The MOST CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENT MADE

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I think I see the problem. (I'm amazed, I've never seen people not understand something so simple...)

It appears that many people here don't even know what baptism means. Why take issue with the simple meaning? It is all about dying to self as Jesus did. Baptism is crucifixion. Be glad that we have only the water ritual and not what each of us really deserves... or do some not think they need to die to self and demonstrate it in the appointed way? Why instead, argue that it means only HS baptism? Where on earth did THAT rebellious spirit come from? I mentioned this earlier, and it was like someone sicced the wolves on me, as though that wasn't the issue... so what IS the issue?

People here don't know what "baptism" means. Let's see some scholarly acknowledgement from everyone here that it is full submission and personal total participation WATER/BLOOD/HOLY SPIRIT of Christ Jesus who is the Gateway to the Kingdom to those who humbly submit. Can we all agree on this? This argument by "Christians" is really embarrassing for me to witness, please stop this sillyness
Baptizo. A greek word. which means to "place into" to "immerse" In the ancient greek. It was used as a form of dying something with blood. or with other things.

The problem is many in the christian church want to add the word "water" every time they see the word. Not only is it not used explicitly with water in greek texts. It is not in scripture either
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Actually, you are quite ignorant in the things you say sir. Newbirth rebuked you, very appropriately I might add. What you post is so unlearned, so unscriptural, and so blatantly false, that you demonstrate rebellious intent toward simple facts. You should read more and respond less, so that you might learn and not be so arrogant in your false doctrine.
lol. Wow I see Christian chat has not changed.

He did not rebuke me at all. If you think so. I am sorry. The arrogance in here is amazing. Is this how Gods people are supposed to discuss the word of God?

Maybe you need to study more?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I have no doubt you died ...but for what it's worth I don't know what was resurrected....because you are preaching a different gospel bro...
I am?

For God so loved the world he gave his only son that whoever believes in him shall never perish, but HAS eternal life.

No baptism.

why are you trying to add it??

Your the one teaching a different gospel. a gospel of works. Your taking credit for the work of God. thats dangerous bro.


Eph 1: 13 - 14 Faith alone. no baptism

You also have all the OT people going to hell. since their gospel is also our gospel. Why would God do that?


I am not going to argue with you. I was baptised in water. And am proud of it. I did what God said to do. I just do not think I am saved by it. That would make me earn salvation.
 
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sin begets death.
"changing your mind from sinful ways to Gods way" is tantamount to recognizing that sin is death, dying to it and becoming alive to righteousness. "to repent" literally means "to turn away from."
turning from death to life.
this is exactly, humbling ourselves to the cross.
so how do you die to sin and become alive to righteousness....it is at baptism...
Colossians 2:9-15American Standard Version (ASV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP]for in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily,
[SUP]10 [/SUP]and in him ye are made full, who is the head of all principality and power:
[SUP]11 [/SUP]in whom ye were also circumcised with a circumcision not made with hands, in the putting off of the body of the flesh, in the circumcision of Christ;
[SUP]12 [/SUP]having been buried with him in baptism, wherein ye were also raised with him through faith in the working of God, who raised him from the dead.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]And you, being dead through your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, you, I say, did he make alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses;
[SUP]14 [/SUP]having blotted out the bond written in ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us: and he hath taken it out that way, nailing it to the cross;
[SUP]15 [/SUP]having despoiled the principalities and the powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it.



lets have a look at another translation...
Colossians 2:9-15Names of God Bible (NOG)

[SUP]9 [/SUP]All of God lives in Christ’s body, [SUP]10 [/SUP]and God has made you complete in Christ. Christ is in charge of every ruler and authority. [SUP]11 [/SUP]In him you were also circumcised. It was not a circumcision performed by human hands. But it was a removal of the corrupt nature in the circumcision performed by Christ. [SUP]12 [/SUP]This happened when you were placed in the tomb with Christ through baptism. In baptism you were also brought back to life with Christ through faith in the power of God,[SUP][a][/SUP] who brought him back to life.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]You were once dead because of your failures and your uncircumcised corrupt nature. But God made you alive with Christ when he forgave all our failures. [SUP]14 [/SUP]He did this by erasing the charges that were brought against us by the written laws God had established. He took the charges away by nailing them to the cross. [SUP]15 [/SUP]He stripped the rulers and authorities of their power and made a public spectacle of them as he celebrated his victory in Christ.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
exactly what I said ....no repentance no baptism ....only believe....that is what you teach.....

No I do not teach this. You just believe. I teach faith. Faith is not belief, one can believe and never be saved, (as you do)

It takes true repentance to have true faith. With out repentance there will be no faith.

Your faith is in yourself and your work. Thus you do not have faith, you have mere belief.
 
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I am?

For God so loved the world he gave his only son that whoever believes in him shall never perish, but HAS eternal life.

No baptism.

why are you trying to add it??

Your the one teaching a different gospel. a gospel of works. Your taking credit for the work of God. thats dangerous bro.


Eph 1: 13 - 14 Faith alone. no baptism

You also have all the OT people going to hell. since their gospel is also our gospel. Why would God do that?


