A "Nice Guys Finish Last" Thread

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Ugly

Guest
First things first, why are you folks being mean to Art05?
@Page 1

lol
@Liamson
In short, humble men get the cake!
@Fenner
Ugh.. You wouldn't want me for a husband. I didn't know that some girls are actually annoyed at boys holding open doors for them. I'm just trying to be nice whenever I do that...
Ahh.. you were just joking, the 2nd part of your post made it obvious. xDD
@Praus
Heh...heh...
@Page 2
@Grace-Like-rain
I agree! I wouldn't want to be the best in the group. I wouln't learn anything, instead I'll have to teach everyone else.
@Art05
Why doesn't Liamson's
contrast of a gentleman and a nice guy work?
@Tintin
I agree!

Hahahahahahahahaha!

You know what? This thread is pointless, so I'm not going to read through all of it. I'll just end my reply post here. God bless you, ladies and gentleman.

Because you are coming in late? This user continues making posts full of whining and complaining. And everyone who tries to help him he attacks and picks every part of their answer apart and finds fault and excuses in everything.

This thread is pointless, but here you are reading and responding to it. So what does that say?

And yeah, the multicolored font thing only serves to make your comments harder to read and is somewhat annoying.
 
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Art05

Guest
Per request of Art05, none of my answers contain an opinion.

Are nice guys finishing last in the Christian culture?

No.

Should they be finishing last with Christian women?

I don't even know what this means.

Why don't Christian women like nice guys?

They do.

If Christian women are not interested in nice guys, but their opposites, then who is to blame: the guys or the girls?

Both.

Are we "nice guys" because we are devoted to Jesus, and not in pleasing the feminine lusts of the flesh?

No.

See how much "fun" a "discussion" is when opinions (or perspectives) aren't allowed?
This is another misunderstanding of what I said. When I said, Please don't make them into opinions, I said that because a certain person misconstrued my questions (or one of them) by turning them into opinions, when their intention was neutral, much like a questionnaire; please see the second, third, or fourth comments on this thread for verification.

Your terseness is appreciated regardless.

"Should they be finishing last with Christian women? I don't even know what this means." ~ What is it that you don't understand? Should Christian "nice guys" be finishing last with Christian women?

Considering your misinterpretation, I guess you are now free to provide any input you may have. If you choose to remain so laconic, however, that is also acceptable :)

Thanks!
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
Im a nice guy and I don't like mean women how they hurt me..

Then find you a sweetheart that is super good to everyone around them. They exist.....pray about it and start looking.
 
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Art05

Guest
Okay, dear brother. Since it seems to matter so much to you as to why it seems that Christian women are not into so-called "nice guys", here's me, sharing a woman's perspective. I hope my sharing helps.

But first off, my definition of a "nice guy" is a genuinely nice guy. Not the kind who just seems nice, but who is really nice because he believes it's the right way to be. Not just because he was raised to think he should be nice, but because he understands that being nice means being pleasing before our LORD's eyes, and honoring to HIS sight in the presence of others surrounding him, regardless of what other people think his motives or intentions are. So, my view of a nice guy is actually a good guy :) Papa GOD's holy and righteous man, closely acquainted and loving HIS Holy Word and ways.

Now, with regards to women not going for this definition of a nice guy/good guy/holy man...

Even though we are Christians, we are still individuals. People, with varying interests and standards. We have a certain set of qualities/qualifications that we would like to see or discover about someone before we say we "like" this person, and eventually fall in love with them. Personally, i lifted up my "wish list" to Papa GOD in prayer. In my case, i know and am quite honest before HIM about all the things that i'd like/love to have my future spouse to have :) personality, quirks, physical characteristics, etc. But of course, i'm very open to HIS leading regarding all these things. HE may or may not grant my wish list to the letter, but i'm sure HE will truly surprise me and leave me breathlessly joyful and in awe of HIS creation of my special holy man when we finally meet :eek:

Back to the original question: Why don't Christian women like nice guys?

