Reminder: these have been on the table since post #2, and have not been addressed from "what the Bible actually says:"
1) First, we see a living (immortal) spirit returning to its body in Lk 8:55.
2) Then there is what Jesus said:
Mt 22:31-32 - "In the account of the bush (Lk 20:37-38), have you not read what God said to you, 'I am (present tense) the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. He is not the God of the dead but of the living."
Two hundred years after the death of the patriarchs, God declared he is (present tense) the God of the patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Ex 3:6). Since he is (present tense) the God only of the living, and not the God of the dead, what part of the patriarchs are still living?
Lk 16:22-26 - "The time came when the beggar man died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. . .he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to. . .cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
But Abraham replied. . .'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "
Jesus presented the rich man in hell, with he and Abraham conversing with one another after their deaths.
If their bodies were dead, then what parts of them were conversing with each other?
Lk 8:51 - "If anyone keeps my word, he will never see death."
Well, all those to whom Jesus spoke those words are now dead.
And God told Adam that the day he ate of the fruit he would die, but he lived for centuries.
So what did not die, and what did die?
Jn 5:24 - "Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal llife. . .he has crossed over from death to life."
So what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they cross over?
3) We find the same thing in the epistles:
1Jn 3:14 - "We know we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death. . .no murderer has eternal life in him."
Again, what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they pass?
Col 2:13 - "When you were dead in your sins. . .God made you alive with Christ."
Eph 2:1,3 - "You were dead in your transgressions and sins. . .by nature objects of wrath."
Again, what was dead? It wasn't their bodies.
Php 1:23 - "I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ which is better by far, but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body."
The NT plainly states that when believers die, they are with Christ, apart from their body.
So what part of them is with Christ, apart from their body?
Heb 12:18, 22-24 - "You have not come to a mountain that is burning with fire. . .You have come to Mount Zion. . .You have come to God, the judge of all men, to the spirits of righteous men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant. . ."
The NT reveals that the spirits of former righteous believers (e.g., Abel and Noah, vv.4, 7) are immortal
and are waiting for the resurrection.
These ten NT Scriptures and their questions, which were presented in post #2, are still on the table unaddressed.
And that is because this false theology cannot address them.
They might be on your table, but not mine. I've addressed them before, but, I shall do it again:
Elin, you are the one that keeps inserting the word "Immortal". It's not in the scripture. You KEEP making stuff up and then deciding it's a fact.
Let's look at Luke 8:55:
"Then her
spirit returned and she arose immediately." Where did her
"spirit" return from?
The Bible says: "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the
spirit return unto God who gave it." Eccleastes 12:7
What is the
"spirit" that returns to God at death?
The Bible says: "The body without the
spirit is dead." James 2:26.
"The
spirit of God [the breath which God gave him] is in my nostrils." Job 27:3
"And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground and
breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."
Elin, The
"spirit" that returns to God at death is the breath of life. Nowhere in the Bible does the
"spirit" have any life, wisdom, or feeling after a person dies. It is the
"breath of life" and nothing more.
So,, 1 is off the table,, at least it's off mine.
Number 2.
Elin, Jesus taught parables. Parables are teaching tools.
You have decided that the begger, lazarus, abraham story is real. And it is not.
The bible says the dead know nothing. "The living know that they shall die, but the dead know nothing." That teaching is from the Bible and it certainly coincides with my point that the story is a parable.
The parable has them talking and communicating.. Eccleastes 9:5,6,10,,, says this:
"The living know that they shall die but the dead know not anything, neither have they anymore a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love , and their hatred, and there envy is now perished; neither have they anymore a portion forever in anything done under the sun."
"There is no work, nor device. nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave..."
The bible says the dead know absolutely nothing!!!!
"So man lieth down and riseth not; til the heavens be no more, they shall not awake nor be raised from their sleep."
"His sons come to honor him and he know it not."
So,, the dead cannot contact the living, nor do they know what the living are doing! They are dead. Their thoughts have perished. (Psalm 146:4)
So,, you are going to have to toss and ignore a whole bunch of scriptures if you want to make the
"spirit" have life unto itself.
Under my theology (not mine, Gods) everything fits perfectly.
Not to mention: Do you really think that if somebody dipped their finger in some water and touched it on sombody's tongue in some flames they would somehow bring relief?
Can Abraham have mercy on the wicked by sending someone with a water cooled finger? Elin,, seriously, must we continue?
Number 2 is off the table..
Because your premise is wrong the rest of your thelogy just doesn't fit!