What does the Law REALLY say?

[just-me]

Elin, if you make it, you will be considered the least in the kingdom according to the words of Jesus.

Matthew 5:18-19
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass , one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled .
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

We all break the commandments in one point or another, but that doesn't give us the right to teach that the commandments of the covenant (both old and new) should not be considered.

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid : yea, we establish the law.

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Put it together rather than tearing it apart

 

[Elin]

Jesus said the laws are not abolished, but completed.

But after Jesus' death, the NT revelation he gave personally to Paul
states that the law is now abolished (Eph 2:14-15).

Because it is now fulfilled (Ro 13: 8, 9, 10) in the law of Christ (Mt 22:37-40).

I have mistaken you for someone else before. Sorry, you are interpreting Paul as giving a gospel other than that of Jesus Christ. He did not.

In fact Paul declares anyone trying to deliver a gospel other than that of Jesus Christ, not that there is one, may he be accursed.

In Christ's teaching of His gospel, for which He suffered and died to deliver to all sinners,
He states He has not abolished the law, He has completed it.

Previously addressed in my quote above.

If you are washed by the same Blood I am washed, That of the Lamb of God, Jesus Christ, you will come to understand this to be part of the gospel.

Paul has no new gospel. The revelation given to Paul was that Jesus Christ is Lord, the same we all have received by the Holy Spirit.

True, Paul was given instructions on where to go and when and many other details for the path given him personally, but,
as Paul teaches, the only gospel is that of Jesus Christ.

And the gospel Paul preached is the gospel of Jesus Christ, including Eph 2:14-5.

 

[Elin]

Elin, if you make it, you will be considered the least in the kingdom according to the words of Jesus.

Matthew 5:18-19
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass , one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled .
19
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so,

You have me confused with someone else.

 

[KohenMatt]

IDOLATRY AND RELATED PRACTICES - Part 2 of 4

12 Leviticus 26:1 - No figured stones to bow down to.
Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the LORD your God.


13 Deuteronomy 16:21 - Not to plant trees near the altar.
Thou shalt not plant thee a grove of any trees near unto the altar of the LORD thy God, which thou shalt make thee.


14 Exodus 23:13 - Make no mention of other gods.
And in all things that I have said unto you be circumspect: and make no mention of the name of other gods, neither let it be heard out of thy mouth.


15 Exodus 23:13 - Not to divert anyone to idolatry.
And in all things that I have said unto you be circumspect: and make no mention of the name of other gods, neither let it be heard out of thy mouth.


16 Deuteronomy 13:12, 13 - Not to try to persuade a Jew to worship idols.
If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities, which the LORD thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying, Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known;


17 Deuteronomy 13:8 - Not to love someone who seeks to mislead you to idols.
Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him:


18 Deuteronomy 13:9 - Not to relax one's aversion to the misleader to idols.
But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.


19 Deuteronomy 13:9 - Not to save the life of a misleader to idols.
But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.


20 Deuteronomy 13:9 - Not to plead for (defend) the misleader to idols.
But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.


21 Deuteronomy 13:9 - Not to oppress evidence unfavorable to the misleader.
But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.


22 Deuteronomy 7:25 - No benefit from ornaments which have adorned an idol.
The graven images of their gods shall ye burn with fire: thou shalt not desire the silver or gold that is on them, nor take it unto thee, lest thou be snared therein: for it is an abomination to the LORD thy God.


23 Deuteronomy 13:16 - Rebuild not a city destroyed as punishment for idolatry.
And thou shalt gather all the spoil of it into the midst of the street thereof, and shalt burn with fire the city, and all the spoil thereof every whit, for the LORD thy God: and it shall be an heap for ever; it shall not be built again.

 

[chubbena]

Straw man.

No one questions the nature of the law, and yet it condemns everyone to eternal death
because they cannot keep it to righteousness.

God had to give us his gift of righteousness (Ro 5:17, 1:17), or we would never be righteous.

