Will There Be A Rapture?

[cv5]

Well you did mention Judas. Everyone thought he was a genuine believer doing the good works that Jesus instructed. And then he betrayed the Lord. The antichrist will pretend for a while too, but those who belong to God won't be fooled. The antichrist will fool shallow Christians but not the true Church.

It think you missed the point friend.

The antichrist is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING like the True Christ.
On the contrary, he is the most profound polar opposite in all of creation.

Judas is THE Satan-man in of all history up to that point. Goliath is a profound Satan-man.

Furthermore, Judas the deceiver was completely UNDETECTABLE by any mere man, including the 12 Apostles.
However, Jesus God literally saw Satan enter Judas at the dipping of the sop, as nothing is hidden from the eyes of the Savior.
Jesus then COMMANDED Satan-Judas to proceed with his folly aka DELIVERING (***not betraying***) God to the Romans and Jews.

Jhn 13:27
And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

"The lie", the greater Judas, the greater Goliath will be the most wicked, evil entity in all of creation.
Which is one of the reasons why we preach to every creature so that they never see his hour.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

TheDivineWatermark said:
The "GREAT tribulation" is ONLY the LATTER HALF of the 7-year period; so already you have misrepresented the "pre-trib Rapture" doctrine, in just your first sentence.

No, I have not... misrepresented man's pre-trib rapture doctrine,

"Pre-trib Rapture" is not the position saying our Rapture takes place before the "GREAT tribulation" (before the "SECOND HALF" of the 7 yr period); that's "MID-tribbers" who believe that.

It seems by your response that perhaps you didn't read past my first sentence.

and you instead want to try and spread lies against Jesus' Own Words, it means you have earned my IGNORE LIST!

Sorry to hear it.







BTW, Jesus' own words shows that the "GREAT tribulation" only commences at the MID-point of the 7 yr period, not at the START of the 7 yr period (which is what "PRE-trib" Rapture means, instead. PRE/BEFORE the START of the 7 yr period... not before the "GREAT tribulation"/SECOND HALF merely--That is an incorrect notion concerning what "Pre-Trib" actually teaches. I'm just being frank.)

 

[cv5]

BTW, Jesus' own words shows that the "GREAT tribulation" only commences at the MID-point of the 7 yr period

Clearly. This mid-point coinciding with......this phenomenon.
For reasons that are obvious.

================================================================================

Actually, Israel's chastisement in earnest (aka "great tribulation" - specific to the sons of Jacob alone) occurs AFTER the AC is possessed/indwelt and vastly supercharged with power by Satan.

The 10 kings who remain after the tribulation wars give their power to the AC only AFTER he is resurrected from the dead (deadly head wound healed). Only then do they submit AND WORSHIP HIM. Because the AC is now (by their perception anyways) "unkillable". So unkillable that this end-time confederacy BELIEVES that they can actually go to war with YHVH and win. A Satanic deception of course......they all die.

The persecution of the Saints/Israel rapidly accelerates after Satan indwells the AC (mid-trib), who then becomes vastly powerful. You either take the mark of the beast or are executed. Resistance means death. All world governments assist in this pogrom.

Rev 13:3
And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

Rev 13:4
And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

Rev 13:5
And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

Rev 13:12
And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

Rev 13:14
And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Clearly. This mid-point coinciding with......

Yeah, a great deal of @DavyP 's notion (of the chronology and timing) of Tribulation events, seems to HINGE on his flawed understanding of the "plural" word in v.24 (of Matt24), which he incorrectly states is "singular".


My, how one little mistaken *idea* (injected INTO the text) can throw off the entire [correct] sequence and chronology of it!



But will he EXAMINE IT to see if these things are so? I hope so.

 

[cv5]

Yeah, a great deal of @DavyP 's notion (of the chronology and timing) of Tribulation events, seems to HINGE on his flawed understanding of the "plural" word in v.24 (of Matt24), which he incorrectly states is "singular".


My, how one little mistaken *idea* (injected INTO the text) can throw off the entire [correct] sequence and chronology of it!

But will he EXAMINE IT to see if these things are so?

Well......I see a lot of copying and pasting from our buddy @DavyP . But little understanding.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

What should be the danger?
I know that everyone who claimes to be the Christ, but is not acting like 1. Thess 4,17 is the wrong One.

Simple concept.

Not sure why it is difficult for some to grasp, but oh well.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Well......I see a lot of copying and pasting from our buddy @DavyP . But little understanding.

