Bernie or Bust?

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shrimp

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2011
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#21
I disagree entirely with the bold. Bernie has never sold out his ideals for anyone. His weakness is that he runs too honorable of a campaign needed to win in today's political environment. He isn't a sellout, he is just wanting to unite his party, even at the expense of the unethical behavior from Clinton/DNC. Disappointing, but I respect him more than Hillary and Trump combined.
Just googled his DNC speech and the first thing that pops up is a CNN article posted 3 hrs ago with a quote in the headline "I am proud to stand with her." I think that says everything about Mr. Sander's integrity and honor.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#22
I disagree entirely with the bold. Bernie has never sold out his ideals for anyone. His weakness is that he runs too honorable of a campaign needed to win in today's political environment. He isn't a sellout, he is just wanting to unite his party, even at the expense of the unethical behavior from Clinton/DNC. Disappointing, but I respect him more than Hillary and Trump combined.
Hypothetically, he talks great... and probably believes a lot of what he says.
But this is the real world, and his Pollyanna outlook just won't work.

In fact the whole party has their heads in the sand when they try to sell the idea that we are greater than ever. We are in deep stuff, standing on the precipice of a long fall to disaster... at home, and worldwide. They seem to be the party of "The Emperor's New Clothes."
 
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Voldemort

Guest
#23
Just googled his DNC speech and the first thing that pops up is a CNN article posted 3 hrs ago with a quote in the headline "I am proud to stand with her." I think that says everything about Mr. Sander's integrity and honor.
No, feeling pride for standing next to Hillary is no reflection of his honor or his integrity. It's does show a poor decision in backing who he thinks is the lesser of two evils. His 25+ years of government, his consistency within that 25 years, and his willingness to go against the Democrats by going Independent are all infinitely greater measures to judge Bernie's integrity and honor than a CNN headline.

Say what you will about his policies, but between he, Trump, and Hillary... who has the most integrity and honor? They certainly aren't all equal...
 
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Voldemort

Guest
#24
Hypothetically, he talks great... and probably believes a lot of what he says.
But this is the real world, and his Pollyanna outlook just won't work.
I believe he absolutely believes what he says, otherwise he wouldn't be singing the same song for 20+ years of service. I'm not saying WHAT he believes is right (all the time), but nevertheless, it shows his sincerity and integrity that he hasn't wavered much from his main political ideals.

If we look at Trump and Hillary... hahaha... when haven't they flip flopped on their decisions? A simple youtube search will show a plethora of stances they both flip flop on.
 
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Voldemort

Guest
#25
[video=youtube;Rpm4rjejFgQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rpm4rjejFgQ[/video]
 
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Voldemort

Guest
#26
[video=youtube;sTtD-2_VgTQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTtD-2_VgTQ[/video]
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#27
I'm a person who tries to answer real questions without a lot of _____.
Here are the serious ones for Trump.

Will Trump piss off some world leaders? Yes.
Will that lead to some terrorism? Yes.
Will that lead to some military conflicts? Probably.

What's different than the past umpteen years? Nothing.

Does Trump know how to build... both buildings and empires? Yes.
Are his buildings and his empire examples of superiority? Yes.
Will Trump improve the economy? Yes.

What's different than the past umpteen years? Everything.

Will the United States of America be a better place to live under his leadership? I think so.

Will this country improve (other than someone else paying for your college) under Clinton? In all honesty, I cannot see how, when she promises no more than what we have been struggling through for years.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#28
I hate the bull of trying to place blame on who might have caused whatever. We are in trouble on almost every front, and, so far, I see no one doing anything to fix it.

And now, last night, I sat and listened to Democrats say there is nothing to fix except to give away some more handouts.

When I started out, I was also given "handouts"...... BUT they were in the form of PAYCHECKS I had worked for, "handed out" every payday, if I worked a full week to earn them.
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
5,065
1,501
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#29
Are we talking about the same Bernie who, just last night, said it was deplorable that BO started his first term facing a $1.4 Trillion debt? Hasn't the debt today, eight years later, soared to $20 Trillion?

Ya know, just about everything I heard them complaining about last night were things they have had control over for eight solid years. They claim Republicans blocked them, yet they certainly had no trouble getting all sorts of things pushed through when they really wanted to.

And I still think every American should keep coming back to just who is going to pay for all of Bernie's free stuff? Why do you think Socialism has failed everywhere it is tried? Yes, it works fine till we drain all the true earners and contributors dry. Then, there is nothing left.

You want to pay a hamburger flipper $15 or $20 an hour. But, you yourself, are not willing to pay the $12 or $13 dollars it would then cost you to buy a burger. A value-meal would soon cost $25.

The question is simple. Who is going to pay for all the freebees? Bleeding prosperous achievers and contributors won't last long.

And don't get me started on the racial divide the Democrats have promoted. It is worse today than it has ever been in our history.
If every Bernie supporter writes in Bernie's name, who do you think will be elected president. The old man's a lot smarter than he lets on.
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#30
I'm a person who tries to answer real questions without a lot of _____.
Here are the serious ones for Trump.

Will Trump piss off some world leaders? Yes.
Will that lead to some terrorism? Yes.
Will that lead to some military conflicts? Probably.

What's different than the past umpteen years? Nothing.

Does Trump know how to build... both buildings and empires? Yes.
Are his buildings and his empire examples of superiority? Yes.
Will Trump improve the economy? Yes.

What's different than the past umpteen years? Everything.

Will the United States of America be a better place to live under his leadership? I think so.

