-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
J
I love Catherder's answer.
Praying for God's guidance and wisdom for you as to how to approach the matter. Praying also for God to begin moving in your home and in the heart of the abuser. Praying for God to give you the words to present to the abuser and at the appropriate time.
CHRISTIAN counseling is always good. I would do some research though. You are going to need more than "Well, you just have to pray and work it out no matter what" to get through this, huh?
If you have to remove yourself from the abusive situation, protecting yourself emotionally and/or physically is healthy and is quite different from divorcing.
Your children are young. Perhaps God is showing you all of this now so that you will not only be protecting yourself, but your children as well. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that people who abuse spouses have no issues with abusing their children eventually as well.
Who knows? Confronting this situation could be the best thing that ever happened to your marriage.
ROMANS 8:28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.
Praying for God's guidance and wisdom for you as to how to approach the matter. Praying also for God to begin moving in your home and in the heart of the abuser. Praying for God to give you the words to present to the abuser and at the appropriate time.
CHRISTIAN counseling is always good. I would do some research though. You are going to need more than "Well, you just have to pray and work it out no matter what" to get through this, huh?
If you have to remove yourself from the abusive situation, protecting yourself emotionally and/or physically is healthy and is quite different from divorcing.
Your children are young. Perhaps God is showing you all of this now so that you will not only be protecting yourself, but your children as well. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that people who abuse spouses have no issues with abusing their children eventually as well.
Who knows? Confronting this situation could be the best thing that ever happened to your marriage.
ROMANS 8:28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.
Leave. Leave now.
That doesn't mean that you are definitely divorcing, but you need to get somewhere safe. Then you need to get some really good counseling from a licensed therapist. I cannot stress to you enough that a pastor (especially of a conservative denomination) is not likely to be your best help right now. The numbers for domestic abuse are higher in conservative denominations that with nonreligious people because of the over-emphasis of submission. And I know too many women who have reached out to their pastoral staff for help just to have (in her words) "Jesus shoved down my throat." In dangerous situations, being told to just trust God and submit is the worst advice you can get. I really encourage you to get out as soon as possible.
The sad truth is that if you don't have a bruise, then the abuse is probably not going to be believed to be as bad as it is, if it is even believed at all. I've had physical abuse survivors tell me that their bodies healed a lot faster than their psyche. Since you have been manipulated for so long, your perspective is probably so skewed that you can't even see how bad the situation is until you extract yourself from it. PTSD is also quite common in mental/emotional/verbal/sexual abuse cases. That means that your brain is not able to fully process what you have endured until it recognizes that you are in a safe place. That's when the flashbacks or that dawning of realization starts to hit you. You need normalcy to contrast with the abuse that you have faced.
I wish I would have been strong enough to have left the monster that I married. My parents and I talked a lot about it this weekend; and I had to ask my mom to stop describing the individual abusive acts that she witnessed (and I can't let myself remember) because they are too ugly, too painful still to see. But when X left me 4.5 years ago, I would not have even described myself as being abused.
No, he did not hit me. The damage was far more precise, almost tactical. The more I heal, the more I realize what a terrible place we we were in. And the more I realize the hell we put my son through. Please, please don't stay another day. You can always go back if you indeed made a mistake or if you both get help. But it's likely to only get worse if you stay.
Yes, God hates divorce. But don't you think you are more precious to Him than that? Your leaving is to save your health, your sanity, and maybe even your life; it's not breaking the marriage covenant. Your spouse already abandoned his vow to love, honor, and cherish you. God hates divorce, but that is only the conclusion of a journey. It's the result of an unhealthy marriage, which is caused by one or both members not walking in His truth by His grace.
You are God's daughter. And nobody gets to treat you like crap. Find a friend, a relative, or a woman's shelter. Or somehow get to Dallas, and you can stay with me (not kidding; I've done this before). You are not really stuck, even though your abuser has built an invisible cage around you. The door is unlocked, if you choose to go through it. You are free to leave and get help. I pray the situation can be fixed, but realize that "fixed" might not be what you think it should be.
That doesn't mean that you are definitely divorcing, but you need to get somewhere safe. Then you need to get some really good counseling from a licensed therapist. I cannot stress to you enough that a pastor (especially of a conservative denomination) is not likely to be your best help right now. The numbers for domestic abuse are higher in conservative denominations that with nonreligious people because of the over-emphasis of submission. And I know too many women who have reached out to their pastoral staff for help just to have (in her words) "Jesus shoved down my throat." In dangerous situations, being told to just trust God and submit is the worst advice you can get. I really encourage you to get out as soon as possible.
The sad truth is that if you don't have a bruise, then the abuse is probably not going to be believed to be as bad as it is, if it is even believed at all. I've had physical abuse survivors tell me that their bodies healed a lot faster than their psyche. Since you have been manipulated for so long, your perspective is probably so skewed that you can't even see how bad the situation is until you extract yourself from it. PTSD is also quite common in mental/emotional/verbal/sexual abuse cases. That means that your brain is not able to fully process what you have endured until it recognizes that you are in a safe place. That's when the flashbacks or that dawning of realization starts to hit you. You need normalcy to contrast with the abuse that you have faced.
