DRINKING AND THE SCRIPTURES
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What is the first point (number 1) below.....to drink a glass of wine or strong drink in front of somebody that could/would be offended and or be caused to stumble is sin and contrary to the truth....As far as witnessing to the lost and being a light....I have been able to witness and preach to numerous people who would have rejected a (suit) if you will and the last time I checked Jesus went to the people who needed it and was not shell shocked by their sin.
I personally do not drink and if you would have read all my posts you would know that and yet at the same time I will not hypocritically reject simple truths and contexts that teach clearly that a glass of wine is not a sin, does not cause one to sin and is fully acceptable in the eyes of God as long as it meets all the scriptures that deal with drinking wine...NOTE ALL SIN ASSOCIATED WITH DRINKING IS WHEN WINE OR STRONG DRINK HAVE BEEN DRANK IN EXCESS!
BE NOT DRUNK IN EXCESS<-----KEY words IN EXCESS
Notice the following and what the bible teaches the wine and strong drink...
Jesus turned water into wine--> John chapter 2
Paul told Timothy as a (pastor( to take a little wine for the sake of his stomach--> 1st Timothy 5:23
To drink wine with a merry heart--> Ecclesiastes 9:7
That laughter and wine makes the heart merry--> Ecclesiastes 10:19
Give strong drink to those ready to perish--> Proverbs 31:6a
Give wine unto those who are heavy of heart (depressed)--> Proverbs 31:6b
It comes down to the following..
1. Does it cause a weaker brother/sister to stumble or be offended Corinthians
2. Not to be drunk in excess Ephesians
3. Not to be (given) to it as in addicted or have to have it 1st Timothy
4. Being mature about it
There is nothing wrong with any one having a drink of wine and or strong drink as long as it meets the requirements above.
I personally do not drink and if you would have read all my posts you would know that and yet at the same time I will not hypocritically reject simple truths and contexts that teach clearly that a glass of wine is not a sin, does not cause one to sin and is fully acceptable in the eyes of God as long as it meets all the scriptures that deal with drinking wine...NOTE ALL SIN ASSOCIATED WITH DRINKING IS WHEN WINE OR STRONG DRINK HAVE BEEN DRANK IN EXCESS!
BE NOT DRUNK IN EXCESS<-----KEY words IN EXCESS
Notice the following and what the bible teaches the wine and strong drink...
Jesus turned water into wine--> John chapter 2
Paul told Timothy as a (pastor( to take a little wine for the sake of his stomach--> 1st Timothy 5:23
To drink wine with a merry heart--> Ecclesiastes 9:7
That laughter and wine makes the heart merry--> Ecclesiastes 10:19
Give strong drink to those ready to perish--> Proverbs 31:6a
Give wine unto those who are heavy of heart (depressed)--> Proverbs 31:6b
It comes down to the following..
1. Does it cause a weaker brother/sister to stumble or be offended Corinthians
2. Not to be drunk in excess Ephesians
3. Not to be (given) to it as in addicted or have to have it 1st Timothy
4. Being mature about it
There is nothing wrong with any one having a drink of wine and or strong drink as long as it meets the requirements above.
Since you don't pay attention to my posts, I'm just gonna have to repost them like you do.
Why in the world would Jesus inspire Paul to write that to the Corinthian church in the early years of his ministry, and again years later in Romans at the end of his ministry while He Himself took the risks of offending holy & sinful people by making alcohol? HE WOULDN'T. GOD DOESN'T CHANGE.
To say Jesus risked offending & then taught thru Paul not to would make him a hypocrite........ Do the math.
Why in the world would Jesus inspire Paul to write that to the Corinthian church in the early years of his ministry, and again years later in Romans at the end of his ministry while He Himself took the risks of offending holy & sinful people by making alcohol? HE WOULDN'T. GOD DOESN'T CHANGE.
