reason only TO
1. speak of this Jesus not another there wee many named Jesus in this day
2. bring attention to HIM being the Messiah
3. to speak th e the words of the Lord

Rom 6 tell us clearly what water Baptism means.
The idea the methodology is ONLY IN Jesus name is not correct . There are historical evidence Both were done.
and both are valid
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
I’ve reposted them, no mentioning of three as per Jesus words to do so.

Acts 2:38 “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 8:12 “But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:16 “For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 10:48 “And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 19:5 “When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 22:16 “And now why tarriest you? arise, and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

And it doesn’t seem water was used in some of these, to be honest they all just say baptize, acts 1:5 mentions two different baptisms so which is which above.
Notice what the following scripture expresses. Water baptism in the name of Jesus and receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost. Both water and Holy Ghost baptism are mentioned

Acts 2:38 “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


When studying all of the verses regarding the Samaritan conversion it becomes clear that they first got water baptized in Jesus' name. Afterward Peter and John came to lay hands on them to receive the infilling of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 8:12-17 “But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done.
Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost
:
For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.


Again, we see a group receiving both water and Holy Ghost baptism. Peter commanded the Gentiles to be water baptized in the name of Jesus after they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 10:44-48
While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.


Paul informs the Ephesus disciples of the need to be re-water baptized because they were not water baptized in Jesus' name after His resurrection. The apostle's comment proves using the Lord's name was essential. After getting water baptized the group of men also received the baptism of the Holy Ghost when Paul laid hands upon them:

Acts 19:4-6
Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them
; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.


Paul's own conversion included water baptism as seen in Ananias statement to get baptized washing away sins calling on the name of the Lord. There is a direct parallel to Peter's words at Pentecost, "...be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.

Acts 22:16 “And now why tarriest you? arise, and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

The word records when Paul received the Holy Ghost:

Acts 9:17-18
And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith
, and arose, and was baptized.


In each case both water and Holy Ghost baptism are referenced.
This debunks the idea that the Holy Ghost baptism replaced water baptism. Paul was still administering water baptism in Jesus' name approximately 19 years after Pentecost as shown in his ex.change with the Ephesus disciples in Acts Chapter 19. Also interesting to note is the fact that Paul stayed at Ephesus to teach others the necessary truth.
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
the name is the Authority by which one does. Jesus is saying I send you in Matthews 28:19 preach and baptize all by the Authority God has called you to.

Just as Jesus was Baptized We have the The Son, who John baptized in the River Jordan, we see the Holy Spirit who came in the form of a dove, and the Voice of the Father who spoke. All three were present AS all three with be with the Believer who is sent to Preach the Gospel.
The word , The Holy Sprit , and the Father are with us always.
I disagree. If in fact people were to be water baptized using the phrase Father, Son and Holy Ghost it would be evidenced within the word. It is not. The phrase was never used in association with administration of water baptisms.

We are told to study the word and in doing so we will find truth through 2-3 witnesses. When one realizes Jesus stated to use a singular name all other water baptism scriptures make sense and relate exactly to what He said.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
5,408
579
113
I think if baptism is that important to do, then Jesus would have instructed the adulterous woman to do so like wise. Jesus only said go and sin no more. I don’t think His intentions was to say sin no more and go and figure out if you need to be baptized or not.
Jesus gave commants about the baptism after his resurrection.
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
1,526
465
83
Yes the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth was used in baptism one one reason only TO
1. speak of this Jesus not another there wee many named Jesus in this day
2. bring attention to HIM being the Messiah
3. to speak th e the words of the Lord

Rom 6 tell us clearly what water Baptism means.
The idea the methodology is ONLY IN Jesus name is not correct . There are historical evidence Both were done.
and both are valid
Consider how the following scriptures apply to the usage of Jesus' name:
"...there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12

"And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him." Col 3:17

Ponder why there is such objection to using Jesus' name in baptism when no believer objects to using Jesus' name at the close of requests made in prayer, laying hands on the sick for healing, casting out demons, etc.

Then ask yourself who opposes using the name of Jesus the most...
 

UnitedWithChrist

Well-known member
Aug 12, 2019
3,045
1,642
113
I wonder if most Pentecostals act this way.

If so, I would never make a good one. I would not be able to get up after flopping on the floor like this.

Maybe the Pentecostals/charismatics can tell me.

 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
I wonder if most Pentecostals act this way.

If so, I would never make a good one. I would not be able to get up after flopping on the floor like this.

Maybe the Pentecostals/charismatics can tell me.


You wonder if most act this way? So Your bias is used on a video and not on the context of that site? I guest all baptist are like Westbro yelling the "N" word and shouting " Gay" going to hell" ?
The gifts of the Holy Spirit are found in 1cor chapter 12 through chapter 14. The Book of Acts chapter 2. and Prophesied in Joel 2 and Jesus said would be in Mark 16. What you see are many things in this video

one is the location is and culture application which is error, notices as I pentecostal I said this was error. Two God still will work with the unlearned , and immature. That preacher will have to answer for not correcting it. I leave that to the Lord. But what I will not do is USE this error to discredit All that is perceived to be a work of the Holy Spirit according to the Word of God. This video is not authoritative Gods word is.
 
I

IFOLLOWHIM

Guest
You wonder if most act this way? So Your bias is used on a video and not on the context of that site? I guest all baptist are like Westbro yelling the "N" word and shouting " Gay" going to hell" ?
The gifts of the Holy Spirit are found in 1cor chapter 12 through chapter 14. The Book of Acts chapter 2. and Prophesied in Joel 2 and Jesus said would be in Mark 16. What you see are many things in this video

one is the location is and culture application which is error, notices as I pentecostal I said this was error. Two God still will work with the unlearned , and immature. That preacher will have to answer for not correcting it. I leave that to the Lord. But what I will not do is USE this error to discredit All that is perceived to be a work of the Holy Spirit according to the Word of God. This video is not authoritative Gods word is.





I know you are Pentecostal! I was in the "Church of God" for many many years!
The Holy Ghost is as real today as He was in Acts,when Jesus breathed on them and said" receive ye the Holy Spirit!
I'm no longer in the church I was in but I'm still filled with the Holy Ghost and He speaks in tongues through me many times in prayer and worship!
I feel for those who simply deny or have never felt this sweet presence of the power of the full G odhead.
God has NOT changed!
But the " church" sure has........
 

CS1

Moderator
May 23, 2012
4,417
1,018
113
I disagree. If in fact people were to be water baptized using the phrase Father, Son and Holy Ghost it would be evidenced within the word. It is not. The phrase was never used in association with administration of water baptisms.

We are told to study the word and in doing so we will find truth through 2-3 witnesses. When one realizes Jesus stated to use a singular name all other water baptism scriptures make sense and relate exactly to what He said.
Modalism is not correct. What many of the Onenesses types fail to see is Baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus and Baptism in the name of the Father, Son , and Holy Spirit are both scriptural and proper. The eliciting of two verses in the word of God is the error. UPC and Onenesses are half right and half wrong because one who was baptized in the Name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit is a valid baptism