God doesn't seem to really care.

[homwardbound]

Because the prophecies do not prove anything about your god. All that proves is some prephecies happened... we don't know if they came from god or not.

There were some prophecies! Lets assume they came from god! Um.. no.

one either believes or they don't that simple to be transferred from death to life, a freegift by belief, too simple isn't it, but true

 

[homwardbound]

Not really. Just set up a system that takes care of everything and then leave us alone. simple. If you are going to bring something into existence you should make sure its needs are fulfilled and it does not suffer simply because of your choice to bring it into existence.

Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Luke 12:31 But rather seek ye the kingdom of God; and all these things shall be added unto you.

 

[Arcynaculr]

My intent on posting that link wasn't to ask why you are here, but to say don't let bickering saints dissuade you from God.

I hear what you're saying in this thread. Going back to your original post; my parents created 3 children, one of whom is an absolute bum who at the age of 53 still lives with and off of them. My 88 year old mother recently broke her hip doing his dishes. Yet they rally around this kid as if producing him was the greatest thing they ever did. Is that maybe how God looks at us? With unconditional love no matter how badly we screw Him or ourselves? He's marching straight to hell yet they cling to him in hopes that he'll change and turn from it. While I don't agree with what's going on there, it is still an example and lesson of God's unconditional love for us even amidst our self destruction.

They even highlight your point about whether God should have created us, knowing we would turn from Him. My father let slip one time that he wishes he'd never had any of us because of the trouble we've caused him. And yet if he hadn't, his life would be void of any meaning or direction. Maybe there's an answer for you, that yes even tho many of us whom He has created will turn to our own destruction, there's still a value in us none the less that He pursues and gains love thru. And wasn't that the whole point in our creation, the generation of value and love in the universe, even if some of it turns sour?

Some parents dont care about their kids. they abuse them, neglect them, even kill them. They do this cuz they hate their kids and/or find it amusing to do those things and/or are apathetic about their (kids) existence. whats to say, if a god created us, that he is not any/one of those types of parents? (as he seems to be, not saying he is, just saying seems)

(be advised bible verses about gods love have very little merit with me cuz they can't be proven)

 

[homwardbound]

Any god could have created the world. An unknown god. or even a creation of a god who have somehow achieved god-like power.

And Christ revealed who this God is, his Father and came to give us new life in the Spirit of God through belief

 

[homwardbound]

I will now address prophecy and send you to a link with arguments discussing biblical prophecy:
Prophecy - Iron Chariots Wiki

Here is a book i have read discussing how ideas about God have changed
The Evolution of God - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

--Of course this does not mean that "God" actually changed over time, i can neither prove nor disprove that

And that is why it is about whether one believes or not period.

• John 16:9 of sin, because they believe not on me;
  John 16:8-10 (in Context) John 16 (Whole Chapter) Other Translations
• John 16:27 for the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
  John 16:26-28 (in Context) John 16 (Whole Chapter) Other Translations
• John 16:30 Now are we sure that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God.
  John 16:29-31 (in Context) John 16 (Whole Chapter) Other Translations
• John 16:31 Jesus answered them, Do ye now believe?
  
  In fact there are many passages as to whether one believes or not, Do you believe?
  

 

[IDEAtor]

... even if i did, i can't. i don't have the ability to trust the unknown..

The thing about ability, one can be given it, or learn to possess it. The thing about the unknown, it is possible for it to become known. Likewise, people forget all of the time. Again, faith is what it comes down to.

...
For example: if a guy pulls a gun on me and says to give him my money. well, i don't know for sure if he is going to shoot me ragardless of wether i give him my money or not. i could have faith that he would not shoot me... but thats stupid. i could have faith that he would shoot me... but i dont know for sure so thats stupid too... i would say the probability of getting shot is higher than not getting shot... but plain fact is, i don't know if i will or not. so what is the best thing to do? Try to minimize the chances of getting shot, of course, but he may shoot you anyway, so really, in the end, all you can do is hope you won't get shot. but i wouldn't/couldn't put faith in it.