I am not going to argue with you. I was baptised in water. And am proud of it. I did what God said to do. I just do not think I am saved by it. That would make me earn salvation.
how could baptism make you earn salvation when Christ tells you to do it?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
he admits his baptism is not that which was practised by the apostles...water baptism...
repentance comes before baptism....repentance is a change of mind from one's sinful ways to Gods way...not this...
he is trying to explain his spiritual baptism...not repentance...

no, repentance is changing ones mind. Admitting you are a sinner, and have NO HOPE.

Trying to place your hope in yourself (water baptism) And not in God (spirit baptism) Thus you have yet to repent.
Like the jews in the NT, You believe in Jesus, But yur faith is in your works.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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wow, it's really all about the mikveh with you, and nothing about the spirit and the fire and the blood :(

so far we've got:

ritual = grace
ritual = salvation
ritual = regeneration
ritual = rebirth
ritual = repentance

i can see how ornate monstrosities of baptistries like this get built:


2012_Baptistry.jpg
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
how could baptism make you earn salvation when Christ tells you to do it?
Christ tells you to take communion, to go to church, to obey his commands, to do many many things.

Not to get saved, but because you are saved. What makes baptism different than any of the other things he commands? if your going to add one, you better add them all. And you better be perfect at obeying them all. or your still lost.
 
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No I do not teach this. You just believe. I teach faith. Faith is not belief, one can believe and never be saved, (as you do)

It takes true repentance to have true faith. With out repentance there will be no faith.

Your faith is in yourself and your work. Thus you do not have faith, you have mere belief.
here you say....
one can believe and never be saved
and your previous post...
For God so loved the world he gave his only son that whoever believes in him shall never perish, but HAS eternal life.
see how confused you are..
.I am?

For God so loved the world he gave his only son that whoever believes in him shall never perish, but HAS eternal life.

No baptism.

why are you trying to add it??

Your the one teaching a different gospel. a gospel of works. Your taking credit for the work of God. thats dangerous bro.


Eph 1: 13 - 14 Faith alone. no baptism

You also have all the OT people going to hell. since their gospel is also our gospel. Why would God do that?


I am not going to argue with you. I was baptised in water. And am proud of it. I did what God said to do. I just do not think I am saved by it. That would make me earn salvation.

why then were you baptised?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
confusion begets confusion
I am not confused. but there you go again with your arrogant responses. Your attitude shows you are not from God. You may be saved (although I doubt it by your gospel) but your definitely not showing the love of Christ.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
here you say....and your previous post...
see how confused you are..
Your confused.

Is my belief in Christ. or in my works (ie baptism)


If my belief is in my work. then I have not obeyed John 3: 16




why then were you baptised?
The same reason I

go to church
Study to shew myself approved
Take communion
Make disciples of those around me
etc etc etc..

Because God told me to. I love God. thus I want to do what he asks me to do.
 
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Christ tells you to take communion, to go to church, to obey his commands, to do many many things.

Not to get saved, but because you are saved. What makes baptism different than any of the other things he commands? if your going to add one, you better add them all. And you better be perfect at obeying them all. or your still lost.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
 
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Your confused.

Is my belief in Christ. or in my works (ie baptism)


If my belief is in my work. then I have not obeyed John 3: 16






The same reason I

go to church
Study to shew myself approved
Take communion
Make disciples of those around me
etc etc etc..

Because God told me to. I love God. thus I want to do what he asks me to do.
so you believe in Christ and he tells you to do something if you disobey do you still consider yourself a believer?he tells us to be baptised it is not our work whatever he tells us to do is his work...if you make baptism your work then it becomes your work..How can you obey Jn 3:16 when you don't believe Mk 16:16 or Matt 28:19
 
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that's a non-answer.

please, answer my question.

can a man isolated from everything else, but having the word of God, be saved?
this is called tempting God...why are you putting limits on God and asking me questions like satan asked Christ?... your question shows you have no confidence in God.....
 
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I am not confused. but there you go again with your arrogant responses. Your attitude shows you are not from God. You may be saved (although I doubt it by your gospel) but your definitely not showing the love of Christ.
That is because your teaching is false and you see through your doctrine...
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,444
13,377
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this is called tempting God...why are you putting limits on God and asking me questions like satan asked Christ?... your question shows you have no confidence in God.....
i think you're misunderstanding me, too.

i'm asking you if you put limits on God.
i'm asking you if you have confidence in God.
i'm asking you if you believe that He is strong to save anyone who hears the word and believes it, as He promised.

i'm asking you because i know He is able, and sufficient, and i'm trying to help you understand that He is.
 
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i think you're misunderstanding me, too.

i'm asking you if you put limits on God.
i'm asking you if you have confidence in God.
i'm asking you if you believe that He is strong to save anyone who hears the word and believes it, as He promised.

i'm asking you because i know He is able, and i'm trying to help you understand that He is.
I am not misunderstanding you .....you have removed the order of God and replaced it with your own....
Acts 2:38-39King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]38 [/SUP]Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[SUP]39 [/SUP]For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.