Difference between God and Jesus

[XianCatalyst]

Brother Josh, it isn't about banning people who disagree with you. It's banning people who try teaching mysterious doctrine. One man once tried telling everyone that Jesus died for only His people and not the world. That's legalistic doctrine....they deserve to be banned for trying to convince people that...

Who can determine who'd doctrine is right? Only God. I'd not want to put that mantle on myself. I'd ban all of you because no one in here agrees with everything I believe. In fact every one of you would do the same.

In a public forum, if someone comes in here teaching some cockamaymie idea, there are a ton of people to set him right. That would open discussion. Anyone reading it, will see both sides of the arguments and be better off for it. By disallowing those discussions to occur, you allow someone who could have seen the objections, be swayed later because they see/hear only one side of the argument. Playing concept police is a tragedy waiting to happen IN MY sorta humble opinion.

 

[XianCatalyst]

If you really think defining Son of God takes people to a theological discussion, and not regarded as basic, then I think you been drinking milk while imagining meat lol.

I think if you "think" you need to define Jesus as God for your theology to stick, then you rewrite the words God chose to present to the people. That's not eating meat, that's poisoning the meat.

Trinity has NO PLACE in a conversation about God. It's not edifying, it ONLY creates dissension, it's NOT an issue to salvation. IT"S NOT something the early church taught. It's a deduction, and therefore subject to error. It's a populist opinion. The only thing relevant is knowing Jesus came and paid your debt, so you could go to God and be made whole again.

Knowledge creates egos, not faith.

Scripture says as much.

According to Paul this whole thread, which is a KNOWN DIVISION is a conversation of the flesh, not led by the Spirit. So for ANY SIDE in this chat, to take some stand of being RIGHT is just foolish. I mean the word literally, not pejoratively.

 

[XianCatalyst]

hi Mark

Arianism is heresy.

No, what was left of Arius' works were destroyed, and the victors wrote and SAID what he believed and proclaimed what they presented he said to be heresy. The greatest minds of the church of that day agreed with him, UNTIL the better marketing plan prevailed.

If you read the only texts we have that we KNOW are his words, and not recordings that other people claim were his words, there is nothing heresitical about his teachings at all.

 

[7seven7]

Brothers my Faith is not only intact, but has taken me from the gates of hell to a soft place in the lap of Christ... Ive spent years in and out of hospitals, and watched most of the friends I had from my youth put in prisons, and cemeteries, or die from over doses...Ive been in jails where men have shown more respect for each other then what I have seen on this thread...You people have attacked and piled up on one man as if he was a piece of bloody meat for both your entertainment and ingestion...This is Christianity! ? ...I think not, you all boast of being on a higher plane of Spirituality, yet you tare into this man like animals in pursuit of blood, justifying it all you want, but this is just plain wrong! And if you dont see that, Christ may not see you! We are all on a journey to freedom in different stages, you might want to look at the log in your own eyes before attempting to remove the spec from his...I am extremely sorry to speak out like this, but this is just wrong on so many levels...If my post poses any discourse, I apologies, and will be more then happy to leave this place...Because I dont see Jesus anywhere in any of this...Peace.

Don't even think about leaving! I couldn't have worded it better myself. God bless.

 

[Godslyric]

Don't even think about leaving! I couldn't have worded it better myself. God bless.

Thanks brother..

 

[Bryancampbell]

I think if you "think" you need to define Jesus as God for your theology to stick, then you rewrite the words God chose to present to the people. That's not eating meat, that's poisoning the meat.

Trinity has NO PLACE in a conversation about God. It's not edifying, it ONLY creates dissension, it's NOT an issue to salvation. IT"S NOT something the early church taught. It's a deduction, and therefore subject to error. It's a populist opinion. The only thing relevant is knowing Jesus came and paid your debt, so you could go to God and be made whole again.

Knowledge creates egos, not faith.

Scripture says as much.

According to Paul this whole thread, which is a KNOWN DIVISION is a conversation of the flesh, not led by the Spirit. So for ANY SIDE in this chat, to take some stand of being RIGHT is just foolish. I mean the word literally, not pejoratively.

Please, we just got over this, I'm not wanting to fight with you

 

[Bryancampbell]

If you wanna fight xiancatalyst, take it to Satan.

