American Health Care Act

[PennEd]

Show me where God supports anything other than a single payer system for all.

Why should quality health care be withheld for anyone?

I pray that none of you avid supporters of limited heath care for some, and no health care for some, never end up in the situation where you need that health care and can't pay for it.

What has happened to "Love your neighbor"?

Heck. Why stop there. Why should some live in better houses than others, or drive nicer cars, or eat lobster and filet, while others eat McDonalds?

Cost Shmost. It's working so well in Cuba and Venezuela!

GET GOVERNMENT COMPLETELY OUT OF EVERYTHING EXCEPT WHAT THE CONSTITUTION SAYS THEY SHOULD BE INVOLVED IN.

 

[RickyZ]

And another one hits the ignore list, simply because I'm tired of listening to rude ignorant people.

I say ignorant because you obviously read things for what you want to hear, and not for what's actually being said.

Very Christ-like of you!

BTW, I was wrong to call Tommy ignorant.

 

[RickyZ]

Heck. Why stop there. Why should some live in better houses than others, or drive nicer cars, or eat lobster and filet, while others eat McDonalds?
.

In the world, that's a perfectly acceptable (and growing) idea.

But we are supposed to be like Jesus, and I don't recall Him having a big house, driving a fancy burro, and only serving salmon.

And He did write 47 different verses telling us not to horde these things.

So I guess it's up to where your spirit lives. If you live in the world, glom worldly things. If you live for Christ, I hope your big house has a room for someone who's honestly not as blessed as you.

 

[oldethennew]

PS. 12:5.
For the oppression of the poor, for the sighing of the needy, now will I arise, saith The LORD;
I will set him in safety from him that puffeth at him.

37:14.
The wicked have drawn out the sword, and have bent their bow, to cast down the poor and needy,
and to slay such as be of upright conversation.

72:4.
He shall judge the poor of the people, He shall save the children of the needy,
and shall break in pieces the oppressor.

82:3.
Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.

PRO. 30:14.
There is a generation, whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor
from off the earth, and the needy from among men.

ISA. 14:30.
And the firstborn of the poor shall feed, and the needy shall lie down in safety:
and I will kill thy root with famine, and He shall slay thy remnant.

11COR. 8:9.
For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though He was rich, yet for your sakes
He became poor, that you through His poverty might be rich.

9:9.
(As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; He hath given to the poor:
His rRghteousness remaineth for ever.

 

[Tommy379]

BTW, I was wrong to call Tommy ignorant.

You can call me anything you want, except late for dinner.

 

[17Bees]

Maybe the United States would be a better country if it were a theocracy. As it is the United States is a lobbyoracy where the government is busy trying to pass a bill where the top 1% income earners get a massive tax cut subsidized by the other 99%.

I've heard this before, but could you please let me know exactly where this massive tax cut to the top 1% is? And also how it's subsidized by the rest of all people in the US? Actually, this horrible 1% pays almost half - nearly 47% - of all fed income tax while the bottom 60% of wage earners pay less than 2%. In all honesty I think USA acts in a equitable and fair fashion with an arguably slanted favoritism toward the poor.

Looking at the United States from the outside, from the view of a modern western society, I am amazed that so many United States citizens do not understand the concept of a national health insurance.

I think you overlook the obvious. There are 321 million people in the USA. The country your profile claims is home of Poland has less population that the one state of California. There are more people in California than all of Canada. Providing a universal health care that suits all people in all regions is about as possible as Brussels providing one health care system for the entire EU. I've often advocated state provided HC systems. Each of our states have our own president, vice president, congress, senate, and judicial. Let's give them something to do. What works in Washington State won't be recognizable two thousand miles away in Louisiana, but more localized health care needs can be addressed locally - not from District of Columbia.

The health act they are trying to pass will benefit ONLY the 1% richest and the private commercial for profit health insurance industry.

Again, please provide proof. I haven't read it yet so I don't know, but if it ONLY benefits 1% I think it would have a hard time passing.

Those Republican congress and senate representatives have sold their souls for commercial interests. They should represent their constituents.

The US is not a democracy, it's a republic. We elect reps based on majority agreement of a candidate's platform. Almost always, 30 to 49% of voters are disappointed in the results of an election, however the 50% or more are represented and the majority rules with minority rights. Of course representatives are beholden to commercial interest. None of us do much work for free. We all need the money and the job and the opportunity to get those things near where we live. So our reps are quite beholden to commercial interests. It would be stupid not to.

