Woman can't teach in the congregation

[Truth7t7]

The new testament gives advice to slaves on how they should behave because slavery was an accepted custom. It doesn't mean that the Bible advocates slavery. The custom of the time saw women as second class citizens and the advice given concerning them does not mean that the Bible advocates treating women as second hand citizens. If a woman gets in front of a congregation and starts spewing out truths concerning the gospel and is filled with love for her brothers and sisters in Christ, how can anyone argue with what she has done? The first will be last and the last will be first when there is a tie and that means that everyone is treated equally. The apostles and those who have died for their faith deservedly will have a higher station in the kingdom of heaven. Women just like men will be judged the same way. We need to repent, trust in Jesus' death for the forgiveness of sins, and be filled with the Holy Spirit which fills our hearts with love.

I Agree, slavery or indentured servitude, that eventually in Europe worked into the working Apprentice and Master, to this day.

Galatians 3:26-29KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Natalieanne]

The Gospel has changed in different forms that's why they allow women to teach or lead these days. Truthfully women are not allowed to teach. This is mostly practiced by most churches that practice sabbath.

 

[oyster67]

are you disconnected? that is not secret knowledge.

babe

ABSOLUTELY!

Free as the wind.... babe

Not secret any more.

 

[Truth7t7]

The Gospel has changed in different forms that's why they allow women to teach or lead these days. Truthfully women are not allowed to teach. This is mostly practiced by most churches that practice sabbath.

I disagree, blame it all on the sabbatarians, wrong

I see the great fall in the US, starting with the Shakers/Quakers 1747, with women taking leadership roles, and it went downhill from there.

Wikipedia: Shakers
The United Society of Believers in Christ's Second Appearing, more commonly known as the Shakers, are a millenarian nontrinitarian restorationist Christian sect founded circa 1747 in England and then organized in the United States in the 1780s. They were initially known as "Shaking Quakers" because of their ecstatic behavior during worship services. Espousing egalitarian ideals, women took on spiritual leadership roles alongside men, including founding leaders such as Jane Wardley, Mother Ann Lee, and Mother Lucy Wright. The Shakers emigrated from England and settled in Revolutionary colonial America, with an initial settlement at Watervliet, New York (present-day Colonie), in 1774. They practice a celibate and communal lifestyle, pacifism, uniform charismatic worship, and their model of equality of the sexes, which they institutionalized in their society in the 1780s. They are also known for their simple living, architecture, technological innovation, and furniture.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

 

[Truth7t7]

A Bishop/Pastor Is to be the husband of one wife, and the Deacon also.

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church.

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

[Dino246]

A Bishop/Pastor Is to be the husband of one wife, and the Deacon also.

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church.

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

The word "pastor" does not appear in that passage... anywhere. You are changing the word of God to suit your agenda.

 

[notuptome]

Really below the belt humor? Would you want a pastor to use this trashy humor or be of a better deportment?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

The word "pastor" does not appear in that passage... anywhere. You are changing the word of God to suit your agenda.

Yes that is true but and it is a big but the word for elder is used interchangeably in the Greek.

1985 ἐπίσκοπος episkopos ep-is’-kop-os

from 1909 and 4649 (in the sense of 1983); n m; TDNT-2:608,244; {See TDNT 250 }

AV-bishop 6, overseer 1; 7

1) an overseer
1a) a man charged with the duty of seeing that things to be done by others are done rightly, any curator, guardian or superintendent
1b) the superintendent, elder, pastor, or overseer of a Christian church; the NT uses the term bishop, overseers, 1985 pastors, 4166 elders, and presbyters 4245 interchangeably {#Ac 20:17,28 Eph 4:11 Tit 1:5,7 1Pe 5:1-4 etc. }

4166 ποιμήν poimen poy-mane’

of uncertain affinity; n m; TDNT-6:485,901; {See TDNT 647}

AV-shepherd 15, Shepherd 2, pastor 1; 18

1) a herdsman, esp. a shepherd
1a) in the parable, he to whose care and control others have committed themselves, and whose precepts they follow
2) metaph.
2a) the presiding officer, manager, director, of any assembly: so of Christ the Head of the church; the NT uses the term bishop, overseers, 1985 pastors, 4166 elders, and presbyters 4245 interchangeably {#Ac 20:17,28 Eph 4:11 Tit 1:5,7 1Pe 5:1-4 etc.}
2a1) of the overseers of the Christian assemblies
2a2) of kings and princes
++++
The tasks of a Near Eastern shepherd were:
to watch for enemies trying to attack the sheep to defend the sheep from attackers to heal the wounded and sick sheep to find and save lost or trapped sheep to love them, sharing their lives and so earning their trust.