 

[ProveMeWrong]

Salaam (Peace)
I am a Muslim from Qatar (not a terrorist)
I have joined this topic as it looks very appealing to me

 

[zone]

Brothers my Faith is not only intact, but has taken me from the gates of hell to a soft place in the lap of Christ... Ive spent years in and out of hospitals, and watched most of the friends I had from my youth put in prisons, and cemeteries, or die from over doses...Ive been in jails where men have shown more respect for each other then what I have seen on this thread...You people have attacked and piled up on one man as if he was a piece of bloody meat for both your entertainment and ingestion...This is Christianity! ? ...I think not, you all boast of being on a higher plane of Spirituality, yet you tare into this man like animals in pursuit of blood, justifying it all you want, but this is just plain wrong! And if you dont see that, Christ may not see you! We are all on a journey to freedom in different stages, you might want to look at the log in your own eyes before attempting to remove the spec from his...I am extremely sorry to speak out like this, but this is just wrong on so many levels...If my post poses any discourse, I apologies, and will be more then happy to leave this place...Because I dont see Jesus anywhere in any of this...Peace.

you're comparing hard core prison to an internet discussion with someone who is not new here, nor to his beliefs - but has already been here under another name and stirred up contention on every thread continually?

and that guy is Mr. Innocent?
no, Arianism (that Jesus is a created entity) was declared heresy a long time ago, and it's still heresy.
people were patient with him for weeks the last time - and he just carried on with his mission....nothing anyone said made a dent.

heresy and challenging trinitarians.
seems to me if someone has a personal belief that Jesus was created, and they've already been removed from a community for promoting the idea, it wouldn't make a lot of sense to come back with the same agenda....would it?
but anyways....how come you don't recognize that Phil's deep concern is for the fella's spiritual well-being?

 

[zone]

No, what was left of Arius' works were destroyed, and the victors wrote and SAID what he believed and proclaimed what they presented he said to be heresy. The greatest minds of the church of that day agreed with him, UNTIL the better marketing plan prevailed.

If you read the only texts we have that we KNOW are his words, and not recordings that other people claim were his words, there is nothing heresitical about his teachings at all.

LOL!
saying Jesus is a CREATED DEITY is making Him a created creature.
and is polytheism to boot.
arianism is heresy.
but, perhaps a new thread? then the matter can be discussed openly.

i'll start.

 

[Sanashankar]

Salaam (Peace)
I am a Muslim from Qatar (not a terrorist)
I have joined this topic as it looks very appealing to me

I am a Muslim from Qatar (not a terrorist)

my sister is in Qatar, she is not a terrorist too...

 

[zone]

Salaam (Peace)
I am a Muslim from Qatar (not a terrorist)
I have joined this topic as it looks very appealing to me

hello ProveMeWrong.
welcome.
perhaps the Lord will open your eyes to the fact that Jesus Christ is indeed God (theos).

 

[zone]

I think if you "think" you need to define Jesus as God for your theology to stick, then you rewrite the words God chose to present to the people. That's not eating meat, that's poisoning the meat.

Trinity has NO PLACE in a conversation about God. It's not edifying, it ONLY creates dissension, it's NOT an issue to salvation. IT"S NOT something the early church taught. It's a deduction, and therefore subject to error. It's a populist opinion. The only thing relevant is knowing Jesus came and paid your debt, so you could go to God and be made whole again.

Knowledge creates egos, not faith.

Scripture says as much.

According to Paul this whole thread, which is a KNOWN DIVISION is a conversation of the flesh, not led by the Spirit. So for ANY SIDE in this chat, to take some stand of being RIGHT is just foolish. I mean the word literally, not pejoratively.

but you just took a rock-hard stand - you said "Trinity has NO PLACE in a conversation about God."
and you think discussion of the GodHead using scripture is a known division?
you're right, it is - sad, but true.
anyways, i'm starting a thread on Arianism.
since the Trinity will be discussed there, should i assume you won't be taking part?

it's an extremely serious matter.
let's treat it accordingly.

