SALVATION ONLY POSSIBLE WITHOUT WORKS!

[Cassian]

It is you and your twisty cousins that do not understand that it is the FAITH OF CHRIST that saves and justifies us and I would suggest a study of Ephesians and Galatians in context without any twisty donut words you usually use so as to get the truth before you end up going someplace that you don't want to go and you are confident that your own works will keep you form going there....

BELIEVE and thou SHALT BE SAVED<--Biblical and is the only door and acceptable way unto the God of heaven and is inspired of God!

BELIEVE AND SUPPLIMENT IT WITH WORKS AND THOU SHALT BE SAVED<--False, man made religion, not accepted by God, gospel of a different kind, double cursed to hell and will take you to the lake of fire!

You aught to actually believe what you write, rather than what you have been stating. The phrase is correct, but you want it to read, If one had/has believed is saved. It is NEVER stated in the past tense. It is faith, believing, present tense, active and continuing.
No such thing as saved finitely by such a thing as simple faith. Scripture never makes that assertion.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I haven't said that at all and I suggest you put your glasses on and read every post I have made in CC before you start mouthing without all the facts mi amigo....

Now, put your peeps on and go read every post that I have had made and then come back and make a correct judgment call about what I believe.....

they still will not

they trust what their pastors say you believe, then what you say you believe.

 

[dcontroversal]

The reasoning comes in two forms:

1) Scriptures that talk about those that have fallen away, and how one can fall away.

2) Seeing for myself some who have fell away, and personal experience in bringing some back to Christ.

Again you fail to see numerous truths from the word such as...

1. It is the spirit that is born again, does not sin and cannot loose it's salvation
2. Saved men/women can do the following and still be saved....

1. Backslide to the point they FORGOT that their SINS HAVE BEEN PURGED<--still saved
2. Live worldly and have works of WOOD, HAY and STUBBLE yet shall STILL BE SAVED thou NAKED AND ASHAMED in the day or their reward
3. Burn YOUR inheritance by riotous living and still BE RECIEVED AS A SON THAT WAS PERCIEVED DEAD, BUT WAS NOT DEAD, but RATHER LIVING WITH THE PIGS
4. Be spiritually immature with little to no growth and remain in a position where you cannot receive anything but milk

And numerous other truths in context that prove there is found every gambit (level of) Christian maturity and faith within the ranks of biblical Christianity.

Works do not and cannot save a spirit that has been redeemed, saved, justified, sanctified and made holy by having a birth from above based upon faith which results in a sealing of the Holy Spirit of promise which is the prepayment of our inheritance and cannot be lost!

 

[Cassian]

nah,

we only have three means of salvation taught, Although maybe thousands of different ways.

1. Licentious (say a prayer no change
2. Faith - Only
3. legalistic - have to earn it by some amount of works (the catholics have the most amount of works, so they must be the closest to God etc)

I'm sure they are all covered by all of these different ways to be saved. Lutheranism, Calvinism, Weslayanism, Pentecostalism, Jehovah Witnesses, Seventh-Day Adventists, Mormons, New Age, Christian Science, Scientology, Christadelphians, Universalism, Unitarians, Urantia, New Community, and the list is endless. Everyone is different from the other. The World Book lists into the thousands of differing ways to be saved, and by whom, or what.

Yet, the Gospel of Christ from the beginning, within His Church, the Body of Christ, has remained unified as the He is with the Father. It has been preserved unchanged by man because the Holy Spirit has not permitted man to impose innovative ideas upon Christ's Gospel, or usurp His authority.

I would definitely say we are operating under different authorities.

 

[dcontroversal]

they still will not

they trust what their pastors say you believe, then what you say you believe.

Yeah no doubt while rejecting foundational truths as found biblically and in context with a twist on the words so as to teach something false......

 

[Cassian]

Again you fail to see numerous truths from the word such as...

1. It is the spirit that is born again, does not sin and cannot loose it's salvation
2. Saved men/women can do the following and still be saved....