The concept of a not-for-profit single healthcare insurance system originated in Christian ethics, based on the Bible.

Jesus taught us to care for each other, not to be selfish.

I'm sure you could probably link some half bible verses together and construe them in such a way as to convince yourself that your concept is valid. I just don't recall reading anything about health care insurance in the bible. I do think God deals with us in a personal way and our concern for the welfare of the poor or disabled has to be tempered by the burden it places on the far majority of unrich but working American. I think we can come up with something. I have faith. It's not going to be something as lame as universal health care. Even in Poland (speaking of caring for your brother) the universal health care is so bad that more than 90% of citizens use private health care insurance. No, I'm hopeful we as States will come up with equitable and sound health care systems that are a little more affordable with more localized care. It might be painful at first, but i'm hopeful.

 

[RickyZ]

You said, this horrible 1% pays almost half - nearly 47% - of all fed income tax . 1 vs 47 sure does sound lopsided.

Let me say that another way: someone who garners 99% of the wealth pays 47% of the taxes. Sounds lopsided the other way, now, doesn't it?

I don't care about percentages. God wrote 47 separate and distinct verses/passages distinctly warning us NOT to horde riches, especially in the last days. And here we are. God tells us repeatedly whatever resources we receive from Him are to be used to pay a fair day's wage and to take care of our fellow man. This should not even be a debate; but far far too many Christians have come to covet mammon and turn a deaf ear to the cries of the poverty they have created by their hording. And now, on something so personal like your friggen health, they covet and steal and with-hold ever more, lest they be "cheated" out of what God has blessed them with. Get wise, bubble eyes, that 'blessing' of a big house fancy car and fat bank account isn't from Jehovah God. Because He makes his feelings pretty clear on that crap.

 

[hornetguy]

When will the Unites States voters vote for a government by the people and for the people?

Immediately after South Africa does..... because everyone knows that South Africa is the LEADER in championing human rights...

 

[hornetguy]

You said, this horrible 1% pays almost half - nearly 47% - of all fed income tax . 1 vs 47 sure does sound lopsided.

Let me say that another way: someone who garners 99% of the wealth pays 47% of the taxes. Sounds lopsided the other way, now, doesn't it?

I don't care about percentages. God wrote 47 separate and distinct verses/passages distinctly warning us NOT to horde riches, especially in the last days. And here we are. God tells us repeatedly whatever resources we receive from Him are to be used to pay a fair day's wage and to take care of our fellow man. This should not even be a debate; but far far too many Christians have come to covet mammon and turn a deaf ear to the cries of the poverty they have created by their hording. And now, on something so personal like your friggen health, they covet and steal and with-hold ever more, lest they be "cheated" out of what God has blessed them with. Get wise, bubble eyes, that 'blessing' of a big house fancy car and fat bank account isn't from Jehovah God. Because He makes his feelings pretty clear on that crap.

Spoken like a true Marxist...

Your idea of "fair" is to tax the rich people at a rate that will lower their useable income down to the level of a McDonald's worker?

Blindingly stupid....

If you had paid any attention in math class, you would know that even if you taxed those 1%'ers at a 100% rate... in other words, took ALL their money, it wouldn't run the government more than about 2 weeks... and after you killed THAT golden goose, where are you going to get your "free" money then? From the middle class? The "poor", that pay almost no taxes now, anyway?

You Pollyanna types are spectacularly ignorant about money.

If you believe that all we have to do (as Christians) is give all our money to help "others", and the country will magically follow, then... put your money where your mouth is. Go find a homeless family, and finance their life for them.... then YOU can explain to God why you let your family do without. I believe there is a scripture about being "worse than an infidel"....

 

[hornetguy]

..............................

Corinthians 8:13-15
King James Version(KJV)

13.)For I mean not that other men be eased, and ye burdened:

14.)But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want: that there may be equality:

15.)As it is written, He that had gathered much had nothing over; and he that had gathered little had no lack.

Even Paul said this was a "suggestion"... not a commandment..

Paul also recommended that young people not get married... how's THAT recommendation being followed?

 

[RickyZ]

Hornet, since you obviously and very clearly missed the point of my post, let me put it another way:




1 Timothy 6:10For the love of money is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing forit have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

1 Timothy 3:3not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the loveof money.

Matthew 6:24No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love theother, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve Godand wealth.

