Attack of the Judaizers

[vic1980]

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Romans 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Romans 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness

The Law of the Lord is perfect

Obedience unto Rightousness

Obay Form the Heart

Servants of Rightousness

Psalms 19

7The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
8The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
10More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.

This is the most important one:

11Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward

When we read Galatians or Romans how many times have we been warned throughout the entire new testament

Answer : God warn us always

God Bless

 

[Rockbysea]

From the passion coming from your post you would think that a Judaizer had a gun to your head saying you must keep Sabbath…. I am a Judaizer and I just want to show and give the love we are instructed to give and show.

This is not about me… you “Judaizers” are no threat to me. The passion is for the truth and in opposition to the potential damage the lies can bring to new and untrained believers.

If the "Judaizers” go around in love saying they love to keep select laws from the old covenant but they are not mandatory for salvation then that’s fine. But they are going around saying it’s mandatory to salvation to keep their make-believe contract made up of select portions from the old covenant... that is a message of condemnation towards other believers… that is spiritual terrorism towards believers (especially new untrained believers) and that has nothing to do with “love.” And to not oppose that passionately also has nothing to do with "love".

 

[WomanLovesTX]

Probably because you don't understand the difference between God's revelation in the OT, which was

up to the time of Jesus' death, and God's revelation in the NT, which was after Jesus' death.

I do understand. I think it is you that does not understand. We are not saved by Jesus death, we are saved by His LIFE. If you understand this, then you would know how the entire Bible is still relevant in our lives today and you would understand what Jesus came and taught us. But instead, you are clinging to two scriptures that I don't believe anyone here is disputing because they are just quotes from the Old Testament. You have much made up doctrine that cannot be proven so you just keep saying the same thing over and over, as though that will make it true.

 

[danschance]

Why to hear some around here, you do not have to obey, Jesus did it all for you. You are free to live anyway you wish, God is just thrilled that you have deigned to say the magic words.

That is a lie. You are contradicting the teachings of Paul. Who here is saying "I don't have to obey the law of Christ". Answer: None one. You are twisting the issue into a straw man argument.

Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? May it never be! Romans 6:1-2

 

[danschance]

OK, then explain this...

Jas 2:24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

and this...

Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Great. Now you are taking things out of context by claiming obedience to OT law is a work of faith, if that is what you are implying. What is a work of faith? If you read the a couple of verses above the verse you posted, Paul explains what a work of faith is.

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar? Jas 2:21

A work of faith in this passage has nothing to do with obedience to any law. It is acting one's faith that is the work of faith, not eating kosher, circumcision or sabbath attendance.

 

[danschance]

So what does one do with that pesky little word Obey?

Easy. We are to obey the commandments of Christ. (Gal 2:6, 1 Cor 9:21, Gal 5:14, Jas 2:12)

 

[LT]

I do understand. I think it is you that does not understand. We are not saved by Jesus death, we are saved by His LIFE. If you understand this, then you would know how the entire Bible is still relevant in our lives today and you would understand what Jesus came and taught us. But instead, you are clinging to two scriptures that I don't believe anyone here is disputing because they are just quotes from the Old Testament. You have much made up doctrine that cannot be proven so you just keep saying the same thing over and over, as though that will make it true.

I think I agree with your premise, but be careful when saying that we are not saved by Christ's death: without blood there is no remission of sins.
Hebrews 9:22
Leviticus 17:11

Although, if Christ was not perfect, then there also would be no forgiveness.

Lucky for us, He was perfect, and did die for us.

 

[just-me]

I invite you to read the posts beginning with #149 on the thread "Breaking Covenant" - it pertains somewhat to this thread.

 

[just-me]

It might help arguments to subside.

 

[WomanLovesTX]

I think I agree with your premise, but be careful when saying that we are not saved by Christ's death: without blood there is no remission of sins.
Hebrews 9:22
Leviticus 17:11

Although, if Christ was not perfect, then there also would be no forgiveness.

Lucky for us, He was perfect, and did die for us.

Romans 5:10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

 

[Elin]

I do understand. I think it is you that does not understand. We are not saved by Jesus death, we are saved by His LIFE.

According to the NT, those who believe in Jesus Christ are saved from the wrath of God (Ro 5:9) on their sin at the final judgment by his sacrificial atoning death (Ro 3:25), which pays the penalty for their sin and makes them right with God; i.e., righteous (Ro 1:17, 3;21; 5:17).

We are likewise kept saved by his ever-living intercession for those who come to God through him. (Heb 9:15)

If you understand this, then you would know how the entire Bible is still relevant in our lives today and you would understand what Jesus came and taught us. But instead, you are clinging to two scriptures that I don't believe anyone here is disputing because they are just quotes from the Old Testament. You have much made up doctrine that cannot be proven so you just keep saying the same thing over and over, as though that will make it true.

Perhaps you could present the doctrine to which you are referring that we may examine it according to the Scriptures.

