THE CALLING OUT OF THE BRIDE, to go to The Wedding of the Lamb

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J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#81
I married Him quite some time back. He is the Lord God almighty, Jesus my Groom.
Could you then please provide a date for the reception and marriage supper, so the rest of us can better plan accordingly?
 
Nov 3, 2014
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#82
John MacArthur is one of the few preachers today that still teaches biblical Christianity

He may not get everything right related to the prophetic scriptures .... but He is willing to learn and modify as time goes on
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#83
The marriage supper of the lamb takes place during the trib. While people on Earth are fighting for their lives, we are having a party. Then after the party we go to war, with The king of Kings leading the charge.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#84
The marriage supper of the lamb takes place during the trib. While people on Earth are fighting for their lives, we are having a party. Then after the party we go to war, with The king of Kings leading the charge.
Adrian Rogers once said it won't be much of a battle, though, that he could see it consisting of two words from the Lord, "Drop dead!"
 
Oct 24, 2014
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#85
Could you then please provide a date for the reception and marriage supper, so the rest of us can better plan accordingly?
Glad to! :)

Grab your wedding garments! Hurry!
(Mat 22:2)
The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
(Mat 22:3)
And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
(Mat 22:4)
Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
(Mat 22:5)
But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
(Mat 22:6)
And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.
(Mat 22:7)
But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
(Mat 22:8)
Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
(Mat 22:9)
Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.
(Mat 22:10)
So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
(Mat 22:11)
And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
(Mat 22:12)
And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
(Mat 22:13)
Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
(Mat 22:14)
For many are called, but few are chosen.


(Mat 22:3)


And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.





(Luk 12:36)
And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.


(Rev 3:20)
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

!!!!!!

What are you waiting for? We have been waaaaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiitinnnnnnnnnnnnnng :) Hurry, time is short!
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#86
Adrian Rogers once said it won't be much of a battle, though, that he could see it consisting of two words from the Lord, "Drop dead!"
More like a massacre than a battle. But what people don't realize and where the confusion comes in is that people will be saved during the trib and most will be killed but not all and that's why people get confused with the Second coming with the rapture.

I meant just think how many will give their hearts to Christ after the rapture and say Oh my God they were right.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#87
More like a massacre than a battle. But what people don't realize and where the confusion comes in is that people will be saved during the trib and most will be killed but not all and that's why people get confused with the Second coming with the rapture.

I meant just think how many will give their hearts to Christ after the rapture and say Oh my God they were right.
The tribulation will be a great revival, somebody once saying "144,000 apostle Pauls on the loose," and, no doubt, things scoffed at now will suddenly become very real and present. One problem we have now is nobody really has to deal with God, at least that they can see, and an unfortunate truth that people only call on God when there's nothing left to turn to, don't need Him when times are good.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#88
The tribulation will be a great revival, somebody once saying "144,000 apostle Pauls on the loose," and, no doubt, things scoffed at now will suddenly become very real and present. One problem we have now is nobody really has to deal with God, at least that they can see, and an unfortunate truth that people only call on God when there's nothing left to turn to, don't need Him when times are good.

It will be an underground revival as the Church has been taken and the Holy Spirit will not be in full power as God allows the Antichrist to rule. Those who get saved will be killed and most by beheading it will be the worst time ever to be a christian. But those killed will receive glorified bodies just like we will. So still better to be saved than to give up, many a christian has been killed in times past and even now. Muslims are killing Christians as fast as they can and by beheading.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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#89
All you have to do is say I DO and receive Him into your bridechamber and bring forth Christ in you :)

I married Him quite some time back. He is the Lord God almighty, Jesus my Groom.

Everyone is SUPPOSED to marry Him, my my, what might anyone be waiting for?!

(Eph 5:31)
For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
(Eph 5:32)
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
(Eph 2:15)
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
(Rom 7:4)...


be married ... to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Only then Can we Bring Forth the New Man child from within us as His Bride. That is His Coming.

(Joh 16:19)
Now Jesus knew that they were desirous to ask him, and said unto them, Do ye enquire among yourselves of that I said, A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me?
(Joh 16:20)
Verily, verily, I say unto you, That ye shall weep and lament, but the world shall rejoice: and ye shall be sorrowful, but your sorrow shall be turned into joy.
(Joh 16:21)
A woman when she is in travail hath sorrow, because her hour is come: but as soon as she is delivered of the child, she remembereth no more the anguish, for joy that a man is born into the world.
(Joh 16:22)


And ye now therefore have sorrow: but I will see you again, and your heart shall rejoice, and your joy no man taketh from you.