I actually heard a man share of a gunpoint experience. He did something that he felt God called him to do, which led to the potential shooter crying and putting the gun away and asking for forgivingness. The man who was obedient to the feeling or call was ready to die without harming the potential shooter. It is asked about potential threatening situations, ''What is the best thing to do.'' Obviously, prepare to die, if the odds are against you. This does not mean commit suicide or run after the gunner or hide or run away. It means, the question of ''Am I ready?'' becomes a reality and must be answered. Since we never know when we will breathe our last, preparing to die is wise, sooner rather than later. Until that final breath, it is asked of all people, ''What will you do with Jesus'' (Hebrews 9:27).

 

[homwardbound]

I wipe my hands of your blood...

You claim of an alien race that could be telecommuting the answers... Or a object that has mysterious secret powers to tell the future and past... Or they just popped into the mans head...


I am sorry but I am done with you...

TLaurich, you have been baited and this one is still baiting you to walk in the flesh and get angry, you need not prove anything to anyone, you knwo the truth and that truth has set you free, stay set free, as Christ created you to be and walk in love and if getting mad walk away, It is not worth it and just love this person and pray for there happiness, trusting Father to do Father's work
Thanks Brother

 

[homwardbound]

Strange that you think those answers are so impossible. they are no more or less impossible than the god of the bible.

Christ was clear that he is not of this world, if he were he would have fought and then restored Malchus's ear that Peter had cut off, wanting to fight physically
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
James 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

I count on this promise because I believe, and that can't be changed, praying for you. Not preying for you as people do this type over the other type, that you might be blaming them for preying on you and thus claim this to be God who does love you, when it is the experiences of others that do not love you and claimed they believe in God

 

[IDEAtor]

I appreciate this post, it is honest and not just throwing out assertions just stepping back and trying to objectively understand the why.
I have no problem then with the faith you have in God, that is your choice. I choose not to simply because i think your reasons are not sufficient.

Now i will address this misconception that atheists think something came from nothing:
That is absurd, obviously we are here therefore something has always existed.
Existence cannot come from non-existence.
You assert the eternal something as a personal being with a human like mind and emotions. Atheist do not.
That is the difference, if you define God as some eternal substance then that is different.... i then believe in God.

Edit-- As to WHY there has always been something ..... I do not know neither does anyone else.

Thanks for your kind reply. I see my error in communication.

 

[Arcynaculr]

Was God not honest when he told Adam that if he ate from that tree he would die. God had Mercy on him and clothed him first sacrifice yet Adam died didn't he?
And today we have a high priest that lives forever, Christ Jesus in the order of Melchisadek
So you don't need life?

Well... i need life to live lol as for eternal life: it seems likely not to exist.

Another idea thats giving me doubts about the legitimacy of this whole thing: what if "god" and the "serpent" were/are both working together?

Note: (don't mean to make anyone mad, just sharing my thoughts)

 

[doseofreality]

So then are you saying there is no God? And if there is no God (creator) then how did this world in all its amazing resources with Sun and Moon get made? Just a big bang theory?
You know in your being there is a God that you seem to be denying and the only one proof that is here to stay is through the Bible, and no man can comprehend it and yes there are errors from man as in rewriting, interpreting and so on and so forth yet it the Spirit of God that brings forth the truth that sets one free, in Father through Son's finished work for us to be presented perfect before Father and receive the new life in the Spirit that he came to give us through the resurrected Christ
For God can not be worshiped in the flesh

John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.


John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

So throuigh the cross starting at the death we die to our own flesh in our minds and be renewed to the new life thought in Spirit
Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

I would say there is no reason to think the God defined in the bible exists.
Your argument of God must exist otherwise how did the sun, moon, universe come to be is a fallacy because it ignores all other possible explanations.
For the sake of argument lets say i am a deist, there is a God that made the universe but this God is completely different than God of the bible. You have no way of knowing if thats not the case, you simply have faith that its not true.
So creation of universe has really nothing to do with claims of christianity and whether the God described in the bible is real.

 

[homwardbound]

some people are happy being atheist, agnostic, deist, whatever.

Yes this is true, and all will know God is real and all when that day of judgment comes will have made their choice as to believe or not and will not have any excuse to their choice.
So let the cards fall wherever they fall, for I personally trust God in all outcomes no matter what God the creator of all knows best and if we get troubles so be it: For I know we will and have so:
[h=3]ohn 16:33[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
[SUP]33 [/SUP]These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

I trust God because he overcame the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[homwardbound]

It may or may not be true. i dont know and im not going to assume.

