ONCE saved always saved!.

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Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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What I post is about salvation.
In fact it is not. And you seem to have an allergy to the concept of salvation. Christ is the Savior. He saves. Those who trust Him as SAvior, get saved. I don't recall you ever addressing that subject.

[/quote]They are the things our Lord Jesus Christ said we must do to see the kingdom of heaven.[/quote]

You can't have it both ways, Kenneth. If before the cross there was a different way to be saved, then you cannot quote prior-cross teachings by Jesus or anyone else on the subject. Salvation is not by water baptism in the OT. And salvation is never by works. It is in fact a big sin to approach salvation that way.

What Jesus taught was not OT teachings, He was teaching how we are to be under the new covenant, and the apostles collaborate what He taught.
Let's see you prove that He did not endorse every jot & tittle of the Law. So which is it Kenneth? Is it one way of salvation in the Bible, or a different way before the cross?

Do you believe the scripture which says the following?

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one should boast.

1 Tim 1:15-17
Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me as chief might Jesus Christ show forth all his longsuffering, for an ensample of them that should thereafter believe on him unto eternal life.


Eph 1:10ff
in whom also we were made a heritage, having been foreordained according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his will; 12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ: 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation,— in whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God’s own possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Luke 8:11-12
Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 And those by the way side are they that have heard; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word from their heart, that they may not believe and be saved.

Acts 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved, thou and thy house.

1 Cor 1:21
it was God’s good pleasure through the foolishness of the preaching to save them that believe.

Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh shall be justified.

John 5:24
2Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believes him that sent me, hath eternal life, and cometh not into judgment, but hath passed out of death into life.

Acts 15:8

And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; and he made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.

Acts 26:18b

that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among them that are sanctified by faith in me.

Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto
salvation to everyone that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.

Rom 4:1ff
2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? And Abraham
believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.
4 Now to him that worketh, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believes on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. 6 Even as David also pronounceth blessing upon the man, unto whom God reckoneth righteousness apart from works, 7 saying,
Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin.

for we say, To Abraham his faith was reckoned for righteousness. . . . that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be in uncircumcision, that righteousness might be reckoned unto them; . . . 13 For not through the law was the promise to Abraham or to his seed that he should be heir of the world, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they that are of the law are heirs, faith is made void, and the promise is made of none effect: 15 for the law worketh wrath; but where there is no law, neither is there transgression. 16 For this cause
it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all

Gal 2:15-16
16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Gal 3:

6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.7 Know therefore that they that are of faith, the same are sons of Abraham.

Philip 3:8-9
that I may gain Christ, and be found in him, not having a righteousness of mine own, even that which is of the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith:

Heb 3:19ff
And we see that they were not able to enter in because of unbelief. Let us fear therefore, lest haply, a promise being left of entering into his rest, any one of you should seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed we have had good tidings preached unto us, even as also they: but the word of hearing did not profit them, because it was not united by faith with them that heard. For we who have believed do enter into that rest;

Heb 10:39
But we are not of them that shrink back unto perdition; but of them that
have faith unto the saving of the soul.

1 Pet 1:3ff

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. . . . ye rejoice greatly with joy unspeakable and full of glory: 9 receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
Re: Give Heed to God's Word on Salvation

I agree with everything you have said.
I only hold that, according to Hebrews, if a person truly does reject the faith, then they either were never saved to begin with, or they have eternally lost their faith.
Either way, such a person cannot recruxify Christ. Unbelief is unforgivable, which is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
I realize that many have said what you say, but unbelief is certainly forgivable. Everyone who trusts Christ & gets saved was an unbeliever first. Scripture does not say that such is the blasphemy of the Spirit.

The passages in Hebrews are explained in Hebrews; people just stop reading too soon. For example Heb 6:9 explains the preceding as being characteristics that do not indicate salvation. Just read a little further.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
Sorry but this is wrong; Hebrews 10:26-31
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
If you continue in willful sin you make your self an adversary of God, and will face the fiery indignation of pit of hell
.
Kenneth, if you would ever trust the Lord Jesus to save you, your eyes would be opened & your blindness relieved.

Heb 10 does not say anyone loses salvation. You seem to ignore the context:

10 By which will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ
once for all.

11
And every priest indeed standeth day by day ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, the which can never take away sins: 12 but he, when he had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 henceforth expecting till his enemies be made the footstool of his feet. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected forever them that are sanctified. . . .
17 And their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.


Heb. 10:39
But we are not of them that shrink back unto perdition; but of them that have faith unto the saving of the soul.
 
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SolidGround

Senior Member
Jan 15, 2014
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Re: Give Heed to God's Word on Salvation

I realize that many have said what you say, but unbelief is certainly forgivable. Everyone who trusts Christ & gets saved was an unbeliever first. Scripture does not say that such is the blasphemy of the Spirit.

