The Letter to the Romans...

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Jan 19, 2013
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Thanks to Karrester and RedTent, we may be able to deliver Homward and Elin from the trap of the Devil. They have made their mind the rule for doctrine. By taking the major doctrine of Justification by faith tooo far; By exaggerating it to "faith alone", thus turning it into nonscense. This error is taking many people to Hell.The whole teaching of Justification is: We are first justified by Grace, 2nd, by faith, 3rd, by works of righteousness. This is the WHOLE Bible teaching on justification. James is clear: "knowing a man is justified by words and not by faith only". other verses teach justification by works also.
You do not understand justification.
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Homward, I use my body to walk to church, and to read, and to sing and to praise: are you telling me, this is sin! LOL. OK, RIGHT?, RIGHT!
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Homward, have you been reading "Christian science" garbage? The law is not the curse, braking the law is the curse. The law is the standard of righteousness for the Christian. The letter and the spirit ( small "s") is our standard, and it is perfectly personified in Jesus. Hoffco
Apparently you are not reading what I have said , I said the Law is perfect!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! but when ever it flows through my flesh it kills me. Are we in unredeemed flesh bodies or not?
Did Christ come to kill the flesh and give us life in the Spirit?
John 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
 
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Hoffco

Guest
WElin, I am saying you and the reformers and the whole Fundamental, church, today, (including MacArthur) don't understand Justification. They are not rightly dividing the word, Love Hoffco
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Never have I said anyone is perfect, most of all me. For why would have Messiah had to die were we perfect before God?

What I am saying, the laws of God are just as important as they ever were, if not more so for our gift of Messiah. We are called to live by God's Word, His commandments, with faith in Messiah. If not, then how are we any different than a heathen? who lives as he sees fit in his own eyes, and says God's laws are abolished.
I never said I live as I see fit, ever, raqther I said as Paul said:
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

I am dead to this world and this world is dead to me, sorry you are not seeing this, b ut will if God permit, thank you for your care love to you and all
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Homward WE are not in the "flesh"(sin) but in the Spirit. My body is neutral, it is how I use my body that is right or sinful. The law is not sin, I am sinful,But now I am saved, in the Spirit ,so I can and I do live in the Spirit. Love, Hoff
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Homward, I will believe every verse in the Bible; But your problem is, you take verses out of context. like Rom.14:4 & 10 this is in the context of neutral things,( like food and drink, days and yrs, feasts,etc.) not unlawful things. We can not judge Red Tent if she wants to make a booth out side her house to represent the wilderness journey of this life, it is a good witnessing point. But if she insists I am sinning by not having a booth, I would be right to tell her, "Bug off," LOL,
It is not your right to judge me on booth making. do the same thing concerning a christmas tree, RIGHT? "Love Hoffco
No you take that Chapter as literal, when it is much deeper. That writing from Paul was about the problem at that time. The problem was food and days. yet Paul said that he knew all things were and are clean of itself for God cleansed all through Son.
Seeing Spiritually not fleshly as most can't see past the flesh. Needing the Spirit of God to enlighten them, and be as Paul dead to flesh and alive to God in the Spirit where is the only way God is worshiped period, no other way
John 4:24 Love to you and all
 
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Hoffco

Guest
Homward, I agree with your post 725. Please keep it all in context with the whole Bible. You think you are spiritual, but your mind is very carnal. Sorry, Love you, hoff
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Homward, I use my body to walk to church, and to read, and to sing and to praise: are you telling me, this is sin! LOL. OK, RIGHT?, RIGHT!
No I am telling you by Christ's death at the cross we are to reckon self dead there with him Daily that daily we are back alive in the Spirit walking that way in new life daily
Phil 3:10-11, but read it all in context please
and also

Acts 17:28 for in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring

We are dead to self and alive to God by trusting God to do this as has done through Son past tense before you and I were ever born
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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WElin, I am saying you and the reformers and the whole Fundamental, church, today, (including MacArthur) don't understand Justification. They are not rightly dividing the word, Love Hoffco