Luke 16:No servant can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love theother, or else he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannotserve God and wealth

Matthew 4:9-10and he said to Him, "All these things I will give You, if You fall downand worship me." Then Jesus said to him, "Go, Satan! For it iswritten, 'YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD, AND SERVE HIM ONLY.'"

James 4:4You adulteresses, do you not know that friendship with the world is hostilitytoward God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himselfan enemy of God.

Matthew 13:22And the one on whom seed was sown among the thorns, this is the man who hearsthe word, and the worry of the world and the deceitfulness of wealth choke theword, and it becomes unfruitful.

Mark 4:19but the worries of the world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the desiresfor other things enter in and choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful.

Luke 8:14The seed which fell among the thorns, these are the ones who have heard, and asthey go on their way they are choked with worries and riches and pleasures ofthis life, and bring no fruit to maturity.

Matthew 19:21-22Jesussaid to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions andgive to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, followMe." But when the young man heard this statement, he went away grieving;for he was one who owned much property.

Mark 10:21-22Looking at him, Jesus felt a love for him and said to him, "One thing youlack: go and sell all you possess and give to the poor, and you will havetreasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." But at these words he wassaddened, and he went away grieving, for he was one who owned much property.

Luke 18:22-23When Jesus heard this, He said to him, "One thing you still lack; sell allthat you possess and distribute it to the poor, and you shall have treasure inheaven; and come, follow Me." But when he had heard these things, hebecame very sad, for he was extremely rich.

1 Timothy 6:17Instruct those who are rich in this present world not to be conceited or to fixtheir hope on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly supplies uswith all things to enjoy.

Job 31:24-28If I have put my confidence in gold, And called fine gold my trust, If I havegloated because my wealth was great, And because my hand had secured so much;If I have looked at the sun when it shone or the moon going in splendor, And myheart became secretly enticed, And my hand threw a kiss from my mouth, That toowould have been an iniquity calling for judgment, For I would have denied Godabove.

Psalm 52:6-7The righteous will see and fear, And will laugh at him, saying, "Behold,the man who would not make God his refuge, But trusted in the abundance of hisriches And was strong in his evil desire."

Proverbs 11:28He who trusts in his riches will fall, But the righteous will flourish like thegreen leaf.

Jeremiah 49:4How boastful you are about the valleys! Your valley is flowing away, Obacksliding daughter who trusts in her treasures, saying, 'Who will comeagainst me?'

Ezekiel 28:5By your great wisdom, by your trade You haveincreased your riches And your heart is lifted up because of your riches

Psalm 62:10Do not trust in oppression and do not vainly hope in robbery; If richesincrease, do not set your heart upon them.

Proverbs 18:23The poor man utters supplications, But the rich man answers roughly.

Proverbs 28:11The rich man is wise in his own eyes, But the poor who has understanding seesthrough him.

Job 20:17-20He does not look at the streams, The rivers flowing with honey and curds. Hereturns what he has attained And cannot swallow it; As to the riches of histrading, He cannot even enjoy them. For he has oppressed and forsaken the poor;He has seized a house which he has not built. Because he knew no quiet withinhim, He does not retain anything he desires.

Proverbs 15:6Great wealth is in the house of the righteous, But trouble is in the income ofthe wicked.

Proverbs 30:8-9Keep deception and lies far from me, give me neither poverty nor riches; Feedme with the food that is my portion, That I not be full and deny You and say,"Who is the LORD?" Or that I not be in want and steal, And profanethe name of my God.

Deuteronomy 32:15 Jeshurun grew fat and kicked; filledwith food, they became heavy and sleek. They abandoned the God who made themand rejected the Rock their Savior.
Nehemiah 9:25-26They captured fortified cities and a fertile land They took possession ofhouses full of every good thing, Hewn cisterns, vineyards, olive groves, Fruittrees in abundance So they ate, were filled and grew fat, And reveled in Yourgreat goodness. "But they became disobedient and rebelled against You, Andcast Your law behind their backs And killed Your prophets who had admonishedthem So that they might return to You, And they committed great blasphemies.

Hosea 13:6As they had their pasture, they became satisfied, And being satisfied, theirheart became proud; Therefore they forgot Me.

Proverbs 23:4Do not weary yourself to gain wealth, Cease from your consideration of it.

