How important are a partner's political beliefs to you?

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lil_christian

Senior Member
Mar 14, 2010
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#61
I guess Im just not the type to force it down someone's throat if they already chose a lifestyle against God. He gave us free will. And if they chose that life I dont count it as hurting themselves. They are happy, so Ill let them be. They can deal with consequences later on. Id rather out effort towards someone that isnt set in their decisions isn't going to end up being a futile waste of time.
Well, no, you don't force it down someone's throat. That's just not cool. God DID give us free will, and we CAN do anything we want, but not everything we do is beneficial for us. I do have a friend who's attracted to people of the same gender, but I don't condemn that person, neither do I try to convert them. But I do not support the fact they're attracted to their own gender.

Plus, prayer is a powerful thing. No effort to show people the Gospel is futile.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
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#62
okay thats fair but if peoplehave decided against already then thats their choice. Im not messing with that
 
Dec 17, 2012
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#63
The last 2-3 pages of posts illustrate why my dating partner and I will have to walk in political lockstep - right down that moderate, middle-of-the-road line.
 
D

Donkeyfish07

Guest
#64
The real problem, as typified in this thread, is there's a lot of people who claim to be Christians(such as the OP), but really only have a superficial or mainstream understanding of the scripture, and as such fall for common deceptions over and over again.

Another example of this is the scripture you misquoted, a common distortion that has been popularized by secular, worldly sinners who use it in an attempt to shut down any and all rebuke of their sinful actions.

I'd give you the same advice as the OP. Maybe spend a little more time studying your bible and less time supporting worldly, sinful, left-wing political causes.
I didn't misquote scripture there, would you mind sharing why you think I have?.It's not an excuse to sin or put a stamp of approval on sin. I don't really support any political causes actually and I'm definitely not a left winger. I'm not a right winger either....Politically, I just don't care. I have opinions just like everybody else but politics doesn't really interest me. I don't have any control over how things are done.

James 2:10

"For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."

I personally can't keep the whole law. I've tried, but I'm still a sinner. I do a lot of repenting. I don't want to judge homosexuals, I don't want to judge murderers, I don't want to judge rapists. Just because you don't judge a person for sinning does not mean you support their sin. Me personally, when judgement day comes I don't want anything anybody has ever done against me to count against them....no matter how bad it is. I look at it like that because that's how I would like to be treated as well.

Then you have Romans Chapter 14:

"
[SUP]10[/SUP] But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
[SUP]11[/SUP] For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
[SUP]12[/SUP] So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
[SUP]13[/SUP] Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way."

I have a pretty good understanding of scripture. Sure homosexuality is a sin but it's not my job to judge anybody for their sin. There is one that seeketh and judgeth.....and it ain't me.
 
Jul 25, 2005
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#65
okay thats fair but if peoplehave decided against already then thats their choice. Im not messing with that
There is a difference between a moral busybody and someone who just wants standards maintained. That is, I suppose where this whole discussion becomes political as well as theological.

Most folks I know do not propose going door to door with a gaydar, but simply assert biblical truths and maintain marriage as God intended it.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
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#66
If marriage was still a purely christian or even religious institution then I would agree Ritter. However you can't have government involvement and assignment of various civil liberties then base the criteria on religious doctrine. At least in a secular nation and then expect everyone to just be okay with it. I know homosexual marriages arent right biblically, but most marriages nowadays aren;t biblical anyways. I do think even if we as christians disagree with the lifestyle the people in it should be able to receive the same rights and benefits as straight people when choosing life partners.
 
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Perseus

Guest
#67
Perseus I want you to know that your actions here have made me feel angry and quite offended...
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword." - Matthew 10:34

Why did Jesus say this? Because he knew that if you held to his teachings, there were bound to be great clashes, and great dividing lines, so great they would turn father against son, mother against daughter, brother against brother.

You grandly state the fact that you've been offended as if that alone is proof of some wrongdoing on my part. Au contraire, my friend - perhaps it means exactly the opposite.

Contrary to the contemporary fuzzy doctrine of most churches, the goal of Christianity isn't to hold hands and sing kumbaya. The goal is to state hard truths in a world that likes to have its' ears tickled with feel-good doctrines. The real message and truth of Christ is bound to upset some people.

What some of us are of the opinion, is that the best way to save these people is not to condemn them. (How did Jesus act towards the woman caught in Adultery?) But to love them, show them God's love.
The best way to save homosexuals is to love them by further sanctioning their sin in the eyes of the state? You already lost me.

I'm not sure if you know this, but what you just said is typical leftist Christian vernacular - they hyper-focus on the love part and completely neglect the rebuke of sin, mixing truth with lies. We save ourselves and others from eternal damnation by rebuking their sin, just as Jesus rebuked sin while he walked the earth.

I believe in looking after the poor...
Weird, I don't remember Jesus going to Caesar and petitioning him for welfare for all.

You believe in looking after the poor with other people's money. That completely dis-incentivizes private charity and private giving, which is what Jesus wanted.

How exactly have I done anything noble in God's eyes when the state has forced me to give to the "poor"?

If I give to the Red Cross or the Salvation Army out of my personal income, on the other hand, that's an individual choice that I've made.

That's a choice that God can actually respect.

I believe in looking after those who have illegally entered the country and intentionally violated immigration laws...
How will you teach someone respect for your country's laws, much less God's moral laws, when you implicitly sanction their violation of those laws?

I believe in looking after the health of those who can't afford to...
By using the state to steal from others to fund your "charity". How incredibly generous of you.