It's not that Christian women don't like nice guys. Everyone :) likes nice guys. Who doesn't want to be treated nicely? Even bad people like nice guys, because they could take advantage of them more than others. Nice guys/good guys/holy men are an awesome blessing to everyone!!! :)

But sadly, in romance, it's not enough that you're a Christian guy for any Christian girl to just want to marry you. But it IS, and should be the number one qualifier. It's a HUGE mistake for any Christian to go for a non-Christian as a future partner, because it never goes well during the course of the relationship. Expect your relationship with our LORD to suffer if you choose this path (i know, 'coz i've been there). When the LORD says "don't be unequally yoked with unbelievers", HE's saying this for our own good and ultimate happiness. Also, we should also start thinking along the lines of wanting to honor and glorify HIM by following HIS teachings because we truly love HIM, not just because we want something good for ourselves.

For someone to like you, be into you, and want to marry you, you have to be attractive to that person. And what attracts a person varies individually. Everything must be satisfied: physical qualities, personality, level of maturity, dependability, how that person makes you feel overall, depth of spirituality and passion for GOD, how much that person inspires you, etc. If that person doesn't come out satisfactory to you, you disqualify that person, and just mark him/her as a friend, and so on.

In my personal experience, i was truly oblivious of the beauty of holy men in the past. They are awesome, yes. Admirable, men i look up to and esteem highly. But i felt they were out of my league XD i was just a growing Christian then. I felt so spiritually immature and unacceptable and unattractive to said men (see, we also gauge our attractiveness to our prospects XD of course, we don't want to fall for someone we think we'd just cry over because they won't feel the same way. No one wants to have their heart broken :(). Also, for some reason, i found nice guys somewhat boring. Prudish. Unexciting. Someone i couldn't be able to have fun with and be crazy around. There was this deep fascination for the dark things inside of me in the past. Sadly, it was what i used to gauge a man's attractiveness to me, even as a Christian. In my thinking, nice guys don't know anything other than doing holy things. I completely disregarded the fact that they can be anything more than what i thought they were. So, i disqualified genuinely good men in the past. I went for the guys who had darkness inside of them, who had deep issues. To me, they were mysterious, highly interesting, unpredictably exciting.

By nature, i never like anything easy. The more complicated something is, the more i have a ball with it XD i LOVE challenges (i was addicted to Sudoku, and when i play games, i ALWAYS set the difficulty to Difficult/Suicidal/Legendary XD heck, i'm actually into Dark Souls at present!!! Anyone who has played it knows that that game is so VERY hard XD ). And, i enjoy solving problems, listening to problems, trying to figure things out. I take my time with these things, trying to understand them (yup, i once wanted to become a psychiatrist XD but as crazy as i am, asylum patients really freak me out. Plus, i don't want the idea of being a doctor who no longer goes through a lot of action, just writing on patient records, writing prescriptions, and so on. I want to think on my feet, and i hate routine, so my job has to be unpredictable and toxic ;) so i chose to work at the ER XD).

I carried this over to my relationships, and choice of men. I chose guys with lots of issues, not because i wanted to fix them, but simply because they fascinated and never bore me. Their darkness was like a flame that drew me close...a flame that burnt me countless times, but in my stubbornness and utter insane blindness, i persisted, saying i was enjoying myself. I lived a very sinful life because of this choice...it's something i am not proud of, and truly regret. I forgot my Christianity on purpose, just to satisfy what i thought would make me happy and feel loved. It was my vain pursuit, for years.

When i've finally had my fill of all that, and the darkness was no longer something fascinating, but something that was cold and consuming...a poison that was killing me, spiritually, emotionally, and physically...i finally ran back to GOD in shame and resignation and desperation. I've finally realized that what i wanted wasn't making me happy and alive. I've finally become weak enough to be sobered up, finally ready to listen to HIM.

By HIS grace, HE revived me from my poisoned, dying state, and filled me with HIS Holy Fire, renewing and restoring what years of sinning brought to decay. HE let me here HIS voice loud and clear, reminding me of my calling and purpose for living. Reminding me of who and what i am before HIM. From that point of revival, EVERYTHING changed :) it felt like i was born again, the 3rd time :eek: to this day, i am at awe in what HE did and is doing in my life!!!

