Dangers of Feminism

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
K

KittenofMelchisedek

Guest
As somebody pointed out, the proverbs 31 women is very busy, and there's no hint of coercion from her husband, I look at that and I don't see anything more she could be free to do in a society where women have historically had that protection, and it gave them freedom to do all this stuff that she would have a real hard time doing on her own. I don't go about unescorted and unarmed and I live in a rural area and have a comparably low level of paranoia as far as people on chat sites go, I just don't wanna get abducted, it happens, like human trafficking.

I still think submission is a beautiful gift for a wife to give her husband. It doesn't make you a slave, we are all to be servants to each other and submit one to another. I've had that save my life before. Being able to take direction is a gift from God.
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
As somebody pointed out, the proverbs 31 women is very busy, and there's no hint of coercion from her husband, I look at that and I don't see anything more she could be free to do in a society where women have historically had that protection, and it gave them freedom to do all this stuff that she would have a real hard time doing on her own. I don't go about unescorted and unarmed and I live in a rural area and have a comparably low level of paranoia as far as people on chat sites go, I just don't wanna get abducted, it happens, like human trafficking.

I still think submission is a beautiful gift for a wife to give her husband. It doesn't make you a slave, we are all to be servants to each other and submit one to another. I've had that save my life before. Being able to take direction is a gift from God.
Proverbs 31 shows that in ancient Israel women were honored - often in contrast to the nations round about.

Blessings.
 
Dec 25, 2009
423
4
18
I don't think there is anything wrong with being submissive to another person. One of the issues I have with a lot of feminist groups is that they are constantly shaming submissive behavior. I consider myself a feminist, and think that the changes that have been made (even just counting changes in the past 20 years) due to the movement have been great. I just do not like how some people feel the need to shame others for behavioral traits that are not unhealthy.

But I might be bias, as I am a very submissive person when in a romantic relationship.
 

fp

Junior Member
Feb 9, 2014
6
1
3
Aloha KringledOne, I agree w/u, re: submission. Doesn't it say somewhere that we are to submit one to another. AND to think of others more highly than ourselves? That does not mean, however, that we must be weak. We must know what we believe in and be able to take a stand no matter what the threat.
 
D

Donkeyfish07

Guest

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,792
113
Aloha KringledOne, I agree w/u, re: submission. Doesn't it say somewhere that we are to submit one to another.
Yes, and if you read on, it says who is to submit to whom. Wives are to submit to their husbands. Children are to obey their parents, and slaves are to submit to their masters.
 
B

biscuit

Guest
It's a movement that has done some good......but arguably more bad. I'm really glad some of the changes that took place happened but it's so ridiculous these days. It's just a good thing more young women are rejecting feminist ideology. Less of this kind of thing going around among the 18-25 age group.

I Look Down On Young Women With Husbands And Kids And I’m Not Sorry | Thought Catalog
It is sad that many of these 18-34 y.o. women will never get married, raise kids in a house with hubby and watch their children graduate because of the feminists agenda. Did you know that the marriage rate in 1960 was about 70-72% !!! Today it is 28-32%. That's pitiful.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,792
113
It is sad that many of these 18-34 y.o. women will never get married, raise kids in a house with hubby and watch their children graduate because of the feminists agenda. Did you know that the marriage rate in 1960 was about 70-72% !!! Today it is 28-32%. That's pitiful.
If they were gifted with celibacy, living their lives to glorify God, I have no problem with women not marrying. But if they are playing the hook-up and shack-up game, that's a big problem
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,957
113
More and more straw men. I am a child of the 60's. I have been happily married to the same man for 33 years. I have 4 children and 3 grandchildren. I was also a teacher and worked part time and full time, to supplement our income. My husband was delighted I could work and make a good wage because of 5 years of University. After getting sick I had to go on disability, but then when I found a small measure of improvement, I was able to get my MDiv and I am working as a chaplain in long term care.

I know I would not have been able to do that, without strong feminists beliefs. I would not have had the courage to pursue higher education, while raising children. My husband was a great support, once he realized how much it would improve our income. He was very traditional at first, and his only model was a mother who literally did nothing but clean house, while his father took care of the 4 kids and worked. My husband was flexible, and listened to the call of God on my heart, and watched me go to Seminary, not encouraging me, but not holding me back. When I found my calling, he told me that he realized how right it was for me to help those who were needing spiritual care, counselling, teaching and preaching who would not otherwise have it. I appreciate that he was growing in God, and changing his traditional beliefs as I tried to obey God and also to treat him with respect and dignity.