I don't remember Jesus going to the Senate and drafting a universal healthcare law either. What he gave to the poor, the sick, the downtrodden, he gave of himself each time.

Charity which is not voluntary is not charity at all. It is meaningless. Furthermore, it does nothing for our spiritual state of mind. It makes us resentful towards those whom we are forced to support.

If you, on the other hand, took money out of your personal savings and paid for a homeless person's medical care, that would mean 1000 times more than the state forcing you and everyone else to pay for that same person's medical care. Because it was a choice that you voluntarily, consciously undertook.

I support the restriction of firearms so that those in our society who choose not to buy them, can live safe lives without fear. (I'm not saying those who have guns don't want to live peaceful lives!)
I'm not really sure what you're saying here. It's typical, perverted leftist-speak.

How can someone "choose" not to buy a firearm when it's restricted in the first place? Once again, you're on the side of curtailing freedom of conscience and will, and imposing your own sense of morality. A firearm is a tool like any other.

In the hands of a righteous, God-fearing person, it could save a woman from getting raped, or an old lady from getting robbed. It could save the life of an innocent person.

In the hands of an evil person, it could commit murder.

In the hands of nobody but criminals(which is what firearms restriction always results in), it results in a completely defenseless innocent populace, ripe for attack and plunder by those with evil intent. I could think of nothing more anti-Christian.

on social issues I'm way down the left spectrum...
The global Leftist movement has been the greatest threat to Christianity. It is they who forced through abortion-on-demand, no-fault divorce, "sex education" to 10-year olds, sanctioning of homosexual behavior, and countless assaults on the heritage of Christianity.

It is the global Leftist movement that has steadily and methodically deconstructed the Christian foundation and laws that used to be in existence.

There is a breed of leftists who likes the message of "love" inherent in Christianity, because it aligns with their doxy of "tolerance" and "acceptance" of sexual deviants and other mental disorders, so they have appropriated that aspect of it. But they are first and foremost loyal to their political church and ideology, and make the rest fit here and there, as has been manifestly evident in this thread. Christianity is the skin they stretch over the exoskeleton of leftism.

to come in here and deride my beliefs without knowing a thing about me other than what I have posted here is extremely offensive...
This notion that to "offend" someone is the greatest crime against humanity is not biblical. The Bible offends a lot of people. What you're saying is more liberal doxy. It's virtually coming out of your pores.

Christ said, "I came to be a sword".

I find it extremely offensive that ostensible "Christians" would call rebuke of homosexuality a "political belief" and advocate surrender in the face of the all-out assault from the homosexual lobby, but instead of crying about it, I share my opinion on the matter.

If you advocate legislating against homosexuality. Would you take this to the logical conclusion of legislating against all sexual immorality. Would you then legislate against Pre-Marital sex? What penalties would you have?
There used to be laws all over the world against sodomy. We used to ban depictions in our movies of "sexual perversion", "ridicule of the clergy", "sympathy with criminals", rape, etc...

All of these laws and more were slowly deconstructed by leftists. And now we're surprised that immorality is flourishing, in our society, in the media, in our movies and music?

When we forsake God in our laws, in our institutions, and in our culture, he forsakes us. It's happened over and over again in history.
 
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Stuey

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2009
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#69
I will say one thing.

Did Jesus petition Caesar for healthcare? No. But look at the laws of Israel - they had built into them support for the Widows and other weak members of society. Go read leviticus if you don't believe me.

Further conversation is unhelpful - I am simply getting angry - I'm out - See you in Heaven.
 
J

Jullianna

Guest
#71
My political views are inseparable from my core beliefs and values, so our political views would have to line up pretty closely.
 
Jul 25, 2005
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#72
I do think even if we as christians disagree with the lifestyle the people in it should be able to receive the same rights and benefits as straight people when choosing life partners.
Marriage is neither a right nor liberty. It is an ancient institution and fundamental building block of society. If we mess with this status legally or ecclesiastically, we invite yet more judgement than we already have coming toward us.


I know homosexual marriages arent right biblically, but most marriages nowadays aren;t biblical anyways.
Do we not have more reason then to defend the institution from all sides and reassert it as a standard along with the other standards we have left in the dust?

... you can't have government involvement and assignment of various civil liberties then base the criteria on religious doctrine. At least in a secular nation and then expect everyone to just be okay with it.
People were fine with this rather benign arrangement for quite a long time under secular governance.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
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#73
Yes and while homosexuality is a rather new issue politically I feel it is one that should be looked at from a legal standpoint especially when considering the 14th amendment and how it has been since applied with various court cases under differing levels of scrutiny, mainly I would say intermediate scrutiny. I feel Lawrence v Texas is the best case to use when arguing this point as it was a case involving homosexual citizens and their prosecution under sodomy laws in texas even though these same sodomy laws where not regularly if ever enforced on heterosexual couples. The US government actually has no legitimate or compelling interest to fight homosexual marriage. While we as Christians may depending on your involvement in anti/pro gay issues, thats a different argument and one I personally believe skirts too closely to establishing a religion mainly since once you start using the bible to legislate homosexuality, how long until you start using it to enforce pre-marital sex, or any other thing we view as a sin?
 

Stuey

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2009
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#74
Apologies if I was harsh with my post before by the way.

Not very loving of me, I'm sorry if anyone got hurt by it.

Also, although I disagree with your views on certain issues, I do respect that you hold them and am sorry if I offended you. We are brothers and sisters in Christ after all.
 
J

Jullianna

Guest
#75
You are ever the gentleman, Stuey :)