-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
V
My wife and I are sitting here with tears after reading your post.
I think it is relevant to point out that we also thought the law was abolished because that's what we were taught. But the Word refutes the traditions and doctrines of men, and HalleluYah, we seek, and we find....and He gives us the love of truth. All we have to do is trust and obey.
I think it is relevant to point out that we also thought the law was abolished because that's what we were taught. But the Word refutes the traditions and doctrines of men, and HalleluYah, we seek, and we find....and He gives us the love of truth. All we have to do is trust and obey.
Genesis 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
What does the word sabbath mean? Hebrews 4...
Galatians 3:1-3
[SUP]1[/SUP]O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? [SUP]2 [/SUP]This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
[SUP]3[/SUP]Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Galatians 3:23-26
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
What does that last part mean, be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage?
Galatians 5:3-5
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Galatians 3:10-12
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
What does the word sabbath mean? Hebrews 4...
Galatians 3:1-3
[SUP]1[/SUP]O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? [SUP]2 [/SUP]This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
[SUP]3[/SUP]Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Galatians 3:23-26
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
What does that last part mean, be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage?
Galatians 5:3-5
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Galatians 3:10-12
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
V
Grandpa, in Matt. 9:12 Yeshua says to the Pharisees "But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." And in Luke 11:46 He tells the lawyers that they lay heavy burdens on men which they themselves would not even attempt to carry.
The Oral Law was the burden. They said that you could do NO work on the Shabbat. They said things like spitting on the ground was sin because it was the same as tilling the ground. In other words they made the Law grievous to be bourn.
Personally, I find it fairly easy to following the Commandments. But the Pharisees with their traditional oral law addendum was impossible to keep, even for themselves. They used it to stand on top of people and raise their own stature. That is yoke bondage.
They forgot to have mercy.
The Oral Law was the burden. They said that you could do NO work on the Shabbat. They said things like spitting on the ground was sin because it was the same as tilling the ground. In other words they made the Law grievous to be bourn.
Personally, I find it fairly easy to following the Commandments. But the Pharisees with their traditional oral law addendum was impossible to keep, even for themselves. They used it to stand on top of people and raise their own stature. That is yoke bondage.
They forgot to have mercy.
3
I just read through many pages of posts and it's pretty depressing. This post above ^ highlights Christ's commandment: to love one another. Yesterday we did some reading of John 13 and Jesus' washing of the disciples' feet. If Jesus met and secured all vertical aspects of our relationship with the Father, then our sole concern should be to horizontally love on each other, with the Holy Spirit. I get the sense that those observing the Sabbath through an OT lens think they are washing Jesus' feet by doing so. Or worse, they are somehow circumventing Christ because they see their observance separate from Him, and somehow exclusive to the Father. So maybe they even think they are washing the Father's feet. I don't mean to accuse or judge, I just can't wrap my head around the heart's motivation with this. In fact, the author of this post has already stated that he is trying to see if there is some special blessing attached to his human effort in observing a former vestige of truth, an old wineskin.
If Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, then please trust His word for it and follow Him. Follow Him. Follow His teaching, which is seen in dc's post. The shadow is filled with truth and these sign posts of truth fill NT scripture, but the NT is the delivery and destination of the Living God. He has done a new thing! He is glorified; He rose from the dead. Please read Jeremiah 31:31,
If Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, then please trust His word for it and follow Him. Follow Him. Follow His teaching, which is seen in dc's post. The shadow is filled with truth and these sign posts of truth fill NT scripture, but the NT is the delivery and destination of the Living God. He has done a new thing! He is glorified; He rose from the dead. Please read Jeremiah 31:31,
3
Bless you brother. From the outside we probably see it in stages.
Whenever someone starts using "Yeshua" or a Hebrew variation of Jesus, it raises a flag. And this does go hand-in-hand with those Sabbath holders. The disciples and apostles who penned scripture through the Holy Spirit wrote in Greek, and if it wasn't the Holy Spirit's design to make the name "Yeshua" proclaimed throughout the world, but "Jesus", why would anyone see this as honoring what God's Spirit has done. Or does scripture say that every tongue confess / knee bow at the name of Yeshua?
Rather…for those who hear and see, its God's intentionality in proclaiming His Son's name in Greek the greater revelation, for truly He is God of all. John 12:32, "And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself."
Not necessarily.
What we do know is that when they insist on mixing Hebrew transliteration ("Yeshua") into the exact same sentence as Latinate translation ("Pharisees") instead of using Hebrew transliteration for all of the terms ("Parashiym" or similar) then you know they don't understand much Hebrew at all.
What we do know is that when they insist on mixing Hebrew transliteration ("Yeshua") into the exact same sentence as Latinate translation ("Pharisees") instead of using Hebrew transliteration for all of the terms ("Parashiym" or similar) then you know they don't understand much Hebrew at all.
P
So you are saying Christ contradicted himself?
Why do you people reject Paul? You sound like catholics - "Let's build our doctrine on the part of the bible that Christ didn't send Paul to talk about"..........HOGWASH!
Paul has the authority of God and Christ:
Paul speaks Christ's words. If you don't listen to Paul you reject Christ.