I wish I would have been strong enough to have left the monster that I married. My parents and I talked a lot about it this weekend; and I had to ask my mom to stop describing the individual abusive acts that she witnessed (and I can't let myself remember) because they are too ugly, too painful still to see. But when X left me 4.5 years ago, I would not have even described myself as being abused.
No, he did not hit me. The damage was far more precise, almost tactical. The more I heal, the more I realize what a terrible place we we were in. And the more I realize the hell we put my son through. Please, please don't stay another day. You can always go back if you indeed made a mistake or if you both get help. But it's likely to only get worse if you stay.
Yes, God hates divorce. But don't you think you are more precious to Him than that? Your leaving is to save your health, your sanity, and maybe even your life; it's not breaking the marriage covenant. Your spouse already abandoned his vow to love, honor, and cherish you. God hates divorce, but that is only the conclusion of a journey. It's the result of an unhealthy marriage, which is caused by one or both members not walking in His truth by His grace.
You are God's daughter. And nobody gets to treat you like crap. Find a friend, a relative, or a woman's shelter. Or somehow get to Dallas, and you can stay with me (not kidding; I've done this before). You are not really stuck, even though your abuser has built an invisible cage around you. The door is unlocked, if you choose to go through it. You are free to leave and get help. I pray the situation can be fixed, but realize that "fixed" might not be what you think it should be.
G
You, at least, got the 100% number right, and, I hope this speaks in love, wisebeardedone 
100% of the time that a person who is an abuser gives that abuse to Christ, just like gives their smokes, their crack, their meth, their PCP, their porn addiction, God REMOVES it ! Gone, in His 'due time,' God does things, per Scripture, but, He will NOT allow that person to go on abusing IF they TURN to Him. Period, end of story, but, I got more to say and I pray you let these words both sink in and filtered by His Loving embrace that goes through your heart, which His Holy Spirit is in, and, also, did you know, you have 'the mind of Christ.'
The Lord leads......"Dear Lord....Amen"
Now, if that person who is with an addiction, like of the ones said above, just a short list there, but, if that person does not turn things over to God as He leads them to go to, like maxmilliansmart said, 'marriage counseling,' or, doesn't got to AA if drinking's the addiction, then, there's ZERO PERCENT hope that the marriage will work.
The willingness to surrender all is the key, and, Hisservantstriker said things very well, too, as IF Christ was not in the believer's life, if they were not doing things to change, like in AA, like attending church, like seeing the pastor, then, there's a serious problem WITH THAT BELIEVER's walk.
But, to put someone in a box and just say, 5% will turn around. No, that's NOT the Christian response, brothers and sisters, is it ?
So, and, am I trying make people feel like what they said is shaming or blaming?No, like I said, at the beginning of the post, I speak in love and it's His love in me that I speak to you, I hope and pray, the Lord leads, let His Spirit lead you, for in His power is so great a grace, so great an understanding, so great a mercy, so great a way to get the abuser to change. 100% change . And, if you go around with a 5% attitude, guess what! That person who's abused someone, in your mind, will never have a chance to change
YOU don't change them remember, you don't think of changing them, you don't pre-determine changing them, YOU let God change them and you be supportive of them changing, and, praying for them, that they can change, because they surely can CHANGE because ALL things are POSSIBLE with Christ
Sorry, if I cap things for emphasis too much for some of ya, but, it's important for you to socially understand that your feelings on this subject are, indeed, your feelings, let's not knock them, they are true, they are yours, but, you also are a Christian and you are to love EVERYONE, your 'neighbor' is everyone. It's not just your good neighbor or your bad neighbor, it's ALL your neighbors.
LOVE your neighbor, an abuser is your neighbor, too, Webster's classifies a 'neighbor' as a 'fellow human.' So, that abuser NEEDS your support to change. YOU LET God condemn them, don't you DARE do that
Don't let psychology of man write that neighbor off, so they say they have a 5% chance of changing, it is absolutely a 100% chance of changing IF they have Christ in their life and are seeking Him !
100% of the time that a person who is an abuser gives that abuse to Christ, just like gives their smokes, their crack, their meth, their PCP, their porn addiction, God REMOVES it ! Gone, in His 'due time,' God does things, per Scripture, but, He will NOT allow that person to go on abusing IF they TURN to Him. Period, end of story, but, I got more to say and I pray you let these words both sink in and filtered by His Loving embrace that goes through your heart, which His Holy Spirit is in, and, also, did you know, you have 'the mind of Christ.'
The Lord leads......"Dear Lord....Amen"
Now, if that person who is with an addiction, like of the ones said above, just a short list there, but, if that person does not turn things over to God as He leads them to go to, like maxmilliansmart said, 'marriage counseling,' or, doesn't got to AA if drinking's the addiction, then, there's ZERO PERCENT hope that the marriage will work.