To say Jesus risked offending & then taught thru Paul not to would make him a hypocrite........ Do the math.
sorry Stephen. been busy and then sleep. what I was talking about was simply saying that anyone who says the Bible says that having a drink is a sin is wrong. there is not one verse that says that. so for anyone to say the Word says something that it does not say it is in error. pastor, denomination, just regular folks , whoever it is should not play fill in the blanks. as I heard a well-known pastor say where the Bible speaks we speak, but where it is silent, we should be silent.
i see booze as demon juice, and don't think the Holy Spirit will stay in a person that is pouring other spirits in, i'm not saying the Holy Spirit leaves and don't come back, i just don't think Holy Spirit will stick around booze. 2Timothy 4:2-4, Preach the word; be instant in season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And shall turn away their ears from truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
I am sure Paul was not condoning moderate drinking for deacons or aged women.
1 Cor 11:21 "For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken."
1 Cor 11:22 "What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not."
Drunken in v21 has a primary meaning of being intoxicated but has a secondary meaning of being full, satiated. It would be the secondary meaning of full contrasted to hungry/empty that Paul is using.
In the context, the church at Corinth had made a common meal out of the Lord's Supper and Paul was condemning them saying one is hungry while another drunken. If drunken carries the idea of intoxication in v21, then Paul is telling them do not eat and get intoxicated at church services during the Lord's Supper for you have houses to eat and get intoxicated in. Paul then would be condoning their intoxication at homes which contradicts the verses where Paul condemns drunkenness, as in Gal 5:21
1 Cor 11:21 "For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken."
1 Cor 11:22 "What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not."
Drunken in v21 has a primary meaning of being intoxicated but has a secondary meaning of being full, satiated. It would be the secondary meaning of full contrasted to hungry/empty that Paul is using.
In the context, the church at Corinth had made a common meal out of the Lord's Supper and Paul was condemning them saying one is hungry while another drunken. If drunken carries the idea of intoxication in v21, then Paul is telling them do not eat and get intoxicated at church services during the Lord's Supper for you have houses to eat and get intoxicated in. Paul then would be condoning their intoxication at homes which contradicts the verses where Paul condemns drunkenness, as in Gal 5:21
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Joh 6:53 Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you.
Joh 6:54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:55 For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.
Joh 6:56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.
Now unless you believe in transubstantiation, the blood here is wine.
Joh 6:54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:55 For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.
Joh 6:56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.
Now unless you believe in transubstantiation, the blood here is wine.
Just a couple off the top of my head...
Gen 14:18 Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; he was the priest of God Most High.
Jdg 9:13 But the vine said to them, 'Should I cease my new wine, Which cheers both God and men, And go to sway over trees?'
Mat 26:27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you.
Mat 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mat 26:29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom."
Gen 14:18 Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; he was the priest of God Most High.
Jdg 9:13 But the vine said to them, 'Should I cease my new wine, Which cheers both God and men, And go to sway over trees?'
Mat 26:27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you.
Mat 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mat 26:29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom."
"And be not drunk with wine, in which is debauchery; but be filled with the Spirit,"
The debauchery is in the wine itself.
1 Pet 4:3 banquetings - potos "not of necessity excessive . . .but giving occasion for excess" R.C. Trench.
Again, in Matt 10:42 Jesus used the verb form of potos and associated it with just a cup.
The debauchery is in the wine itself.
1 Pet 4:3 banquetings - potos "not of necessity excessive . . .but giving occasion for excess" R.C. Trench.
Again, in Matt 10:42 Jesus used the verb form of potos and associated it with just a cup.
Addiction is soooooo easy that even perscription meds can bind a believer. Yet, you can't get people to believe alcohol is a drug, too. Even in Jesus' day, it was used to kill infection in the story of the good Samaritan. Strong drink was given to someone about to die or in bad shape to keep them from going into shock and save their lives.
There are more alcoholics today than all other drug addicts combined...... & casual drinkers want to keep rolling the dice. I guess it's ok to gamble on alcohol addiction even though many christians are against gambling in general.
There are more alcoholics today than all other drug addicts combined...... & casual drinkers want to keep rolling the dice. I guess it's ok to gamble on alcohol addiction even though many christians are against gambling in general.