At least you are pondering what is truth and you will come to know it and then decide Hallelujah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Arcynaculr]

The thing about ability, one can be given it, or learn to possess it. The thing about the unknown, it is possible for it to become known. Likewise, people forget all of the time. Again, faith is what it comes down to.



I actually heard a man share of a gunpoint experience. He did something that he felt God called him to do, which led to the potential shooter crying and putting the gun away and asking for forgivingness. The man who was obedient to the feeling or call was ready to die without harming the potential shooter. It is asked about potential threatening situations, ''What is the best thing to do.'' Obviously, prepare to die, if the odds are against you. This does not mean commit suicide or run after the gunner or hide or run away. It means, the question of ''Am I ready?'' becomes a reality and must be answered. Since we never know when we will breathe our last, preparing to die is wise, sooner rather than later. Until that final breath, it is asked of all people, ''What will you do with Jesus'' (Hebrews 9:27).

Quite frankly, i don't think i will ever be "ready" to die. wether their is a god or not.
But breaking down one day and ending it in a fit of despair? Possibly.

 

[Arcynaculr]

And you don't blame the people, Satan got you to blame God as to the bad things that happened as if God according to their claim did this to you. When it was not God at all. It is the selfish flesh, but claimed to b ein God beleive, and they did not, which happens a lot
Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Well as far as i can tell they really believe. But i'm certainly not an authority on believing xD

 

[Arcynaculr]

If you were God and saw the people you created stomp on other people and not care, how would you react, would you kill them all and start over and not give free will, thus we be puppets and not truly love?
HMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! God saw this and written in the time of Noah about what I just wrote and he regretted making man because of the evil, yet found grace with Noah. Yet God did n ot wipe out all did he. And eventually came with his Son and they killed the Son. Yet that was only to evil's demise and made an open spectacle over them
2 Corinthians 2:14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place.
Colossians 2:15 and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it

Well it certainly seems that an all-powerful god could have set up a better system than this. I could almost think of one but that would take a whole book to explain.

 

[Arcynaculr]

Can I ask why? What is holding you back? You have been given so many answers by so many people. Are you still having trouble with the part about having to have faith? Or is there something else that is causing you to lean towards not believing?

Why...? that has a complicated answer. yes, i still struggle with the "faith" aspect. but there is more than that. its hard for me to explain it all... some things i'm not even sure how to explain... i'm sorry i can't just type everything out in one big perfect paragraph, but i am trying to convey my misgivings as best i know how...Also, just wanna point out that "many people" depends what you think of as many people. There are billions of people in the world so...

 

[Arcynaculr]

Believing in the one true living God is not religion, It is a personal relationship with nand through the Savior, Christ Jesus, where we are presented to God
Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

That is what is so amazing about God, he loves us this much, and we will receive if we believe, but if we do not how can we receive? Your choice, kind of like a commercial, try it you will like it if you can wait and once you taste, you can't eat just one
Best steak and water I have ever eaten and drank, lots of regrets at first, bur after lasting through none now.
I gave up what I wanted now for what I knew I needed in the long run, and that is a gift from God called life everlasting, even when the body is destroyed, The Soul lives on and not destroyed. the God of this world, evil can only destroy the body but not the soul

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

You say its my choice to believe, like all i havta do is just choose it, like deciding on what shirt to wear. like its so simple and easy. And maybe it was/is for you. Maybe it even is for most people, i don't know. but i do know its not easy and simple for me... im not sure if there is something wrong with me or with others... but we seem to be different.

 

[Arcynaculr]

The thing about ability, one can be given it, or learn to possess it. The thing about the unknown, it is possible for it to become known. Likewise, people forget all of the time. Again, faith is what it comes down to.

Sorry, forgot to respond to this part earlier.

Well some abilities are impossible to gain... but lets say it can become possible for me to gain the "faith" ability, then i guess the question is: what can make it become possible?

 

[homwardbound]

I don't need hope, I need something real.

Can you see the air, is it real, do you breath the air to live. If no air that you do not see is not there we die right
So here is your analogy of truth about God you don't see God yet God is real jusy as the air you breath