"Prayer Won't Change Things. Only Money Will."

[seoulsearch]

Hey Singles,

Over the years, like anyone else, I've been to the doctor for a whole host of generic symptoms--can't sleep, headaches, nausea, fatigue... and like all of you, the doctors will then test me for a whole host of things that they guess it could possibly be.

While I feel very blessed to not have so many things they've tested me for, my heart always goes out to the people who DO suffer with these afflictions.

One of the charities I support is Diabetes Research, and in the latest newsletter I received today, there was a quote from a a Mom whose 3-year-old daughter suffers from type 1 diabetes. This woman made an incredibly poignant statement: "I always hear people say 'I pray for a cure.' I understand. I pray, too. But the bottom line is, money is what's going to cure diabetes. Not praying."

That statement has stayed with me all day. OF COURSE our trust is not in money, and we serve God above all else, NOT money. But the Bible also tells us... if someone is standing before us and is hungry, thirsty, in need, and we just say, "God bless you," or "I'll pray for you", what practical help are we really giving them?

And yet, we can't help everyone. Here are some other examples I've thought of today.

1. "I'll pray for the homeless." But how are we going to give the means to support themselves?

2. "I'll pray for a cure for cancer." But what do we pray? Do we pray for some brilliant scientist comes along and discovers a cure... all for free? At the very least, that scientist is going to need money to go to school.

3. "I'll pray for the church." Prayer is always helpful, but doesn't the church really need things like volunteers and funds to pay their bills?

4. I know there are a million examples but here's another one that's close to home: "I'll pray for CC." But will prayers alone, without donations, keep Christian Chat going?

"The bottom line is, prayer isn't going to cure or keep (insert your most passionate cause here) going. Money is."

I found this statement to be heartbreaking, raw, and very honest.

We will NEVER give up praying, of course. But at some point, God also calls us to roll up our sleeves and "Git R Done," too. After all, Jesus didn't save the world through His prayers alone.

What are your thoughts on the balance between prayer and actions when it comes to tackling the problems/diseases/pains of this world?

 

[David_1]

I think from prayer, we should then Do actions.

Like vote using critical thinking, not because our Church says always vote one party.

We should look at these charities and actually see what they use the monies for. I tend to favour research grants over 'awareness' charities, but not always.

We should support the integrity of peer review science, and not give in to skepticism funded by big oil interests.

Praying and thinking and observing better all helps!

imho

 

[Jimbone]

Hey Singles,

Over the years, like anyone else, I've been to the doctor for a whole host of generic symptoms--can't sleep, headaches, nausea, fatigue... and like all of you, the doctors will then test me for a whole host of things that they guess it could possibly be.

While I feel very blessed to not have so many things they've tested me for, my heart always goes out to the people who DO suffer with these afflictions.

One of the charities I support is Diabetes Research, and in the latest newsletter I received today, there was a quote from a a Mom whose 3-year-old daughter suffers from type 1 diabetes. This woman made an incredibly poignant statement: "I always hear people say 'I pray for a cure.' I understand. I pray, too. But the bottom line is, money is what's going to cure diabetes. Not praying."

That statement has stayed with me all day. OF COURSE our trust is not in money, and we serve God above all else, NOT money. But the Bible also tells us... if someone is standing before us and is hungry, thirsty, in need, and we just say, "God bless you," or "I'll pray for you", what practical help are we really giving them?

And yet, we can't help everyone. Here are some other examples I've thought of today.

1. "I'll pray for the homeless." But how are we going to give the means to support themselves?

2. "I'll pray for a cure for cancer." But what do we pray? Do we pray for some brilliant scientist comes along and discovers a cure... all for free? At the very least, that scientist is going to need money to go to school.

3. "I'll pray for the church." Prayer is always helpful, but doesn't the church really need things like volunteers and funds to pay their bills?

4. I know there are a million examples but here's another one that's close to home: "I'll pray for CC." But will prayers alone, without donations, keep Christian Chat going?

"The bottom line is, prayer isn't going to cure or keep (insert your most passionate cause here) going. Money is."

I found this statement to be heartbreaking, raw, and very honest.

We will NEVER give up praying, of course. But at some point, God also calls us to roll up our sleeves and "Git R Done," too. After all, Jesus didn't save the world through His prayers alone.

What are your thoughts on the balance between prayer and actions when it comes to tackling the problems/diseases/pains of this world?

