Is LITERAL Hellfire Torment A Bible Teaching?

[Shiloah]

Well I see it very just, tbh, Shiloah. because first of all, no human deserves to be in Heaven or to be present before God.
Had Christ chose not to come to the World and sacrifice His life, God is still just in sending all of Humans to hell. Why? Because He is infinitely Holy, while humans nature are sins.
Second of all, God is Love that's why He doesn't gleefully watch Humans to perish and enjoy seeing it. He desires that humans can be saved. But He is also just and righteous. He hates sin very much, that it's said in the book of Isaiah. it Pleaseth the Lord to crush Him. and to reject a sacrifice of His Own Son? Everlasting God himself? I believe in God's judgment has been and will always be eternally just.
I Praise the Lord for His Grace.

You're right, leonardronaldo, no human deserves heaven. Only through Christ's sacrifice and by His grace are we saved. As for hell, are you suggesting God has no control over this everlasting torture chamber you suggest sinners go to? What rubbish. What He doesn't want is for anyone to perish, as in die forever and not share in eternity with Him. Just like scripture says.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

 

[Shiloah]

Hmmm. You are too wise.

Does Scripture teach this:

The Law brings life. Christ brings death.

Jesus did not pay the ransom to deliver us from death.

There will not be an everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord handed down to those on His left.

Those who are asleep in Christ will not come with Him?

They who die in their sins will not die?

If Scripture says the complete opposite of what I stated, then are you not introducing a theory which states such contradictive things?

Your old theory contradicts scriptures in many ways. Jesus didn't die to save us from death?/Perish?

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Your theory twists the word perish (which means to die) into everlasting torment.

(Sorry if I totally misread your post.)

 

[4enlightment]

I've already been down that road. I have no doubt that the dead are in their graves. I also have no doubt that satan will decieve all who beleive the dead are alive.

Believing the dead are alive is false doctrine. I don't buy into it.

Matthew 9:24he said, “Go away. The girl is not dead but asleep.” But they laughed at him.

Ephesians 5:14This is why it is said: “Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.”

 

[Shiloah]

Matthew 9:24he said, “Go away. The girl is not dead but asleep.” But they laughed at him.

Ephesians 5:14This is why it is said: “Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.”

Jesus called dead asleep. He did this with Lazarus as well. He said He was asleep, and when the disciples then said that Lazarus will wake up and be fine, Jesus told them Lazarus was dead. The dead in Christ rise to their reward, and the wicked dead rise to the judgement of the wicked, which you'll notice scripture calls "the second death." In other words they are and will be dead twice. The second time? For all of eternity.

 

[john832]

Matthew 9:24he said, “Go away. The girl is not dead but asleep.” But they laughed at him.

Ephesians 5:14This is why it is said: “Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.”

You gotta love it when someone posts a half-truth. Let's put the whole story out here...

Luk 8:52 And all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.
Luk 8:53 And they laughed him to scorn, knowing that she was dead.

Eph 5:14 Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.

Word for dead:

G3498
νεκρός
nekros
nek-ros'
From an apparently primary word νέκυς nekus (a corpse); dead (literally or figuratively; also as noun): - dead.

 

[cfultz3]

Your old theory contradicts scriptures in many ways. Jesus didn't die to save us from death?/Perish?

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Your theory twists the word perish (which means to die) into everlasting torment.

(Sorry if I totally misread your post.)

Shiloah,

"....so that...shall not perish" says John 3:16. Yet you say, "Jesus didn't die to save us from death?/Perish?"

You say you are sorry if you misread my post, yet you boldly stated: Your theory [does] twist the word 'perish'..." Which one is it: did I purposely twist the meaning of the word or did you misunderstand me?

Nonetheless, you also boldly state that "Jesus didn't die to save us from death", yet, it is very Scriptural that He die to pay the ransom to deliver us from death.

This is torment: eternity without God. If they who are in Christ are given everlasting life, then everlasting remains the same when speaking of the adverse sentencing given to those on His left during judgment. And we are told that this adverse judgment is an "everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord". How then is it not an everlasting torment to be forevermore banned from the presence of God?

 

[Michael50]

Matthew 9:24he said, “Go away. The girl is not dead but asleep.” But they laughed at him.

Ephesians 5:14This is why it is said: “Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.”

Jesus referred to death as a sleep. Jesus will raise everybody that sleeps in the grave. Some will be raised at the appearance of Jesus (Righteous dead). Some will be raised 1000 years later (wicked dead). All who sleep (are in the grave) will be ressurected.

Also,, the girl that Jesus raised,,,,, Did she have a glorified immortal body? Nope,,,she did not,,, I tell you,, she either got sick again and died, or she got old and died. But I'm sure she is dead, waiting the appearance of Jesus to be raised, at the Last day.

 

[cfultz3]

You're right, leonardronaldo, no human deserves heaven. Only through Christ's sacrifice and by His grace are we saved. As for hell, are you suggesting God has no control over this everlasting torture chamber you suggest sinners go to? What rubbish. What He doesn't want is for anyone to perish, as in die forever and not share in eternity with Him. Just like scripture says.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Have you looked into the mood of the two Greek words: "God will"? If you would, you will find that the ten or so instances of "God will" are in the subjunctive, which indicates possibility. That, in and of itself, is the direct opposite of reality. But, "God will" one day have His Kingdom returned to Him the way it was before the fall, and that has been determined by Him.

God desires it, but will it happen? Not according to Revelation where it speaks about those who received the mark of the beast will be thrown into the Lake of Fire.

 

[leonardronaldo]

Christ palinly says that three days and nights after He told the thief the famous phrase about being in Paradise, He had not gone there YET. So if the thief went to Paradise that very day, Christ was about 3-1/2 days late and was not the firstborn among many brethren. The thief beat Him there by at least 3-1/2 days.