I know literally 100's of women who have had professional jobs, marriages and children who were my friends. All feminists! Really, the whole complementarian movement is just an attempt to limit women in their ability to contribute to the family, by holding back their gifts and callings, and ignoring their abilities. A second income in our society is almost mandatory, and 2 of my sons have working wives, one a doctor, the other a computer specialist. My daughter is married to a doctor, and works as a social worker. One son has a wife with no skills, because she never finished her degree, and has never developed a career. Her desire was to be a stay at home mom and now they are learning that it is impossible to make ends meet without a career, and she does not have one.

Women have the right to do everything men can do, as God has said, he created US in "OUR image." That is the Biblical model, not the ugly roles that sin brought after the fall. Feminists may do things wrong, being human, but the justice will be served by the lost if the Christian church does not lead in establishing a society which does not treat one gender, race, or ethnic origin as different than others. Like Balaam's donkey, God can use anything to do his will. It is God's will that Jesus return for his people, and justice will finally be achieved for all those who worship Jesus Christ in spirit and in truth.
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
More and more straw men. I am a child of the 60's. I have been happily married to the same man for 33 years. I have 4 children and 3 grandchildren. I was also a teacher and worked part time and full time, to supplement our income. My husband was delighted I could work and make a good wage because of 5 years of University. After getting sick I had to go on disability, but then when I found a small measure of improvement, I was able to get my MDiv and I am working as a chaplain in long term care.

I know I would not have been able to do that, without strong feminists beliefs. I would not have had the courage to pursue higher education, while raising children. My husband was a great support, once he realized how much it would improve our income. He was very traditional at first, and his only model was a mother who literally did nothing but clean house, while his father took care of the 4 kids and worked. My husband was flexible, and listened to the call of God on my heart, and watched me go to Seminary, not encouraging me, but not holding me back. When I found my calling, he told me that he realized how right it was for me to help those who were needing spiritual care, counselling, teaching and preaching who would not otherwise have it. I appreciate that he was growing in God, and changing his traditional beliefs as I tried to obey God and also to treat him with respect and dignity.

I know literally 100's of women who have had professional jobs, marriages and children who were my friends. All feminists! Really, the whole complementarian movement is just an attempt to limit women in their ability to contribute to the family, by holding back their gifts and callings, and ignoring their abilities. A second income in our society is almost mandatory, and 2 of my sons have working wives, one a doctor, the other a computer specialist. My daughter is married to a doctor, and works as a social worker. One son has a wife with no skills, because she never finished her degree, and has never developed a career. Her desire was to be a stay at home mom and now they are learning that it is impossible to make ends meet without a career, and she does not have one.

Women have the right to do everything men can do, as God has said, he created US in "OUR image." That is the Biblical model, not the ugly roles that sin brought after the fall. Feminists may do things wrong, being human, but the justice will be served by the lost if the Christian church does not lead in establishing a society which does not treat one gender, race, or ethnic origin as different than others. Like Balaam's donkey, God can use anything to do his will. It is God's will that Jesus return for his people, and justice will finally be achieved for all those who worship Jesus Christ in spirit and in truth.
Would you thus describe yourself as a Christian feminist, maybe?

Or, to look for another term, a Biblical feminist?

Blessings.
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
"Radical feminism is rebellion, plain and simple. Rebellion against the God-given order. It is a rebellion that is destroying western society. And it is a trap into which even professing Christians are liable to fall, if they are not on their guard.

The crying need of the times is for Christians to be well taught about what the Word of God says about the roles of husbands, wives, and children, and to put it into practice; to understand what true womanhood and true manhood is all about. Remember the commandment of Holy Scripture: “Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil” (Exod. 23:2).

Go against the grain! Swim against the tide! Let your own life, and your family structure, be a reflection of the biblical pattern! “Be not conformed to this world” (Rom. 12:2)!

Human nature being what it is, we just never get the right balance. Not wanting women to be the virtual slaves they are in various Middle Eastern countries, western society has swung the pendulum so far in the other direction that “freedom” for women means license to live lower than animals if they want.

Which would we rather have? Women as virtual slaves, or women fornicating, aborting their children, and using their acquired power to grind men underfoot? Frankly, I don’t want either extreme.

The unregenerate are destined to always swing from one extreme to the other. Only in Christ is the right balance set out, and maintained: the husband as the head of the home, the provider and protector; the wife as the homemaker; the children in their proper place, under parental care and guidance until they are adults. This alone is the God-ordained pattern, and the only key to true and lasting happiness." -Pastor Shaun Willcock

"Feminism's disrespect for men and boys has shaped schools and educational policy around values and methods that favor girls over boys. Competition, a natural state of being for many boys, is considered harmful and evil, to be replaced with girl-friendly cooperative, relational activities.

