-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Now let me connect these three posts and show how they harmonize in God's truth:
John 3:5-6 “Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.”
By saying that, Jesus was being realistic that as those in the flesh of Jerusalem's womb were fleshly and had to go through the convulsions of that flesh in the process of learning, just as we all do, even in a church which has a fleshly component by those who are yet fleshly and struggling due to that carnality of a flesh centered mind. “That which is born of the flesh is flesh” Those of the great crowd of that remainder of that Israel after the 144,000 were sealed out of it, and who serve at the temple of God in the earthly courtyard.
But once we are born away from that to the Jerusalem above, the true heavenly church of God, then it is that we have been sired of God to be wed to His Son. “that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.” That 144,000 sealed elect of God who are God's temple along with Christ.
John 3:5-6 “Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.”
By saying that, Jesus was being realistic that as those in the flesh of Jerusalem's womb were fleshly and had to go through the convulsions of that flesh in the process of learning, just as we all do, even in a church which has a fleshly component by those who are yet fleshly and struggling due to that carnality of a flesh centered mind. “That which is born of the flesh is flesh” Those of the great crowd of that remainder of that Israel after the 144,000 were sealed out of it, and who serve at the temple of God in the earthly courtyard.
But once we are born away from that to the Jerusalem above, the true heavenly church of God, then it is that we have been sired of God to be wed to His Son. “that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.” That 144,000 sealed elect of God who are God's temple along with Christ.
Last edited:
good play on words no Christ is my savior and Christ said we must be born again and
I really do not care which way this is sliced to be water Babtised or not
Becasue as Scripture is stated without being born again one can not see the kingdom of God and God today can only be worshipped in spirit and truht?
So how is one born again? Water or Holy Ghost babtism. John's or Christ's?
Yuo choose my choi8ce is God through the death, burial and resurrection,being today born again of incorruptible seed
I really do not care which way this is sliced to be water Babtised or not
Becasue as Scripture is stated without being born again one can not see the kingdom of God and God today can only be worshipped in spirit and truht?
So how is one born again? Water or Holy Ghost babtism. John's or Christ's?
Yuo choose my choi8ce is God through the death, burial and resurrection,being today born again of incorruptible seed
we are born unbelievers jinx and the Job if the Holy Ghost is
[h=3]John 16:8-11[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: [SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me; [SUP]10 [/SUP]of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; [SUP]11 [/SUP]of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
To be born again okay
[h=3]John 16:8-11[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: [SUP]9 [/SUP]of sin, because they do not believe in Me; [SUP]10 [/SUP]of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; [SUP]11 [/SUP]of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
To be born again okay
1
Some people seem to be saying that the baptism Jesus instructs in Matthew 28 is the spiritual baptism known as being filled with the Spirit/baptized into Christ/baptized into the body of Christ.
But they are clearly two different things.
This can be seen by looking at who does the baptizing in each.
We're told that Jesus is the one who does the spiritual baptizing.
Jesus is the one who baptizes in the spiritual stuff.
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Matthew 3:11 [/FONT]He will baptize you [SUP][b][/SUP]with the Holy Spirit and fire.
But in Matthew 28 Jesus instructs THEM to baptize.
[SUP]19 [/SUP][SUP][e][/SUP]Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,[SUP]20 [/SUP]teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you[SUP][f][/SUP]always, even to the end of the age.”
Jesus isn't going to instruct them to do something, that only Jesus can do.
To say that we baptize people into the Spirit, is to put US in the place of Jesus.
But they are clearly two different things.
This can be seen by looking at who does the baptizing in each.
We're told that Jesus is the one who does the spiritual baptizing.
Jesus is the one who baptizes in the spiritual stuff.
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Matthew 3:11 [/FONT]He will baptize you [SUP][b][/SUP]with the Holy Spirit and fire.
But in Matthew 28 Jesus instructs THEM to baptize.
[SUP]19 [/SUP][SUP][e][/SUP]Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,[SUP]20 [/SUP]teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you[SUP][f][/SUP]always, even to the end of the age.”
Jesus isn't going to instruct them to do something, that only Jesus can do.
To say that we baptize people into the Spirit, is to put US in the place of Jesus.