So it may not be an exact literal translation it is a valid dynamic translation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Dino246]

Yes that is true but and it is a big but the word for elder is used interchangeably in the Greek.

1985 ἐπίσκοπος episkopos ep-is’-kop-os

from 1909 and 4649 (in the sense of 1983); n m; TDNT-2:608,244; {See TDNT 250 }

AV-bishop 6, overseer 1; 7

1) an overseer
1a) a man charged with the duty of seeing that things to be done by others are done rightly, any curator, guardian or superintendent
1b) the superintendent, elder, pastor, or overseer of a Christian church; the NT uses the term bishop, overseers, 1985 pastors, 4166 elders, and presbyters 4245 interchangeably {#Ac 20:17,28 Eph 4:11 Tit 1:5,7 1Pe 5:1-4 etc. }

4166 ποιμήν poimen poy-mane’

of uncertain affinity; n m; TDNT-6:485,901; {See TDNT 647}

AV-shepherd 15, Shepherd 2, pastor 1; 18

1) a herdsman, esp. a shepherd
1a) in the parable, he to whose care and control others have committed themselves, and whose precepts they follow
2) metaph.
2a) the presiding officer, manager, director, of any assembly: so of Christ the Head of the church; the NT uses the term bishop, overseers, 1985 pastors, 4166 elders, and presbyters 4245 interchangeably {#Ac 20:17,28 Eph 4:11 Tit 1:5,7 1Pe 5:1-4 etc.}
2a1) of the overseers of the Christian assemblies
2a2) of kings and princes
++++
The tasks of a Near Eastern shepherd were:
to watch for enemies trying to attack the sheep to defend the sheep from attackers to heal the wounded and sick sheep to find and save lost or trapped sheep to love them, sharing their lives and so earning their trust.

So it may not be an exact literal translation it is a valid dynamic translation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

The words for elder and shepherd appear together only in 1 Peter 5. There, the word "shepherd" appears in the verb form for men, and the noun form for Jesus. Otherwise, the terms are distinct and are not used together. I don't know who you're quoting, but their claim of "interchangeably" is bogus, and is an anachronistic interpretation rather than a strict exegetical one.

 

[Truth7t7]

The words for elder and shepherd appear together only in 1 Peter 5. There, the word "shepherd" appears in the verb form for men, and the noun form for Jesus. Otherwise, the terms are distinct and are not used together. I don't know who you're quoting, but their claim of "interchangeably" is bogus, and is an anachronistic interpretation rather than a strict exegetical one.

Stop trying to change the simplicity of scripture, you have two positions of authority (Bishop) and (Deacon) below, you know well that (Bishop) is the leader of the Church body, and the (Deacon) is subordinate to the (Bishop)

Philippians 1:1KJV
1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church, as clearly seen in verse 5 below.

(Take Care Of The Church)

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

[Platosgal]

Study in the original language and you will see its not about woman teaching

I beg to differ

This common mis-interpretation is a virus in the Modern Western Christian
Church

The bible is clear
Women are NOT allowed to "Lead" teach or usurp authority
It causes an imbalance and that is ( as in Eden) the begining of Ego/Evil

 

[Blade]

Hmm 28 pages.. why? Anyway the real problem for some is man didn't call them to teach GOD did. So pray and take it up with Him. Just thinking I am JUUUUST about 60 mar 25th and the greatest person oh was so bless love so much was a follow of Jesus Christ prayed 4h a day taught bible studies and other things and was a woman. The only time she ever let me say thank you because she never took it always give it to Jesus she said was when I said if it was not for you I would not be saved..fact.

The day before I kept waking up and when I thought about her I could not stop crying. So I called her the next day and told her and she said nothing..nothing. Died shortly after that. I praise GOD for woman preachers, teachers you name it. Not getting in His way..

 

[Truth7t7]

Hmm 28 pages.. why? Anyway the real problem for some is man didn't call them to teach GOD did. So pray and take it up with Him. Just thinking I am JUUUUST about 60 mar 25th and the greatest person oh was so bless love so much was a follow of Jesus Christ prayed 4h a day taught bible studies and other things and was a woman. The only time she ever let me say thank you because she never took it always give it to Jesus she said was when I said if it was not for you I would not be saved..fact.