This is all very true but money is not a guaranteed fix either. The doctor you pay could make the mistake that kills you, or leave you worse off. Money is defiantly useful in this world no doubt, but having the Creator of the universe inside you with His assurance is on a different level than what money offers us in this world. "Prayer Won't Change Things. Only Money Will." is a raw, hard, truth in this world, but We are not of this world if we have His spirit in us. Money has nothing on what our God can do if it's His will. He can do what NOONE could buy with money. I wouldn't think of it from such a worldly perspective, He is so beyond that.

 

[djness]

This is why every given challenge and no shave november and pink ribbon is useless junk in my opinion.
Those people don't contribute anything. It's more of a fad then Kim K's butt.

I don't participate , I donate.

 

[Blain]

Prayer sometimes may not be enough, Sometimes it requires us to take action. I can see a homeless person and pray that they get help but if I had the means to help them but I instead simply asked God to help them then well...you get the idea. Money really does make the world go round, without money a family will become homeless without money a person cannot get their medicine without money we cannot fund research for cures.

I was with my mom going to a doctors appointment down town in okc I think it's called brick town. This area has many homeless ppl walking around. we were driving and saw a homeless person asking for change and I asked her if we could help him and she said no because odds are they either aren't really homeless or they will by alcohol. It is true that some ppl would actually pretend to be homeless instead of work but it's my moms kind of attitude that makes it where lots of ppl who actually need help don't get it. There are lots of groups that need help with funding to do what they do like the research for cures or the churches that help to feed and take care of the homeless and children and not to mention some ppl rely on donations to spread the gospel.

If I ever am able to get a job and if I am ever to be able to have control over my money you can bet I will be giving a good amount of it. Right now even if I had a job my mom would police my money and only give me like 20 bucks and I don't have a credit card which a lot of business requires to give. but one day I will be able to give freely because it's not about me. all I need is the essentials food water and a home, I can go without t.v. and internet for a while so that others can have the basics or so that others can continue helping ppl.

Believe me you all have no idea how lucky you are to have money and a job and are able to give freely

 

[seoulsearch]

He can do what NOONE could buy with money. I wouldn't think of it from such a worldly perspective, He is so beyond that.

I agree that God, of course, is completely beyond money.

However... some things to ponder.

I was found in a cardboard box in a street when I was a few days old. Someone found me and took me to an orphanage.

When the adoption agency contacted a young, God-fearing couple in a small Midwestern town, if they hadn't had the money to pay the fees, they would not have been able to adopt me.

Sure, God could have chosen to somehow save me without money. But in this situation, it was necessary.

That's not "thinking from such a worldly perspective."

That's real life.

My parents were also later blessed to be able to pay for several medical bills they had no idea they would encounter in adopting this child (meaning, me.) If my parents had not been able to pay for my surgeries, I would have gone blind in my 20's (which is why I also support an organization that makes resources for the blind.)

If I had not been found or adopted, I know very well what my fate most likely would have been--I would have died, been forced into child prostitution, or spent my life in an institution.

People can say, "Oh, I'll pray for the unwanted children of the world."

And then they can actually do something about it, like my parents. Which, I hate to tell you, worldly or not, most likely, will take money.

 

[seoulsearch]

Believe me you all have no idea how lucky you are to have money and a job and are able to give freely

I do feel very blessed when I am able to help others, Blain. I don't have a big money pot to give out, believe me. But if I am even able to give $10 to something I believe in (of course, my former adoption agency is tops on my list every year), I feel a deep joy that God has enabled me to hopefully bless another child in the way I was blessed.

 

[Jakob]

Maybe this is crazy, but it's almost as many people in the western world have the illusion of being free? Like we're so... Addicted? or rather in need of money. They made money to a worshipping God, kinda? And celebrities as the gold calf.
It's a cruel world,
when we buy smartphones, we are supporting the abuse of the minium wage, capitalism in china etc.
I mean, Nike were capitalists too in the 90's right? While we walk around with slavery stiched in our clothes..
We even need (what I would say is a lot of) money to buy Healthy food..
There's so much pain in this world that's confusing. All the wrong people have the power too.
I do understand the whole thing with money to be healthy etc, but what if a rich man gave food to a homeless man, wouldnt he still be homeless? BUT if you give him food AND hope, or a bible.
Kinda like, give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.


How sad it might sound, I think nothing will change when the people who have power is filled with greed in their soul.

 

[seoulsearch]

Maybe this is crazy, but it's almost as many people in the western world have the illusion of being free? Like we're so... Addicted? or rather in need of money. They made money to a worshipping God, kinda? And celebrities as the gold calf.
It's a cruel world,
when we buy smartphones, we are supporting the abuse of the minium wage, capitalism in china etc.
I do understand the whole thing with money to be healthy etc, but what if a rich man gave food to a homeless man, wouldnt he still be homeless?
How sad it might sound, I think nothing will change when the people who have power is filled with greed in their soul.