My love and fascination for darkness fled me. I no longer want to be associated with anything that puts my relationship with GOD in danger or compromise. I simply don't get anymore what i found attractive about darkness at all XD i've finally come to discover the beauty of holiness and righteousness. Something i never understood in the past, even though i knew i should. Now, i simply love to revel in HIS sweet, holy presence :eek: my heart sings with so much joy, as i know and discover more of HIS wonders, every single day!!!

And yes, now, i've come to find holy men as incredibly attractive :) and i've discovered that they are more special and unique and fun than i realize!!! I am truly blessed by what changes the LORD has done in me internally, coz now i see that everything HE makes holy is absolutely beautiful :eek:

So you see, my conclusion on this? Christians need to have that change in their hearts for them to find nice guys/good guys/holy men as truly attractive or beautiful for them to truly seek after and pray for them :) for one's heart to be changed, Papa GOD's Holy Spirit must truly be the one that reigns and is in full control, free to move about, expose and destroy every darkness in it, replacing it with a heart that loves what is HIS :) all that is pure and holy. It takes one's daily devotion and full submission to HIS will and HIS Word for this to take place.

I hope my rambling here helps XD GOD bless you all, dear brethren!!! :D
Ma'am, if I could kiss your feet, I would! :')

TRULY BORN AGAIN WOMEN WILL GO AFTER THE NICE GUYS! YES! I RECEIVE IT IN JESUS' NAME!
 
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Elisa

Guest
Sometimes Christian women don't like "nice" Christian guys because they can tend to be indecisive, and no one wants an indecisive person by their side.
 
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Art05

Guest
I don't think Jesus was a "Nice guy."

There I said it.
I think Jesus was a super nice Guy. In fact ...

Paul called Him the King of kings and Lord of lords, and I call Him the nicest Guy of all the nice guys! He's our Example!
 
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Art05

Guest
No where near ready to date... But when I do I seek a gentleman who follows the teachings of Christ!
I think that's a nice guy

I don't believe I am alone in this but maybe. I do my best to follow Christ, not what's popular.

Love you all,
lexi
You've got it, young lady ;) God bless you.
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
"Fear is a prime motivator. It tells us that for our actions there is negative consequences that would do us harm. Simply taking the path of least harm, will leave us feeling like nice guys finish last. Because most nice guys are simply trying to lose as little skin as possible." ~ A good observation. But, are not we, as Christians, commanded to fear evil and rashness? Consider the following verse, A prudent man foreseeth the evil, and hideth himself; but the simple pass on, and are punished; have you noticed the word foreseeth? This goes along well with another verse, Happy is the man that feareth alway: but he that hardeneth his heart shall fall into mischief.

Along with this, the young have been told for years (especially the young ladies) to keep their hearts, guard their hearts; is this what you are accusing the nice guy of? Of guarding his heart from potential harm? Shouldn't we all try to lose as little skin as possible? We are like this in all other affairs, and that is wisdom; and why shouldn't be wise in these affairs?

"A nice guy swoops in like a brother to give comfort when the opportunity arises and then tries to twist it around to being the object of a woman's affection. A nice guy is opportunistic. A gentleman is honest and upfront about his intentions and his motivation. He is not going to try and persuade a woman of all the reasons why he is right for her, he is going to show her why he is right for her." ~ At this point, I begin to become confused with your comparison. How is it that the nice guy here suffers from an inferiority complex? Are you condemning the nice guy for being a good brother in Christ, a good friend, and be a comforter in anyone's time of distress? And are you, at the same time, saying that a gentleman is none of this? I'm sorry, but I must disagree.

"He is not going to try and persuade a woman of all the reasons why he is right for her, he is going to show her why he is right for her." ~ And I believe that a nice guy is doing the same, but always seems to get the short end of the stick.

I'm sorry, but your contrast of the gentleman and the nice guy simply doesn't work.


God bless!
It does work, very well....you just aren't grasping the concepts he's presenting. I'm very impressed with the responses he's given you.....they've answered your questions and he's even presented it with an artistic finesse I dare say.

Re-read the part I both emboldened and underlined....he clearly defined the difference. That's a 100% perfect explanation of the difference.
 