Read the post I was answering to. Read it again.
Read my post. Read it again.
And see if you are even answering my post.

 

[just-me]

Read the post I was answering to. Read it again.
Read my post. Read it again.
And see if you are even answering my post.

you're the straw man, and I am the shoe horner. LOL

 

[JaumeJ]

When one claims to believe Jesus Christ yet interprets the words of Paul to contradict Him, there is no longer much we may do except keep him in our prayers.........

 

[Elin]

When one claims to believe Jesus Christ yet interprets the words of Paul to contradict Him, there is no longer much we may do except keep him in our prayers.........

Does that apply to anyone who sets the Scriptures against themselves, as you set Christ against Paul?

 

[Elin]

Just because Paul wrote Ephesians 1:3 does not nullify the Word of God spoken through and recorded by Moses and the prophets.
Did he have to write "the law is spiritual, righteous and holy" after each verse in every letter?

Straw man.

No one questions the nature of the law, and yet it condemns everyone to eternal death
because they cannot keep it to righteousness.

God had to give us his gift of righteousness (Ro 5:17, 1:17), or we would never be righteous.

Read the post I was answering to. Read it again.
Read my post. Read it again.
And see if you are even answering my post.

Yep, that's exactly your post I was answering. . .clarifying that
the "spiritual righteous and holy" law made no one any of those things.

Is my statement false?

 

[Elin]

you're the straw man, and I am the shoe horner. LOL

Almost. . .his argument is the straw man, not he himself.

But you are the shoe horner.

 

[just-me]

Almost. . .his argument is the straw man, not he himself.

But you are the shoe horner.

I'm working on giving you a name. Oh that wouldn't be nice, for the law of Moses is telling me to keep it to myself and repent.

"18 Thou shalt not avenge , nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD." (Leviticus 19:18)

 

[Elin]

I'm working on giving you a name. Oh that wouldn't be nice, for
the law of Moses is telling me to keep it to myself and repent.

"18 Thou shalt not avenge , nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD." (Leviticus 19:18)

So you got it in anyway by the back door?

That's some interesting "law keeping."

 

[LEPIDUS]

Almost. . .his argument is the straw man, not he himself.

But you are the shoe horner.

You are so negative, ask God for peace. What does shoe horner even mean, insulting people will not get your point across in fact it will only show your character, and I would hate to be associated with anyone with this type of behavior. Act your age.

 

[Elin]

You are so negative, ask God for peace. What does shoe horner even mean,
insulting people will not get your point across in fact it will only show your character, and
I would hate to be associated with anyone with this type of behavior. Act your age.

The NT record shows the Judaizers felt the same way about Paul.

 

[cfultz3]

I'm working on giving you a name. Oh that wouldn't be nice, for the law of Moses is telling me to keep it to myself and repent.

"18 Thou shalt not avenge (Rom 12:19),

nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people (Mat 18:35, Mat 5:23-24 These are the Words of our LORD spoken by the Word amongst us)

, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: (Mar 12:30-31These are the Words of our LORD spoken by the Word amongst us)

I am the LORD." (Leviticus 19:18)

And because you are my LORD, Jesus, I will do your will, my Adonis........

 

[KohenMatt]

IDOLATRY AND RELATED PRACTICES - Part 3 of 4

24 Deuteronomy 13:17 - Not deriving benefit from property of an apostate city.
And there shall cleave nought of the cursed thing to thine hand: that the LORD may turn from the fierceness of his anger, and shew thee mercy, and have compassion upon thee, and multiply thee, as he hath sworn unto thy fathers;


25 Deuteronomy 7:26 - Do not use anything connected with idols or idolatry.
Neither shalt thou bring an abomination into thine house, lest thou be a cursed thing like it: but thou shalt utterly detest it, and thou shalt utterly abhor it; for it is a cursed thing.


26 Deuteronomy 18:20 - Not prophesying in the name of idols.
But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.


27 Deuteronomy 18:20 - Not prophesying falsely in the Name of God.
But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.


