The lockdowns accomplished absolutely nothing!

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May 23, 2020
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That is the conclusion of a recent study by J. P. Morgan. In fact, infection rates dropped after countries and states decided to reopen. However, millions of livelihoods were destroyed. China could not have asked for a better outcome. We could call this "the Chinese revenge against Trump".

Lockdowns failed to alter the course of pandemic and are now destroying millions of livelihoods worldwide, JP Morgan study claims

Coronavirus lockdowns have failed to alter the course of the pandemic but have instead 'destroyed millions of livelihoods', a JP Morgan study has claimed. Falling infection rates since lockdowns were lifted suggest that the virus 'likely has its own dynamics' which are 'unrelated to often inconsistent lockdown measures', a report published by the financial services giant said...

Author Marko Kolanovic, a trained physicist and a strategist for JP Morgan, said governments had been spooked by 'flawed scientific papers' into imposing lockdowns which were 'inefficient or late' and had little effect. 'Unlike rigorous testing of new drugs, lockdowns were administered with little consideration that they might not only cause economic devastation but potentially more deaths than Covid-19 itself,' he claimed...

..Infection rates have continued to decline even once a lag period for new infections to become visible is factored in, the report says. The R rate shows how many people each virus patient typically infects, and some countries regard a rate below 1.0 as a key indicator that the epidemic is in retreat...

..This graph [not shown here] published in a JP Morgan report shows that many countries saw their infection rates fall rather than rise again when they ended their lockdowns - suggesting that the virus may have its own 'dynamics' which are 'unrelated' to the emergency measures. The JP Morgan report includes graphs showing that 'the vast majority of countries had decreased infection rates' after lockdowns were lifted.

A second graph [not shown here] shows a similar effect in the US, showing that many states saw a lower rate of transmission (R) after full-scale lockdowns were ended. They included Colorado, Iowa, Alabama, Wyoming, Wisconsin and Mississippi, according to the chart, although not all states are included. Nevada and North Dakota are among the exceptions which appear to have had a higher rate of transmission since normal life began to resume... The report also shows many US states including Alabama, Wisconsin and Colorado enjoying lower R rates after lockdown measures were lifted... All 50 US states have at least partially reopened this week by relaxing restrictions on businesses and social distancing in varying degrees across the country

'While we often hear that lockdowns are driven by scientific models, and that there is an exact relationship between the level of economic activity and the spread of [the] virus - this is not supported by the data,' the report says. 'Indeed, virtually everywhere infection rates have declined after re-opening even after allowing for an appropriate measurement lag.

'This means that the pandemic and Covid-19 likely have [their] own dynamics unrelated to often inconsistent lockdown measures that were being implemented.' Those dynamics may be influenced by increased hand-washing and even weather patterns but seemingly not by full-scale lockdowns, the report suggests. 'The fact that re-opening did not change the course of the pandemic is consistent with studies showing that initiation of full lockdowns did not alter the course of the pandemic either,' it says...

In some European countries, studies suggest that the measures 'did not produce any change in pandemic parameters' such as the R rate, the JP Morgan report says. Kolanovic says that lockdowns had remained in place even as 'our knowledge of the virus and lack of effectiveness of total lockdowns evolved'. 'At the same time, millions of livelihoods were being destroyed by these lockdowns,' he writes...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...r-course-pandemic-JP-Morgan-study-claims.html
Well, there are studies and there is real life. The fact is that the disaster that Italy faced in the epidemic was not faced in Northern Europe where there is also a dense population and yet they locked down early. I work in a hospital and I can tell you that the numbers of sick and dying were significantly less than prepared for because of social distancing. That was the point. That the number of deaths would be less. We were not as draconian as other places though. Masks were not required at any time and otherwise people pretty much complied.

I asked a few people from Italy where the numbers were terribly high and Germany where the numbers were very low what the difference might have been. The Italian friend said that the Italians have a very large older population, second only to Japan in the world and that they sterilze everything including kitchen floors. She, not being Italian, did not and said her small children were way less sick than the Italian children. They are also a very huggy people and tend to have extended family all living together for economic reasons.

The German said that those people more or less always practice some social distancing and are not huggy except with close friends or family members. They also do not live with parents and grandparents and do not visit them as often.

Now the bit that reopening does not change shows the author knows nothing about immunology. As time progresses, more and more of the population have been exposed to the virus and have antibodies. So the governments with lock down were playing for time. The virus will spread but by slowing this down, it enables the medical world to handle the matter so fewer die. This was accomplished. With time, more people have antibodies and so cannot infect others nor become sick. SO opening up after some months will make a large difference as opposed to never closing. So this is foolish to think closing did nothing as opening doesn't exaberate the situation. THey forget about immunity. Many people were never very sick and still had it and now have antibodies. This was the hope of all of us in the hospital. Immunity without the real disease. It happened and not seldom.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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The lock downs should not even have been initiated, never mind about going on too long. And, no, hindsight is NOT 20/20 in this case.

