Culture Changes & the Church

[Grace-Like-Rain]

Threads on modesty have really made me start thinking on how our culture changes over the years, and how we as Christians should deal with it. A hundred years ago, it was considered scandalous for women to wear pants at all. Obviously now most people think nothing of it. Clothing changes, the definition of what is modest changes. Even our language... words that were taboo when I was a kid are now seemingly no big deal even for the most devout. Obviously we have to change along with the culture, but knowing how much or how quickly can be tricky.

Thoughts?

 

[Pipp]

It almost seems like we become desensitized to some things and they become as normal or at least less looked down on. This world is all about tolerance. I still get looked at like I'm from another planet when I'm grocery shopping in a skirt or doing yard work in a skirt or whatever else it is I'm doing in a skirt (which is everything.. lol ) . Its funny how the "tolerate" crowd are only tolerate of what they want. Oh well.... Romans 12:2 -[SUP] [/SUP]And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. Just my thoughts.

 

[CatHerder]

I get looked at funny when I wear a skirt too, but I'm a dude, so....

 

[kayem77]

Sometimes I wonder how much I would change if I moved to different countries, something which I've already done since I was born in Mexico...but at least clothing-wise there was no much difference. But let's say I moved to a place where all women wear head coverings. I wouldn't want to be the one to cause someone to stumble or be the cause of criticism of the church. I would wear a head covering if it was necessary.

I think that we can (and should,imo) adapt to the culture around us as much as it is allowable under Christian standards, because being completely and purposelly different just for the sake of being different, will make us unreachable to others. As long as we are not disobedient to God or become a stumbling block to someone else, we have liberty to adapt to different cultures. I think this is what Paul meant in ''to the Jews I became like a Jew''. I also wanna add that it doesn't mean that you have to forget who you are or your roots, just an open mind to compromise when possible. That's my two cents.

 

[Misty77]

The message of God's truth should never be changed, but the delivery is quite flexible. For people who only know one language or have only experienced their own culture, it's hard to tell the difference between actual sin and social no-nos. just proceed with grace and arm yourself with truth.

But keep in mind that the original Hebrew and Greek of the Bible has been sanitized for English ears. Paul literally says "hell, no!" in Romans 6:2. And don't even get me started on the Song of Solomon. Jesus was quite scandalous in allowing women to travel with him and even teaching them on occasion. Just because it offends your refined sensibilities doesn't mean that it's wrong. And just because we are free in Christ doesn't mean we should be careless in how we live out that freedom.

 

[Pipp]

I get looked at funny when I wear a skirt too, but I'm a dude, so....

I'm pretty sure I'm one of the ones who would be looking at you funny. I've already seen one young "man" wearing a skirt at Walmart...... it's just so wrong....

 

[Shouryu]

I get looked at funny when I wear a skirt too, but I'm a dude, so....

That's called a kilt, man.

I keep trying to work up the courage to rock a kilt. It would be made even more absurd by the fact that I'm Asian, rather than Scottish...but it would definitely be a conversation piece, no?

 

[Nautilus]

[video=youtube;4h3ewZxrqU4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h3ewZxrqU4[/video]

 

[Ugly]

That's called a kilt, man.

I keep trying to work up the courage to rock a kilt. It would be made even more absurd by the fact that I'm Asian, rather than Scottish...but it would definitely be a conversation piece, no?

Sometimes a skirt is just a skirt....

 

[Ugly]

Do people really look at a woman strangely for wearing a skirt while grocery shopping? I've never heard of that. Perhaps it's not the skirt causing people to look at you weird. Or perhaps its your imagination.

 

[KJV15John11]

There are things, that I have to admit, that can distract me. What I started to notice is that I had the choice to either allow it to affect me, or to turn away and refocus on what was important. It definitely is a balancing act. We shouldn't judge others for their choices but we need to take opportunities to teach our youth about what is appropriate and what is not. For me, I try to be mindful of my choices so as not to offend because it is more important for me to have the opportunity to share God with someone who is open to me, rather than express my individuality. If though, I sense that someone is making a point to be easily offended, I am usually naughty and really give them something to be offended at. Not mature, I know, but sometimes, it just calls for it.

 

[RaneyMarie]

Yes we do have freedoms in Christ, "All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient..." 1 Corinthians 6:12 KJV

I will also add although things change with cultures and time, the Word of God does not change, God is the same yesterday as He is today. So when it comes to language, bad language you know what words and usages should and should not be said as a Christian, we all have a conscious. When it comes to clothing we are to be modest, not by the worlds definition of modest, but by God's, which again we have that conscious and we know what is and is not modest for both men and women. And if there be any questions on to what that modesty, language, or behavior should be or look like, we have the Word of God to turn to and of course prayer, truly it is good to seek out the Lord for His advice on matters.

Now with that said keep in mind that we are also not to judge others, lest we ourselves be judged (Matthew 7:1-5 KJV).

We need to be longsuffering to others, that is show them patience, for we all have things we are working on in God. It is better to edify and lift each other up, be examples for each other and when we bring the word of God we do so in meekness, being humble. Strive daily to put on the fruits of the Spirit. (Ephesians 4:7, Galatians 6:1, 2 Timothy 2:25, Philippians 2:15 KJV)

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." Galatians 5:22-23 KJV

"Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men." 1 Thessalonians 5:14-15 KJV

 

[seoulsearch]

I get looked at funny when I wear a skirt too, but I'm a dude, so....