Schools are denying the very behavior that makes little boys: boys. My colleague Don Closson wrote, Gender crusaders believe that if they can influence little boys early enough, they can make them more like little girls.

To despise the glory of masculinity is to reject the very image of God. To despise the treasure of femininity is to reject what the Bible calls the glory of man. That's the problem with feminism: it is a rejection of what God has called good.

It has gone too far in addressing the inequities of living in a fallen world. It's a rebellion against God's right to be God and our responsibility to submit joyfully to Him." -Sue Bohlin

^ True! That said, one only needs to open the New Testament and read the synoptic gospels to see that Jesus was the first Christian feminist ;).

Jesus' interactions with women are prominent in the life of Jesus. With great insight Dorothy Sayers said about Jesus:

“Women had never known a man like this. A prophet and teacher who never nagged them, never flattered or coaxed or patronized them. One who took their questions and arguments seriously; who never mapped out their sphere for them, never urged them to be feminine or jeered at them for being female; who had no axe to grind and no uneasy male dignity to defend; who took them as he found them and was completely unself-conscious."

Both in his teaching and in his activities, Jesus reached out to women as persons who were equally worthy as men in his saving activity.

In the gospels, Jesus treated women with incredible respect. His interaction with the Samaritan woman is a remarkable exchange since Jesus was not only interacting with a Samaritan, a member of a race that was despised by Jews, but also a woman in a male dominated society. Jesus’ conversation with this woman is one of the most profound records in the entire Bible.

Jesus transcended all cultural, ethnic, and gender barriers treating her as a person worthy of the living water of eternal life apart from what others said about her, her accomplishments, her possessions, or her appearance: all immaterial to His relationship to her. And, who doesn't want to be loved like THAT.

Jesus honored women's spirituality, intellectual capabilities, service, and personhood.

Note; however, that Jesus did so without EVER degenerating, degrading, attacking, undermining, etc... a single male or the Biblical male role.

Those would call themselves Christian feminists need to understand that Peter doesn't get robbed anything whatsoever in order for Mary to get paid and follow Jesus's example.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,957
113
Would you thus describe yourself as a Christian feminist, maybe?

Or, to look for another term, a Biblical feminist?

Blessings.
I like that idea of Biblical feminist. Christians feminist sometimes carries overtones of being left leaning and not believing the whole Bible. I believe in the Bible totally, and I do not find roles and "oppression" in Jesus, nor in the Garden of Eden.

I think more people need to go back and read Genesis 1, 2 and 3. That is where the roles came in, a direct result of sin.
 
B

biscuit

Guest
[h=1]What does the Bible say about feminism? Should a Christian be a feminist?[/h][HR][/HR][TABLE="align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]Subscribe to our Question of the Week[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 56%, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="width: 44%, align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[HR][/HR]
Question: "What does the Bible say about feminism? Should a Christian be a feminist?"

Answer:
This question is especially important to Christian women. Does the Word of God address feminism? The modern concept of feminism was not present during the time that the Bible was written, but that does that mean that the Bible has nothing to say on the basic issues of feminism. Even when the Scriptures seem to be silent on something that affects us today, there are eternal principles that speak to the underlying issue.

What are the issues of feminism? Feminism is a counterfeit solution to the real issue of the inequality of women in a sinful society. Feminism arrogates to itself the right to demand respect and equality in every aspect of life. Feminism is based in arrogance, and it is the opposite of the call to the born-again believer to be a servant. The actions of the modern, militant feminists are geared to cause women to rise up and rebel against the order that God has given to mankind. That brand of feminism seeks to impose humanistic solutions that are in direct opposition to the Word of God. Feminism was originally a positive movement, focused on giving women the basic rights God intends for every human being to have. Tragically, feminism has gone past those roots to focus on destroying any trace of a distinction in roles between men and women.

What then should be the view of a Christian about feminism? A believing woman, who is seeking to obey God and walk in peace and grace, should remember that she has equal access to all spiritual blessings in Christ. "There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Galatians 3:28). A believing woman should not allow herself to be a pawn in the worldly agenda of the feminist movement. Men and women have a God-given privilege to fulfill the plan He has set for us. Rebellion against that plan and the arrogance that seeks to put self above God's Word result in very difficult consequences. We see those consequences in the destruction of the relationship between husbands and wives, the destruction of the family, and the loss of respect for human life.

"For everything in the world—the cravings of sinful man, the lust of his eyes and the boasting of what he has and does—comes not from the Father but from the world" (1 John 2:16). The principles of the fall are present in this verse. Eve believed the lie that eating the fruit would bring her wisdom. She lusted and she took or arrogated to herself something that was forbidden. This is the basis for the feminist movement. Women have bought into the lie that feminism will bring them what they want, what they think that they "deserve." However, the promise is empty for the premise is based in pride and pride goes before a fall. "Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall" (Proverbs 16:18).

In the last decades, there has been the rise of a society that is so concerned with political correctness and so sensitive to being "offended" that civility has lost its way. However, this is really nothing new for there has always been inequality in the world. It is sad but true that artificial barriers that have no basis in God's Word have always divided humanity. There is only one race—the human race! Within that race are male and female, different ethnicities, different colors, and different national origins. It is sin in the heart that causes inequality. It is sin in the heart that causes men to treat women in ways that are meant to demean. It is sin that sets one person above another. And it is sin that seeks to use counterfeit solutions to counteract these inequalities. The only true cure for inequality is obedience to God's Word. If men and women would walk in obedience to God's Word, feminism would be unmasked for what it is, and the harmony that God has ordained for the relationship between men and women would result.

Recommended Resources: A Woman After God's Own Heart by Elizabeth George and Logos Bible Software.

 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
I like that idea of Biblical feminist. Christians feminist sometimes carries overtones of being left leaning and not believing the whole Bible. I believe in the Bible totally, and I do not find roles and "oppression" in Jesus, nor in the Garden of Eden.

I think more people need to go back and read Genesis 1, 2 and 3. That is where the roles came in, a direct result of sin.
I think you may find that the essential relationship that Paul expounds in the New Testament was already there in some measure before the coming of sin at the beginning of Genesis. Of course, you are right that sin has grievously affected relationships.

Blessings.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,792
113
Angela,
A woman going to school or working outside the home is not at odds with complementarianism. One can hold to a complementarian view of marriage and believe that. And plenty of women have gotten advanced degrees who were not Feminists.
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
1,746
45
0
Angela,
A woman going to school or working outside the home is not at odds with complementarianism. One can hold to a complementarian view of marriage and believe that. And plenty of women have gotten advanced degrees who were not Feminists.
But feminism gave them the right to go to school.

If you are a complementarian woman who has a degree, owns property, and votes: Thank a feminist. =)
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
But feminism gave them the right to go to school.

If you are a complementarian woman who has a degree, owns property, and votes: Thank a feminist. =)
A secular feminist? :)

Godly women such as Catherine Winkworth who translated many Biblical hymns widely sung today was very much involved in the movement for the higher education of women in the 19th century.

I think it is partly a matter of defining what terms mean, anyway.

Blessings.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,957
113
Yes, we certainly can thank feminists, at least in Canada where I live, for fighting for the vote, and to become people.
It took until 1929 for women to be considered persons. They had to fight it to the British Privy Council!

NOT a Straw woman! This is a real and concrete example of a Christian feminist. Not the fake ones that the complementarians keep creating to justify their misogynist viewpoint!

Nellie McClung is an example of a Christian woman who fought for justice on many fronts, and combined with other women, were successful in giving women the vote and also

Nellie McClung.jpg

"A well-rounded and capable woman, her various careers cannot be described separately, as her teaching, writing and public speaking abilities all fueled her desire to improve the rights of Canadian women. This desire, combined with her true activist nature, Christian faith and sense of duty, meshed perfectly with the social and moral reform movements arising in the West in the early 1900s and produced one of Canada's great social activists."

ARCHIVED - Nellie Letitia (Mooney) McClung - Themes - Activism - Celebrating Women's Achievements - Library and Archives Canada
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
Actually the quote, used by Ms McClung, was originally by Benjamin Jowett, a 19th century Master of Balliol College, Oxford. :)
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,792
113
It seems like the feminists among us want to use the word 'Feminist' for various women's movements of the past that probably did not call themselves 'Feminists.' I'm using the term to refer to the movement that called itself 'feminist.'

I'm not as enthusiastic about women having the vote as some feminists. A just society could have the male head of household voting. There could be some advantages to that, including ease of counting. I don't see a Biblical mandate for men voting either. I think the Lord is more concerned with societies being just than democratic. I believe a righteous monarchy or even dictatorship is better than a wicked democracy. If the majority doing the voting are wicked and hate God, we can't expect righteousness to reign. I realize my views aren't all the popular in the west. One day we will have a righteous monarchy, when the one true righteous Monarch returns and rules the world in justice.