WHY ARE PEOPLE WORSHIPING ON SUNDAY?

[danschance]

This is right, pagans did not want to change the day they worshipped from the beginning and Constantine made his laws in 324. We are following Constantine and the pagans, not God's word.

See my above post. We are doing exactly what God wants us to do. We are not bound to the law. Only judaizers think they are.

 

[Wall]

Secoundly notice how the early church---before COnstantine worshipped and assembled on Sunday and not the Jewish Sabbath?

Yes, I saw you quoted some guys writings. But as I said...you wont find that in the bible

 

[danschance]

ACTS 20 [7] And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.[8] And there were many lights in the upper chamber, where they were gathered together.

The above scripture is used by the "many" to convince people that sunday was being kept as a day of rest instead of the sabbath during the time of Paul. They will point out that on the first day of the week they came together to “break bread” and thus the believers of Pauls time were following sunday as the “new testament” day of rest.

ACTS 2 [42] And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.[43] And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.[44] And all that believed were together, and had all things common;[45] And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.[46] And they, CONTINUING DAILY with one accord in the temple, AND BREAKING BREAD from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

But as you can see they “broke bread” daily. Not just on the first day of the week. They were simply eating. The fact is, you will find no where in the new testament anyone keeping sunday as a day of rest.

You are correct, but the sad part is...they won't even spend 3 seconds reading what you wrote. They will simply assume you a wrong and move on to the next thing they want to say.

They have a strong delusion which is evident by the lack of new testament support they think exists.

 

[Wall]

1 CORINTHIANS 16:2...
[SUP]2. [/SUP]Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Not a single mention of a new day of rest nor of the Sabbath. I don't know what you read into that scripture but this is what I see.

Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

 

[Wall]

MARK 2:27-28...
[SUP]27. [/SUP]And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
[SUP]28. [/SUP]Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Yes! And if God made the Sabbath for man why in the wide wide world of sports would man ignore the Sabbath God made for him and look for another day of rest

strike 3. New batter

 

[danschance]

Wall, I was wrong. You are one of the decieved.

Your arguement is one of ignoring the implications of what has been said and done for centuries until a few nuts came along and said Sunday is not the Lord's Day even if it says that in scripture. No, no, no, It is Saturday like back when Moses parted the red sea.

I really hate the johnny come latelies, who point their bony finger at the world and claim they are correct and everyone else is not, like the schizophrenic on the street corner who believes the voices in his head are real and he is Nepolean.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

I bet you wont tell me where those scriptures are.

Edited out, that was already discussed and I didn't see the conversation.

 

[RedTent]

John, that is pure fiction, pure fantasy, pure lies. The early church Fathers wrote about how and why Sunday became the day of assembly for group worship more than a hundred years before that. Below are statements from early church writings.

You are quoting what the early church fathers said, they were all converted pagans. From the beginning the pagans wanted to separate all worship of Christ from the worship of the Father, to make Christianity a brand new religion. Have you read the manifesto of Constantine? Perhaps it isn't authentic, but I've read Constantine's letters and they are, they say the same thing. Constantine was a man who murdered his wife. Do you really think we should follow these ideas or should we follow Christ?

 

[Shiloah]

Yeah, let's just give them all up. Helter Skelter. Let's just all start committing adultery, lying, stealing, worshiping false gods. No one can keep those laws anyway. Besides! Christ freed us from those laws, right? What an argument.

 

[Bookends]

I think you can look at that both ways......Do not let anyone judge you for choosing to keep it, and do not judge anyone else regarding their observance or non-observance of it either.

So who's doing the judging? Who starts these types of threads?

 

[Shiloah]

You are quoting what the early church fathers said, they were all converted pagans. From the beginning the pagans wanted to separate all worship of Christ from the worship of the Father, to make Christianity a brand new religion. Have you read the manifesto of Constantine? Perhaps it isn't authentic, but I've read Constantine's letters and they are, they say the same thing. Constantine was a man who murdered his wife. Do you really think we should follow these ideas or should we follow Christ?

Constantine was the first ruler to enacted Sunday worship as law for one purpose: to unite the Roman world.

First Sunday Law enacted by Emperor Constantine -
March, 321 A.D.

On the venerable Day of the Sun let the magistrates and people residing in cities rest, and let all workshops be closed. In the country, however, persons engaged in agriculture may freely and lawfully continue their pursuits; because it often happens that another day is not so suitable for grain-sowing or for vine-planting; lest by neglecting the proper moment for such operations the bounty of heaven should be lost. (Given the 7th day of March, Crispus and Constantine being consuls each of them for the second time [A.D. 321].)

Source: Codex Justinianus, lib. 3, tit. 12, 3; trans. in Philip Schaff, History of the Christian Church, Vol. 3 (5th ed.; New York: Scribner, 1902), p. 380, note 1.