The day before I kept waking up and when I thought about her I could not stop crying. So I called her the next day and told her and she said nothing..nothing. Died shortly after that. I praise GOD for woman preachers, teachers you name it. Not getting in His way..

Your story dosent change the fact of scripture.

A Bishop/Pastor Is to be a man, the husband of one wife, and the Deacon's also.

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church.

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

[Scribe]

Your story dosent change the fact of scripture.

A Bishop/Pastor Is to be a man, the husband of one wife, and the Deacon's also.

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church.

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Not everyone is stupid. Most people know that he is saying to be blameless he cannot be married to more than one wife. And We know that if Paul taught in 1 Cor 7 that one who is single can focus on undistracted devotion to the Lord not concerning with the things of the world to please his wife that it would apply to a bishop and deacon even more so. Any attempt to bludgeon people with bad hermeneutics just screams "I CANT COMPREHEND AUTHORIAL INTENT" This is what we see when we read this post.

 

[Dino246]

Stop trying to change the simplicity of scripture, you have two positions of authority (Bishop) and (Deacon) below, you know well that (Bishop) is the leader of the Church body, and the (Deacon) is subordinate to the (Bishop)

Philippians 1:1KJV
1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church, as clearly seen in verse 5 below.

(Take Care Of The Church)

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

And Phoebe was a deacon, therefore the comments about "husband of one wife" must refer to monogamy, not male-only leadership. How many times do I have to tell you this before you learn?

 

[Dino246]

Your story dosent change the fact of scripture.

A Bishop/Pastor Is to be a man, the husband of one wife, and the Deacon's also.

Yes a Bishop is the Pastor/Overseer, the person responsible for the church.

Here you go repeating your error again. My goodness, you are stubborn!

 

[Truth7t7]

I praise GOD for woman preachers, teachers you name it. Not getting in His way..

1 Corinthians 14:33-35KJV
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

1 Timothy 2:11-14KJV
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

 

[Scribe]

I beg to differ

This common mis-interpretation is a virus in the Modern Western Christian
Church

The bible is clear
Women are NOT allowed to "Lead" teach or usurp authority
It causes an imbalance and that is ( as in Eden) the begining of Ego/Evil

Women should not Teach or Usurp authority over the man but they are allowed to teach the Bible to a man as Pricilla did to Apollos and she was not usurping authority over him by doing so. The bad interpretation that has been a virus all these years is reading into the text "teach the Bible" or "teach the bible to a man" This is not what he said. He said "Teach or usurp authority over a man." The Greek word translated Teach hear appears only in this one instance in the New Testament. It means Usurp authority over a man. It is a type of teaching that usurps authority over a man. In other words you don't really have to know Greek to understand it since Paul explains what kind of attitude of teaching he is meaning by being verbose and saying "or usurp authority over a man".

If we stick to the text and don't try to apply it to a scenario Paul did not have in mind we can understand it as "Teach / Usurp authority over the man" which is not what happens when a woman teaches the bible to a man. So what scenario would he be talking about? "It is when a woman uninvited take upon herself to teach a man. That would be usurping authority. I am going to teach you what is correct and you must listen to me and do what I say. And the man does not want to hear it. That is something that wives have a problem with. 1 Pet 3 is speaking about the same subject. 1 Pet 3 makes it clear what Paul was talking about because Peter uses the exact same wording as 1 Tim 2:11.

So a woman must not Teach/Usurp authority over a man but a woman can teach the Bible to a man if he wants her to. You're welcome! I think the light just turned on for some folks.

 

[Truth7t7]

Not everyone is stupid. Most people know that he is saying to be blameless he cannot be married to more than one wife. And We know that if Paul taught in 1 Cor 7 that one who is single can focus on undistracted devotion to the Lord not concerning with the things of the world to please his wife that it would apply to a bishop and deacon even more so. Any attempt to bludgeon people with bad hermeneutics just screams "I CANT COMPREHEND AUTHORIAL INTENT" This is what we see when we read this post.

Scripture is very simple and clear, a bishop/deacon must be a "Married Man"

You can have all the opinions you want, it isn't going to change what's before your eyes.

1 Timothy 3:1-13KJV
1 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.