The willingness to surrender all is the key, and, Hisservantstriker said things very well, too, as IF Christ was not in the believer's life, if they were not doing things to change, like in AA, like attending church, like seeing the pastor, then, there's a serious problem WITH THAT BELIEVER's walk.
But, to put someone in a box and just say, 5% will turn around. No, that's NOT the Christian response, brothers and sisters, is it ?
So, and, am I trying make people feel like what they said is shaming or blaming?No, like I said, at the beginning of the post, I speak in love and it's His love in me that I speak to you, I hope and pray, the Lord leads, let His Spirit lead you, for in His power is so great a grace, so great an understanding, so great a mercy, so great a way to get the abuser to change. 100% change . And, if you go around with a 5% attitude, guess what! That person who's abused someone, in your mind, will never have a chance to change
YOU don't change them remember, you don't think of changing them, you don't pre-determine changing them, YOU let God change them and you be supportive of them changing, and, praying for them, that they can change, because they surely can CHANGE because ALL things are POSSIBLE with Christ
Sorry, if I cap things for emphasis too much for some of ya, but, it's important for you to socially understand that your feelings on this subject are, indeed, your feelings, let's not knock them, they are true, they are yours, but, you also are a Christian and you are to love EVERYONE, your 'neighbor' is everyone. It's not just your good neighbor or your bad neighbor, it's ALL your neighbors.
LOVE your neighbor, an abuser is your neighbor, too, Webster's classifies a 'neighbor' as a 'fellow human.' So, that abuser NEEDS your support to change. YOU LET God condemn them, don't you DARE do that
Don't let psychology of man write that neighbor off, so they say they have a 5% chance of changing, it is absolutely a 100% chance of changing IF they have Christ in their life and are seeking Him !
Last edited by a moderator:
G
And, with all I said to give your spouse a 100% chance to change, through Christ working on him, or her (Yeah, women can be the abuser too in a marriage/relationship), and, yes, maybe, Christ working through you.
There's a reason for the person turning to abuse, not saying you are at fault, I'm just saying to be open to change as the Lord may lead you to change some behavior that could be triggering things from your spouse. That's where professional CHRISTIAN MARRIAGE COUNSELING comes in, likely, for both of you. And, if the person abusing won't go to counseling, then, find out WHY ?
Make them talk to your pastor and get you answer that way, or, some way. YOU need to know why. YOU deserve to know why they won't go. But, there are only TWO things that we can divorce over, adultery and death of a spouse, per Scripture. So, and ,yes, those who've already divorced/seperated, it's NOT a salvation issue that I'm speaking of, I would never condemn of that, as we ALL have our different sins. Just do. So, quit judging others in that way, that's God's territory, 100%, completely, His' s
So, hopefully, that all helps, and, as julieannie said, we need to be praying for that person and that Christ can do things and we are to be supportive as we can be of their going through things that God is doing to change them away from their abusing ways. Again, God CAN 100% change them of their abuse, that's not our decision to say that only 5% change. Sorry, folks, it's NOT. Never will be either. Not for the Christian, just not our choice, not our control to manipulate people's thinking in that way, don't do it. Let the Lord do things, through the counseling, through the pastor, through the church members, through YOU, in how you treat them fairly, NO DIFFERENT, as the Lord will lead you to do, I absolutely GUARANTEE it, IF that person is trying to change with Christ their 'catalyst,' as ServantStrike said so well .
YOU be on the person abusing's side, in their corner, their BIGGEST fan, from a distance if you have to be. Sure, the Lord leads, pray, but, yeah, move out of the house if the abuse is too much) IF he/she is on His side .
There's a reason for the person turning to abuse, not saying you are at fault, I'm just saying to be open to change as the Lord may lead you to change some behavior that could be triggering things from your spouse. That's where professional CHRISTIAN MARRIAGE COUNSELING comes in, likely, for both of you. And, if the person abusing won't go to counseling, then, find out WHY ?
Make them talk to your pastor and get you answer that way, or, some way. YOU need to know why. YOU deserve to know why they won't go. But, there are only TWO things that we can divorce over, adultery and death of a spouse, per Scripture. So, and ,yes, those who've already divorced/seperated, it's NOT a salvation issue that I'm speaking of, I would never condemn of that, as we ALL have our different sins. Just do. So, quit judging others in that way, that's God's territory, 100%, completely, His'
s So, hopefully, that all helps, and, as julieannie said, we need to be praying for that person and that Christ can do things and we are to be supportive as we can be of their going through things that God is doing to change them away from their abusing ways. Again, God CAN 100% change them of their abuse, that's not our decision to say that only 5% change. Sorry, folks, it's NOT. Never will be either. Not for the Christian, just not our choice, not our control to manipulate people's thinking in that way, don't do it. Let the Lord do things, through the counseling, through the pastor, through the church members, through YOU, in how you treat them fairly, NO DIFFERENT, as the Lord will lead you to do, I absolutely GUARANTEE it, IF that person is trying to change with Christ their 'catalyst,' as ServantStrike said so well .