Yeah, he sounds an awful lot like a poster who used to post similar ideas (esp. about the Trib's chronology [and duration], based on his faulty understanding of Matt24... and esp. v24, in the same way)... who also wrote a book covering the subject of the Greek word "apostasia" in 2Th2:3, touting a lot of mis-information about that also. I mean, all he needed to do was to zero in on "APO STASIS" (instead of going off on a bunch of unrelated tangents [and words], taking him far afield of the thing...)

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

It think you missed the point friend.

The antichrist is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING like the True Christ.
On the contrary, he is the most profound polar opposite in all of creation.

Judas is THE Satan-man in of all history up to that point. Goliath is a profound Satan-man.

Furthermore, Judas the deceiver was completely UNDETECTABLE by any mere man, including the 12 Apostles.
However, Jesus God literally saw Satan enter Judas at the dipping of the sop, as nothing is hidden from the eyes of the Savior.
Jesus then COMMANDED Satan-Judas to proceed with his folly aka DELIVERING (***not betraying***) God to the Romans and Jews.

Jhn 13:27
And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

"The lie", the greater Judas, the greater Goliath will be the most wicked, evil entity in all of creation.
Which is one of the reasons why we preach to every creature so that they never see his hour.

I did state that the antichrist will PRETEND. Please read posts carefully. This is how you end up wasting time in vapid arguments that go nowhere. So tiring honestly.


🍝

 

[cv5]

I did state that the antichrist will PRETEND. Please read posts carefully. This is how you end up wasting time in vapid arguments that go nowhere. So tiring honestly.

You are right. Sorry buddy. Multi-tasking here so I was neglectful.

My bad.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

And many who try to fail simply because they haven't yet studied enough of God's Word of both Old and New Testament Books. Did you know that starting in Isaiah 24 there are many Revelation parallels? Some Bible scholars call certain Chapters of the Book of Isaiah as "The Apocalypse of Isaiah."

Yes, Isaiah 24-27 is often called the little apocalypse, as you rightly mention.



This is why I am often pointing out the CONNECTIONS between:


--the FIRST of TWO "PUNISH" words in Isaiah 24:21-22[,23] PARALLELS "Rev19:19,21 / 16:14-16 / 20:5" (Armageddon time-slot / Second Coming); whereas the SECOND of the TWO "PUNISH" words in that Isa text PARALLELS the LATER "GWTj" time-slot, Rev20:11-15;


--the "GREAT" trumpet / sound of a trumpet, in Isaiah 27:9,12-13 PARALLELS "Matthew 24:29-31" (which Isaiah passage ALSO PARALLELS both Romans 11:27 and Daniel 9:24 [parts]... ALL regarding "ISRAEL'S *FUTURE*"--not about *us*/"the Church which is His body");


--the "Come, my people," in Isaiah 26:13-21 (v.20 esp) [but please read from v.13!!], "enter thou into they chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: HIDE THYSELF as it were for a little moment, UNTIL THE INDIGNATION BE OVERPAST" PARALLELS both Rev12:6,14 and Matt24:16,21 (so where it says, "Come, MY PEOPLE," this is referring to WHEN Israel WILL AGAIN [in the FUTURE] be called by Him "MY PEOPLE" [see also Ezek39:7], whereas presently they are "Lo Ammi" ['not my people'--see Rom9:26, about "Israel"]--but this is only temporary, during [the] "BLINDNESS [/a hardening]... UNTIL" Rom11:25[,15]... v.27, which again connects with "Isa27:9,12-13/Matt24:29-31" ABOUT *THEM* [the believing remnant of Israel])

 

[j55]

Rapture is false doctrine. Ezekiel chapter 13 to Document the fly away doctrine. Psalm chapter 5
For thou art not God that hath pleasure in wickedness, neither shall evil dwell with thee.
5:6
Thou shall destroy them that speak lies: false shepherd's will be condemned on judgement Day. They are Spiritual murderers, and have blood on there hands. Im not judging anyone. God wants the truth told. Jesus is not angry with those who repent, love and serve God, and teach sound doctrine. False brethren are the issue.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Rapture is false doctrine.

"harpagēsometha ἁρπαγησόμεθα [Strong's G726]" is actually a biblical word / concept... and thus worthy of study and discussion.

Ezekiel chapter 13 to Document the fly away doctrine.

Ezekiel 13... a completely distinct concept being covered there...

"Rapture [harpagēsometha ἁρπαγησόμεθα - Strong's G726]" was not promised to Israel;



...only to "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY" (note: "WHEN [as to its existence]" per Eph1:20-23);
and ponder just what Jesus had meant when John 7:39 references what He'd said... and why.