(Rev 22:17)
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.


(Gal 4:26)
But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


MY, so you arranged your own Marriage contract. That is not only NOT BIBLICAL, but also IT IS NOT EVEN in agreement with the teachings of ANY RABBI.

The Betrothal Cup at the Last Supper, IF YOU ARE BORN AGAIN, made you part of the Bride for the Betrothal Period, BUT THE WEDDING CEREMONY IS NEVER UNTIL THE BRIDEGROOM FINISHES THE NEW DWELLING PLACE, AND THE FATHER SENDS HIM TO CALL OUT HIS BRIDE, AND HE TAKES HER TO HER NEW DWELLING PLACE IN THE FATHER'S HOUSE.


Ancient Jewish Wedding and the Return of Our Bride Groom King
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#90
The marriage supper of the lamb takes place during the trib. While people on Earth are fighting for their lives, we are having a party. Then after the party we go to war, with The king of Kings leading the charge.

NO! It takes place AFTER THIS BATTLE at the very END of Tribulation, thus it is at the beginning of HIS 1000 Year Kingdom:

Revelation 17:14 (HCSB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] These will make war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will conquer them because He is Lord of lords and King of kings. Those with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”

Revelation 19:11-21 (NASB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] And I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse, and He who sat on it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and wages war.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] His eyes are a flame of fire, and on His head are many diadems; and He has a name written on Him which no one knows except Himself.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] And the armies which are in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, were following Him on white horses.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] From His mouth comes a sharp sword, so that with it He may strike down the nations, and He will rule them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS."
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and he cried out with a loud voice, saying to all the birds which fly in midheaven, "Come, assemble for the great supper of God,
[SUP]18 [/SUP] so that you may eat the flesh of kings and the flesh of commanders and the flesh of mighty men and the flesh of horses and of those who sit on them and the flesh of all men, both free men and slaves, and small and great."
[SUP]19 [/SUP] And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies assembled to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And the beast was seized, and with him the false prophet who performed the signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image; these two were thrown alive into the lake of fire which burns with brimstone.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] And the rest were killed with the sword which came from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse, and all the birds were filled with their flesh.
{Sounds to me like it comes immediately after ALL of His enemies are Detroyed, at HIS SECOND COMING.}
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#91
the actual wedding will be in the very end of rev.

1And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away;
and there was no more sea.

2And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven,

prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.


3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying,
Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men,
and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people,
and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

7He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

Think again, a Jewish Wedding is a Week long Ceremony, and I believe that while that is going on in Heaven, the 70th Week of Daniel will be going on here on earth. That WEEK, is clearly a Week of Years, not days, according to Daniel. And while GOD is redeeming Israel during that 70th Week, HE will be pouring out His Wrath on the Unbelievers of Earth, also known as the Great Tribulation.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#92
It will be an underground revival as the Church has been taken and the Holy Spirit will not be in full power as God allows the Antichrist to rule. Those who get saved will be killed and most by beheading it will be the worst time ever to be a christian. But those killed will receive glorified bodies just like we will. So still better to be saved than to give up, many a christian has been killed in times past and even now. Muslims are killing Christians as fast as they can and by beheading.
Here is the Catch 22 though. I used to be a Volunteer Prison Chaplain in the Prison where the most violent inmates in California were housed. The threat of violence with them only brought the response, "Bring it, I can take it!" When I taught about the Tribulation Saints, I found a way make the seriousness of refusing the Mark of the Beast real to them. I would say to the Christian inmates, "I know you can say in a macho attitude that there is no threat, including being beheaded, that could make you deny Christ and accept that mark. BUT, can you watch them behead your two year old daughter and not take the mark to save her life; or watch them behead your baby boy and not take the mark to save his life?" They would get real silent, and the macho attitude would disappear.

I think that is exactly how EVIL things will get when the Holy Spirit and the Church-age believers are Called Out to go to Heaven for the Wedding of the Lamb. That Evil in the form of the Antichrist, cannot come to full power while we are here, because we have the Holy Spirit in us, but the Bible says there is a time when HE will be taken out of the way. If the Holy Spirit is going some place "out of the way", so that Antichrist can come to full power, WE HAVE TO GO WITH HIM; because Christ promised HE would never leave us.