YOU be on the person abusing's side, in their corner, their BIGGEST fan, from a distance if you have to be. Sure, the Lord leads, pray, but, yeah, move out of the house if the abuse is too much) IF he/she is on His side .
Last edited by a moderator:
You, at least, got the 100% number right, and, I hope this speaks in love, wisebeardedone
100% of the time that a person who is an abuser gives that abuse to Christ, just like gives their smokes, their crack, their meth, their PCP, their porn addiction, God REMOVES it ! Gone, in His 'due time,' God does things, per Scripture, but, He will NOT allow that person to go on abusing IF they TURN to Him. Period, end of story, but, I got more to say and I pray you let these words both sink in and filtered by His Loving embrace that goes through your heart, which His Holy Spirit is in, and, also, did you know, you have 'the mind of Christ.'
The Lord leads......"Dear Lord....Amen"
Now, if that person who is with an addiction, like of the ones said above, just a short list there, but, if that person does not turn things over to God as He leads them to go to, like maxmilliansmart said, 'marriage counseling,' or, doesn't got to AA if drinking's the addiction, then, there's ZERO PERCENT hope that the marriage will work.
The willingness to surrender all is the key, and, Hisservantstriker said things very well, too, as IF Christ was not in the believer's life, if they were not doing things to change, like in AA, like attending church, like seeing the pastor, then, there's a serious problem WITH THAT BELIEVER's walk.
But, to put someone in a box and just say, 5% will turn around. No, that's NOT the Christian response, brothers and sisters, is it ?
So, and, am I trying make people feel like what they said is shaming or blaming?No, like I said, at the beginning of the post, I speak in love and it's His love in me that I speak to you, I hope and pray, the Lord leads, let His Spirit lead you, for in His power is so great a grace, so great an understanding, so great a mercy, so great a way to get the abuser to change. 100% change . And, if you go around with a 5% attitude, guess what! That person who's abused someone, in your mind, will never have a chance to change
YOU don't change them remember, you don't think of changing them, you don't pre-determine changing them, YOU let God change them and you be supportive of them changing, and, praying for them, that they can change, because they surely can CHANGE because ALL things are POSSIBLE with Christ
Sorry, if I cap things for emphasis too much for some of ya, but, it's important for you to socially understand that your feelings on this subject are, indeed, your feelings, let's not knock them, they are true, they are yours, but, you also are a Christian and you are to love EVERYONE, your 'neighbor' is everyone. It's not just your good neighbor or your bad neighbor, it's ALL your neighbors.
LOVE your neighbor, an abuser is your neighbor, too, Webster's classifies a 'neighbor' as a 'fellow human.' So, that abuser NEEDS your support to change. YOU LET God condemn them, don't you DARE do that
Don't let psychology of man write that neighbor off, so they say they have a 5% chance of changing, it is absolutely a 100% chance of changing IF they have Christ in their life and are seeking Him !
100% of the time that a person who is an abuser gives that abuse to Christ, just like gives their smokes, their crack, their meth, their PCP, their porn addiction, God REMOVES it ! Gone, in His 'due time,' God does things, per Scripture, but, He will NOT allow that person to go on abusing IF they TURN to Him. Period, end of story, but, I got more to say and I pray you let these words both sink in and filtered by His Loving embrace that goes through your heart, which His Holy Spirit is in, and, also, did you know, you have 'the mind of Christ.'
The Lord leads......"Dear Lord....Amen"
Now, if that person who is with an addiction, like of the ones said above, just a short list there, but, if that person does not turn things over to God as He leads them to go to, like maxmilliansmart said, 'marriage counseling,' or, doesn't got to AA if drinking's the addiction, then, there's ZERO PERCENT hope that the marriage will work.
The willingness to surrender all is the key, and, Hisservantstriker said things very well, too, as IF Christ was not in the believer's life, if they were not doing things to change, like in AA, like attending church, like seeing the pastor, then, there's a serious problem WITH THAT BELIEVER's walk.
But, to put someone in a box and just say, 5% will turn around. No, that's NOT the Christian response, brothers and sisters, is it ?
So, and, am I trying make people feel like what they said is shaming or blaming?No, like I said, at the beginning of the post, I speak in love and it's His love in me that I speak to you, I hope and pray, the Lord leads, let His Spirit lead you, for in His power is so great a grace, so great an understanding, so great a mercy, so great a way to get the abuser to change. 100% change . And, if you go around with a 5% attitude, guess what! That person who's abused someone, in your mind, will never have a chance to change
YOU don't change them remember, you don't think of changing them, you don't pre-determine changing them, YOU let God change them and you be supportive of them changing, and, praying for them, that they can change, because they surely can CHANGE because ALL things are POSSIBLE with Christ
Sorry, if I cap things for emphasis too much for some of ya, but, it's important for you to socially understand that your feelings on this subject are, indeed, your feelings, let's not knock them, they are true, they are yours, but, you also are a Christian and you are to love EVERYONE, your 'neighbor' is everyone. It's not just your good neighbor or your bad neighbor, it's ALL your neighbors.