 

[j55]

"harpagēsometha ἁρπαγησόμεθα [Strong's G726]" is actually a biblical word / concept... and thus worthy of study and discussion.






Ezekiel 13... a completely distinct concept being covered there...

"Rapture [harpagēsometha ἁρπαγησόμεθα - Strong's G726]" was not promised to Israel;



...only to "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY" (note: "WHEN [as to its existence]" per Eph1:20-23);
and ponder just what Jesus had meant when John 7:39 references what He'd said... and why.

Sir. The word rapture isn't in the Bible. And some shepherds have twisted 1 Thessalonians chapter 4 to make it into rapture theory. I'm not here to debate about it. I plant seeds and move. If anyone wants to believe in it. Its fine with me.
Satan, and all evil spirits, in the name of Jesus Christ, Get behind me !!

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ Fine if you don't care to "debate" it.


Let the readers CONSIDER just what is meant, in the following verse, by the phrase "shall present [future tense; G3936 - παραστήσει parastēsei ]" - 2 Corinthians 4:14 - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/2co/4/14/ss1/t_concif_1082014 ; https://biblehub.com/interlinear/2_corinthians/4-14.htm


[note: this verse isn't speaking solely of "the DEAD in Christ / those who SLEEP through Jesus" (i.e. the members of the Church which is His body who will have "DIED" prior to the time-slot being spoken of...]

 

[cv5]

^ Fine if you don't care to "debate" it.


Let the readers CONSIDER just what is meant, in the following verse, by the phrase "shall present [future tense; G3936 - παραστήσει parastēsei ]" - 2 Corinthians 4:14 - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/2co/4/14/ss1/t_concif_1082014 ; https://biblehub.com/interlinear/2_corinthians/4-14.htm


[note: this verse isn't speaking solely of "the DEAD in Christ / those who SLEEP through Jesus" (i.e. the members of the Church which is His body who will have "DIED" prior to the time-slot being spoken of...]

Good. Figured out how you did that. Just activate the STRONGS's box.



2Co 4:14
Knowing G1492 that G3754 he which raised up G1453 the Lord G2962 Jesus G2424 shall raise up G1453 us G2248 also G2532 by G1223 Jesus, G2424 and G2532 shall present G3936 us with G4862 you. G5213

 

[homwardbound]

Rapture is false doctrine. Ezekiel chapter 13 to Document the fly away doctrine. Psalm chapter 5
For thou art not God that hath pleasure in wickedness, neither shall evil dwell with thee.
5:6
Thou shall destroy them that speak lies: false shepherd's will be condemned on judgement Day. They are Spiritual murderers, and have blood on there hands. Im not judging anyone. God wants the truth told. Jesus is not angry with those who repent, love and serve God, and teach sound doctrine. False brethren are the issue.

Yet, God continues to love us all, amazing grace that saves, the only way for me anyways, after being under Law first to see "I" can't. and that God by Son did what was needed for me to get saved in his risen Life as a gift. As no gift can ever be earned or can it?
Still not qualified, yet am safe in Father and Son as Won (One) Tank you

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

Rapture is false doctrine.

Precious friend, the rapture itself is A True Bible Doctrine. The 'bone of contention'
is whether it is God's Pre-Trib Great GRACE Departure! Or is it as many others say:

1/4-trib, mid-trib, 3/4 trib, pre-wrath, end-trib, or after the millenium.​

The Word Of God, Rightly Divided Solves all the Confusion above:

1) One must Be Saved And Have The Holy Spirit Indwelling them to "be taught Sound doctrine":

Grace, Peace, Mercy, And Love! + ( #3 Of: ) God's OPERATION On All New-born babes In Christ!​

2) One must be prayerful and Very Careful following/obeying All Bible study Rules!:

3) Especially the one about Right Division ( "Approval of God" )!

4) Please Be Very Richly Encouraged And Edified In God's Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!

5) Amen.



And, there is Also This:

Biblically "Concise Condensed": Evidence Of A Pre-Tribulational Rapture Of The Church! (K Lawson)

 

[j55]