I have been posting on this BOGUS PANDEMIC LOCK DOWN almost since the start. And you have been mocking and trying to support the so-called experts.

These same experts had an agenda and a conspiracy, and the proof is in the fact that they actually ATTACKED the effective HCQ/erythromycin/zinc sulfate to promote the ineffective Remdesivir from Gilead. As far as I'm concerned that was criminal sabotage, since many lives were lost because of greed and self-serving politics.

Here's documentation of HCQ being attacked.

Summary
On March 19, at a White House briefing, President Trump “touted” chloroquine (hydroxychloroquine is chloroquine metabolite) for possible use against COVID-19. The very next day, a media operation was launched to deny this treatment to the public. Several fake news outlets published articles, saying things like this (NYT, March 20):
Trump’s Embrace of Unproven Drugs to Treat Coronavirus Defies Science
Doctors and patients also worry that the president’s rosy outlook for the treatments will exacerbate shortages of old malaria drugs relied on by patients with lupus and other debilitating conditions.
Referring to this as a media operation is appropriate because multiple outlets repeated the same false talking points. At that time
  • The use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19 already had scientific support, although not to the level required for FDA approval of a new drug; but HCQ was already approved.
  • The fact that hospitals had already been increasing their supply of HCQ and CQ before President’s briefing was an additional indication that medical professionals believed in the drugs’ usefulness against COVID-19.
  • There were no shortages of HCQ or CQ for lupus & RA patients at that time.
  • Multiple pharma companies announced an increase in HCQ manufacturing and substantial donations of HCQ.
  • Even without these increases, the HCQ amounts required for COVID-19 patients were too small to impact the supply for other users.
This false alarm had all the behavioral characteristics of the Democrat-Socialist operatives: pitting groups of citizens against each other, sowing fear and division, and hoping that the conflict would damage President Trump. In this case, they incited lupus and rheumatoid arthritis patients against current and future COVID-19 victims. Google, Facebook, Twitter, and Microsoft support the fake new media financially, send web traffic to them, and endorse them to some extent. Amplified by Big Tech, the announcement of HCQ shortage caused a vicious spiral: panic buying by lupus patients, which led to actual shortages, which amplified the panic buying and so on. Then the blame was directed at COVID-19 patients and their physicians prescribing HCQ for them...

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/05/11/distributed-denial-of-hcq-to-covid-19-victims/

I wonder do you tell your doctor how to treat you when you are ill?

What blood tests, lab tests to run?
Do you discuss with him/her the latest research on various treatment methodologies?
Do you tell him/her what medicine to prescribe, how long you want to take it and if you should have any refills?
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,479
7,920
113
Well, there are studies and there is real life. The fact is that the disaster that Italy faced in the epidemic was not faced in Northern Europe where there is also a dense population and yet they locked down early. I work in a hospital and I can tell you that the numbers of sick and dying were significantly less than prepared for because of social distancing. That was the point. That the number of deaths would be less. We were not as draconian as other places though. Masks were not required at any time and otherwise people pretty much complied.

I asked a few people from Italy where the numbers were terribly high and Germany where the numbers were very low what the difference might have been. The Italian friend said that the Italians have a very large older population, second only to Japan in the world and that they sterilze everything including kitchen floors. She, not being Italian, did not and said her small children were way less sick than the Italian children. They are also a very huggy people and tend to have extended family all living together for economic reasons.

The German said that those people more or less always practice some social distancing and are not huggy except with close friends or family members. They also do not live with parents and grandparents and do not visit them as often.

Now the bit that reopening does not change shows the author knows nothing about immunology. As time progresses, more and more of the population have been exposed to the virus and have antibodies. So the governments with lock down were playing for time. The virus will spread but by slowing this down, it enables the medical world to handle the matter so fewer die. This was accomplished. With time, more people have antibodies and so cannot infect others nor become sick. SO opening up after some months will make a large difference as opposed to never closing. So this is foolish to think closing did nothing as opening doesn't exaberate the situation. THey forget about immunity. Many people were never very sick and still had it and now have antibodies. This was the hope of all of us in the hospital. Immunity without the real disease. It happened and not seldom.

I agree, however latest research indicates surface transmission is not the primary means and the virus does not live outside of a host cell as long as they originally thought.

Airborne particles are the primary mode of transmission.

The author to whom you refer LOL ... has been told this numerous times.. and persists to deny the facts.
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
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So - you do not want [whoever] to get the virus - but, you do want them to "become the next casualty" . . . ??? o_O
Yesterday was not my day. Please insert a do not between you and become.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
7,635
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I agree, however latest research indicates surface transmission is not the primary means and the virus does not live outside of a host cell as long as they originally thought.

Airborne particles are the primary mode of transmission.

The author to whom you refer LOL ... has been told this numerous times.. and persists to deny the facts.
funny, i was saying that the virus was not as contagious as we were being told 2 1/2 months ago.

based on what my eyes were seeing, and my brain was processing.

we don't need scientists telling us what observation, rational reasoning, and common sense gives us the answer.
 