Will this country improve (other than someone else paying for your college) under Clinton? In all honesty, I cannot see how, when she promises no more than what we have been struggling through for years.
well here are the questions that i ask...

does donald trump understand and respect the constitution? no
does hillary clinton understand and respect the constitution? no
is donald trump a pathological liar? yes
is hillary clinton a pathological liar? yes
does donald trump share my values? no
does hillary clinton share my values? no
does donald trump show signs of being dangerously unstable? yes

bottom line...
is donald trump fit for office? no!
is hillary clinton fit for office? no!
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#31
If every Bernie supporter writes in Bernie's name, who do you think will be elected president. The old man's a lot smarter than he lets on.
There are nowhere near enough Bernie supporters to elect him over Hillary. We all know that. So, are you saying that since if his supporters did that, the democrat vote would be split, and Trump would be elected?

I just don't see Bernie wanting Trump in, so we both know he is never going to do that.

(Or, were you just hoping that Bernie would do that, and, thus, you must have been talking about yourself when you said "the old man is smarter than he lets on"? That bit was a little hard for me to follow.)
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#32
well here are the questions that i ask...

does donald trump understand and respect the constitution? no
does hillary clinton understand and respect the constitution? no
is donald trump a pathological liar? yes
is hillary clinton a pathological liar? yes
does donald trump share my values? no
does hillary clinton share my values? no
does donald trump show signs of being dangerously unstable? yes

bottom line...
is donald trump fit for office? no!
is hillary clinton fit for office? no!
I know where Democrats are against much of the Constitution. But, where has Trump defied the Constitution? I don't know... that is why I'm asking.
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#33
I know where Democrats are against much of the Constitution. But, where has Trump defied the Constitution? I don't know... that is why I'm asking.
first amendment...called for penalties against reporters for reporting that he doesn't agree with...called for religion based immigration bans...

second amendment...wants to deny gun ownership rights to those on 'no fly' lists...

fourth amendment...mathematically speaking his call for deporting all illegal immigrants would require 'booking' every single person on american soil...otherwise it will just not be possible...

fifth amendment...also related to the 'no fly' list gun ban due to the fact that being on this list would have you immediately banned from owning a gun without due process...

tenth amendment...trump promised the death penalty for anyone who murders a police officer...but this is a power reserved to the states...

fourteenth amendment...trump opposes citizenship by birth...
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#34
first amendment...called for penalties against reporters for reporting that he doesn't agree with...called for religion based immigration bans...

second amendment...wants to deny gun ownership rights to those on 'no fly' lists...

fourth amendment...mathematically speaking his call for deporting all illegal immigrants would require 'booking' every single person on american soil...otherwise it will just not be possible...

fifth amendment...also related to the 'no fly' list gun ban due to the fact that being on this list would have you immediately banned from owning a gun without due process...

tenth amendment...trump promised the death penalty for anyone who murders a police officer...but this is a power reserved to the states...

fourteenth amendment...trump opposes citizenship by birth...
Most of that was too cryptic to make much sense of, but you are in favor of suspected terrorists having guns simply because our forefathers wanted us to be able to defend ourselves? That is way too far out there for me.
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#35
Most of that was too cryptic to make much sense of, but you are in favor of suspected terrorists having guns simply because our forefathers wanted us to be able to defend ourselves? That is way too far out there for me.
'suspected' by who? the 'no fly' lists are an exclusive project of the executive branch...would you want to give -obama- or for that matter -hillary clinton- the power to unilaterally revoke your second amendment rights because they 'suspect' you?
 
Mar 2, 2016
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#36
well here are the questions that i ask...

does donald trump understand and respect the constitution? no
does hillary clinton understand and respect the constitution? no
is donald trump a pathological liar? yes
is hillary clinton a pathological liar? yes
does donald trump share my values? no
does hillary clinton share my values? no
does donald trump show signs of being dangerously unstable? yes

bottom line...
is donald trump fit for office? no!
is hillary clinton fit for office? no!
You forgot a couple. Is Trump responsible for the death of Americans....is Hillary? Did Trump or Hillary enable and cover for a rapist....here's a few more things Trump did the are apparently against your values. Go ahead and fact check it.

13669573_1081267618588781_8864949083883589588_n.jpg
 
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jennymae

Guest
#37
I think we need to stop for a moment and think things over. It's obvious that none of the candidates are going to be guarding the Constitution, what Rachel said about Trumps laidback approach to the Constitution is troubling. If people are ready to waive their Constitutional rights to get Trump elected, well, that would be un-American and unconstitutional. Same goes for the Hillary folks. What we are looking at is two candidates not comprehending our constitutional rights.
 
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jennymae

Guest
#38
You forgot a couple. Is Trump responsible for the death of Americans....is Hillary? Did Trump or Hillary enable and cover for a rapist....here's a few more things Trump did the are apparently against your values. Go ahead and fact check it.

View attachment 156331
Be that the truth it is great:)
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#39
You forgot a couple. Is Trump responsible for the death of Americans....is Hillary? Did Trump or Hillary enable and cover for a rapist....here's a few more things Trump did the are apparently against your values. Go ahead and fact check it.
there is a long list of other considerations...but the ones i listed are the decisive ones for me in concluding that neither candidate is fit for office and neither deserves my vote...

an analogy would be that someone has already failed all of the exams so miserably that they have no hope of passing the course...and you want to look at their homework assignments...
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#40
'suspected' by who? the 'no fly' lists are an exclusive project of the executive branch...would you want to give -obama- or for that matter -hillary clinton- the power to unilaterally revoke your second amendment rights because they 'suspect' you?
I'm sorry, but with wild thinking like that, I honestly have no idea how to converse with you. I imagine there are many hundreds, probably thousands, of family members of dead victims of terrorists who wish someone had done SOMETHING about the guns possessed by people the government felt were a threat , long before they ended the lives of their loved ones.