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Art05

Guest
Sometimes Christian women don't like "nice" Christian guys because they can tend to be indecisive, and no one wants an indecisive person by their side.
Thank you for your input!
 

rachelsedge

Senior Member
Oct 15, 2012
3,659
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This is another misunderstanding of what I said. When I said, Please don't make them into opinions, I said that because a certain person misconstrued my questions (or one of them) by turning them into opinions, when their intention was neutral, much like a questionnaire; please see the second, third, or fourth comments on this thread for verification.
Ah, I actually kind of see your point now. You're not saying to answer without an opinion, but rather that your questions are not opinions themselves? I did misread that, in that case. By "them" I thought you meant the answers, not the questions.

Understand, though, that when it comes to questions like those, they tend to already have an underlying opinion. For example, "Why do guys only like models?" Obviously they all don't, but the implications behind the question is that they all do. Does that make sense?

What is it that you don't understand? Should Christian "nice guys" be finishing last with Christian women?
I don't understand the question, though I guess you'd have to define what "finishing last" means. If it's marriage, then yes, Christian men should be "finishing last" with Christian women. But if that's not what you mean, then that's why I'm not quite sure.
 
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Art05

Guest
Totally unrelated, but a fantastic, powerful quote by one of my heroes, Oswald Chambers:

"Nothing hoodwinks us more quickly than the idea that we are serving God."


 
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Art05

Guest
Ah, I actually kind of see your point now. You're not saying to answer without an opinion, but rather that your questions are not opinions themselves? I did misread that, in that case. By "them" I thought you meant the answers, not the questions.

Understand, though, that when it comes to questions like those, they tend to already have an underlying opinion. For example, "Why do guys only like models?" Obviously they all don't, but the implications behind the question is that they all do. Does that make sense?



I don't understand the question, though I guess you'd have to define what "finishing last" means. If it's marriage, then yes, Christian men should be "finishing last" with Christian women. But if that's not what you mean, then that's why I'm not quite sure.
Let's just ... leave it as is, hmm? ;)
 
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Art05

Guest
I don't have the intention of letting this go; I plan on putting up more threads on this subject, based on my questions.
 
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Art05

Guest
It does work, very well....you just aren't grasping the concepts he's presenting. I'm very impressed with the responses he's given you.....they've answered your questions and he's even presented it with an artistic finesse I dare say.

Re-read the part I both emboldened and underlined....he clearly defined the difference. That's a 100% perfect explanation of the difference.
I'm sorry, but it doesn't work. Did you even consider what I said to him?

Please, this is not a denunciation of what Liamson is saying; he may have some good points, but, from what I can tell, his contrast isn't very good. Nice guys are gentlemen; the antithesis of the nice guy, the so called 'bad boy' (which I do not refer to, because we are speaking in a Christian sphere of thinking, and there are no Christian bad boys except backsliders) are by definition not gentlemen at all, neither are they interested in being gentlemen.

Plus, as I told Liamson, much of his verbiage in his comment is rather opaque; let's just say, he needs to clean up his shirt, because they have too many purple stains. I'll leave it at that. To be quite honest, I feel that his answer is fallacious.

But oh well.
 

rachelsedge

Senior Member
Oct 15, 2012
3,659
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Art05, can you give us your definition of what a nice guy is? I think that's where some of the confusion is coming from. People have different definitions for it, and if ours aren't matching yours, then it's probably no wonder our answers aren't satisfying to you.
 

alexis

Banned by Admin Team (verified fraud)
Dec 5, 2013
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I don't have the intention of letting this go; I plan on putting up more threads on this subject, based on my questions.
Art,

I completely love you and want to help you in your quest!

Can I ask you a couple question to understand what you are asking better? Not trying to argue or offend I just think this might help.

1. Do you comcider yourself a nice guy?

2. Do you feel Christian women reject you for bad boys or basically not nice guys?

3. Does it appear in life that the jerks get more girlfriends?

I won't judge your answers, others may. I can only control me.
Why I ask these questions is to understand the basis of your question. Also to better gain perspective I don't know many believers among my actual real life friends and in my peer group can only name a couple nice guys. I am not speaking of CC but my actual friends here where I live. Maybe I think nice guys are going to win because I would only when ready and allowed to date a Godly man who is leading in Christ's word. He will be nice, humble, gentle and confident. Protective, strong in faith and kind in the way Christ intended. Yet maybe I am rare though I believe most Christian girls would agree.