To me this is a blasphemy. Christ is God. He created the Paradise, let alone being there later than a mere creature.
If you're saying Jesus' body is beaten to get there, that might be acceptable.

 

[danschance]

You gotta love it when someone posts a half-truth. Let's put the whole story out here...

Luk 8:52 And all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.
Luk 8:53 And they laughed him to scorn, knowing that she was dead.

Eph 5:14 Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.

Word for dead:

G3498
νεκρός
nekros
nek-ros'
From an apparently primary word νέκυς nekus (a corpse); dead (literally or figuratively; also as noun): - dead.

If the word sleep is applied to the dead, how does this support non-existance of the soul upon death?

 

[danschance]

Jesus referred to death as a sleep. Jesus will raise everybody that sleeps in the grave. Some will be raised at the appearance of Jesus (Righteous dead). Some will be raised 1000 years later (wicked dead). All who sleep (are in the grave) will be ressurected.

Also,, the girl that Jesus raised,,,,, Did she have a glorified immortal body? Nope,,,she did not,,, I tell you,, she either got sick again and died, or she got old and died. But I'm sure she is dead, waiting the appearance of Jesus to be raised, at the Last day.

When we sleep we do not die. Sleep implies still alive. Yet for you in this context sleep means non-existence. I really do not get that. Maybe "sleep" in this context simply is a reference to the resurrection, were the body will walk up.

 

[leonardronaldo]

He DIED for your sins. He didn't shed a husk or molt like a lizard, He literally DIED to pay for our sins.

Are you saying the Spirit of Christ, which is God, died. Another blasphemy. The being of Christ never Died nor it would ever. His physical body did.
Please just stop all of this blasphemy, Sir. thanks.

 

[danschance]

okay,, well excuse me then,,, I thought you were advancing a thought that those who died before Jesus,,, went on to Heaven.. sorry,, if I misunderstood you.

You are right, they did not go to Heaven. They went to sheol, the place of the dead. Sheol =hades and the story of Lazarus the beggar and the rich man, we learn sheol had two compartments. One a place of torment and the other not

 

[FIRE_of_ELIJAH]

[h=3]Hell is eternal torment !!!!

Revelation 14:11[/h]And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever.There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”

[h=3]Revelation 20:14[/h]Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15
Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

I can't change what has already written !!!

 

[leonardronaldo]

You're right, leonardronaldo, no human deserves heaven. Only through Christ's sacrifice and by His grace are we saved. As for hell, are you suggesting God has no control over this everlasting torture chamber you suggest sinners go to? What rubbish. What He doesn't want is for anyone to perish, as in die forever and not share in eternity with Him. Just like scripture says.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Are you a universalist? I never said God has no control, God is in control, even in hell. I stated also God is love and doesn't gleefully watch humans to perish and enjoy seeing it; did you miss that part?
He desires humans to be saved. I wrote that in what you quoted. Please read again.
Blessings

 

[Michael50]

Hell is eternal torment !!!!

Revelation 14:11

And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever.There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”

Revelation 20:14

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15
Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

I can't change what has already written !!!

Was Sodom & Gommorah destroyed with "eternal fire"?

 

[john832]

To me this is a blasphemy. Christ is God. He created the Paradise, let alone being there later than a mere creature.
If you're saying Jesus' body is beaten to get there, that might be acceptable.

I was using the term "beat" as one would use it as the winner of a race. I ran a footrace against so and so but he beat me to the finish line. Perhaps English is not yoru first language and if so, my apologies for using teh veranacular. Let me restate it...

Christ plainly says that three days and nights after He told the thief the famous phrase about being in Paradise, He had not gone there YET. So if the thief went to Paradise that very day, Christ was about 3-1/2 days late and was not the firstborn among many brethren. The thief was in heaven at least 3-1/2 days before Christ.

 

[john832]

Was Sodom & Gommorah destroyed with "eternal fire"?

Just a little fuel for your fire Michael (sorry, I couldn't resist)...

Eze 20:47 And say to the forest of the south, Hear the word of the LORD; Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will kindle a fire in thee, and it shall devour every green tree in thee, and every dry tree: the flaming flame shall not be quenched, and all faces from the south to the north shall be burned therein.
Eze 20:48 And all flesh shall see that I the LORD have kindled it: it shall not be quenched.

Still burning is it? No, it burned out but it was not quenched. It burned itself out.

Jer 17:27 But if ye will not hearken unto me to hallow the sabbath day, and not to bear a burden, even entering in at the gates of Jerusalem on the sabbath day; then will I kindle a fire in the gates thereof, and it shall devour the palaces of Jerusalem, and it shall not be quenched.

It happened and Jerusalem was burned but is it still burning? Nope, it burned out. No one put it out, it wasn't quenched, but it is not still burning, it burned itself out.

 

[leonardronaldo]

I was using the term "beat" as one would use it as the winner of a race. I ran a footrace against so and so but he beat me to the finish line. Perhaps English is not yoru first language and if so, my apologies for using teh veranacular. Let me restate it...

Christ plainly says that three days and nights after He told the thief the famous phrase about being in Paradise, He had not gone there YET. So if the thief went to Paradise that very day, Christ was about 3-1/2 days late and was not the firstborn among many brethren. The thief was in heaven at least 3-1/2 days before Christ.

No, no I don't think this is because of my english. This was why I asked you in the previous post, Sir, to explain your understanding on the term Firstborn.
Christ has been everywhere since He was and is and is God who is omnipresent., what's so hard to digest about that?
The human body of Jesus might not have been there, I know.

 

[danschance]

Was Sodom & Gommorah destroyed with "eternal fire"?

No, it was destroyed by "fire and brimstone (sulphur)". Why do you ask?