LOVE your neighbor, an abuser is your neighbor, too, Webster's classifies a 'neighbor' as a 'fellow human.' So, that abuser NEEDS your support to change. YOU LET God condemn them, don't you DARE do that
Don't let psychology of man write that neighbor off, so they say they have a 5% chance of changing, it is absolutely a 100% chance of changing IF they have Christ in their life and are seeking Him !
Eccl 3:12-13 (just after the time for verse)
I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live.That each of them may eat and drink, and find satisfaction in all their toil—this is the gift of God.
The idea of toil includes long and laborious, strenuous, fatiguing, strain, struggle. So yes, there is a time for everything, but the best thing is to find satisfaction in your pain and struggles. To see God at work in everything.
Is suffering good? Certainly not. Is suffering to be expected? Certainly. But in those times when we are most powerless, those are the times when God's power is an absolute necessity. When we don't think we can go on. When God demonstrates that He is there by carrying us forward. All we can do is try, ourselves, to act righteously. To avoid causing pain. Sometimes that does mean enduring it.
In the end, if you remain strong in the faith, no matter what pain you suffer, no matter how much pain you avoid, you will be with God and that is what He desires. Taking actions to minimize personal pain is not what a christian life is about. Seek first the kingdom of God.
I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live.That each of them may eat and drink, and find satisfaction in all their toil—this is the gift of God.
The idea of toil includes long and laborious, strenuous, fatiguing, strain, struggle. So yes, there is a time for everything, but the best thing is to find satisfaction in your pain and struggles. To see God at work in everything.
Is suffering good? Certainly not. Is suffering to be expected? Certainly. But in those times when we are most powerless, those are the times when God's power is an absolute necessity. When we don't think we can go on. When God demonstrates that He is there by carrying us forward. All we can do is try, ourselves, to act righteously. To avoid causing pain. Sometimes that does mean enduring it.
In the end, if you remain strong in the faith, no matter what pain you suffer, no matter how much pain you avoid, you will be with God and that is what He desires. Taking actions to minimize personal pain is not what a christian life is about. Seek first the kingdom of God.
Last edited:
While you are speaking truth, like the words of Job's friends, it is misapplied. Why would you ever think that it's a good idea to tell a victim of abuse to find "satisfaction in pain and struggles"? She's already enduring. That is her present state. What she needs to hear is the other side of the coin, that she doesn't have to be treated like that.
I only know of one abuser who turned to God and became a pillar in his community. But that was after his children had witnessed the mistreatment of their mother for far too many years. Now their eldest is 18 years into an abusive marriage and holding on hope that her monstrosity of a spouse will change, too. The former abuser's 16-year-old granddaughter has never lived in a home without verbal/financial/emotional/physical/sexual abuse. The cycle of familial abuse will continue unless it's broken.
That's why leaving is really the only option that I have ever seen to work. If not for the sake of the abused, then for the sake of the kids and future grandkids. Whatever children grow up around becomes normal to them. In the case of an abused wife, does she want her daughters to think that is the kind of treatment they deserve? Does she want her sons to think that is how they should treat their wives?
X's father was a teenage runaway in Mexico because of his abusive step-mom and negligent father. Then he raised his children in what he term "military-style" which included beatings with bruises. When he committed suicide in 98, X idolized him and credited his "strict" upbringing for making him successful. [That didn't last, but I digress.] Then X controlled me. And later controlled our son. I'm not going to describe the "punishments" meted out to keep us in line, but they were horrific. Now, I'm doing all I can to get my son some positive male role-models so he can see how good men treat their families. I won't let my grandchildren go through that same hell. The cycle stops here.
I only know of one abuser who turned to God and became a pillar in his community. But that was after his children had witnessed the mistreatment of their mother for far too many years. Now their eldest is 18 years into an abusive marriage and holding on hope that her monstrosity of a spouse will change, too. The former abuser's 16-year-old granddaughter has never lived in a home without verbal/financial/emotional/physical/sexual abuse. The cycle of familial abuse will continue unless it's broken.
That's why leaving is really the only option that I have ever seen to work. If not for the sake of the abused, then for the sake of the kids and future grandkids. Whatever children grow up around becomes normal to them. In the case of an abused wife, does she want her daughters to think that is the kind of treatment they deserve? Does she want her sons to think that is how they should treat their wives?
X's father was a teenage runaway in Mexico because of his abusive step-mom and negligent father. Then he raised his children in what he term "military-style" which included beatings with bruises. When he committed suicide in 98, X idolized him and credited his "strict" upbringing for making him successful. [That didn't last, but I digress.] Then X controlled me. And later controlled our son. I'm not going to describe the "punishments" meted out to keep us in line, but they were horrific. Now, I'm doing all I can to get my son some positive male role-models so he can see how good men treat their families. I won't let my grandchildren go through that same hell. The cycle stops here.