Transition from Pagan to Christian

[p. 122] This legislation by Constantine probably bore no relation to Christianity; it appears, on the contrary, that the emperor, in his capacity of Pontifex Maximus, was only adding the day of the Sun, the worship of which was then firmly [p. 123] established in the Roman Empire, to the other ferial days of the sacred calendar…
[p. 270] What began, however, as a pagan ordinance, ended as a Christian regulation; and a long series of imperial decrees, during the fourth, fifth, and sixth centuries, enjoined with increasing stringency abstinence from labour on Sunday.
​

Source: Hutton Webster, Rest Days, pp. 122, 123, 270. Copyright 1916 by The Macmillan Company, New York.

Yes, the title Pontifex Maximus is pagan, derived from the Sun worshiping Roman Empire, and the source of the papal title of Pontiff.

Pope Sylvester first among the Romans ordered that the names of the days [of the week], which they previously called after the name of their gods, that is, [the day] of the Sun, [the day] of the Moon, [the day] of Mars, [the day] of Mercury, [the day] of Jupiter, [the day] of Venus, [the day] of Saturn, they should call feriae thereafter, that is the first feria, the second feria, the third feria, the fourth feria, the fifth feria, the sixth feria, because that in the beginning of Genesis it is written that God said concerning each day: on the first, "Let there be light:; on the second, "Let there be a firmament"; on the third, "Let the earth bring forth verdure"; etc. But he [Sylvester] ordered [them] to call the Sabbath by the ancient term of the law, [to call] the first feria the "Lord's day," because on it the Lord rose [from the dead], Moreover, the same pope decreed that the rest of the Sabbath should be transferred rather to the Lord's day [Sunday], in order that on that day we should rest from worldly works for the praise of God.

Note particularly, he says that "the same pope [Sylvester I] decreed that the rest of the Sabbath should be transferred rather to the Lord's day [Sunday]."[SUP]8[/SUP] According to this statement, he was the first bishop to introduce the idea that the divinely appointed rest of the Sabbath day should be transferred to the first day of the week. This is significant, especially in view of the fact that it was during Sylvester's pontificate that the emperor of Rome [Constantine] issued the first civil laws compelling men to rest from secular labor on Sunday, and that Eusebius, bishop of Caesarea, was the first theologian on record to present arguments, allegedly from the Scriptures, that Christ did transfer the rest of the Sabbath day to Sunday.

[SUP]6[/SUP] Rabanus Maurus, Liber de Computo (A book Concerning Computation), Chap. XXVII ("Concerning Festivals"), as translated by the writer from the Latin text in Migne's Patrologia Latina, Vol. CVII, col. 682.

Sylvester the pope first among the Romans ordered that the names of the days, which before they called according to the names of their own gods, that is (the day) of the sun, of the moon, of Mars, of Mercury, of Venus, of Saturn, they should call feria (day of celebration), that is, first feria, second feria, third feria, fourth feria, fifth feria, sixth feria, because in the beginning of Genesis it is written that God had said for each day: first, "Let there be light"; second, "Let there be the firmament"; third, "Let the earth produce living plants", etc. But the Sabbath he commanded they call by the ancient name of the law, and the first feria the Lord’s day, because the Lord rose on that day. Moreover the same pope ordered that the rest (otium) of the Sabbath would better be transferred to the Lord’s day, so that we should leave that day free of worldly works in order to praise God.

Daniel 7:25

He shall speak words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and shall think to change the times and the law; and they shall be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time.


​

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Most importantly, when people discuss this....keeping this in mind is a good idea

Colossians 2:16

"Let no man therefore judge you in food, or in drink, or in respect of a holy day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:"


If somebody doesn't want to keep the Sabbath, don't judge, if someone chooses to keep it...don't judge. However, I can provide some scriptures that prove that it's a good thing to keep it and that God's Sabbaths are eternal

Isiah 56: 1-5
"
56 Thus saith the Lord, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.

[SUP]2 [/SUP]Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.

[SUP]3 [/SUP]Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the Lord, speak, saying, The Lord hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For thus saith the Lord unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off."



Isiah 66: 22-23

[SUP]22 [/SUP]For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord."

The Sabbath will still be observed even after this heaven and this earth passes away, and the new ones are created. A man is blessed of the Lord if he keeps the Sabbath.......If someone chooses not to observe the Sabbath I don't judge him and scripture also instructs me not to......what I don't understand is why people are judged for choosing to keep it. When did obedience become a bad thing?

 

[Donkeyfish07]

So who's doing the judging? Who starts these types of threads?

I'm not calling anyone out and haven't read every single post in the thread....but I've seen it happen quite a bit anytime there's a Sabbath discussion taking place. Seen it happen from pro-sabbath and anti-sabbath people....both ends

 

[Wall]

Wall, I was wrong. You are one of the decieved.

Your arguement is one of ignoring the implications of what has been said and done for centuries until a few nuts came along and said Sunday is not the Lord's Day even if it says that in scripture.

So please show me the scripture that says sunday is the Lords day

Love Wallnut

 

[Kerry]

Sunday, Saturday, Wednesday,Thursday........ ect. Baloney, hogwash. David said that I can be out here keeping my sheep and begin to praise Him and He encompasses me. David was under law, yet he knew that God inhabits the praises of His people. We can spend any day with God, it is our choice. The fact is that people want to live like the devil for 6 days and get all holy on one.