2 Thessalonians 2:7-12 (NKJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders,
[SUP]10 [/SUP] and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie,
[SUP]12 [/SUP] that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Antichrist will form a seven year peace treaty with Israel, allowing them to build the Third Temple, and 3.5 years later, breaks the treaty, putting an end to the sacrifices in the Temple. The Antichrist will actually set up his throne in the Holy of Holies and demand to be worshipped as god. I know many think that in and of itself is the Abomination of Desolation, but I suspect that is not the whole story.

Daniel 9:27 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] He will make a firm covenant with many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering. And the abomination of desolation will be on a wing of the temple until the decreed destruction is poured out on the desolator.”

2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 (NKJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,
[SUP]4 [/SUP] who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

What is the ONLY Seat in the Temple and it's location?

CORRECT, it is the Mercy Seat in the Holy of Holies.

Exodus 25:15-22 (HCSB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] The poles are to remain in the rings of the ark; they must not be removed from it.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] Put the ⌊tablets of the⌋ testimony that I will give you into the ark.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Make a mercy seat of pure gold, 45 inches long and 27 inches wide.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Make two cherubim of gold; make them of hammered work at the two ends of the mercy seat.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Make one cherub at one end and one cherub at the other end. At its two ends, make the cherubim of one piece with the mercy seat.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] The cherubim are to have wings spread out above, covering the mercy seat with their wings, and are to face one another. The faces of the cherubim should be toward the mercy seat.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] Set the mercy seat on top of the ark and put the testimony that I will give you into the ark.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] I will meet with you there above the mercy seat, between the two cherubim that are over the ark of the testimony; I will speak with you from there about all that I command you regarding the Israelites.

Leviticus 16:15 (NKJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] "Then he shall kill the goat of the sin offering, which is for the people, bring its blood inside the veil, do with that blood as he did with the blood of the bull, and sprinkle it on the mercy seat and before the mercy seat.

Since it says the Antichrist will SIT as God in the temple, it will be in the Holy of Holies (the Inner Room), not on one of the wings of the temple.


What then is the Antichrist going to put on one of the two Wings of the Temple?
Could it be a guillotine to begin the beheadings?
Is that the Abomination of Desolation prophesied?
 
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watcher2013

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Aug 6, 2013
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#93
It does not tell us who they are verbatim, but I think there is a VERY STRONG HINT:

Hebrews 9:27 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,

And the only exception to that Rule that I find is this:

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the archangel’s voice, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then we who are still alive will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and so we will always be with the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore encourage one another with these words.

ENOCH and ELIJAH did NOT die, HOWEVER:

1 Corinthians 15:50 (NIV)
[SUP]50 [/SUP] I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

So we know GOD did not take them to Heaven, but where did he send them then?

GOD is Omnipresent Not only in ever cubic inch that exists, but ALSO in every second of TIME as we know it at the same time. That is why HE is called the I AM. HE is not a created being traveling through time like we do, HE IS LITERALLY THE CREATOR OF TIME as we know it. HE declares the End from the Beginning because HE is the I AM simultaneously in all time. Don't put GOD in a box called TIME, HE does not fit there, because HE is thee ETERNAL BEING, GOD. Since we know NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE WITH GOD, is it not possible that GOD grabbed ENOCH and ELIJAH out of their time frame and put them in the End Times to Lead HIS CHOSEN NATION ISRAEL to believe in Yeshua as Messiah?

What would be the effect on Jews if those two returned and they they were miraculously recognized like on the Mount of Transfiguration, and they were doing miracles like the Prophets of Old to validate they were sent by GOD?
Would there not be a MASSIVE conversion in ISRAEL?


AND then the two witnesses are killed in the streets of Jerusalem by the Antichrist, keeping GOD's word 100% accurate, about GOD giving men once to die, EXCEPT those who are caught up to meet HIM in the air, when He calls out HIS BRIDE (True Believers of all time).

Acts 1:6-7 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] So when they had come together, they asked Him, “Lord, are You restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?”
[SUP]7 [/SUP] He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or periods that the Father has set by His own authority.

GOD IS NOT FINISHED WITH ISRAEL, and the 70th WEEK of Daniel has not happened, YET.