God will cause us both to stand, so i know this and trust this in Father through Son, thanks
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
16,140
364
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Homward WE are not in the "flesh"(sin) but in the Spirit. My body is neutral, it is how I use my body that is right or sinful. The law is not sin, I am sinful,But now I am saved, in the Spirit ,so I can and I do live in the Spirit. Love, Hoff
Love it and so we both are on the same page seeing and thanking God for his amazing Love
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Homward this is your problem, post 727. You have rejected the literal, objective word of God. Sorry, I think you have a demon teaching you and not the Spirit of God. love ya, Hoff
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Homward, I agree with your post 725. Please keep it all in context with the whole Bible. You think you are spiritual, but your mind is very carnal. Sorry, Love you, hoff
And am daily:
[h=3]Romans 12:2[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]2 [/SUP]And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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WElin, I am saying you and the reformers and the whole Fundamental, church, today, (including MacArthur) don't understand Justification. They are not rightly dividing the word, Love Hoffco
So that leaves only Catholicism in the West with whom you agree.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
16,140
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Homward this is your problem, post 727. You have rejected the literal, objective word of God. Sorry, I think you have a demon teaching you and not the Spirit of God. love ya, Hoff
Okay then if so I am sure God will straighten this out and the same for you and all, God is Love Brother and his Mercies keep going on thanking God entering his courts with thanks giving and praise Psalms 100:4 being taught daily
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
Homward, We are NOT on the same page, you have totally twisted the Bible, you are a rank liberal. not a Christian, Are you American Baptist? I see this argument from them and other liberals. Love ya, Hoff
 
K

Karraster

Guest
6 For to be carnally minded is death;

Perhaps we should pause here, and let that soak in. ...why is carnally minded=death?


Here's Paul's answer..

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God

Gasp!! What???

So now we have the definition from Paul, what is carnally minded..not subject to the Law of God.
Hmm, maybe we should read our Bibles and not depend on men to teach us. I don't hear this verse preached very much. Do you?


This is probably one of the least "preached on" verses in the "New Testament," as its clear message is that anyone claiming to follow Yahshua in truth, is to submit himself to learning and obeying God's Torah.

As discussed, we are not subject to the "curse" of the Torah (its condemnation), but as "sons of God," we are called to learn and obey the Father's instruction (His Torah). Note that this was the decree for gentiles as found in Acts 15. They were given several basic essential Torah commands to allow for fellowship with Jews who followed Yahshua/Jesus, with the intent that they would learn more when attending the synagogues where Moses (Torah) was preached (Acts 15:21).
too late to edit..
[SUP]8 [/SUP]and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.


Those seeking to do their own will, apart from God's will, can never please God. All the knowledge in the world cannot please God, rather obedience is what He wants. He is our King, and we are under His rule.

[h=3]Hebrews 10:7
[/h]English Standard Version (ESV)

[SUP]7 [/SUP]Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come to do your will, O God,
as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.’”
 
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Hoffco

Guest
God's Amazing love is that He takes Hell deserving sinners, of all favors, and in power and love, God converts them into law abiding citizens of the kingdom of Heaven. LKOve Hoffco
 
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Hoffco

Guest
Sorry, Karrester, what was said in Acts 15, must be edited by the rest of the Scriptures, it is not totally right, but was meant for that day only, "because Moses is read every Sabbath day. The sab. is gone and both Jews and Gentile Christians are under the same law for the new cov.. Love Hoffco
 
K

Karraster

Guest
Verses 12-16 explains a conclusion drawn from 1-11. Faith is "proactive" and involves obligation on our part. (James 2:17-26). As believers, we are to continually and actively (through the power of the Holy Spirit) "put to death" our Yetzer Hara (evil inclination) and not let it rule us (re: 6:12,13,19; 7:5,23.) Yahshua Himself said we had to be prepared to "take up our cross every day" (Luke9:23).[SUP]

12 [/SUP]So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh— [SUP]13 [/SUP]for if you are living according to the flesh, you [SUP][f][/SUP]must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Paul says that "through the Spirit" WE do this, a dual role of the work of the Spirit and the work of the believer himself, a continual work.

To "live" means to be adopted as a son of God and to live eternally (i.e., "to be saved"). If we are trusting in God, we have this salvation in the present, but its full realization or benefit comes later. We live as sons and not slaves, serving God out of love (the positive commandments without condemnation) and not fear (the negative commandments, with condemnation)
[h=3]The Lord Is My Light and My Salvation[/h][h=4]Of David.[/h]27 The Lord is my light and my salvation;
whom shall I fear?
The Lord is the stronghold[SUP][a][/SUP] of my life;
of whom shall I be afraid?