Getting annoyed with the animals in this country History being destroyed

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Do you think these statues should be left alone?


  • Total voters
    20
  • Poll closed .

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
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#41
Fun fact.

Most monuments to soldiers are erected decades after their service. I'm not saying there was no attitude involved 100% of the time, but it's natural to build statues of remembrance when those who fought are dying of old age.

Heck, we only just got done building the D-Day monument in VA.

Fun fact.
Many of these monuments were put up during the Jim Crow era. Kind of like a giant middle finger to and already downtrodden and disenfranchised demographic who just wanted to be treated like human beings
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#42
And if we want to talk disenfranchised and downtrodden demographics, the same could be said of all southerners until just after the WWII industrial boom.

I can't imagine being a Confederate veteran in the aftermath of "Reconstruction." The fabric of what you knew (regardless of what it was) is torn asunder. Your family is living off of little more than cornmeal and water. You're still kept awake by haunting memories of Gettysburg, Shiloh, Antietam, etc.

Having some recognition of your honor and sacrifice for yourhome is actually quite little to ask for as you review your life and take your first steps into eternity.
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
5,216
1,620
113
#43
And if we want to talk disenfranchised and downtrodden demographics, the same could be said of all southerners until just after the WWII industrial boom.

I can't imagine being a Confederate veteran in the aftermath of "Reconstruction." The fabric of what you knew (regardless of what it was) is torn asunder. Your family is living off of little more than cornmeal and water. You're still kept awake by haunting memories of Gettysburg, Shiloh, Antietam, etc.

Having some recognition of your honor and sacrifice for yourhome is actually quite little to ask for as you review your life and take your first steps into eternity.
I was fortunate enough to know three of my four great-grandmothers. They grew up in the reconstruction south. Every thing that their families owned was either destroyed or taken from them. None of the families had any slaves, and the men fought because their way of life was threatened. All four families left South Carolina and migrated south to the wilderness of Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, and Florida. It took two generations for them to recover, and a two world wars for them to finally begin to grow an economy. The average age of the men of that era living in our area was in the low fifties.

These so called traitors were the first in line every time that the United States called for soldiers to defend the country in every war after the Civil War.

I'll be honest with you. I've traveled through 25 states. I have met more racists north of the Mason-Dixon line, than I have ever met in the south. Instead of tearing down a few statues to rile a few skin heads, why don't every one of you with such harsh criticism of the people and monuments of the south, clean up around your own front door. You might look to the south for guidance.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#44
Amen. I'm a son of New England, but this is my experience.

Yankees are more segregated and racist than Southerners. That doesn't make them AWFUL people. It's just how it is.

I was fortunate enough to know three of my four great-grandmothers. They grew up in the reconstruction south. Every thing that their families owned was either destroyed or taken from them. None of the families had any slaves, and the men fought because their way of life was threatened. All four families left South Carolina and migrated south to the wilderness of Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, and Florida. It took two generations for them to recover, and a two world wars for them to finally begin to grow an economy. The average age of the men of that era living in our area was in the low fifties.

These so called traitors were the first in line every time that the United States called for soldiers to defend the country in every war after the Civil War.

I'll be honest with you. I've traveled through 25 states. I have met more racists north of the Mason-Dixon line, than I have ever met in the south. Instead of tearing down a few statues to rile a few skin heads, why don't every one of you with such harsh criticism of the people and monuments of the south, clean up around your own front door. You might look to the south for guidance.
 

HoneyDew

Senior Member
Apr 30, 2011
2,333
375
83
#45
Amen. I'm a son of New England, but this is my experience.

Yankees are more segregated and racist than Southerners. That doesn't make them AWFUL people. It's just how it is.
I'm from South Carolina now living in New England. I will say from my experience up here, they are just as racist as people in the South just more sneaky. Whereas in the south they don't hide it and are more vicious. You pretty much know what folks think of you.
 

jenniferand2

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2016
1,433
33
48
#46
Most countries execute traitors instead of building monuments to them
Don't take this the wrong way because I am not racist in anyway. However what if white people wanted to destroy monuments of Rosa parks or Harriet Tubman or Martin Luther King what would you say to that? What if people went after those staues saying they bother me they are racist etc.. I am asking because I want to know what if the shoe was in the other foot.
 