READ Joel Chapter 2, about the END of the Tribulation WEEK of Years. You will see absolute proof that GOD is not finished with Israel, AND you will find that the Bride, the Church, IS IN THE NEW DWELLING PLACE IN HEAVEN, and leaves to come with the Bridegroom, CHRIST to set up HIS KINGDOM on Earth. These things were hidden until the time of the END. I believe we are rapidly approaching that DAY.
Enoch and elijah, why they need to die when the bible said clearly that therr will be people alive when He returns...
Remember " those who are ALIVE AND REMAIN".
You are using the passage in hebrew falsely. Plus there are people who had been dead then resurrected. Did they violate your "die once" teaching?

Another God never stop dealing with Israel.
Regarding the Gospel they were blinded in PART only.
Regarding Israel Nation, Read the book of ezekiel 36-37.
Regarding Israel and its enemies future eze 38-39

Regarding the future bride. I suggest you read Isaiah 62
 

watcher2013

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Aug 6, 2013
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#94
the Church is the Body of Christ, not the sum of all believers. The Church was still future in Mat 16 ("I will build My Church"). Abraham was not in the Church, nor Moses. In the Tribulation or Dan's 70th week in scripture, the Church is never mentioned. The witnesses are evidently saints of a different age, not the Church Age.
What is the age after the Church age?
Does this mean the church will no longer exist after the church age?
Before Christ there was the LAW, so what is there after Christ?

If those two are cleansed by the blood of Christ that means those two witnesses are part of the Church.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#95
Enoch and elijah, why they need to die when the bible said clearly that therr will be people alive when He returns...
Remember " those who are ALIVE AND REMAIN".
You are using the passage in hebrew falsely. Plus there are people who had been dead then resurrected. Did they violate your "die once" teaching?

Another God never stop dealing with Israel.
Regarding the Gospel they were blinded in PART only.
Regarding Israel Nation, Read the book of ezekiel 36-37.
Regarding Israel and its enemies future eze 38-39

Regarding the future bride. I suggest you read Isaiah 62
YES, HE gives us an exception, and it clearly points out that those two did not die. However, the Calling Out of the Bride is what it is talking about, when He mentions those who are ALIVE AND REMAIN. That is YET another reason why that Prophecy has to happen Before the Seven Year Peace Treaty begins, that the Antichrist will make with Israel. The Two Witnesses appear on the scene sometime AFTER that Peace Treaty begins. Clearly that one week that Daniel is talking about is the 70th week of Daniel, and it is a week of years, set apart from the 69 weeks by the Church-age. The Calling Out of the Bride happens at the End of the Church-age, just prior to the beginning of the one week mentioned in Daniel 9:27.

Daniel 9:27 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]He will make a firm covenant with many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering. And the abomination of desolation will be on a wing of the temple until the decreed destruction is poured out on the desolator.”

Thank you, that is yet another Biblical support for a pre-Tribulation Calling Out of the Bride of Christ, that I had never thought of before.
 

watcher2013

Senior Member
Aug 6, 2013
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#96
YES, HE gives us an exception, and it clearly points out that those two did not die. However, the Calling Out of the Bride is what it is talking about, when He mentions those who are ALIVE AND REMAIN. That is YET another reason why that Prophecy has to happen Before the Seven Year Peace Treaty begins, that the Antichrist will make with Israel. The Two Witnesses appear on the scene sometime AFTER that Peace Treaty begins. Clearly that one week that Daniel is talking about is the 70th week of Daniel, and it is a week of years, set apart from the 69 weeks by the Church-age. The Calling Out of the Bride happens at the End of the Church-age, just prior to the beginning of the one week mentioned in Daniel 9:27.

Daniel 9:27 (HCSB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]He will make a firm covenant with many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering. And the abomination of desolation will be on a wing of the temple until the decreed destruction is poured out on the desolator.”

Thank you, that is yet another Biblical support for a pre-Tribulation Calling Out of the Bride of Christ, that I had never thought of before.
In your OP you believed that all believers are sum up of all the churches; The CHurch.

The two witnesses are believers either symbolic or figurative thus they are part of the Church.

Where they left behind? That part of the church?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#97
In your OP you believed that all believers are sum up of all the churches; The CHurch.

The two witnesses are believers either symbolic or figurative thus they are part of the Church.

Where they left behind? That part of the church?
That period of time after the Church-age is a Combination of the 70th week of years recorded in Daniel, and the Week of Years that was supposed to be a Peace Treaty with Israel, orchestrated by the Antichrist, which is also known as Tribulation. They run literally simultaneously for that Seven Year period which is the final age of man ruling the Earth. Then COMES the Second Coming of Christ, when He sets up His 1000 Year Kingdom and rules from David's Throne.