 

[phil36]

I watched you and silas go back and forth for days, and viewed it as a debate between two men, and if it gets a little heated, then so be it. You both entered into the debate, and I take my hat off the you both for being so very tenacious and passionate in your exchanges, But when I saw several people attacking one man, any man at the same time, I felt the need to speak out... I apoligies for my manner, but I really felt it was getting ugly. If you people call it tough love, who am I to say different, but from where I was sitting at that time and space, it just looked like a town lynching...Thats just me. Im new here, and maybe out of line, but I believe from the bottom of my heart, and the glasses The Lord gave me to see through that discernment breeds a good teacher, and discourse in the byproduct of inner discourse, that dosent lead to anything but more of the same. And unfortunately I displayed that here tonight. I have a real problem witnessing a pile up...Im still a work in progress...Peace Brother.

Hi godslyric,

The one man, I assume you refer to silas? Personally he wasn't piled up on. Infact if you go back to the beginning of the thread you will se he started his antics. And don't forget he had his followers, he had those willing to bedfellow with him..an I right? I think in all honesty you need to focus your glasses in scriptur, that will give you discernment..

But as I say it amazes me those who are willing to bedfellow with any belief oh and they call it love!

 

[Hoffco]

Most Christians are not trained to be in a discussion of this kind. If we could just present the biblical proofs supporting the trinity and not get drawn into heated dialog. I think we need to keep adding to our explanation of the keep passages. The "oneness" have no sound arguments for their position. If they are united Pentecostal, we know they are into Demonology. The tongues movement is controlled by Satan. They have no order in their churches, they go crazy. Others are into witchcraft, talking to the dead. Any one who believes in reincarnation and new revelation from spirits, are not a serious Bible students. Please listen to their faulty reasoning on the key passages they use, just kindly point out their bad reasoning, of not being a good reader, of English. It is good when we point out Biblical meaning for words, but that does not work with badly grounded ,seasoned Christians, because their are hooked on faulty systems of theology. I have presented a pure doctrine of salvation but it is not accepted by those who are deceived by key leaders in the Church who teach a lie of "faith only" and no real repentance, and obedience to Jesus for salvation ; Others had taught the same trues that I teach and have been shot down with "faith only" garbage, heresy. We who are teaching the whole truth of Salvation by Repentance, trust in Jesus and obedience to Jesus, have to just hang in there and be patience, we know God will speak the truth to those whom He wants to. God will save all those whom He has chosen in love to save. Love to all, Hoffco

 

[Quickfire]

Hi godslyric,

The one man, I assume you refer to silas? Personally he wasn't piled up on. Infact if you go back to the beginning of the thread you will se he started his antics. And don't forget he had his followers, he had those willing to bedfellow with him..an I right? I think in all honesty you need to focus your glasses in scriptur, that will give you discernment..

But as I say it amazes me those who are willing to bedfellow with any belief oh and they call it love!

thats just been your typical mentality hasn't it. From my personal stance you love debate, would you give my less well endowed mind some creditability and at least admit this fact, he has left your still out to nail his coffin tight, in fact i would go on tosay your jumping on his grave, a lass poor sila42 may you rest in peace, there i said it for you and may you eat my words,

now your your throwing personal insults again, your saying other people here are bed fellowed with him, you even acused of worshiping a false god, and you still have not shown where i have.
And i know if i where to get into a full blown debate with you about this you would not admit you have falsely accused me in the first place until either the thread gets closed or someone get banned,
Go on admit it you love debate, here here order order order,

 

[Hoffco]