28 Deuteronomy 13:3 - Listen not to one who prophesies in the name of idols.
Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.


29 Deuteronomy 18:20 - Not fearing or refraining from killing a false prophet.
But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.


30 Leviticus 20:23 - Imitate not the ways nor practice customs of idolaters.
And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them.


31 Leviticus 19:26 - Not practicing divination (Deuteronomy 18:10).
Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, nor observe times.


32 Deuteronomy 18:10 - Not practicing soothsaying.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,


33 Deuteronomy 18:10 - Not practicing enchanting.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,

 

[KohenMatt]

IDOLATRY AND RELATED PRACTICES - Part 4 of 4

34 Deuteronomy 18:10 - Not practicing sorcery.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,


35 Deuteronomy 18:11 - Not practicing the art of the charmer.
Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.


36 Deuteronomy 18:10 - Not consulting a necromancer.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,


37 Deuteronomy 18:11 - Not consulting a sorcerer.
Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.


38 Deuteronomy 18:11 - Not to seek information from the dead, necromancy.
Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.


39 Deuteronomy 22:5 - Women not to wear men's clothes or adornments.
The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.


40 Deuteronomy 22:5 - Men not wearing women's clothes or adornments.
The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.


41 Leviticus 19:28 - Not tattoo yourself, as is the manner of the idolaters.
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.


42 Deuteronomy 22:11 - Not wearing a mixture of wool and linen.
Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.


43 Leviticus 19:27 - Not shaving the temples or sides of your head.
Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.


44 Leviticus 19:27 - Not shaving the corners of your beard.
Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.


45 Leviticus 19:28 - Not making cuttings in your flesh over your dead.
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.

 

[KohenMatt]

PROHIBITIONS RESULTING FROM HISTORICAL EVENTS

46 Deuteronomy 17:16 - Not returning to Egypt to dwell there permanently.
But he shall not multiply horses to himself, nor cause the people to return to Egypt, to the end that he should multiply horses: forasmuch as the LORD hath said unto you, Ye shall henceforth return no more that way.


47 Numbers 15:39 - Not to follow one's heart or eyes, straying to impurity.
And it shall be unto you for a fringe, that ye may look upon it, and remember all the commandments of the LORD, and do them; and that ye seek not after your own heart and your own eyes, after which ye use to go a whoring:


48 Exodus 23:32 - Not to make a pact with the Seven Canaanite Nations.
Thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor with their gods.


49 Deuteronomy 20:16 - Not to spare the life of the Seven Canaanite Nations.
But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:


50 Deuteronomy 7:2 - Not to show mercy to idolaters.
And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them:


51 Exodus 23:33 - No one serving false gods to settle in the Land of Israel.
They shall not dwell in thy land, lest they make thee sin against me: for if thou serve their gods, it will surely be a snare unto thee.


52 Deuteronomy 7:3 - Not to intermarry with one serving false gods.
Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son.


53 Deuteronomy 23:3 - Not to enter the congregation, an Ammonite or Moabite.
An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD for ever:


54 Deuteronomy 23:8 - Exclude not marrying a descendant of Esau if a proselyte.
The children that are begotten of them shall enter into the congregation of the LORD in their third generation.


55 Deuteronomy 23:8 - Not to exclude marrying an Egyptian who is a proselyte.
The children that are begotten of them shall enter into the congregation of the LORD in their third generation.


56 Deuteronomy 23:6 - Not permitted to make peace with Ammon and Moab nations.
Thou shalt not seek their peace nor their prosperity all thy days for ever.


57 Deuteronomy 20:19 - Not destroying fruit trees, even in time of war.
When thou shalt besiege a city a long time, in making war against it to take it, thou shalt not destroy the trees thereof by forcing an axe against them: for thou mayest eat of them, and thou shalt not cut them down (for the tree of the field is man's life) to employ them in the siege:


58 Deuteronomy 7:21 - Not fearing the enemy in time of war.
Thou shalt not be affrighted at them: for the LORD thy God is among you, a mighty God and terrible.