The Two witnesses come to fulfill God's Promises to ISRAEL, in the 70th Week of Daniel. Those who did not receive Jesus Christ by submitting to His LORDSHIP, prior to the End of the Church-age, will have to become Martyred Saints, during the Tribulation. THUS even Jews who turn to believe in Jesus as the Messiah after the Rapture of the Church, who are not part of the 144,000 mortal Jews sealed from harm by GOD; will become martyred Tribulation Saints.

Revelation 6:9-11 (HCSB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the people slaughtered because of God’s word and the testimony they had.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] They cried out with a loud voice: “Lord, the One who is holy and true, how long until You judge and avenge our blood from those who live on the earth?”
[SUP]11 [/SUP] So a white robe was given to each of them, and they were told to rest a little while longer until ⌊the number⌋ would be completed ⌊of⌋ their fellow slaves and their brothers, who were going to be killed just as they had been.

Revelation 7:13-15 (NIV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Then one of the elders asked me, "These in white robes--who are they, and where did they come from?"
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I answered, "Sir, you know." And he said, "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Therefore, "they are before the throne of God and serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne will spread his tent over them.

Revelation 20:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them {Church-age Saints}. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded {Tribulation Saints} because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they {both groups} came to life {The Church-age Saints before Tribulation and the Tribulation Saints AFTER Tribulation.} and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

NOW, before you get confused, and ask about Old Testament Saints, the BRIDE of CHRIST is made up of Old Testament Saints, Church-age Saints, and Tribulation Saints. ALL three groups were Sanctified by the Blood of Lamb, Jesus Christ.

Old Testament Saints believed the Messiah would come and save them from their Sins.
Church-age and Tribulation Saints believe Messiah did come and saved us by the shedding of His Blood.

Thus the Bride of Christ is made up of all three groups. Thinking that the Church is the only group that is the Bride of Christ, leads to all kinds of Confusion about Prophecy. I have a Surprise for you, the word CHURCH is NOT in the original language manuscripts. The word actually used was the "Assembly" of the Lord; the same thing He called the Old Testament Saints. Look at this verse in Young's Literal Translation:

Ephesians 5:23 (YLT)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] because the husband is head of the wife, as also the Christ is head of the assembly, and He is saviour of the body,

Matthew 16:18 (YLT)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] `And I also say to thee, that thou art a rock, and upon this rock I will build my assembly, and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it;
 
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watcher2013

Senior Member
Aug 6, 2013
1,931
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#98
That period of time after the Church-age is a Combination of the 70th week of years recorded in Daniel, and the Week of Years that was supposed to be a Peace Treaty with Israel, orchestrated by the Antichrist, which is also known as Tribulation. They run literally simultaneously for that Seven Year period which is the final age of man ruling the Earth. Then COMES the Second Coming of Christ, when He sets up His 1000 Year Kingdom and rules from David's Throne
Based on Daniel's vision there are four stages prior to God' Kingdom:
1 beast, 2nd beast , 3rd beast then the fourth beast.
you see the Church will never end. As such it will stay forever.

" church age was introduced to support the pretrib doctrine.

The Two witnesses come to fulfill God's Promises to ISRAEL, in the 70th Week of Daniel. Those who did not receive Jesus Christ by submitting to His LORDSHIP, prior to the End of the Church-age, will have to become Martyred Saints, during the Tribulation. THUS even Jews who turn to believe in Jesus as the Messiah after the Rapture of the Church, who are not part of the 144,000 mortal Jews sealed from harm by GOD; will become martyred Tribulation Saints.
i do not know how you consider the death of James, Stephen,Peter etc... Some were stoned to death, crucified and beheaded.they were martyred.

and even today who have attain righteousness by their works..none..this will be the same...

no one can attained righteousness in the future time by their works (being martyred)
this teaching of attaining righteousness during tribulation by becoming a martyr is to delegitimise and belittling the works of our Lord Christ on the cross.

Revelation 6:9-11 (HCSB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the people slaughtered because of God’s word and the testimony they had.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] They cried out with a loud voice: “Lord, the One who is holy and true, how long until You judge and avenge our blood from those who live on the earth?”
[SUP]11 [/SUP] So a white robe was given to each of them, and they were told to rest a little while longer until ⌊the number⌋ would be completed ⌊of⌋ their fellow slaves and their brothers, who were going to be killed just as they had been.