Don't think so, what about that 35 bucks you spent watching hollywood's latest with all kinds of nakedness and homosexuality and drinking and drug use. I bet most of you let your ten year olds watch it.

Oh I do not support that kind of stuff. Really you spent your hard earned money on it and now want to gripe about a tithe. Where is your focus, America please return to the God of our forefathers. that is the only hope we have.

Keep watching Oprah, and Wendy, and the amazing Dr. Phil., and watch this country that has been so blessed by God fall. It is already happening. Yet we have become so blind we cannot see it. This welfare state is going bankrupt and China is waiting to cash in. Either turn to God or brush up on you Chinese. I know of many companies and banks that are funded by the Chinese. My investor, just went to China to try to ease their investment in his company. American banks are not loaning money because they are cashing in on the government bail out. So companies are having to go to China for funding. and were are worried about what day to worship God. It needs to be everyday and night and every waking hour in between.

 

[josh123]

Yes! And if God made the Sabbath for man why in the wide wide world of sports would man ignore the Sabbath God made for him and look for another day of rest

strike 3. New batter

sabbath means rest... Rest is made for man we are at rest when we accept god in our hearts..For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said, “As I swore in my wrath, ‘They shall not enter my rest,’” although his works were finished from the foundation of the world.[h=3]Hebrews 4:3[/h]

 

[Wall]

sabbath means rest... Rest is made for man we are at rest when we accept god in our hearts..For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said, “As I swore in my wrath, ‘They shall not enter my rest,’” although his works were finished from the foundation of the world.Hebrews 4:3

Hebrews 4 is all about keeping Gods Sabbath day

HEBREWS 4 [10] For HE THAT IS ENTERED INTO HIS REST, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Well...Ya see what it says. As God did from His. Now lets see how God rested from His work

HEBREWS 4 [4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works

Yup. Its right there in Hebrews 4 for all to see. God rested the 7th day. Pretty simple

 

[Bookends]

The Sabbath is biblical. Sunday being the Lords day? Nowhere to be found in scripture

You might believe that to be true and you may have been told that is true, but that is the kind of stuff I flush.

1 Corinthians 16:2 - Upon the first [day] of the week (Sunday) let every one of you lay by him in store, as [God] hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.
(Tithe on Sunday!)

7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul began talking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight. Acts 20:7

On the first day of every week each one of you is to put aside and save, as he may prosper, so that no collections be made when I come. 1Cor.16:2

16 Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. Col, 2:16,17

I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day Rev1:10

So first of you can't tell anyone when to worship because then you are acting as my judge in violation of Col. 2:16 above.

Secoundly notice how the early church---before COnstantine worshipped and assembled on Sunday and not the Jewish Sabbath?

Thirdly, Isn't it astounding that the apostle John called Sunday the Lord's day too? Is this tacit approval of the church worshipping on Sunday and not Sabbath? I think so.

Thanks for answering this for me. You saved me a lot time. Sunday may not be directly called the Lord's day in Scripture but the point of the resurrection is the pivotal point for the Christian Church is it foundation. The problem as I see it, some don't understand the Spirit of the law in which it's roots stem from the written law.

[h=3]1 Corinthians 15:17[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)


[SUP]17 [/SUP]And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!



Romans 1:1-4
1 Paul, a bondservant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated to the gospel of God [SUP]2 [/SUP]which He promised before through His prophets in the Holy Scriptures, [SUP]3 [/SUP]concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh, [SUP]4[/SUP]and declared to be the Son of God with power according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead.

[h=3]1 Corinthians 15:20[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[h=3]The Last Enemy Destroyed[/h][SUP]20 [/SUP]But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.




Just curious, after Christ's resurrection, Christ hung around some 40 days and appeared to many people, is it ever recorded in the bible that he step into the temple or synagogue, or appeared to anyone on the sabbath? I think nope, zippo.

Also that fact that Pentecost (who many consider the birth of the NT Church) happened on Sunday speaks volumes.

 

[Bookends]

You are quoting what the early church fathers said, they were all converted pagans. From the beginning the pagans wanted to separate all worship of Christ from the worship of the Father, to make Christianity a brand new religion. Have you read the manifesto of Constantine? Perhaps it isn't authentic, but I've read Constantine's letters and they are, they say the same thing. Constantine was a man who murdered his wife. Do you really think we should follow these ideas or should we follow Christ?

Please stop trying to reinvent History - 2nd century writers such as Justin Martyr attest to the widespread practice of Sunday worship (First Apology, chapter 67).

 

[Bookends]

I'm not calling anyone out and haven't read every single post in the thread....but I've seen it happen quite a bit anytime there's a Sabbath discussion taking place. Seen it happen from pro-sabbath and anti-sabbath people....both ends

Well I've seen some heated exchanges as well, but I never seen a Sunday gatherer start a thread regarding this issue of "what day to worship" or "what day you need to worship", we may explain why we worship on Sunday, but we don't force it on others...personally I don't agree with the choice of your words describing Sunday worshipers as anti-sabbath, for I am a sabbath keeper because I worship the substance that fulfilled the shadow.