The passages in Hebrews are explained in Hebrews; people just stop reading too soon. For example Heb 6:9 explains the preceding as being characteristics that do not indicate salvation. Just read a little further.
Then we do agree (in practicality).
Salvation is not held in the hands of the recipient, but in the hand of the Almighty.
In the view of election, none are ever lost who have been chosen.
Perseverance is in the Will of God, through the Spirit,
not in the will of man, through his effort.
 

SolidGround

Senior Member
Jan 15, 2014
904
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I would still argue that unbelief is still unforgivable,
as though we were in unbelief, our unbelief is removed when we believe.
It needs no forgiveness, because it is no longer our identity.
For one who doesn't ever believe, or who rejects belief, their unbelief is their identity,
and therefore held against them.

But none of this is necessary.

As long as we preach holiness as our calling,
and that it brings reward, fellowship, and blessing,

and that spurning holiness is our enemy,
and it takes away reward, fellowship, and blessing,
and brings trial, hardship, and discipline even unto physical death,

Then we are preaching what is right and sound.
 

SolidGround

Senior Member
Jan 15, 2014
904
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Re: Give Heed to God's Word on Salvation

Those who believe have a new identity in Christ.
 
Jan 27, 2013
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Sorry but this is wrong;

Hebrews 10:26-31
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.


If you continue in willful sin you make your self an adversary of God, and will face the fiery indignation of pit of hell.
just a thought, if the scripture was robbed or stolen by war, out the temple, at ad 70

and, i took a book without the owner approval. and said read this, i took this by thieft, would you read it.

in the same way, are you asking god or jesus for forgivness, for reading the bible,(each and every day) that was took without the owners approval, out the temple. (food for thought)
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
just a thought, if the scripture was robbed or stolen by war, out the temple, at ad 70

and, i took a book without the owner approval. and said read this, i took this by thieft, would you read it.

in the same way, are you asking god or jesus for forgivness, for reading the bible,(each and every day) that was took without the owners approval, out the temple. (food for thought)
What has this got to do with the subject at hand ?

The bible makes it clear that a believer in Christ can not keep living a life purposefully sinning ( willful sin as the scriptures put it ).

Our Lord says you can not serve both Him and satan. If you live in willful sin, sin is your master not God.

If you can live in willful sin and still be saved, Jesus would not have said repent turn away from and sin no more.
 
H

Hoffco

Guest
What has this got to do with the subject at hand ?

The bible makes it clear that a believer in Christ can not keep living a life purposefully sinning ( willful sin as the scriptures put it ).

Our Lord says you can not serve both Him and satan. If you live in willful sin, sin is your master not God.

If you can live in willful sin and still be saved, Jesus would not have said repent turn away from and sin no more.
I totally agree with you, in this statement you made here. This is how I could fellowship ,for years, with the Wesleyan church, I did not force my Calvinist doctrine upon them. They loved my holiness preaching, but their leadership would not let me pastor the church., of course, because, I believe in election. Love HJoffco
 
Jan 27, 2013
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What has this got to do with the subject at hand ?

The bible makes it clear that a believer in Christ can not keep living a life purposefully sinning ( willful sin as the scriptures put it ).

Our Lord says you can not serve both Him and satan. If you live in willful sin, sin is your master not God.

If you can live in willful sin and still be saved, Jesus would not have said repent turn away from and sin no more.
If you continue in willful sin you make your self an adversary of God, and will face the fiery indignation of pit of hell.(your quote)
the bible was stolen, so do you read a book, that is stolen. yet is this willful sin, you know the bible was stolen, and history proves it.
 
Dec 9, 2011
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So what you are saying your good heart causes God to save you? Bro we are saved by grace through faith and created new unto good works....God changed your heart so your works will show if you obey the new heart that God gave you...or if you obey the old one and put him to shame daily....
NO that's not what I am saying,
.Read it again,its not that hard to understand is it?
If man can only judge what they can perceive by their 5 senses,and GOD sees what the truth is then man would need to see actions expressed through the body.
that's what I think paul and james were talking about.
 
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Do you have a flesh body? Well it now belongs to God...

And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
The spirit which cannot sin because it is born of GOD is where the change took place.Our body has not been glorified yet and needs to be renewed to the right thinking that has been created new and its GOD that did it.
 
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The spirit is of God because he gave us of his spirit as a gift....as long as we are in this body we are supposed to follow His Spirit. Our duty is to make this body obey the spirit. God gave us the power to do so. You belong to God it is your duty to keep your body clean from sin.
 
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NO that's not what I am saying,
.Read it again,its not that hard to understand is it?
If man can only judge what they can perceive by their 5 senses,and GOD sees what the truth is then man would need to see actions expressed through the body.
that's what I think paul and james were talking about.
Well James said it.... do you think God is happy because your heart desire is to feed the world but you refuse to give one person a piece of bread or an old coat? Which is of more benefit .....Matt 25 tells the story
 
Aug 20, 2014
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I think it is a real shame if any pastor says that eternal salvation means we can do anything we want and we're in the Heaven guaranteed club.