May 23, 2020
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I agree, however latest research indicates surface transmission is not the primary means and the virus does not live outside of a host cell as long as they originally thought.

Airborne particles are the primary mode of transmission.

The author to whom you refer LOL ... has been told this numerous times.. and persists to deny the facts.
When enough people are immune, life is normal again.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,479
7,920
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When enough people are immune, life is normal again.

As of mid - May Stockholm reached 7.6% immunity... generally speaking most epidemiologists will state herd immunity is around 70%

I think the world has a long way to go yet

Life will not be normal this is huge impetus for change.. economically and in terms of capital, production and labour.

Also geo-political shifts because of economic uncertainty and mostly likely a world wide recession if not depression
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,479
7,920
113
funny, i was saying that the virus was not as contagious as we were being told 2 1/2 months ago.

based on what my eyes were seeing, and my brain was processing.

we don't need scientists telling us what observation, rational reasoning, and common sense gives us the answer.
See if you had been in Italy you would have seen a very different reality.
The virulence of the virus itself is only one part of the equation.. certainly in the USA the virus has had a more devastating impact on the poor and those who live in congested areas.
 
May 23, 2020
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As of mid - May Stockholm reached 7.6% immunity... generally speaking most epidemiologists will state herd immunity is around 70%

I think the world has a long way to go yet

Life will not be normal this is huge impetus for change.. economically and in terms of capital, production and labour.

Also geo-political shifts because of economic uncertainty and mostly likely a world wide recession if not depression
I meant normal as in able to socialize as before. Economically it will be a fair while.
 

Gregoryp

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2019
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I don't care what your so called experts say. The virus is real, and it is deadly. I pray that none of you naysayers, friends, and families get it. I also pray that you become th

Last week forty new cases at nearby LTC. Three have died to date. There were no cases the week before. Employee who did not know he had the virus was the source.

I'm not a big fan of the shutdown, but I believe it was necessary to allow us to get a handle on how it's really spread, and who is most at risk. We knew the risks and how to deal with at the end of April, but we lacked the testing capability to put them in place. Testing is now in place in most critical areas.
Going by this , its only people with underlying conditions who are at risk, not the majority of the population. I also note with amusement that NYC health no longer publishes the above table, and the data is now very hard to find, its still there, but much more difficult to get. Interesting indeed
 

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gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
7,635
3,574
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See if you had been in Italy you would have seen a very different reality.
The virulence of the virus itself is only one part of the equation.. certainly in the USA the virus has had a more devastating impact on the poor and those who live in congested areas.
you may not remember this, but a while back i stated to you that the " virus will probably not reach 2 million cases due to the lockdowns and social distancing ."

well, in was wrong, and you were right, just wanted to put that out there.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
11,513
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Going by this , its only people with underlying conditions who are at risk, not the majority of the population.
But the conspirators were counting on the sheeple to go along with their nonsense as seen below:

1591666520176.png
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
11,513
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But the conspirators were counting on the sheeple to go along with their nonsense as seen below:

View attachment 217554

WHO: It's 'Very Rare' for People Without Symptoms To Spread COVID-19

At a briefing Monday in Geneva, a top World Health Organization official said the spread of the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 from individuals who aren’t showing symptoms of illness is now considered “very rare.”
“From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, head of WHO’s emerging diseases and zoonosis unit, told reporters in Geneva, according to CNBC.


https://www.westernjournal.com/rare-people-without-symptoms-spread-covid-19/
 

Moses_Young

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
707
342
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But the conspirators were counting on the sheeple to go along with their nonsense as seen below:

View attachment 217554
You can tell these people can't think for themselves, when you see them kneeling before their fellow man and begging for his forgiveness, as if their fellow man is their god. Would be funny if it weren't so sad.
 

Moses_Young

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
707
342
63
WHO: It's 'Very Rare' for People Without Symptoms To Spread COVID-19

At a briefing Monday in Geneva, a top World Health Organization official said the spread of the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 from individuals who aren’t showing symptoms of illness is now considered “very rare.”
“From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, head of WHO’s emerging diseases and zoonosis unit, told reporters in Geneva, according to CNBC.


https://www.westernjournal.com/rare-people-without-symptoms-spread-covid-19/
"Rare", as in it was a baseless claim to begin with.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,479
7,920
113
you may not remember this, but a while back i stated to you that the " virus will probably not reach 2 million cases due to the lockdowns and social distancing ."

well, in was wrong, and you were right, just wanted to put that out there.
What is evident to me through much of this pandemic is that some Christians seems to place a very low value on human life.

If this virus targeted babies I wonder if their response would be different.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,479
7,920
113
you may not remember this, but a while back i stated to you that the " virus will probably not reach 2 million cases due to the lockdowns and social distancing ."

well, in was wrong, and you were right, just wanted to put that out there.

You are an honorable man. :)