Haggai 1:3-5Then the word of the LORD came by Haggai the prophet, saying, "Is it timefor you yourselves to dwell in your paneled houses while this house liesdesolate?" Now therefore, thus says the LORD of hosts, "Consider yourways!

Luke 16:19-21Now there was a rich man, and he habitually dressed in purple and fine linen,joyously living in splendor every day.Anda poor man named Lazarus was laid at his gate, covered with sores, and longingto be fed with the crumbs which were falling from the rich man's table;besides, even the dogs were coming and licking his sores … 25But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received yourgood things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted hereand you are in agony

1 Timothy 6:8-9If we have food and covering, with these we shall be content. But those whowant to get rich fall into temptation and a snare and many foolish and harmfuldesires which plunge men into ruin and destruction.

Leviticus 19:13You shall not oppress your neighbor, nor rob him. The wages of a hired man arenot to remain with you all night until morning.

Deuteronomy 24:12-15 If he is a poor man, you shall notsleep with his pledge.When the sun goesdown you shall surely return the pledge to him, that he may sleep in his cloakand bless you; and it will be righteousness for you before the LORD your God. Youshall not oppress a hired servant who is poor and needy, whether he is one ofyour countrymen or one of your aliens who is in your land in your towns.

Proverbs 22:16He who oppresses the poor to make more for himself or who gives to the rich,will only come to poverty.

Isaiah 1:23Your rulers are rebels And companions of thieves; Everyone loves a bribe Andchases after rewards. They do not defend the orphan, Nor does the widow's pleacome before them.

*

Oh wait, it's too long for one frame ...

 

[RickyZ]

Continuing ...



Isaiah 1:23Your rulers are rebels And companions of thieves; Everyone loves a bribe Andchases after rewards. They do not defend the orphan, Nor does the widow's pleacome before them.

Jeremiah 22:13Woe to him who builds his house without righteousness And his upper roomswithout justice, Who uses his neighbor's services without pay And does not givehim his wages,

Micah 6:12For the rich men of the city are full of violence, Her residents speak lies,And their tongue is deceitful in their mouth.

Malachi 3:5Then I will draw near to you for judgment; and I will be a swift witnessagainst the sorcerers and against the adulterers and against those who swearfalsely, and against those who oppress the wage earner in his wages, the widowand the orphan, and those who turn aside the alien and do not fear Me,"says the LORD of hosts.

James 2:6But you have dishonored the poor man. Is it not the rich who oppress you andpersonally drag you into court?

James 5:4Behold, the pay off the laborers who mowed your fields, and which has beenwithheld by you, cries out against you; and the outcry of those who did theharvesting has reached the ears of the Lord of Sabbath.

Job 31:24,25, 28 If I have put my confidence in gold, And called fine gold my trust, If Ihave gloated because my wealth was great, And because my hand had secured somuch; ... That too would have been an iniquity calling for judgment, For Iwould have denied God above.

Psalm 52:7Behold,the man who would not make God his refuge, But trusted in the abundanceof his riches And was strong in his evil desire."

Proverbs 18:11A rich man’s wealth is his strong city, And like a high wall in his ownimagination.
Luke6:20 “Blessed are you who are poor,for yours is the kingdom of God.21Blessed are you who hunger now,for you will be satisfied.Blessed are you whoweep now,foryou will laugh.22Blessed are you whenpeople hate you,whenthey exclude you and insult youand reject your name as evil,because of the Son ofMan.23“Rejoice in that day and leap for joy,because great is your reward in heaven. For that is how their ancestors treatedthe prophets.24“But woe to you who are rich, for you have already receivedyour comfort. 25Woeto you who are well fed now, for you will go hungry. Woe to you who laugh now,for you will mourn and weep. 26 Woe to you when everyone speaks well of you, for that ishow their ancestors treated the false prophets.

Luke 12:13-21 [SUP]13 [/SUP]Someonein the crowd said to him, “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritancewith me.”[SUP]14 [/SUP]Jesus replied, “Man, who appointed me a judge or anarbiter between you?” [SUP]15 [/SUP]Then he said to them, “Watch out! Beon your guard against all kinds of greed; life does not consist in an abundanceof possessions.” [SUP]16 [/SUP]And he told them this parable: “The groundof a certain rich man yielded an abundant harvest. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Hethought to himself, ‘What shall I do? I have no place to store my crops.’ [SUP]18 [/SUP]“Thenhe said, ‘This is what I’ll do. I will tear down my barns and build biggerones, and there I will store my surplus grain. [SUP]19 [/SUP]And I’ll sayto myself, “You have plenty of grain laid up for many years. Take life easy;eat, drink and be merry.”’ [SUP]20 [/SUP]“But God said to him, ‘You fool!This very night your life will be demanded from you. Then who will get what youhave prepared for yourself?’ [SUP]21 [/SUP]“This is how it will be withwhoever stores up things for themselves but is not rich toward God.”