John Nelson Darby, theologian, early 19 th century. The rapture was developed by him. Let me be absolutely clear. The word rapture is not in the Bible.
1 john 4:1. Beloved, believe not every Spirit, but try the Spirit, whether they are of God, because many false prophets are gone out in the world. Be very careful of those who promote rapture. It's not written in the Bible. Mark those who do this.
1 Timothy chapter 4
Now the Spirit expressly says that in the latter times some shall depart from the Faith by devoting them selves to deceitful spirts and teachings of demons.
False brethren spread heresy. They poison minds of those who lack knowledge of God's word.
Ezekiel chapter 13:22. Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have made not made sad, and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising life.
Like teaching the rapture, which is false doctrine. False brethren are spreading heresy.
13:23. Therefore he shall see no more vanity, nor Divination, for I will deliver my people out of your hand, and ye shall know that I am the Lord.
Jesus is coming 7th Trump, to put stop to the hunting grounds of false teachers. They will go into the pit during milliumum with Satan. Matthew chapter 25:32. And.before him he shall seperate them from one another, as a shepherd divided his sheep, and goats.
25:44. Then shall he say also unto them, verily, I say unto you, in as much as ye have done unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done unto me.
Righteous who faithfully taught sound doctrine and exposed fruits of darkness, are in kingdom of God.
25:44
Then shall say unto them on the left, Depart from me, ye cursed, into ever lasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels. False brethren don't have future. They will be condenmed on judgement Day. Teaching false doctrine.
There mimd is warped, and twisted.
1 Timothy 4:2. Speakings lies in hypocrisy, having thier conscience seared with hot iron.
Satan sears the impurities in the mind. False brethren have unclesn Spirit. There puppets for Satan. Satan, and evil spirits can't make habitation with Christian people who have Holy Spirit. False brethren are seard by Satan. They spread heresy. False brethren are servant's of Satan. This group is hell bound. Stay clear of them.

I moved on. Done with this thread.

 

[homwardbound]

Precious friend, the rapture itself is A True Bible Doctrine. The 'bone of contention'
is whether it is God's Pre-Trib Great GRACE Departure! Or is it as many others say:

1/4-trib, mid-trib, 3/4 trib, pre-wrath, end-trib, or after the millenium.​

The Word Of God, Rightly Divided Solves all the Confusion above:

1) One must Be Saved And Have The Holy Spirit Indwelling them to "be taught Sound doctrine":

Grace, Peace, Mercy, And Love! + ( #3 Of: ) God's OPERATION On All New-born babes In Christ!​

2) One must be prayerful and Very Careful following/obeying All Bible study Rules!:

3) Especially the one about Right Division ( "Approval of God" )!

4) Please Be Very Richly Encouraged And Edified In God's Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!

5) Amen.

View attachment 268559

And, there is Also This:

Biblically "Concise Condensed": Evidence Of A Pre-Tribulational Rapture Of The Church! (K Lawson)

1 John 2:27
But you have received the Holy Spirit, and he lives within you, in your hearts, so that you don’t needanyone to teach you what is right. For he teaches you all things, and he is the Truth, and no liar; and so, just as he has said, you must live in Christ, never to depart from him.

Whoever needs to be taught or told what is right by man/woman, is not seeing being born again by God yer, as religion uses this to control people
Puts people under (Law*s) to do. To see they can't and think those in charge got it together and become their leaders, (Do as they teach, they tell truth, yet do not do it themselves, I know had been me and could be again, no thanks) as if these others do not put their pants on one leg at a time as all others do. God has no respect of persons. God desires a willing personal relationship, and will not force that on anyone as people do, the first birth, not born again yet. wants to be in charge, and will do that any way it can to be that, unfortunately.
This gift is given as a gift, no gift given can ever be earned or be used to maintain it. God did it for us to appreciate it, between God and each person personally. Then share to all in true care, trusting God as in Luke 21:14-15
To me at least, I am in process, seeing what is done, remaining unqualified, yet am given, wow woe is me as in Isaiah 6:1-7
A gift, I need God, I glory in my need and see to not use it to get anything from anyone else
Given everything I need for life and Godliness (all are given, not all believe this) in thanksgiving and praise, done by Son who has taken all sin away on that cross, done willingly for us, one sacrifice forever for the greatest good ever, getting born new as born again from God Father forgiven, reconciled as far as the east is from the west. left only one choice left.
To believe God in this done work of Son as risen for you or not, and all the world or people first born in the flesh nature, first birth in the knowledge knowing good and evil naturally. to see it and choose self or God over it all y'all
There are those still not knowing, and those that know and have chose to not beleive God over themselves and fake as if are born new, listen you will hear truth and remain harmless as a dove aware of the evil all around us intros world.
Thank you Father for all hearing you, thank you fro this love and mercy through Son to us all to choose to believe or not thank you

 

[Firmament4]

I do not believe so because of many verses but hey if you believe rapture that's fine just be prepared if there is not one. Many rapture preachers mess up by saying you don't need to read revelation because we won't be here. It's the only book that says you are blessed for reading. So Def learn about it and know the many different interpretations for end times then just use discernment as we go day by day.