1. Backslide to the point they FORGOT that their SINS HAVE BEEN PURGED<--still saved
2. Live worldly and have works of WOOD, HAY and STUBBLE yet shall STILL BE SAVED thou NAKED AND ASHAMED in the day or their reward
3. Burn YOUR inheritance by riotous living and still BE RECIEVED AS A SON THAT WAS PERCIEVED DEAD, BUT WAS NOT DEAD, but RATHER LIVING WITH THE PIGS
4. Be spiritually immature with little to no growth and remain in a position where you cannot receive anything but milk

And numerous other truths in context that prove there is found every gambit (level of) Christian maturity and faith within the ranks of biblical Christianity.

Works do not and cannot save a spirit that has been redeemed, saved, justified, sanctified and made holy by having a birth from above based upon faith which results in a sealing of the Holy Spirit of promise which is the prepayment of our inheritance and cannot be lost!

I think you just saved the entire world, Stalin and Hitler as well.

 

[CWJ]

To teach salvation based upon your own works is heretical!....

1. NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, BUT ACCORDING TO HIS MERCY HAS HE SAVED US
2. IN THE GRACE YOU ARE, HAVING BEEN SAVED OUT OF FAITH, NOT OF WORKS LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST
3. IF YOU BELIEVE WITH YOUR MIND AND CONFESS WITH YOUR MOUTH....THOU SHALT BE SAVED!
4. Galatians chapters 1, 3--->Faith plus works =false heretical doctrine with no ability to save!
5. Romans 8:1 NO CONDEMNATION FOR THOSE WHO ARE IN CHRIST---LAST PART OF VERSE ADDED AND NOT IN ORIGINAL TEXT
6. DAVID AND ABRAHAM--->DESCRIBE ACURATELY THAT GRACE AND SALVATION AND RIGHTEOUSNESS IMPUTED UNTO MAN WITHOUT THE DEEDS OF THE LAW<----WORKS
7. NUMEROUS SCRIPTURES THAT POINT ONLY TO FAITH (BELIEF) FOR TOTAL SALVATION

I hope you unbelievers have enough works and that your works exceed the PHARISEES in righteousness and that you are not 1 work short.....NO HOPE OR ASSURANCE IN WORKS!

If salvation could have been secured by works then our Lord need not have died.

'Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law,
but by the faith of Jesus Christ,
even we have believed in Jesus Christ,
that we might be justified by the faith of Christ,
and not by the works of the law:
for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ,
we ourselves also are found sinners,
is therefore Christ the minister of sin?
God forbid.
For if I build again the things which I destroyed,
I make myself a transgressor.
For I through the law am dead to the law,
that I might live unto God.
I am crucified with Christ:
nevertheless I live;
yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: a
nd the life which I now live in the flesh
I live by the faith of the Son of God,
who loved me, and gave himself for me.
I do not frustrate the grace of God:
for if righteousness come by the law,
then Christ is dead in vain.'
(Gal 2:16-21)

 

[dcontroversal]

I think you just saved the entire world, Stalin and Hitler as well.

You know...when you can't respond biblically I guess you just mouth.....neither one of them had faith and NO MURDERER HATH ETERNAL LIFE DWELLING IN HIM so your response is moot, unjustified and about like a 13 year old who didn't get to watch the Dukes of Hazzard!

 

[dcontroversal]

If salvation could have been secured by works then our Lord need not have died.

'Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law,
but by the faith of Jesus Christ,
even we have believed in Jesus Christ,
that we might be justified by the faith of Christ,
and not by the works of the law:
for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.


But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ,
we ourselves also are found sinners,
is therefore Christ the minister of sin?
God forbid.
For if I build again the things which I destroyed,
I make myself a transgressor.
For I through the law am dead to the law,
that I might live unto God.
I am crucified with Christ:
nevertheless I live;
yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: a
nd the life which I now live in the flesh
I live by the faith of the Son of God,
who loved me, and gave himself for me.
I do not frustrate the grace of God:
for if righteousness come by the law,
then Christ is dead in vain.'
(Gal 2:16-21)

I agree with your statement for sure mi amigo....

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I think you just saved the entire world, Stalin and Hitler as well.

oh really?

Well according to you they could go to a priest and do some penance, Or sit in purgatory and be forgiven.