Revelation 7:13-15 (NIV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Then one of the elders asked me, "These in white robes--who are they, and where did they come from?"
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I answered, "Sir, you know." And he said, "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Therefore, "they are before the throne of God and serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne will spread his tent over them.

Revelation 20:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them {Church-age Saints}. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded {Tribulation Saints} because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they {both groups} came to life {The Church-age Saints before Tribulation and the Tribulation Saints AFTER Tribulation.} and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
you are mixing things up;

please see note that in rev 6 those who were given the robe were told to wait for their "fellow" brothers ( Israel?)
also rev 7 speaks that those who come out of great tribulation are before the throne and serve him? Did you notice where your church age saints?

NOW, before you get confused, and ask about Old Testament Saints, the BRIDE of CHRIST is made up of Old Testament Saints, Church-age Saints, and Tribulation Saints. ALL three groups were Sanctified by the Blood of Lamb, Jesus Christ.

Old Testament Saints believed the Messiah would come and save them from their Sins.
Church-age and Tribulation Saints believe Messiah did come and saved us by the shedding of His Blood.

Thus the Bride of Christ is made up of all three groups. Thinking that the Church is the only group that is the Bride of Christ, leads to all kinds of Confusion about Prophecy. I have a Surprise for you, the word CHURCH is NOT in the original language manuscripts. The word actually used was the "Assembly" of the Lord; the same thing He called the Old Testament Saints. Look at this verse in Young's Literal Translation:

Ephesians 5:23 (YLT)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] because the husband is head of the wife, as also the Christ is head of the assembly, and He is saviour of the body,

Matthew 16:18 (YLT)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] `And I also say to thee, that thou art a rock, and upon this rock I will build my assembly, and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it;
i think you are the one who is confused about what is the bride.
Isaiah 62 and rev 21 talks about it as the New Jerusalem
Abraham looked for that heavenly city (heb11:16), the city of God rev 3:12.
read my blog about the bride.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
#99
In your OP you believed that all believers are sum up of all the churches; The CHurch.

The two witnesses are believers either symbolic or figurative thus they are part of the Church.

Where they left behind? That part of the church?

NO, I believe the TWO WITNESSES, literally are Enoch and Elijah, and GOD who is Omnipresent in all time, grabbed them out of their time frame, and PLACED them in them in the 70th Week of Daniel, to be instrumental in fulfilling these prophecies about Israel, leading them all to believe in Yeshua as they Messiah and LORD.

Ezekiel 37:21 (HCSB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] tell them: This is what the Lord GOD says: I am going to take the Israelites out of the nations where they have gone. I will gather them from all around and bring them into their own land.

AND for the past few decades, we have been witnessing that very event being fulfilled; BUT GOD IS NOT FINISHED WITH ISRAEL.

Romans 11:25-27 (NKJV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP] For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
[SUP]26 [/SUP] And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
[SUP]27 [/SUP] For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins."

Jeremiah 23:6 (NKJV)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] In His days Judah will be saved, And Israel will dwell safely; Now this is His name by which He will be called: THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

Ezekiel 34:13-15 (NKJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] And I will bring them out from the peoples and gather them from the countries, and will bring them to their own land; I will feed them on the mountains of Israel, in the valleys and in all the inhabited places of the country.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I will feed them in good pasture, and their fold shall be on the high mountains of Israel. There they shall lie down in a good fold and feed in rich pasture on the mountains of Israel.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] I will feed My flock, and I will make them lie down," says the Lord GOD.
Ezekiel 34:22 (NKJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] therefore I will save My flock, and they shall no longer be a prey; and I will judge between sheep and sheep.
Ezekiel 34:30-31 (NKJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] Thus they shall know that I, the LORD their God, am with them, and they, the house of Israel, are My people," says the Lord GOD.' "
[SUP]31 [/SUP] You are My flock, the flock of My pasture; you are men, and I am your God," says the Lord GOD.

Isaiah 4:2-4 (HCSB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] On that day the Branch of the LORD will be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the land will be the pride and glory of Israel’s survivors.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Whoever remains in Zion and whoever is left in Jerusalem will be called holy—all in Jerusalem who are destined to live—
[SUP]4 [/SUP] when the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion and cleansed the bloodguilt from the heart of Jerusalem by a spirit of judgment and a spirit of burning.