Last edited:

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
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#47
Unpopular opinion: General Lee was a better man than MLK and way more worthy of being a monument.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,668
1,098
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#48
Don't take this the wrong way because I am not racist in anyway. However what if white people wanted to destroy monuments of Rosa parks or Harriet Tubman or Martin Luther King what would you say to that? What if people went after those staues saying they bother me they are racist etc.. I am asking because I want to know what if the shoe was in the other foot.
The people you mentioned are people who fought for civil rights
Civil War monuments represent people who fault 2 take away people civil rights.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#49
The people you mentioned are people who fought for civil rights
Civil War monuments represent people who fault 2 take away people civil rights.
You do know that enslaving people was not the main issue of that war, don't you?
 
Dec 15, 2016
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#50
Who cares about history why would we want statues of americas biggest traitors dp you guys want a benedict arnold statue put up as well
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#51
I can tell a lot of people slept through history class. These men were not like the California freaks who just want to be their own country. They were hard-working men, family men, fighting what they felt was an isolated government in the North that was dragging them through the coals and was exploiting them to profit the North.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#52
Hitler did the same thing.....those who forget history are destined to repeat it....a civil war is brewing and will happen if the idiocy continues.....!
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#53
You do know that enslaving people was not the main issue of that war, don't you?
Exactly....taxes on cotton and tobacco......slavery was thrown in to keep the French out of it by pulling England into it to offset the French
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
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#54
Which is why I would argue that Northerners are, on balance, more racist. If you do not admit or display your monstrosity, you are more likely to layer it in false virtue. The monstrosity is then given breathing space.

I moved South shortly after Obama was elected. It was fascinating- up North, people would describe him using the N-word if they thought you wouldn't go blabbing. In the South, dissatisfaction or satisfaction with him was not addressed on racial grounds.

Don't take this the wrong way because I am not racist in anyway. However what if white people wanted to destroy monuments of Rosa parks or Harriet Tubman or Martin Luther King what would you say to that? What if people went after those staues saying they bother me they are racist etc.. I am asking because I want to know what if the shoe was in the other foot.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#55
Benedict Arnold betrayed his homeland to the benefit of a foreign government. General Lee et al betrayed their government to fight for their homeland.

The two are not the same.

Who cares about history why would we want statues of americas biggest traitors dp you guys want a benedict arnold statue put up as well
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
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#56
It's more of a both/and than it is an either/or scenario. If slavery was merely a political maneuver, why did the Southerners reference it in various Ordinances of Secession (TX,AL,VA)? Why was it featured in the Confederate constitution?

Why did we fight each other in Kansas and Missouri?

For multiple reasons, the Southerners believed their way of life was about to be stripped away at gun point by a government acting outside of its Constitutional bounds. Radical abolitionists themselves called for the discarding of the legal order in an effort to rid the country of slavery.

I am no apologist for the Confederate cause, but white washing either to favor the North or the South takes away from the real, stated reasons why the war was fought.

Exactly....taxes on cotton and tobacco......slavery was thrown in to keep the French out of it by pulling England into it to offset the French
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#57
Amen. To paraphrase Orwell, the totalitarians want to erase the past to maintain a perpetual present of party-control.

Hitler did the same thing.....those who forget history are destined to repeat it....a civil war is brewing and will happen if the idiocy continues.....!
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#58
You folks do realize that slavery is still here don't you?
Business just call them "associates" now and refuse to house and feed them.:(
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
42,571
17,039
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Tennessee
#59
By all means, let's tear down all the statues that may offend someone, history is a crock anyway. Next, empty all of the museums of the offensive artifacts, they're probably fake anyway. Get rid of all plaques of the 10 Commandments as they are obsolete. Burn all the books in the library that hold a conservative point of view. Yeah, let's empty our pockets too while were at it.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
42,571
17,039
113
69
Tennessee
#60
Don't take this the wrong way because I am not racist in anyway. However what if white people wanted to destroy monuments of Rosa parks or Harriet Tubman or Martin Luther King what would you say to that? What if people went after those staues saying they bother me they are racist etc.. I am asking because I want to know what if the shoe was in the other foot.
Yeah, they gotta go too.