But no one who is born of God would act like Hitler and stalin.

yet again you stuck your foot in your mouth, and have no clue what we believe. why do you wish to continue to do this.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I'm sure they are all covered by all of these different ways to be saved. Lutheranism, Calvinism, Weslayanism, Pentecostalism, Jehovah Witnesses, Seventh-Day Adventists, Mormons, New Age, Christian Science, Scientology, Christadelphians, Universalism, Unitarians, Urantia, New Community, and the list is endless. Everyone is different from the other. The World Book lists into the thousands of differing ways to be saved, and by whom, or what.

Yet, the Gospel of Christ from the beginning, within His Church, the Body of Christ, has remained unified as the He is with the Father. It has been preserved unchanged by man because the Holy Spirit has not permitted man to impose innovative ideas upon Christ's Gospel, or usurp His authority.

I would definitely say we are operating under different authorities.

1. Those are not gospels thay are churches, The gospel is in scripture. not in some denomination.
2. Your right we do. Your authority is some man in your church, My authority is God as given in his word.

 

[dcontroversal]

1. Those are not gospels thay are churches, The gospel is in scripture. not in some denomination.
2. Your right we do. Your authority is some man in your church, My authority is God as given in his word.

No doubt and to compare heretical religions to biblical Christianity is moot when considered in light of the biblical truths associated with salvation by the faith OF Christ which cannot be earned, worked for and or embellished with works so as to help Jesus save us.

 

[Jabberjaw]

No doubt and to compare heretical religions to biblical Christianity is moot when considered in light of the biblical truths associated with salvation by the faith OF Christ which cannot be earned, worked for and or embellished with works so as to help Jesus save us.

Again, so now all culpability is on God, you say "salvation by the faith OF Christ which cannot be earned", so every man since the cross on both sides of the cross because of Jesus is now saved, and if any man be lost it is Gods fault.

 

[dcontroversal]

Again, so now all culpability is on God, you say "salvation by the faith OF Christ which cannot be earned", so every man since the cross on both sides of the cross because of Jesus is now saved, and if any man be lost it is Gods fault.

Didn't even come close to saying that and if you would close your eyes, take a deep breath and clear you mind of the fog of your false religion you would be able to understand exactly what I said........

And you fail to understand that the works have been completed in Christ, is based upon the faith of Christ, Is open UNTO ALL MEN and by acknowledging faith into JESUS the above described completed works are applied unto your SPIRIT WHICH is born again of the SPIRIT, is ETERNALLY SAVED, SEALED AND SECURE in CHRIST, does NOT SIN, CANNOT SIN, CANNOT LOOSE the ETERNAL LIFE/SALVATION THAT IT PRESENTLY and CONTINUALLY HAS and JESUS will FINISH THAT GOOD WORK THAT HE BEGAN IN ALL WHO ARE TRUELY BORN AGAIN.....KEY WORDS---> JESUS IS THE BEGINNER AND FINISHER OF THE WORK HE BEGAN IN THOSE WHO ARE SAVED!

 

[Jabberjaw]

Didn't even come close to saying that and if you would close your eyes, take a deep breath and clear you mind of the fog of your false religion you would be able to understand exactly what I said........

And you fail to understand that the works have been completed in Christ, is based upon the faith of Christ, Is open UNTO ALL MEN and by acknowledging faith into JESUS the above described completed works are applied unto your SPIRIT WHICH is born again of the SPIRIT, is ETERNALLY SAVED, SEALED AND SECURE in CHRIST, does NOT SIN, CANNOT SIN, CANNOT LOOSE the ETERNAL LIFE/SALVATION THAT IT PRESENTLY and CONTINUALLY HAS and JESUS will FINISH THAT GOOD WORK THAT HE BEGAN IN ALL WHO ARE TRUELY BORN AGAIN.....KEY WORDS---> JESUS IS THE BEGINNER AND FINISHER OF THE WORK HE BEGAN IN THOSE WHO ARE SAVED!

So your saying man must "do something" to be saved?

 

[newbirth]

Again you fail to see numerous truths from the word such as...

1. It is the spirit that is born again, does not sin and cannot loose it's salvation
2. Saved men/women can do the following and still be saved....