That's not scripture. But eternal irrevocable salvation is. As are those scriptures that tell us we must be holy and live in a manner pleasing to God.

So that while Jesus died to give us eternal life, and he promises that no one can pluck us out of his hand, thereby reiterating OSAS, as it's called, there is no scripture that says we can sin till we're tickled pink and we're OK with God.

The promise of eternal life in salvation is salvation eternal. Jesus didn't die so that salvation could be revocable on his part, nor transient on ours.

ONCE saved always saved!. That is the cry so often heard from many of the pulpits today. "I can do whatever I want, as long as I have accepted Jesus as my personal Savior. Why I could go out and mow down a crowd of people with a machine gun and if I were to die at that very moment, I would be saved." Many people believe this teaching today, but is it true? Once we have accepted Jesus as our personal Savior, can we go on living like the world, in open, rebellious sin and still be saved?

Most people who believe the above teaching once saved always saved will quote the following Bible verse as proof: "For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38, 39.

Now this is a wonderful Bible promise that God has given us and it should inspire us all. But does it say once a person is born again, it is impossible for him to lose his way and be lost? In fact, is this verse talking about salvation or eternal life at all? No, this verse is clearly talking about God's unconditional love towards man, not unconditional salvation. Salvation is conditional! You might also notice that the word "sin" was not included in the list of things which are unable to separate us from the love of God.

If we continue in sin, after we have asked Jesus to be our personal Savior, are we really in a saved relationship, are we converted? Here is an aswer "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." Hebrews 10:26.

What was the very first lie recorded in the Bible? It was the devil, speaking through the serpent when he was talking to Eve. "And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:" Genesis 3:4. The devil has been deceiving people ever since with this lie. "Once saved always saved", is another lie from Satan and people have been believing it for years and will be sadly surprised in the judgment.


 
Jan 27, 2013
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If you continue in willful sin you make your self an adversary of God, and will face the fiery indignation of pit of hell.(your quote)
the bible was stolen, so do you read a book, that is stolen. yet is this willful sin, you know the bible was stolen, and history proves it.
Purpose of the Synagogue
The primary purpose of the synagogue is as a house of prayer (beit tefilah). Although much prayer takes place outside of the synagogue, group prayer is extremely important in Judaism. Certain prayers may only be said in the presence of a minyan, or a group of at least 10 adults (10 men in Orthodox shuls).
As suggested by the Orthodox term shul, another of the synagogue's primary functions is as a house of study (beit midrash). It is the place where Jewish children receive their religious education. But education does not end with the bar or bat mitzvah - adult study is supported by the library of sacred texts housed within many synagogues.
Finally, like the houses of worship of most faiths, the synagogue often functions as a social gathering place, a town hall for community events and a headquarters for social and charity work.
See Jewish Worship and Prayer for more information on the content of synagogue services.
The Jewish Synagogue - ReligionFacts


ad 70 to 1500 , for the bible to go to print, the 66 books are what we call the holy bible. so we can ask history, ware did you get some of these books.
 
Mar 28, 2014
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Purpose of the Synagogue
The primary purpose of the synagogue is as a house of prayer (beit tefilah). Although much prayer takes place outside of the synagogue, group prayer is extremely important in Judaism. Certain prayers may only be said in the presence of a minyan, or a group of at least 10 adults (10 men in Orthodox shuls).
As suggested by the Orthodox term shul, another of the synagogue's primary functions is as a house of study (beit midrash). It is the place where Jewish children receive their religious education. But education does not end with the bar or bat mitzvah - adult study is supported by the library of sacred texts housed within many synagogues.
Finally, like the houses of worship of most faiths, the synagogue often functions as a social gathering place, a town hall for community events and a headquarters for social and charity work.
See Jewish Worship and Prayer for more information on the content of synagogue services.
The Jewish Synagogue - ReligionFacts


ad 70 to 1500 , for the bible to go to print, the 66 books are what we call the holy bible. so we can ask history, ware did you get some of these books.
The Holy Scripture is the word of God no man nor nation holds copyright to it... don't know where you are heading with that line of thought
 
Jan 27, 2013
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The Holy Scripture is the word of God no man nor nation holds copyright to it... don't know where you are heading with that line of thought
if you cant keep up, with my line of though, may be you should read more.then ask history whos copyright was it, before they stole or robbed it.
 
Mar 28, 2014
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if you cant keep up, with my line of though, may be you should read more.then ask history whos copyright was it, before they stole or robbed it.
Nothing happens without God's approval friend so don't worry about who stole what and when.
 
Dec 9, 2011
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The spirit is of God because he gave us of his spirit as a gift....as long as we are in this body we are supposed to follow His Spirit. Our duty is to make this body obey the spirit. God gave us the power to do so. You belong to God it is your duty to keep your body clean from sin.
I,m not 100% sure we are saying the same thing but i would say it like this, that since GOD knows all about us we would need to renew our minds to being spiritual minded by believing the WORD of GOD/the bible which is spirit and life.