I had that discussion once before when someone was trying pass that verse off as if it is saying, [SUP]19 [/SUP]Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in [the authority of] the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,[SUP]20 [/SUP]teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
It violates the Greek grammar to understand it that way because in that phrase, "baptizing them in the name of", that word in Greek which is translate "in", is the Greek preposition, "eis", which quite clearly means in as an action of entering something "into" something. The literal meaning of that Greek preposition is, "into".
For it to be expressing the use of the authority of the name, it would have to be the Greek preposition, "en", which means, literally, "in", as in "fixed in" or as "on the basis of", and that is not what it is.
Therefore, we have to look at what word that Greek preposition, "eis" (into), is inflected to agreement with as noted by the last one or two letters.
In the case of that phrase, we find that the inflection of that word, "into" (though they said it in short form as "in") is connected to (a verb literally meaning "dipping") "baptizing" and to "them", Thus it is literally saying, "dipping them into the name".
That ought to not surprise anyone for many reasons, just two of which are that we are clearly told the righteous run into his name and are given protection, and we are told that God would take out a people for his name.
It violates the Greek grammar to understand it that way because in that phrase, "baptizing them in the name of", that word in Greek which is translate "in", is the Greek preposition, "eis", which quite clearly means in as an action of entering something "into" something. The literal meaning of that Greek preposition is, "into".
For it to be expressing the use of the authority of the name, it would have to be the Greek preposition, "en", which means, literally, "in", as in "fixed in" or as "on the basis of", and that is not what it is.
Therefore, we have to look at what word that Greek preposition, "eis" (into), is inflected to agreement with as noted by the last one or two letters.
In the case of that phrase, we find that the inflection of that word, "into" (though they said it in short form as "in") is connected to (a verb literally meaning "dipping") "baptizing" and to "them", Thus it is literally saying, "dipping them into the name".
That ought to not surprise anyone for many reasons, just two of which are that we are clearly told the righteous run into his name and are given protection, and we are told that God would take out a people for his name.
Last edited:
"Baptizo" means to fully immerse something. It is also a command action in the Greek. So it is something WE are to do without question. We don't do spiritual baptisms as that is what Jesus does. We do baptisms from water. As asked earlier, why would he command something that only he himself could do? Doesn't make sense to me..again..
L
To Anyone that chooses to jump in this thread—you may.
This is the first of a series of answers to the assertions made by—“Well we know who”. I will not debase this forum by mentioning the name of the one that bears recalcitrant fruit. For those that bear the fruit of the Spirit in love…we must continuing to show love and respect for one another as commanded by the Lord, so that we put to shame those that lack His love.
Part I
In Acts 10, Peter clearly associates the “Death, Burial, and Resurrection” of my Lord and Savior—Jesus the Christ with the water baptism in verses 42-44. Peter reiterates the same in a paraphrased manner to the Church that was under attack from others that said only the Jews were to be “saved” under the “Circumcision Covenant”; the latest of the OT way of receiving salvation.
Salvation is clearly Peter’s intent to associate with “Covenant Cutting” in the 45th verse where he makes special reference to those of the circumcision being present.
I will then, show with scripture how Moses, David, and Abraham is saved in a different post; Part II.
Acts 10:40 Him G-d raised up the third day, and shewed him openly; 41] Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of G-d, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.
42] And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of G-d to be the Judge of quick and dead. 43] To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44] While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45] And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46] For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify G-d. Then answered Peter, 47] Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48] And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
Jinx and Cisco is a little off with the terminology that they use, but if anyone that Loves Jesus would stop and consider that my Brother and Sister in Christ Jesus is sincere and attempting to share not attack, they would understand what it is they are communicating.
Homwardbound, I am aware that you and Kardiaoangelous believe in brotherly love and are sincere concerning your salvation and being redeemed at the Lord’s appearing—. “Love you brothers but you can’t have my baptism.” LOL
Since I possess a clear conscience toward G-d, which according to the Word can only be obtained by “water baptism”, I will work with Jinx and Cisco to show with the Word of G-d, what they are attempting to communicate and with the Love of G-d.