1. Backslide to the point they FORGOT that their SINS HAVE BEEN PURGED<--still saved
2. Live worldly and have works of WOOD, HAY and STUBBLE yet shall STILL BE SAVED thou NAKED AND ASHAMED in the day or their reward
3. Burn YOUR inheritance by riotous living and still BE RECIEVED AS A SON THAT WAS PERCIEVED DEAD, BUT WAS NOT DEAD, but RATHER LIVING WITH THE PIGS
4. Be spiritually immature with little to no growth and remain in a position where you cannot receive anything but milk

And numerous other truths in context that prove there is found every gambit (level of) Christian maturity and faith within the ranks of biblical Christianity.

Works do not and cannot save a spirit that has been redeemed, saved, justified, sanctified and made holy by having a birth from above based upon faith which results in a sealing of the Holy Spirit of promise which is the prepayment of our inheritance and cannot be lost!

really ...? man you just saved satan too...Do you believe in Christ, the same Christ who obeyed the father to point of dying for our sins. If you believe Christ you will obey him
[h=3]James 2:18-20[/h]King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]18 [/SUP]Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?



What does believing in Christ mean to you? Yes, he is the lord and that's it? No obedience to his word? What is the faith that saves you? Is it the same spirit that was in Christ working in you? Will it not produce the same nature that was in Christ?
KJV
John 14
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.


John 6


[SUP]40 [/SUP]And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.


[h=2]may[/h][SUP]1 [/SUP] [mey] Show IPA
auxiliary verb, present singular 1st person may, 2nd may or ( Archaic ) may·est or mayst, 3rd may; present plural may; past might. 1. (used to express possibility): It may rain.

2. (used to express opportunity or permission): You may enter.

3. (used to express contingency, especially in clauses indicating condition, concession, purpose, result, etc.): I may be wrong but I think you would be wise to go. Times may change but human nature stays the same.

4. (used to express wish or prayer): May you live to an old age.

5. Archaic. (used to express ability or power.)

 

[dcontroversal]

So your saying man must "do something" to be saved?

It is called faith....which is a spiritual GIFT from God and applied under several words such as believe, acknowledge, trust, receive and any other word of such caliber! Jesus was the one that completed the works, kept the law, became sin for us, sacrificed himself for us, offered his blood before the mercy seat for us, intercedes for us and claims us before the Heavenly Father!

 

[Elin]

Read it again (Lk 1:77).

Forgiveness of sin is salvation.

With no common final authority as the basis for resolving our opposing differences,

you are wasting your time and ours here.

What that actually means

Actually, though it may surprise you, it means exactly what it says.

for a sola scripturist over the last 500 years is that one's opinion cannot be overruled by another man's opinion. Thus
we have thousands of Christs, of means of salvation, all developed by man.

"Thousands" of Christ's now? . ."Thousands" of means of salvation now?

It's time for the hot air to stop, and to end your arguing about your contra-NT views.

Is that the authority of which you speak?

You get to examine my posts again if you want to know the authority of which I speak.

You are wasting your time and ours here

with your inadequate understanding of the NT which does not represent it correctly,

starting with the NT meaning of "justification."

 

[Vaudeville]

So your saying man must "do something" to be saved?

yes, get your hind-end to a preacher and HEAR. when God the Spirit breaks your heart and fills it with terror (Law - assuming you believe what it says about you), then you cry. and are ashamed.

then guess what happens? you hear the Good News. then what?

Ephesians 1
11 in whom also we were made a heritage, having been foreordained according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his will;
12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ:
13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation,-- in whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God's own possession, unto the praise of his glory.

if you don't believe that, you don't believe the gospel. full stop.

 

[dcontroversal]

Actually, though it may surprise you, it means exactly what it says.


"Thousands" of Christ's now? . ."Thousands" of means of salvation now?

It's time for the hot air to stop, and to end your arguing about your contra-NT views.


You get to examine my posts again if you want to know the authority of which I speak.

You are wasting your time and ours here

with your inadequate understanding of the NT which does not represent it correctly,

starting with the NT meaning of "justification."

HAHAHA I LOVE the CONTRA-N.T. thing HAH!