 

[Keren]

I read some of the writing on Breaking Covenant. I'm sorry, I do not understand it. I can not save myself.
We are saved by the death of Jesus. His resurrection was the proof, wasn't it?

 

[Elin]

Romans 5:10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Yes, that would be his unending life and heavenly ministry now,

where he applies the redemption he obtained in his earthly ministry,

by his interceding, and sanctifying, transforming and preserving (keeping) us for glory,

through his Spirit (Jn 15:26).

 

[danschance]

I read some of the writing on Breaking Covenant. I'm sorry, I do not understand it. I can not save myself.
We are saved by the death of Jesus. His resurrection was the proof, wasn't it?

Exactly Keren. Jesus is our Hope, our Redeemer and our Savor. Those who think works in an old system by obeying laws are foolish as Paul states that the no one can be saved by the law. The law condemns but Jesus saves.

 

[JaumeJ]

Anyone who has read any of my own posts on law, grace, and obedience knows etter, even those who fan the flames of dissension. I do have a recommendation on what you eat, eat healthy, but that is not a law. I have posted in this OP there are good laws and there are bad laws given by Yahweh, and the latter are not to be followed. I will again, point out just one. Does it seem correct for any sinner to judge another sinner to be stoned to death? If you say no, you are correct. As for the laws that are intended to be, again, all one need do is listen to Jesus, Yeshua, and do what He teaches and be as He was our Example.

No one is to teach disobedience, for disobedience is likened by Yahweh to witchcraft, and this is quite easy to understand.

 

[danschance]

Anyone who has read any of my own posts on law, grace, and obedience knows etter, even those who fan the flames of dissension. I do have a recommendation on what you eat, eat healthy, but that is not a law. I have posted in this OP there are good laws and there are bad laws given by Yahweh, and the latter are not to be followed. I will again, point out just one. Does it seem correct for any sinner to judge another sinner to be stoned to death? If you say no, you are correct. As for the laws that are intended to be, again, all one need do is listen to Jesus, Yeshua, and do what He teaches and be as He was our Example.

No one is to teach disobedience, for disobedience is likened by Yahweh to witchcraft, and this is quite easy to understand.

Sorry but I must disagree. You claim a sinner can not judge a sinner and yes this is true, but a sinner armed with the word of God can say when another is wayward because of the bible. Sinners are not the standard of judgement, the bible is!

2 For the Word of God is living and powerful and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Heb 4:12

 

[weakness]

Sure it is, but I did not ask about all of the N.T., I specifically ask about this verse...

Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

What does this mean? Can you explain it?[/QUOTE I think we can see the truth of this in the actions of the scribes and pharisees. They wore long robes and traveled the world to make proselytes, they pray to be seen of men. Basically they were acting out of pride, self love ,reputation,ect. The way of the lord is to do all things out of love. Paul said all men seek their own, but not so in true religion which is to clothe those who are naked,feed those that are hungry, bind the broken hearted. Not just to be seen of men.we should proclaim the acceptable year of the lord. Walk in Gods love, he knows what each situation needs ,and will direct us through the Holy Spirit.We all have a different measure of Christ. And a different job or calling in his body, not to say we are not one body directed by Christ ,But it is the Spirit that holds us all together, it is like the blood in our earthly bodies that flows through us all ,if the Spirit of Christ dwells within us. Love ,Gods love, that is the difference between religion and the works that God ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[Rockbysea]

Sure it is, but I did not ask about all of the N.T., I specifically ask about this verse...

Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!' What does this mean? Can you explain it?

Lawlessness means one is not Christ-like. The goats on the left of Christ practiced lawlessness, which means the sheep on the right of Christ were practicing the opposite…they were being lawful. Christ told the sheep on His right why they were saved (lawful) and it was because of their kind treatment towards His brethren. It was not because they observed the Sabbath laws or other old covenant observances. He gave the same example of what it means to be lawful in the parable of the Good Samaritan.

 

[just-me]

I read some of the writing on Breaking Covenant. I'm sorry, I do not understand it. I can not save myself.
We are saved by the death of Jesus. His resurrection was the proof, wasn't it?

I answered your legitimate questions and responses on that thread. Hope it helps you understand better.

 

[john832]

Sanitary regulations for Israel's military camp were not ceremonial laws.

Ceremonial laws were in Lev.


Building codes were not ceremonial laws.

Ceremonial laws were in Lev.


Yes, the Levitical laws were the ceremonial laws, and those of Lev 15 were the ceremonial defilement and purification laws.

All discharges were defiling; i.e., sweat, sperm, menstrual blood, birthing, spittal, etc., etc., etc.

and had to be purified according to the purification laws.

It's not about health, and it's not about morality.

It's about patterning the meaning of sin as spiritual defilement, from which God's people must be cleansed,
that apart from the new birth, everything man does is sin, because he does not believe.

I'm having a hard time taking you seriously with such weak understanding of Scripture and erroneous application of it.

I'm having a very difficult time taking you seriously when you just dismiss plain scripture that doesn't agree with your agenda.