Truthfully I will only date if it is God's will. The only relationship I care about is mine with Christ but I also if it His will would someday like a family and a husband to lead our home in God's grace.

Love you,
lexi
 
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ServantStrike

Guest
Brother, I'm not sure you even realize you're doing this, but it's alienating people. Please, just take a step back. I think there is some pain in your life over the fact that your single and it's blinding you to the advice that people are trying to give.

I've been turned down repeatedly in my life. I've seen what I thought were nice women fall for men who I knew were shallow and vain. I've been where you are, but you're coming across as bitter about it, and that will show. Find a way to find peace, and then people will naturally gravitate to you. They will want to see that peace that you have within your heart. And a good woman, a Christian woman, will see that and know that you aren't just putting on a front.

It only takes one.

But please, ratchet it down, can you see where this might look suspect to some people?

I don't have the intention of letting this go; I plan on putting up more threads on this subject, based on my questions.
Oh okay, this guy has an axe to grind.

I'm sorry, but it doesn't work. Did you even consider what I said to him?

Please, this is not a denunciation of what Liamson is saying; he may have some good points, but, from what I can tell, his contrast isn't very good. Nice guys are gentlemen; the antithesis of the nice guy, the so called 'bad boy' (which I do not refer to, because we are speaking in a Christian sphere of thinking, and there are no Christian bad boys except backsliders) are by definition not gentlemen at all, neither are they interested in being gentlemen.
Passive

Plus, as I told Liamson, much of his verbiage in his comment is rather opaque; let's just say, he needs to clean up his shirt, because they have too many purple stains. I'll leave it at that. To be quite honest, I feel that his answer is fallacious.

But oh well.
Aggressive
 
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Art05

Guest
Brother, I'm not sure you even realize you're doing this, but it's alienating people. Please, just take a step back. I think there is some pain in your life over the fact that your single and it's blinding you to the advice that people are trying to give.

I've been turned down repeatedly in my life. I've seen what I thought were nice women fall for men who I knew were shallow and vain. I've been where you are, but you're coming across as bitter about it, and that will show. Find a way to find peace, and then people will naturally gravitate to you. They will want to see that peace that you have within your heart. And a good woman, a Christian woman, will see that and know that you aren't just putting on a front.

It only takes one.

But please, ratchet it down, can you see where this might look suspect to some people?



Oh okay, this guy has an axe to grind.



Passive



Aggressive
Oh my goodness. I refuse to talk to people like you; that, instead of actually having a discussion, you patronize them with your analysis of their intention when they say anything.

Here's a fact: you don't know me at all. As I told another person on this website, it is a very unwise to try and analyze and judge the mind of a person simply from reading their comments and posts; it doesn't work and it doesn't help.

So let's have done with appeals to motive and "Bulverisms" alright? Because I am telling you now, there is none.

Sheesh. smh
 
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ServantStrike

Guest
Oh my goodness. I refuse to talk to people like you; that, instead of actually having a discussion, you patronize them with your analysis of their intention when they say anything.

Here's a fact: you don't know me at all. As I told another person on this website, it is a very unwise to try and analyze and judge the mind of a person simply from reading their comments and posts; it doesn't work and it doesn't help.

So let's have done with appeals to motive and "Bulverisms" alright? Because I am telling you now, there is none.

Sheesh. smh
You know, I'm genuinely trying to help, and here I am being attacked for it.

I wasn't attacking you, your concepts, or your ideas, I was showing you how they could be misconstrued and trying to offer some advice that might get you more of the answers that you seek. In your other thread I told you how I had gone from feeling derided to empowered, and reached out to you and asked if you'd let me share that.

I am not your enemy here. I'm sorry you feel that way about me. I do not like to let the sun go down in anger, but it appears that is what you seem to feel towards me. This saddens me, as I do strive to please others.