Sometimes a skirt is just a skirt....

When the said article of clothing flounces out like a balloon and has poodles on it... yes. That would be definitely be a skirt.

The only difference is, Catherder's has kittens on it instead of the poodles...

(Great thread... very interesting perspectives from people who actually live in different cultures... awesome!!)

 

[MissCris]

I think we should draw the line at hugely pregnant 15 year olds wearing tube tops that expose their "baby bump" and use the term "baby daddy".

 

[rachelsedge]

Sometimes I wonder how much I would change if I moved to different countries, something which I've already done since I was born in Mexico...but at least clothing-wise there was no much difference. But let's say I moved to a place where all women wear head coverings. I wouldn't want to be the one to cause someone to stumble or be the cause of criticism of the church. I would wear a head covering if it was necessary.

I totally agree with your whole post, kayem77, but this part made me wonder: What if the clothing was different culture wise somewhere, but in a lesser? For example, in some places in Africa, women walk around topless and it's no big deal because breasts aren't as sexualized there as they are here. I don't think it's sinful that they do that, either. What then? Just wondering out loud. I'm not talking about wearing less clothing in other cultures just because that's the "norm", because in America, that IS the norm but it's in a trying-to-be-sexy-to-people-besides-their-spouse way and that IS sinful.

I don't know if any of that made sense. Basically, what if the culture requires clothing (or lack thereof) that makes you feel less modest and uncomfortable? Do you (general you) conform, or just stick to most of your own rules of modesty?

I've not done research on this at all, so perhaps for foreigners to do that among tribes is considered offensive and they'd rather you just keep your clothes on, but it just makes me curious.

GLR, I do have an answer to your original question, that will come later. Hope I'm not derailing.

 

[MissCris]

Rachel- those would be really good questions for missionaries who have been to those countries I would think that in cases where a culture is less dressed than we are used to, a person would just wear their normal clothing and cover all the parts they're used to covering. It may draw attention and questions from the people who are mostly nekked, but I can't see how it would offend them.

 

[ServantStrike]

I think styles of dress have changed, but dressing conservatively is still dressing conservatively whether it's pants or a skirt.


And, I also want to rock a kilt some time.


Let's just all just agree that people shouldn't be saying this about the way other's dress.

[video=youtube;y5p4WCSyhnc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5p4WCSyhnc[/video]

 

[Ugly]

I totally agree with your whole post, kayem77, but this part made me wonder: What if the clothing was different culture wise somewhere, but in a lesser? For example, in some places in Africa, women walk around topless and it's no big deal because breasts aren't as sexualized there as they are here. I don't think it's sinful that they do that, either. What then? Just wondering out loud. I'm not talking about wearing less clothing in other cultures just because that's the "norm", because in America, that IS the norm but it's in a trying-to-be-sexy-to-people-besides-their-spouse way and that IS sinful.

I don't know if any of that made sense. Basically, what if the culture requires clothing (or lack thereof) that makes you feel less modest and uncomfortable? Do you (general you) conform, or just stick to most of your own rules of modesty?

I've not done research on this at all, so perhaps for foreigners to do that among tribes is considered offensive and they'd rather you just keep your clothes on, but it just makes me curious.

GLR, I do have an answer to your original question, that will come later. Hope I'm not derailing.

I think part of the issue of things being 'sexualized' in America has more to do with a culture founded on religious teachings. Teachings that use modesty, from a biblical standard. Adam and Eve, when they became aware, recognized their nakedness and were ashamed and hid. The cultures you're talking about are Godless pagan cultures whose 'gods' are not God, and therefore do not feel a need to conform to a God standard. So to say that a culture accepts something doesn't make it right. I still would think it's wrong for them to do, even if they are unable to recognize it themselves.

Personally i would not dress in a way that i felt was too 'showy' or whatever. I'm not going to visit tribes in Africa and wear a loin clothe and a butt flosser. And my cousin, who spent years in African villages helping build, etc.. was not expected to 'dress down. Considering that most of these village cultures simply do not have the means to mass produce clothing, i would think part of the culture of nakedness has to do with a lack of supplies. So they learn to accept doing with less. Therefore it is not an issue if you choose to wear more.

 

[rachelsedge]

Good point, Ugly. I don't mean to play devil's advocate here or ask useless questions, but do we really know what they covered up in the garden? For all we know, they only covered their lower regions (as that seems to be a universally covered area, no matter where you go) and over time, the top covering for the female was added. Who knows, and because no one knows, I suppose it's a pointless thing to ask, but like I said...I'm a curious person.

 

[Grace-Like-Rain]

Good point, Ugly. I don't mean to play devil's advocate here or ask useless questions, but do we really know what they covered up in the garden? For all we know, they only covered their lower regions (as that seems to be a universally covered area, no matter where you go) and over time, the top covering for the female was added. Who knows, and because no one knows, I suppose it's a pointless thing to ask, but like I said...I'm a curious person.

That's a really good question.