M
That's my biggest fear in all this; my babies. My son is 3, and already is beginning to treat me in the same manner his father does. My daughter is about to turn 1, and I hope and pray that I get her out of here in time to spare her picking up even a little on how I'm treated, because I do not want her to grow up thinking that anything about this is right- I don't want her growing up in a house where all of her abilities, her intelligence, her looks will be bashed and her spirit crushed.
And it has been a cycle; my husband's father was verbally, emotionally, mentally, maybe even physically abusive to his wife. She finally left a few years back.
My father-in-law was abused in the same way by his mother.
If I don't break this cycle now, protect my children from it, who will?
And believe me, it's not that I haven't got enough faith in God to carry me and my babies through this, though I know many of you will see it that way. It isn't that I don't trust in the Lord, or that I can't handle sticking around here the rest of my life and just enduring all this. If it were just me here, that's probably what I would do. But my kids? I refuse to let this happen to them, and in turn, let them do this to, or receive this from, anyone when they grow up.
I know counseling has been recommended- and I agree, it's a good idea. However, I've brought it up before, and the idea has been shot down as unnecessary and stupid. Because there's nothing wrong with him- just ask him, he'll tell you all about it. How do you reason with, or live with, someone who is perfect? Someone who does everything right, all the time, and never has anything to say sorry for? How do you work through a problem with someone who HAS no problems, except for me?
It's impossible.
Unless he were to open his eyes and see what he's doing, rather than ONLY my faults, we could salvage something.
But I have left here before, I have tried, and begged, and pleaded with him...and nothing changes, he never sees that what he says/does is hurtful. I don't think he ever will see it that way.
And I know I'm by no means anywhere near perfect myself. I can be a pain in the neck, forgetful, mess things up, burn things...but I am not...I'm NOT...worthless, I'm NOT as horrible as he makes out, and I'm NOT stupid. And that's how he treats me, and that's what he says to me using different words.
I won't let this happen to my babies.
Anyway, I wanted to say to everyone, thank you for your responses, and I know y'all mean well and are trying to help. I do appreciate it.
And it has been a cycle; my husband's father was verbally, emotionally, mentally, maybe even physically abusive to his wife. She finally left a few years back.
My father-in-law was abused in the same way by his mother.
If I don't break this cycle now, protect my children from it, who will?
And believe me, it's not that I haven't got enough faith in God to carry me and my babies through this, though I know many of you will see it that way. It isn't that I don't trust in the Lord, or that I can't handle sticking around here the rest of my life and just enduring all this. If it were just me here, that's probably what I would do. But my kids? I refuse to let this happen to them, and in turn, let them do this to, or receive this from, anyone when they grow up.
I know counseling has been recommended- and I agree, it's a good idea. However, I've brought it up before, and the idea has been shot down as unnecessary and stupid. Because there's nothing wrong with him- just ask him, he'll tell you all about it. How do you reason with, or live with, someone who is perfect? Someone who does everything right, all the time, and never has anything to say sorry for? How do you work through a problem with someone who HAS no problems, except for me?
It's impossible.
Unless he were to open his eyes and see what he's doing, rather than ONLY my faults, we could salvage something.
But I have left here before, I have tried, and begged, and pleaded with him...and nothing changes, he never sees that what he says/does is hurtful. I don't think he ever will see it that way.
And I know I'm by no means anywhere near perfect myself. I can be a pain in the neck, forgetful, mess things up, burn things...but I am not...I'm NOT...worthless, I'm NOT as horrible as he makes out, and I'm NOT stupid. And that's how he treats me, and that's what he says to me using different words.
I won't let this happen to my babies.
Anyway, I wanted to say to everyone, thank you for your responses, and I know y'all mean well and are trying to help. I do appreciate it.
Does it break my heart to see people being abused? Yes! Do I want to fix this world? Yes! I've seen too many times where someone's good intentions have been misplaced. Too many times where what seems to clearly to be "good" actually bred more evil. God alone knows how and when to act to build peace and love. Following Him, submitting to Him, I live with confidence.
Just to make sure that this post is properly tempered, I still believe my statement above (and have seen) that God can lead an abuser away from the one being abused; with or without legal intervention. The abuse will always end. God has said that the only way that end can be true freedom is through a relationship with Christ. In a perfect world, it would end with all parties close to God. In this world, maybe it will end with the abused close to Christ and the abuser in jail; maybe it will end with the abuser close to Christ and the abused in a hospital. But I, for one, do not feel comfortable deciding myself that the abused has more value to God than the abuser.
Just to make sure that this post is properly tempered, I still believe my statement above (and have seen) that God can lead an abuser away from the one being abused; with or without legal intervention. The abuse will always end. God has said that the only way that end can be true freedom is through a relationship with Christ. In a perfect world, it would end with all parties close to God. In this world, maybe it will end with the abused close to Christ and the abuser in jail; maybe it will end with the abuser close to Christ and the abused in a hospital. But I, for one, do not feel comfortable deciding myself that the abused has more value to God than the abuser.
Last edited:
"The abuse will always end."