James 5:1Now listen, you rich people,weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you. 2Your wealth has rotted, andmoths have eaten your clothes. 3Your gold and silver arecorroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh likefire. You have hoarded wealth in the last days. 4Look! The wages you failedto pay the workers who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The criesof the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord Almighty. 5You have lived on earth inluxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves in the day ofslaughter. 6You have condemned and murdered the innocentone, who was not opposing you.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Maybe the United States would be a better country if it were a theocracy. As it is the United States is a lobbyoracy where the government is busy trying to pass a bill where the top 1% income earners get a massive tax cut subsidized by the other 99%.

Looking at the United States from the outside, from the view of a modern western society, I am amazed that so many United States citizens do not understand the concept of a national health insurance.

The health act they are trying to pass will benefit ONLY the 1% richest and the private commercial for profit health insurance industry.

Those Republican congress and senate representatives have sold their souls for commercial interests. They should represent their constituents.

The concept of a not-for-profit single healthcare insurance system originated in Christian ethics, based on the Bible.

Jesus taught us to care for each other, not to be selfish.

It's so Sad but SO True

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Looking at the United States from the outside, I do not see a democracy. I see a lobbyocracy where the Republican and Democratic parties are two sides of the same lobbyist coin, supported by and serving their big financial supporters.

When will the Unites States voters vote for a government by the people and for the people?

IMO,the part about "by" the people Is the reason some don't get the help they need ,the lack of compassion,me and mine ,selfish type of attitude.

 

[PennEd]

In the world, that's a perfectly acceptable (and growing) idea.

But we are supposed to be like Jesus, and I don't recall Him having a big house, driving a fancy burro, and only serving salmon.

And He did write 47 different verses telling us not to horde these things.

So I guess it's up to where your spirit lives. If you live in the world, glom worldly things. If you live for Christ, I hope your big house has a room for someone who's honestly not as blessed as you.

Ricky, you don't seem to get that wealth is a relative term.
If you receive $10,000 a year YOU, RICKY, are wealthier than 87% of humans on Earth. So I don't know how YOU can live with your wealth, while others around The world have so much less than you.

You also conflate Church and INDIVIDUAL responsibility with government.

I boast only in Jesus Christ, and Him crucified, so I'm not going to get into all I have done to love people with my time, talents, and resources, ALL of that glory goes to God.
It boggles the mind that you can't understand that socialism ALWAYS descends into shared misery, and extreme government oppression, ala Venezuela.
Would you rather have $1000 knowing the other guy has $10,000, or you have $500 and he has $500?

Be happy and joyful with the incredible blessings the Lord has given YOU, and stop coveting what your neighbor has.

 

[Willie-T]

If every liberal who wants "others" to pay for universal free healthcare would simply send in $100 to the government on a periodic basis, the whole problem would be solved.

The other half of us will continue to pay for our own insurance, and won't say a word about how much you choose to donate to strangers. And it will likely drive down our premiums when we are letting you support the deadbeats.

 

[Susanna]

I thank the Lord for blessing me with a health care plan and a decent salary.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

If every liberal who wants "others" to pay for universal free healthcare would simply send in $100 to the government on a periodic basis, the whole problem would be solved.

The other half of us will continue to pay for our own insurance, and won't say a word about how much you choose to donate to strangers. And it will likely drive down our premiums when we are letting you support the deadbeats.

If the liberals were to do this from the heart,would they be saved better or would they get more rewards?

 

[Tommy379]

If the liberals were to do this from the heart,would they be saved better or would they get more rewards?

Why would you care if you are getting someone else to pay for your life?

 

[Billyd]

Get up off your pocket books. I paid more in income tax last year than a large portion of the population earns. I have no problem paying more if all my brothers and sisters in this country have adequate healthcare. I can not understand why anyone calling himself a Christian loves his/her money so much that he/she can't part with enough to ensure that not one US citizen will be denied adequate healthcare.