Ezekiel 39:28-29 (HCSB)
[SUP]28 [/SUP] They will know that I am Yahweh their God when I regather them to their own land after having exiled them among the nations. I will leave none of them behind.
[SUP]29 [/SUP] I will no longer hide My face from them, for I will pour out My Spirit on the house of Israel.” ⌊This is⌋ the declaration of the Lord GOD.


NOW, I ask you, what would be the effect of the TWO WITNESSES, if they were miraculously recognized by all the Jewish People as being Enoch and Elijah; just like the Disciples miraculously recognized Moses and Elijah on the Mt. of Transfiguration. And according to the Scriptures, these TWO WITNESSES will be doing miracles of GOD to validate GOD sent them; and what if their primary WITNESS was "Yeshua is your Messiah! Yeshua is God in the Flesh!" AND it would CERTAINLY be ALL OVER the TV NEWS over and over again in ISRAEL. How long would it take to convert every single one of the Jewish People to Believe and receive Jesus Christ as their Messiah and LORD?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
Based on Daniel's vision there are four stages prior to God' Kingdom:
1 beast, 2nd beast , 3rd beast then the fourth beast.
you see the Church will never end. As such it will stay forever.

" church age was introduced to support the pretrib doctrine.

i do not know how you consider the death of James, Stephen,Peter etc... Some were stoned to death, crucified and beheaded.they were martyred.

and even today who have attain righteousness by their works..none..this will be the same...

no one can attained righteousness in the future time by their works (being martyred)
this teaching of attaining righteousness during tribulation by becoming a martyr is to delegitimise and belittling the works of our Lord Christ on the cross.

you are mixing things up;

please see note that in rev 6 those who were given the robe were told to wait for their "fellow" brothers ( Israel?)
also rev 7 speaks that those who come out of great tribulation are before the throne and serve him? Did you notice where your church age saints?



i think you are the one who is confused about what is the bride.
Isaiah 62 and rev 21 talks about it as the New Jerusalem
Abraham looked for that heavenly city (heb11:16), the city of God rev 3:12.
read my blog about the bride.

NO, it is your mixed up understanding that is causing you to misunderstand what I said.

I CERTAINLY DID NOT SAY IT WAS THEIR MARTYRED BLOOD THAT SAVED THEM, IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN ON THE BLOOD OF JESUS THAT SAVES THEM.

You can LOOSE your misunderstanding about the Bride being the New City Jerusalem because it says:

Revelation 22:17 (HCSB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Both the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” Anyone who hears should say, “Come!” And the one who is thirsty should come. Whoever desires should take the living water as a gift.

NEVER EVER WILL A CITY SAY “Come!”

The Expression "adorned as a bride" is ONLY talking about HOW you dress up your HOUSE if you are going to have a Wedding in it. THUS, it it identifies the LOCATION of the Wedding, not who the Bride is.

Revelation 6:9-11 (HCSB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the people slaughtered because of God’s word and the testimony they had.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] They cried out with a loud voice: “Lord, the One who is holy and true, how long until You judge and avenge our blood from those who live on the earth?”
[SUP]11 [/SUP] So a white robe was given to each of them, and they were told to rest a little while longer until ⌊the number⌋ would be completed ⌊of⌋ their fellow slaves and their brothers, who were going to be killed just as they had been. {The Tribulation Saints.}
Revelation 7:13-14 (HCSB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Then one of the elders {THIS clearly identifies the LOCATION of the Church, as ALREADY BEING IN HEAVEN for the Wedding of the Lamb.} asked me, “Who are these people robed in white, and where did they come from?”
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I said to him, “Sir, you know.” Then he told me: These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

twenty-four elders. Their joint rule with Christ, their white garments (19:7, 8), and their golden crowns (2:10) all seem to indicate that these twenty-four represent the redeemed (vv. 9-11; 5:5-14; 7:11-17; 11:16-18; 14:3; 19:4). The question is which redeemed? Not Israel, since the nation is not yet saved, glorified, and coronated. That is still to come at this point in the events of the end. Their resurrection and glory will come at the end of the seven-year Tribulation time (cf. Dan. 12:1-3). Tribulation saints aren’t yet saved (7:9, 10). Only one group will be complete and glorified at this point—the church. Here, elders represent the church, which sings the song of redemption (5:8-10). They are the overcomers who have their crowns and live in the place prepared for them, where they have gone with Jesus (cf. John 14:1-4).
The MacArthur Bible Commentary.
 
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