Yes, but at what cost?
At a certain point we are to shun those who are unrepentant. She is not property who has no options but to endure. There are certainly times when we are called to endure and a lot of situations must be endured until the end. But sometimes we are given a way out. Many people have fought for many years for everyone to have the right to flee dangerous situations and to "pursue happiness."
2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14,15 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.
Mat. 18:15-17 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. [as in, have no fellowship with him.]
Yes, but at what cost?
At a certain point we are to shun those who are unrepentant. She is not property who has no options but to endure. There are certainly times when we are called to endure and a lot of situations must be endured until the end. But sometimes we are given a way out. Many people have fought for many years for everyone to have the right to flee dangerous situations and to "pursue happiness."
2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14,15 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.
Mat. 18:15-17 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. [as in, have no fellowship with him.]
L
so how long is she supposed to wait around for this guy who already thinks he's perfect decide to change ?
i am LOST on how anyone could recommend to a woman and her two small children to stay in an abusive situation.
what if he NEVER changes ? ( look up the literature on the odds of an abuser changing... they are not good. they don't change, look at the statistics of abusers changing and turning around.. it practically never happens. look at the statistics of abused women in the world and in this country- they are astounding! ) what then... then you will have given the advice to someone being tormented and lied to about themselves repeatedly and living in fear 24/7 to stay ' till death do us part ' with an abuser.
AN ABUSER> not a repentant christian ! ! !
HELOOOOO !
what the heck is wrong with you people... you've either never experienced abuse in it's truest sense, so have no idea what it is like to live under it... walking on eggshells, having your personality torn apart and destroyed and being hurt deeply spiritually, mentally, emotionally and sometimes physically ... body soul and spirit under constant duress -
AND YOU WANT HER TO WAIT AROUND AND SEE IF HE CHANGES>
to even suggest that she do this states that you have no idea what it is like to live in a situation and try and hold yourself together and endure a thorough and constant beating of the psyche. . . and the body is affected, it's cells are... anything living, including her two small and precious children are being affected on all levels and learning to pattern their lives after this model.
so to suggest she stay says that you have no idea what you are talking about, in any regard . . . or you have no empathy and are also not able to feel for what this woman is going through, just as her abuser is NOT ABLE TO FEEL what he is doing to these three precious children of God, who deserve to live in peace and safety, not under constant fear and oppression and cruelty.
suggest she stay ?
heck no.
i will not do that,
the three of them deserve better... no matter what miracles God is capable of, we still have freewill - and this man is obviously not choosing to use his in a responsible manner.
she has said that she has left, tried to reason, tried to get him to go to counseling and that her ideas were rejected and thought stupid.
and you want her to stay !
Lord have mercy on your soul, saying that a woman and her two small children should stay in such a situation.
Lord have mercy.
i am LOST on how anyone could recommend to a woman and her two small children to stay in an abusive situation.
what if he NEVER changes ? ( look up the literature on the odds of an abuser changing... they are not good. they don't change, look at the statistics of abusers changing and turning around.. it practically never happens. look at the statistics of abused women in the world and in this country- they are astounding! ) what then... then you will have given the advice to someone being tormented and lied to about themselves repeatedly and living in fear 24/7 to stay ' till death do us part ' with an abuser.
AN ABUSER> not a repentant christian ! ! !
HELOOOOO !
what the heck is wrong with you people... you've either never experienced abuse in it's truest sense, so have no idea what it is like to live under it... walking on eggshells, having your personality torn apart and destroyed and being hurt deeply spiritually, mentally, emotionally and sometimes physically ... body soul and spirit under constant duress -
AND YOU WANT HER TO WAIT AROUND AND SEE IF HE CHANGES>
to even suggest that she do this states that you have no idea what it is like to live in a situation and try and hold yourself together and endure a thorough and constant beating of the psyche. . . and the body is affected, it's cells are... anything living, including her two small and precious children are being affected on all levels and learning to pattern their lives after this model.
so to suggest she stay says that you have no idea what you are talking about, in any regard . . . or you have no empathy and are also not able to feel for what this woman is going through, just as her abuser is NOT ABLE TO FEEL what he is doing to these three precious children of God, who deserve to live in peace and safety, not under constant fear and oppression and cruelty.
suggest she stay ?
heck no.
i will not do that,
the three of them deserve better... no matter what miracles God is capable of, we still have freewill - and this man is obviously not choosing to use his in a responsible manner.
she has said that she has left, tried to reason, tried to get him to go to counseling and that her ideas were rejected and thought stupid.
and you want her to stay !
Lord have mercy on your soul, saying that a woman and her two small children should stay in such a situation.
Lord have mercy.
Last edited:
U
Yes. The abuse will stop in the hospital. That is a totally reasonable and valid way to encourage a woman. He may beat you senseless. Break some bones. Maybe a concussion. But hey, at least the abuse will have stopped! Oh oh oh... maybe he'll kill you and your kids will be left with an abusive murderer or in the child welfare system. But the abuse will stop! So be encouraged. Your body and spirit may be broken, your kids will be abused and grow up to abuse others or be victims, or you'll be dead. But you should feel better knowing that the abuse will end. Right...