Everyone of you that dissent with Paul's teachings are denying what Christ said. Everyone of you would be well served to read carefully, prayerfully, and objectively, Paul's teachings.
Still haven't had one of you go down Galatians 5th chapter and explain to me where I am wrong.
Why do you people reject Paul? You sound like catholics - "Let's build our doctrine on the part of the bible that Christ didn't send Paul to talk about"..........HOGWASH!
Paul has the authority of God and Christ:
Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead
....................For I neither received it of man, neither wasI taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.............But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, [SUP] [/SUP]To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
....................For I neither received it of man, neither wasI taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.............But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, [SUP] [/SUP]To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Everyone of you that dissent with Paul's teachings are denying what Christ said. Everyone of you would be well served to read carefully, prayerfully, and objectively, Paul's teachings.
Still haven't had one of you go down Galatians 5th chapter and explain to me where I am wrong.
V
It has been taught that the apostles wrote in Greek. I am persuaded through my study that they were not originally written in Greek but in Aramaic. Matthew was among the Dead Sea Scrolls and was certainly in Aramaic. It makes more sense to me that since Aramaic was the language of the day that they wrote in that language. Peter was no scholar. As far as I know, Paul was the only one who spoke Greek and was capable of writing in Greek.
Was Messiah Greek? No. What is the meaning of the name Jesus? As far as I am aware it has no meaning. I know what the name Yeshua means: Yah is Salvation. Why would YHWH want the meaning of His Son's name to be removed and then replaced with a made up Greek name that has no meaning?
We don't hold Sabbath. We keep the Commandments, the 4th included. Is it okay to steal now? Is ok to sleep with your son's wife now? This is frustrating.
I have never in my life been so horribly treated than I have been by well-churched Christians when discussing these truths. I am no longer interested in doctrines of men or the pagan traditions that the Church continues to follow and teach billions to also follow.
I don't know what others who profess to be Commandment Keepers really believe. I don't know anyone on this forum. But, here is my question: How can a believer call pagan holidays like Halloween, Easter, X-Mas, etc. good, and then call His Commandments bad? Haven't they read this scripture:"Woe unto those who call good evil and evil good"? Honestly, I don't understand how believers can speak evil of our Father's instructions. It seriously makes my heart hurt.
Was Messiah Greek? No. What is the meaning of the name Jesus? As far as I am aware it has no meaning. I know what the name Yeshua means: Yah is Salvation. Why would YHWH want the meaning of His Son's name to be removed and then replaced with a made up Greek name that has no meaning?
We don't hold Sabbath. We keep the Commandments, the 4th included. Is it okay to steal now? Is ok to sleep with your son's wife now? This is frustrating.
I have never in my life been so horribly treated than I have been by well-churched Christians when discussing these truths. I am no longer interested in doctrines of men or the pagan traditions that the Church continues to follow and teach billions to also follow.
I don't know what others who profess to be Commandment Keepers really believe. I don't know anyone on this forum. But, here is my question: How can a believer call pagan holidays like Halloween, Easter, X-Mas, etc. good, and then call His Commandments bad? Haven't they read this scripture:"Woe unto those who call good evil and evil good"? Honestly, I don't understand how believers can speak evil of our Father's instructions. It seriously makes my heart hurt.
V
There are no more blood sacrifices. Yeshua was the final sacrifice of perfect blood and no other blood matters any more. Yeshua IS the High Priest...Currently and always. If you think you can keep the law perfectly, then you are condemned. His sacrifice is the remission of our sins. Our obedience to Him is simply the right thing to render Him for His grace. Yeshua was in the order of Melchizedek....Meaning Righteous King. He was in the line of earthly Kings via David and the Heavenly King via Yahweh. He was the High Priest having been immersed by John to fulfill all righteousness and when Caiphus put him under oath and tore his garments (disqualifying his false position as the Jews placed him in) he took it in this physical realm.
What you copied above shows a desperate lack of understanding.
How do you know what sin is if there are no instructions? What are you supposed to repent from if there is no law? What scripture was it that Paul wrote to Timothy about saying, "All scripture is good for instruction, reproof and sound doctrine" ? Do you think Paul had relegated his letters as Scripture?
What you copied above shows a desperate lack of understanding.
How do you know what sin is if there are no instructions? What are you supposed to repent from if there is no law? What scripture was it that Paul wrote to Timothy about saying, "All scripture is good for instruction, reproof and sound doctrine" ? Do you think Paul had relegated his letters as Scripture?
Well you’ve got do ask that believer you are referring to why he or she calls pagan holidays good and God’s commandments bad. Posting it up on the board and expecting others to guess who that person is isn’t going to help you get an answer to your question.
For myself: Christ’s commandments are good… people trying to shove Sabbaths down believers’ throats violating one of Christ’s commandments is bad.
Regarding pagan holidays they are useless and meaningless…. Like an old shoe on the side of the road… Certainly not a good idea to try and shove that down the throats of believers.
For myself: Christ’s commandments are good… people trying to shove Sabbaths down believers’ throats violating one of Christ’s commandments is bad.
Regarding pagan holidays they are useless and meaningless…. Like an old shoe on the side of the road… Certainly not a good idea to try and shove that down the throats of believers.