A-Omega has allots of zeal for the “letter” of the Gospel but unfortunately, he has the same spirit of thought as Saul of Tarsus. I pray that he has a similar Damascus Road experience and the Lord knocks him right off his “hee-haw”. LOL
This is the first of a series of answers to the assertions made by—“Well we know who”. I will not debase this forum by mentioning the name of the one that bears recalcitrant fruit. For those that bear the fruit of the Spirit in love…we must continuing to show love and respect for one another as commanded by the Lord, so that we put to shame those that lack His love.
Part I
In Acts 10, Peter clearly associates the “Death, Burial, and Resurrection” of my Lord and Savior—Jesus the Christ with the water baptism in verses 42-44. Peter reiterates the same in a paraphrased manner to the Church that was under attack from others that said only the Jews were to be “saved” under the “Circumcision Covenant”; the latest of the OT way of receiving salvation.
Salvation is clearly Peter’s intent to associate with “Covenant Cutting” in the 45th verse where he makes special reference to those of the circumcision being present.
I will then, show with scripture how Moses, David, and Abraham is saved in a different post; Part II.
Acts 10:40 Him G-d raised up the third day, and shewed him openly; 41] Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of G-d, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.
42] And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of G-d to be the Judge of quick and dead. 43] To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44] While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45] And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46] For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify G-d. Then answered Peter, 47] Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48] And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
Jinx and Cisco is a little off with the terminology that they use, but if anyone that Loves Jesus would stop and consider that my Brother and Sister in Christ Jesus is sincere and attempting to share not attack, they would understand what it is they are communicating.
Homwardbound, I am aware that you and Kardiaoangelous believe in brotherly love and are sincere concerning your salvation and being redeemed at the Lord’s appearing—. “Love you brothers but you can’t have my baptism.” LOL
Since I possess a clear conscience toward G-d, which according to the Word can only be obtained by “water baptism”, I will work with Jinx and Cisco to show with the Word of G-d, what they are attempting to communicate and with the Love of G-d.
A-Omega has allots of zeal for the “letter” of the Gospel but unfortunately, he has the same spirit of thought as Saul of Tarsus. I pray that he has a similar Damascus Road experience and the Lord knocks him right off his “hee-haw”. LOL
Last edited by a moderator:
This is most directly what we are told to help people do, at Matthew 28:19 >: Micah 4:5 "For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the LORD our God for ever and ever."
Proverbs 18:10 "The name of the LORD is a strong tower: the righteous runneth into it, and is safe."
Isaiah 50:10 "Who is among you that feareth the LORD, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the LORD, and stay upon his God."
So you will have to take that objection up with God.
As for me, I must honestly read the Greek grammar for what it clearly says.
As I fully trust God and His word, there is no reason for me to resist what it says.
Proverbs 18:10 "The name of the LORD is a strong tower: the righteous runneth into it, and is safe."
Isaiah 50:10 "Who is among you that feareth the LORD, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the LORD, and stay upon his God."
So you will have to take that objection up with God.
As for me, I must honestly read the Greek grammar for what it clearly says.
As I fully trust God and His word, there is no reason for me to resist what it says.
Last edited:
Yes, that is what it means to dip a thing, which is it's literal meaning. A way to describe it would be to submerse something, either literally or figuratively.
The Greek grammar there at Matt 28:19 prohibits what you are saying that it specifically means to submerse in water but that is up to you to accept or reject.
The Greek grammar there at Matt 28:19 prohibits what you are saying that it specifically means to submerse in water but that is up to you to accept or reject.
Last edited:
Acts 10:47-48 "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days."
Yes indeed, that chapter means water baptism. We must always accept what is said, the way it is said in the Greek or Hebrew text, matter not where in the Bible it is found. There is never a reason not to.
That was the New Covenant being extended to the Gentiles to make them a part of the Church of Christ. No Church gone out to the Gentiles would equal no salvation gone out to the Gentiles.
Yes indeed, that chapter means water baptism. We must always accept what is said, the way it is said in the Greek or Hebrew text, matter not where in the Bible it is found. There is never a reason not to.
That was the New Covenant being extended to the Gentiles to make them a part of the Church of Christ. No Church gone out to the Gentiles would equal no salvation gone out to the Gentiles.
Last edited: