Except the problem here isn't drinking its people being idiots thinking they can drive after drinking. I've consumed alcohol for 12 years now. Never ONCE was I dumb enough to get behind the wheel of a car myself or ride in a car with someone who had been drinking. So its not alcohol thats the issue there, its poor life choices.
DRINKING AND THE SCRIPTURES
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Except the problem here isn't drinking its people being idiots thinking they can drive after drinking. I've consumed alcohol for 12 years now. Never ONCE was I dumb enough to get behind the wheel of a car myself or ride in a car with someone who had been drinking. So its not alcohol thats the issue there, its poor life choices.
And one thing leads to another, drink a little okay and then a little more then tragedy comes along and a little more to escape that tragedy. Get away with it and used to it and watch it overtake and creep up on you to deceive you and take control of you and not only harm self but others as well along the way.
Been there done that was an alcoholic from 14 to 27, wasted much of my life in drunkenness, escaping from the death of my Sister who overdosed at 18, until I faced what I was self medicated running from, Not accepting that she died, when accepted lost the desire to drink and understood what hardships do to us being in unredeemed flesh
But to each their own, but please you all take a tally as to whether you are deceived or not in drinking socially or not, Free choice. Ask yourself is this harmful to you and or anyone else. And you decide if it is beneficial or not, Then you will make the right choice,m if the wrong choice you will be shown and then make the right one as I was and made that choice, in freed from it by God
Been there done that was an alcoholic from 14 to 27, wasted much of my life in drunkenness, escaping from the death of my Sister who overdosed at 18, until I faced what I was self medicated running from, Not accepting that she died, when accepted lost the desire to drink and understood what hardships do to us being in unredeemed flesh
But to each their own, but please you all take a tally as to whether you are deceived or not in drinking socially or not, Free choice. Ask yourself is this harmful to you and or anyone else. And you decide if it is beneficial or not, Then you will make the right choice,m if the wrong choice you will be shown and then make the right one as I was and made that choice, in freed from it by God
Do we not see the wine Christ made not being of earth alcohol, rather Spirit filled with my cup overfloweth
New wine Brothers and Sisters
Psalm 100:4 Enter into his gates with thanksgiving, and into his courts with praise: be thankful unto him, and bless his name.
Drunk in the Spirit you all, best wine ever, and not of this earth either
New wine Brothers and Sisters
Psalm 100:4 Enter into his gates with thanksgiving, and into his courts with praise: be thankful unto him, and bless his name.
Drunk in the Spirit you all, best wine ever, and not of this earth either
God is the righteous one, we are not, none of us are. Let every man be the liar man is and God be the truth God is. As it says do not drink in excess where it leads to not loviong God and neighbor as self.
Too much or too little of anything can and is harmful. Every man has got to know his own limitations, and only God can teach each of us that, personally and we walk by Faith, considering neighbor as self, before going forward to possible harmful behavior
Too much or too little of anything can and is harmful. Every man has got to know his own limitations, and only God can teach each of us that, personally and we walk by Faith, considering neighbor as self, before going forward to possible harmful behavior
The Corinthians took the grace of God for granted, thought what the devil had planted in their thoughts, hey you are forgiven, so you can drink up all the wine and have sex with who you want, eat all the food without care for the neighbor, whether or not they will have enough to eat. Or if another is harmed by your actions and reactions
That is what is talked about do not drink in excess, that leads to Debauchery
That is what is talked about do not drink in excess, that leads to Debauchery
No and not trying to, not my place, all I am after is for each to see for them, between them and God. FDor tha tis the true teacher to freedom in Son and through Son, to know our own limitations, how far can I go doen any road and not harm my neighbor in the proces
Do not destroy my brother for whom Christ also died or. simple to me, praying we all see this and love one another as God has already done through son to the whole world
And definitely appreciate you as well Bro. it is the lpove regardless that sets one straight and one becomes willing not forced.
Forced brings about commandment and commandment brings the Law and the Law shows our inability in the flesh that is still unredeemed, where as in the drunken Spirit of God through the resurrected Christ we are alive, and are in Joy and peace given to us by Father through Son. I personally am drunk in the Spirit with overwhelming thankfulness
Do not destroy my brother for whom Christ also died or. simple to me, praying we all see this and love one another as God has already done through son to the whole world
And definitely appreciate you as well Bro. it is the lpove regardless that sets one straight and one becomes willing not forced.
Forced brings about commandment and commandment brings the Law and the Law shows our inability in the flesh that is still unredeemed, where as in the drunken Spirit of God through the resurrected Christ we are alive, and are in Joy and peace given to us by Father through Son. I personally am drunk in the Spirit with overwhelming thankfulness
So each of us learn from God our own limitations from God
[h=3]Hebrews 8:10-12[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [SUP]11 [/SUP]and they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
So who tells the truth God or man?
[h=3]Hebrews 8:10-12[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [SUP]11 [/SUP]and they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
So who tells the truth God or man?
The dangers of drinking is an unleaventh ming not circumcised at all for a little leaven leaventh the whole lump ,example on tv i saw steve harvey doing a wine tasting ,if they want to call it just that but steve harvey after one goblet of wine forgot he was a christian and said a name resembling that of a womans genetilia in a vulgar street slang style..
Have you ever seen the idiots that say "I've only had a few, I'm not drunk"?
What about those that say while drinking, "I know when I've had too many"?
People forget when they compare drinking to gluttony & other sins that drinking alone temporarily turns you into an idiot. Even those who have only had a few is loosened up to do or say things they nomally wouldn't.
You see, many people who drink are totally unaware that they've lost any common-sense disearnment. Most think they're actually "better", or "smarter" after a few. We who know this also know you can't tell them anything when they're like that.
What about those that say while drinking, "I know when I've had too many"?
People forget when they compare drinking to gluttony & other sins that drinking alone temporarily turns you into an idiot. Even those who have only had a few is loosened up to do or say things they nomally wouldn't.
You see, many people who drink are totally unaware that they've lost any common-sense disearnment. Most think they're actually "better", or "smarter" after a few. We who know this also know you can't tell them anything when they're like that.
Nice for you, but what about all the people, who have had their lives ruined by a drunk driver, drunk husband, including me!!
Act responsibly all you want, the facts are that MANY people do not, and the innocent are the victims. Poor life choices are the norm. My cousin just got hit by a drunk driver the other day, I just found out, totaling her car.
When people drink, they lose their judgment. That is a KNOWN effect of alcohol. That is why so many drink and drive. When the church condones any type of drinking, they are condoning the 31% of all deaths are alcohol related. Alcohol is a big issue. While we cannot change the world, we can certainly stand against the people who do drink and cause deaths, maiming and destruction.
Act responsibly all you want, the facts are that MANY people do not, and the innocent are the victims. Poor life choices are the norm. My cousin just got hit by a drunk driver the other day, I just found out, totaling her car.
When people drink, they lose their judgment. That is a KNOWN effect of alcohol. That is why so many drink and drive. When the church condones any type of drinking, they are condoning the 31% of all deaths are alcohol related. Alcohol is a big issue. While we cannot change the world, we can certainly stand against the people who do drink and cause deaths, maiming and destruction.
Wrong, again, When the Lord instituted the communion He used the phrase "fruit of the vine" instead of one of the words that could have been translated by "wine." This should settle the issue. There are those who need more proof that the fruit of the vine is the only element that we must use in the cup our Lord. We shall now present this proof.
The phrase, fruit of the vine, comes from the following Greek words: tou gennhmato" th" ampelou. The word for "fruit" is "gennema" and means: "that which has been born or begotten; the offspring or progeny of men or animals: the fruits of the earth, the produce of agriculture." The word for "vine" is "ampelos" and its definition is simply "a vine." The word "vine" as it appears in the scriptures always has reference to the grape vine. In only one situation, that being the Old Testament, it has reference to a gourd plant. The vine culture of the land of Israel is well know, so when we use this word, it has reference to the grape vine - no other is under consideration.
The phrase has reference to the produce of the vine. Because Jesus had reference to drinking, we naturally conclude that it was the juice produced by the vine. This is what we know as grape juice. This was a common drink during the time of our Lord, and throughout the history of God's people.
If the Lord had used the word "oinos," which is the normal word for wine, then there might be debate as to what was inside the cup. However, the Lord did not use this word, but the phrase "fruit of the vine." This should settle the question, yet there are those who will still argue the issue.
There are certain facts that we must recognize about the time that the Lord instituted the communion. First, it was the time of the Passover. During this time period, there could not be anything that had been fermented or leavened within the homes of the Jewish people. For one week before this feast, there was an effort to remove anything leavened from their homes. Since wine is the result of fermentation, there could not be any alcoholic wine within their home. This alone would bring us to the conclusion that the fruit of the vine was not wine.
Leaven has been used as a symbol of evil and sin. The word for leaven in the Greek is "zume." It occurs thirteen times in the New Testament scriptures. It means: "1) leaven; 2) metaph. of inveterate mental and moral corruption, viewed in its tendency to infect others. Leaven is applied to that which, though small in quantity, yet by its influence thoroughly pervades a thing; either in a good sense as in the parable Mat. 13:33; or in a bad sense, of a pernicious influence, 'a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.'" (From Thayer's, as found in Logos.)
Logic would conclude that the Lord would not have chosen something that represented sin and corruption to be a symbol of His blood. Our Lord lived a pure and sinless life. Whatever represented His blood would have to be pure and free from any corruption. The fruit of the vine fills this need.
There is always the objection to the use of the fruit of the vine that says that they could not keep fresh grape juice during this time. This is not true. There were many different ways to preserve fruits fresh during the time of our Lord. Often, they would boil the juice of the grape down to a tick syrup called sapa or defrutum (Latin words that mean "must or new wine boiled thick.") This could be kept for long periods of time without spoiling. All they had to do was add water or goats milk, and the thick syrup would become thin and drinkable. Throughout the Old Testament history, this was a common practice among the nations. It was a product of quality and desired among many. When Jacob sent gifts to Egypt, one of these was honey (or the boiled down juice of the grape.) In Gen. 43:11, the word for honey has reference to grape honey. Gesenius defines this on page 188-89:
"debash" (2) {honey of grapes}, i.e. must or new wine boiled down to a third or half (Gr. epsami, Lat. sapa, defrutum, Ital. musto coto
which is now commonly carried into Egypt out of Palestine, especially out of the district of Hebron (comp. Russel's Natural History of Aleppo, p. 20); Gen. 43:11; Eze. 27:17. Another source that supports grape honey is from Unger's Bible Dictionary, p. 1158, 1970 edition:
The phrase, fruit of the vine, comes from the following Greek words: tou gennhmato" th" ampelou. The word for "fruit" is "gennema" and means: "that which has been born or begotten; the offspring or progeny of men or animals: the fruits of the earth, the produce of agriculture." The word for "vine" is "ampelos" and its definition is simply "a vine." The word "vine" as it appears in the scriptures always has reference to the grape vine. In only one situation, that being the Old Testament, it has reference to a gourd plant. The vine culture of the land of Israel is well know, so when we use this word, it has reference to the grape vine - no other is under consideration.
The phrase has reference to the produce of the vine. Because Jesus had reference to drinking, we naturally conclude that it was the juice produced by the vine. This is what we know as grape juice. This was a common drink during the time of our Lord, and throughout the history of God's people.
If the Lord had used the word "oinos," which is the normal word for wine, then there might be debate as to what was inside the cup. However, the Lord did not use this word, but the phrase "fruit of the vine." This should settle the question, yet there are those who will still argue the issue.
There are certain facts that we must recognize about the time that the Lord instituted the communion. First, it was the time of the Passover. During this time period, there could not be anything that had been fermented or leavened within the homes of the Jewish people. For one week before this feast, there was an effort to remove anything leavened from their homes. Since wine is the result of fermentation, there could not be any alcoholic wine within their home. This alone would bring us to the conclusion that the fruit of the vine was not wine.
Leaven has been used as a symbol of evil and sin. The word for leaven in the Greek is "zume." It occurs thirteen times in the New Testament scriptures. It means: "1) leaven; 2) metaph. of inveterate mental and moral corruption, viewed in its tendency to infect others. Leaven is applied to that which, though small in quantity, yet by its influence thoroughly pervades a thing; either in a good sense as in the parable Mat. 13:33; or in a bad sense, of a pernicious influence, 'a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.'" (From Thayer's, as found in Logos.)
Logic would conclude that the Lord would not have chosen something that represented sin and corruption to be a symbol of His blood. Our Lord lived a pure and sinless life. Whatever represented His blood would have to be pure and free from any corruption. The fruit of the vine fills this need.
There is always the objection to the use of the fruit of the vine that says that they could not keep fresh grape juice during this time. This is not true. There were many different ways to preserve fruits fresh during the time of our Lord. Often, they would boil the juice of the grape down to a tick syrup called sapa or defrutum (Latin words that mean "must or new wine boiled thick.") This could be kept for long periods of time without spoiling. All they had to do was add water or goats milk, and the thick syrup would become thin and drinkable. Throughout the Old Testament history, this was a common practice among the nations. It was a product of quality and desired among many. When Jacob sent gifts to Egypt, one of these was honey (or the boiled down juice of the grape.) In Gen. 43:11, the word for honey has reference to grape honey. Gesenius defines this on page 188-89:
"debash" (2) {honey of grapes}, i.e. must or new wine boiled down to a third or half (Gr. epsami, Lat. sapa, defrutum, Ital. musto coto
which is now commonly carried into Egypt out of Palestine, especially out of the district of Hebron (comp. Russel's Natural History of Aleppo, p. 20); Gen. 43:11; Eze. 27:17. Another source that supports grape honey is from Unger's Bible Dictionary, p. 1158, 1970 edition:
Jesus said he would not drink again of the FRUIT OF THE VINE until we all meet in heaven. I hardly think that Jesus would want us all drinking of fermented blood and that he would have alcohol in his bloodstream when he is the Savior of the world. There is something incongruous in remembering the blood that was shed to purchase us for God (Acts 20:28; 1 Corinthians 6:20; 1 Peter 1:18,19) by using that which the Bible teaches is sinful to drink even socially. The symbol of the blood of our Lord is the "fruit of the vine." As we have seen, this has reference to the juice of the grape. This juice was not fermented, but was pure and free from the influence of the fermentation germ. This juice was known as the "blood of the grape," therefore a fit symbol for the blood of our Lord. When we observe the communion of the blood of our Lord, we are proclaiming that it took the blood of Jesus to ratify the covenant by which we have fellowship with God. Also, by the shedding of the blood of Jesus, we can obtain the forgiveness of our sins.