59 Deuteronomy 25:19 - Blot out the remembrance of Amalek.
Therefore it shall be, when the LORD thy God hath given thee rest from all thine enemies round about, in the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance to possess it, that thou shalt blot out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven; thou shalt not forget it.

 

[KohenMatt]

BLASPHEMY

60 Leviticus 24:16 - Not blaspheming the Holy Name of God.
And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name of the LORD, shall be put to death.


61 Leviticus 19:12 - Not violating an oath by the Holy Name.
And ye shall not swear by my name falsely, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD.


62 Exodus 20:7 - Not taking the Holy Name in vain.
Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.


63 Leviticus 22:32 - Not profaning the Holy Name of God.
Neither shall ye profane my holy name; but I will be hallowed among the children of Israel: I am the LORD which hallow you,


64 Deuteronomy 6:16 - Not tempting God’s promises and warnings.
Ye shall not tempt the LORD your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.


65 Deuteronomy 12:3,4 - Do not destroy houses of worship or holy books of The LORD.
And ye shall overthrow their altars, and break their pillars, and burn their groves with fire; and ye shall hew down the graven images of their gods, and destroy the names of them out of that place. Ye shall not do so unto the LORD your God.


66 Deuteronomy 21:23 - Leave not body of executed criminal hanging overnight.
His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

 

[KohenMatt]

TEMPLE - Part 1 of 2

67 Numbers 18:5 - Be not lax in guarding the Sanctuary.
And ye shall keep the charge of the sanctuary, and the charge of the altar: that there be no wrath any more upon the children of Israel.


68 Leviticus 16:2 - High Priest enter Sanctuary only at prescribed times.
And the LORD said unto Moses, Speak unto Aaron thy brother, that he come not at all times into the holy place within the vail before the mercy seat, which is upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat.


69 Leviticus 21:23 - Cohen (priest) with blemish come near to Altar.
Only he shall not go in unto the vail, nor come nigh unto the altar, because he hath a blemish; that he profane not my sanctuaries: for I the LORD do sanctify them.


70 Leviticus 21:17 - Cohen (priest) with a blemish not to minister in the Sanctuary.
Speak unto Aaron, saying, Whosoever he be of thy seed in their generations that hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God.


71 Leviticus 21:18 - Cohen (priest) with temporary blemish minister not in Sanctuary.
For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach: a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose, or any thing superfluous,


72 Numbers 18:3 - Levites and Cohanim not to interchange in their functions.
And they shall keep thy charge, and the charge of all the tabernacle: only they shall not come nigh the vessels of the sanctuary and the altar, that neither they, nor ye also, die.


73 Leviticus 10:9 - Drunk persons may not enter Sanctuary or teach Torah.
Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations:


74 Numbers 18:4 - A non-Cohen (priest) not to minister in Sanctuary.
And they shall be joined unto thee, and keep the charge of the tabernacle of the congregation, for all the service of the tabernacle: and a stranger shall not come nigh unto you.


75 Leviticus 22:2 - A unclean Cohen (priest) not to minister in Sanctuary.
Speak unto Aaron and to his sons, that they separate themselves from the holy things of the children of Israel, and that they profane not my holy name in those things which they hallow unto me: I am the LORD.


76 Leviticus 21:6 - A defiled Cohen (priest), not to minister in Sanctuary.
They shall be holy unto their God, and not profane the name of their God: for the offerings of the LORD made by fire, and the bread of their God, they do offer: therefore they shall be holy.


77 Numbers 5:2 - A leper not to enter any part of Temple.
Command the children of Israel, that they put out of the camp every leper, and every one that hath an issue, and whosoever is defiled by the dead:


78 Deuteronomy 23:11 - No unclean person may enter camp of Levites.
But it shall be, when evening cometh on, he shall wash himself with water: and when the sun is down, he shall come into the camp again.