Sorry ,wrong word,"keep" should be "key passages" , Like Jh.1:14 14,18 please keep reading them over and over,then relate them to other key passages. AND, Jh,5:21-30 we must honor the Son as we honor the Father, Jesus is not crazy, He is talking of His Father , any one who denys this is not at the third grade level of reading English, so , don't argue with them ,pray for them. AND, Jh.8:18-59 Jesus claims to be the "I AM" of the OLD T.. what could be clearer? OH AND THEIR FAVORITE PASSAGE, JH,17:21-23 How is Jesus one with the Father They are two Spirit persons, spirit can be "IN" other beings, demons can be in humans, spirits live in the same spirit world, which we can not see. The Father is in the Son and the Son is in the Father, HOW? by their spirits,not their persons. NOW two spirit can not be one spirit, How are two spirits one, or HOW can two persons be one? ONLY in PURPOSE ,NOT IN SPIRIT or PERSON. The uniqueness of the three spirits and three persons of GOD, is they share one essence ,GOD. Jesus is in us, christians, His spirit as God is in us, not the person of Jesus' body. Jesus spiritual body can only be in one spot, Heaven. Jesus doesn't live His life out in us, only as God can Jesus live in us. So Jesus is praying that His disciples be one in love, in purpose, not in our persons, Jesus is not the same person as the Father. Nor is He the same person as any other spirit person ,like satan. what I am saying, there is a large spirit world out there and God is not all that is there, all is not God. That would be pantheism. God, F. S. and H.S. created it all. There is a Hebrew word that is key to the trinity teaching of the Bible. In Duet. 6:4 "... the LORD is one!" The word "one" is ACHAD, which mean, "one in plurality" a group of persons who are in one accord, purpose, are said to be ACHAD "one". GOD, LORD, is one with plurality, of persons. Hebrew word ASHITD, is "one as opposed to two ,three,,etc. numbers. I may have the spelling, I can be corrected or affirmed by one who knows more Hebrew than I. Love and patience to all, Hoffco

 

[Quickfire]

Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne; and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth." Revelation 1:4, 5

 

[Godslyric]

you're comparing hard core prison to an internet discussion with someone who is not new here, nor to his beliefs - but has already been here under another name and stirred up contention on every thread continually?

and that guy is Mr. Innocent?
no, Arianism (that Jesus is a created entity) was declared heresy a long time ago, and it's still heresy.
people were patient with him for weeks the last time - and he just carried on with his mission....nothing anyone said made a dent.

heresy and challenging trinitarians.
seems to me if someone has a personal belief that Jesus was created, and they've already been removed from a community for promoting the idea, it wouldn't make a lot of sense to come back with the same agenda....would it?
but anyways....how come you don't recognize that Phil's deep concern is for the fella's spiritual well-being?

In reference to Phil...I have absolutely no problem with Phils position, at all, or with the way he went about his debate...None what so ever...what I have a problem with is any man being piled up on and beaten down by a group, weather it be a physical, mental or spiritual, a beat down, is a beat down, and it always emanates from the same source. After you have seen enough of it you come to realize satan is at work whenever men go about seeking to assault other men in packs, over anything, again, weather mental phy, or Spiritual...Christ has a path for everyone to walk down, and everyone is on a different part of his or her path... if a man stirs up some controversy, handle it with care that others can see as the byproduct of being in Christ. What I saw was just more of the world at work in here yesterday...and it made my stomach crawl to witness it in the name of Christ...Unfortunately I fell pray to it also in my response to it... Christ dosent need us to defend His position, and I would think He also wouldn't want to see His kids using His name to inflict discourse in any manner, even out here where the world can see that kind of behavior emanating from Christians, not good...Again my problem wasent about Phil or Sials agreeing to debate...My problem is any man being attacked by many...For me its just plain ugly...I apologies for allowing all this to prompt me to behave in an aggressive manner...I will do my best to refrain from it happening again...Peace

 

[Quickfire]

In reference to Phil...I have absolutely no problem with Phils position, at all, or with the way he went about his debate...None what so ever...what I have a problem with is any man being piled up on and beaten down by a group, weather it be a physical, mental or spiritual, a beat down, is a beat down, and it always emanates from the same source. After you have seen enough of it you come to realize satan is at work whenever men go about seeking to assault other men in packs, over anything, again, weather mental phy, or Spiritual...Christ has a path for everyone to walk down, and everyone is on a different part of his or her path... if a man stirs up some controversy, handle it with care that others can see as the byproduct of being in Christ. What I saw was just more of the world at work in here yesterday...and it made my stomach crawl to witness it in the name of Christ...Unfortunately I fell pray to it also in my response to it... Christ dosent need us to defend His position, and I would think He also wouldn't want to see His kids using His name to inflict discourse in any manner, even out here where the world can see that kind of behavior emanating from Christians, not good...Again my problem wasent about Phil or Sials agreeing to debate...My problem is any man being attacked by many...For me its just plain ugly...I apologies for allowing all this to prompt me to behave in an aggressive manner...I will do my best to refrain from it happening again...Peace

I suppose then there is no problem in him accusing me of worshiping a false god then either. and not showing me where i have, ?