I'm logging off before i say ...
I'm logging off before i say ...
L
Mark Driscoll Screaming How Dare You - YouTube
Mark Driscoll
How Dare You
How Mark Driscoll Says Men Should Treat Women - YouTube
How Mark Driscoll Says Men Should Treat Women
Mark Driscoll
How Dare You
How Mark Driscoll Says Men Should Treat Women - YouTube
How Mark Driscoll Says Men Should Treat Women
Thank you all for responding! The last sentence of my previous post was intended as a summary of the rest of the post, not a new idea. I'm not sure if this is more clear not, but maybe: But I, for one, do not feel comfortable deciding myself that encouraging the abused to rely on God is more important than encouraging the abuser to rely on God.
I have lived it, I have read that Jesus lived it, I have read that Paul lived it, I have read that Job lived it... The encouragement comes in that it IS temporary. True Love, heaven, is the prize. When(if) each injury is God's will, it is a step towards perfection. And again: I am not claiming that God's plan is for all people who are abused to endure. I am claiming that God can, and has, lead people to successfully endure. He is THAT big. An abuser never really has the control when God is involved. In the end, the only way to know is to seek His will in each and every specific occasion.
"The abuse will always end."
Yes, but at what cost?
Exactly! I haven't been arguing with you about a specific situation. Perhaps you are talking specifically about your situation. Perhaps you have spoken with God often and He has shown you that it is time. I'm not here to tell you that the way you are reacting in your situation is or isn't God's will. Your question was a general one. The general answer is that there isn't one. There is a time to endure and a time to run. But knowing when the time to run is has been what I have been pointing out. Each situation is different, the only righteous way is His. My statements thus far, though long, have been simply that. No matter how often something happens one way, God can and does contradict it.
At a certain point we are to shun those who are unrepentant. She is not property who has no options but to endure. There are certainly times when we are called to endure and a lot of situations must be endured until the end. But sometimes we are given a way out. Many people have fought for many years for everyone to have the right to flee dangerous situations and to "pursue happiness."
2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14,15 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.
Mat. 18:15-17 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. [as in, have no fellowship with him.]
Great verses! It's been a while since I've read them. I'm not sure if you read the following verse in 2 thess or not, but it states "Yet do not regard them as an enemy, but warn them as you would a fellow believer." And this is where my concern comes, and the 'value' that I was talking about in the sentence Ugly questioned earlier. I have seen many people respond to the pain of abuse with indignation, with a desire for retribution for all of the pain it has caused.I don't know your situation, I'm not suggesting this is your case The only way that I've found to be able to respond to pain in the way God leads is to first accept it. Upon accepting that it is pain, that it is not righteous, but that God is using it, my fear, my anger, is minimized. I give it to God. In that time, I can see clearly and am not blinded by pain and anger. Please know, I am not attacking you or your actions. I am sharing with you the experiences that I have had and the revelations that God has given me through them.
Yes, but at what cost?
Exactly!
I haven't been arguing with you about a specific situation. Perhaps you are talking specifically about your situation. Perhaps you have spoken with God often and He has shown you that it is time. I'm not here to tell you that the way you are reacting in your situation is or isn't God's will. Your question was a general one. The general answer is that there isn't one. There is a time to endure and a time to run. But knowing when the time to run is has been what I have been pointing out. Each situation is different, the only righteous way is His. My statements thus far, though long, have been simply that. No matter how often something happens one way, God can and does contradict it.At a certain point we are to shun those who are unrepentant. She is not property who has no options but to endure. There are certainly times when we are called to endure and a lot of situations must be endured until the end. But sometimes we are given a way out. Many people have fought for many years for everyone to have the right to flee dangerous situations and to "pursue happiness."
2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14,15 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.
Mat. 18:15-17 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. [as in, have no fellowship with him.]
Great verses! It's been a while since I've read them. I'm not sure if you read the following verse in 2 thess or not, but it states "Yet do not regard them as an enemy, but warn them as you would a fellow believer." And this is where my concern comes, and the 'value' that I was talking about in the sentence Ugly questioned earlier. I have seen many people respond to the pain of abuse with indignation, with a desire for retribution for all of the pain it has caused.I don't know your situation, I'm not suggesting this is your case The only way that I've found to be able to respond to pain in the way God leads is to first accept it. Upon accepting that it is pain, that it is not righteous, but that God is using it, my fear, my anger, is minimized. I give it to God. In that time, I can see clearly and am not blinded by pain and anger. Please know, I am not attacking you or your actions. I am sharing with you the experiences that I have had and the revelations that God has given me through them.
Last edited:
I think you know what you need to do. I don't how I can physically help you but if you need to talk I'll be here, many others will too. Whatever you decide,me and I am and sure many other's on CC support you.
God Bless you and the kids. I support you Criss and God does too. He will always be with you.