These are good thoughts and I think of them often as well. For instance, I don't have a smart phone and never intend to as long as I don't need one. I have a cheap phone that I've had for 5 years and use a $30-a-month plan.

So I often wonder... Should we all forego $500 phones if we don't really need them, and give the rest to a good cause, or to the poor? The same goes for everything else in life... Less expensive cars, fewer clothes, giving up or at least cutting back video games, fewer toys for our kids... I've even been in Walmart and thought, "I don't need this $5 bottle of nail polish. I could give it to another good cause..."

How far do we go? Where is the line to be drawn after which are we all to be convicted of "greed"?

 

[CatHerder]

[SUP]Good stuff, seoulsearch!

James 2 (ESV)
14 [/SUP]What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? [SUP]15 [/SUP]If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, [SUP]16 [/SUP]and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good[SUP][a][/SUP] is that? [SUP]17 [/SUP]So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

 

[Jimbone]

I agree that God, of course, is completely beyond money.

However... some things to ponder.

I was found in a cardboard box in a street when I was a few days old. Someone found me and took me to an orphanage.

When the adoption agency contacted a young, God-fearing couple in a small Midwestern town, if they hadn't had the money to pay the fees, they would not have been able to adopt me.

Sure, God could have chosen to somehow save me without money. But in this situation, it was necessary.

That's not "thinking from such a worldly perspective."

That's real life.

My parents were also later blessed to be able to pay for several medical bills they had no idea they would encounter in adopting this child (meaning, me.) If my parents had not been able to pay for my surgeries, I would have gone blind in my 20's (which is why I also support an organization that makes resources for the blind.)

If I had not been found or adopted, I know very well what my fate most likely would have been--I would have died, been forced into child prostitution, or spent my life in an institution.

People can say, "Oh, I'll pray for the unwanted children of the world."

And then they can actually do something about it, like my parents. Which, I hate to tell you, worldly or not, most likely, will take money.

I understand what you're saying but I'm sure you parents thanked God they had the money to adopt you, and God provided everything on this earth the businesses that they worked for used to build the building, make the products, run and operate them so there could even be anything or way to make money. I understand that money is a necessity to live in our society, but I just can't agree this at all, I can't make myself even type it. To me money is the bars on the invisible prison Satan's built around us, and prayer is so much more powerful than money to me, I just CAN'T look at it any other way. Sure I can't pray for a big mac or heart surgery and get it on demand, but I do value my relationship with God more than my own life, to be completely honest I value my connection through prayer with God more than my families lives when you get right down to it (Thank Him most of them know Him, still trying to point a few towards Him, so no hurry). Prayer and my ability to commune with our God is something money and ALL it can do for us in this world just can't touch. In my life and opinion anyway. I am not trying to "correct you" or even argue just to be right, but I just cannot agree, respectfully of course. I am sorry that you had to feel like this over someone's seeming true and sad truth.

 

[Jakob]

seoulsearch, yeah I think that's the problem, almost everyone has been raised by greed, not parents but then society.
Also in history it's filled with greed. And ALL of this, everything like empires, war, slavery, prostitution is man made, in search of happiness (Without God).
I mean, even the white house has, how many rooms again?? Good question why they dont welcome homeless people to stay with them with 100'rs of empty rooms. I mean are they not letting them in cause the white house is sacred? or too fancy?
The whole goverment is based on greed and narcissism I guess.

I do think it's okay to own possessions, as long as it's not a sickness.

 

[kenthomas27]

And are acts or works of faith any less of a miracle? Are they any less a Godly intervention? There's a friend that I once shared this thought with - that of the story of the loaves of bread and fish that Christ fed to the multitudes. After Christ blessed the small amount of food He and the disciples had collected and by the time it was passed around to the multitude, everyone was satisfied and there was so much left over there weren't enough baskets to save it all.

Would it have been any less a miracle if one of the multitude of people was so moved by witnessing Jesus and His Disciples giving all they had that they gave what they brought too. And then another was inspired by this one and gave all they had? Would it be any less an intervention of God that many were moved so that all were fed by the one's that had much to the one's that brought nothing? So much so that so much food was even left over?

Whether Jesus performed the supernatural miracle of multiplying food or the miracle was in the hearts of many men and women, to me, it's no less a divine intervention.

 

[seoulsearch]

I understand what you're saying but I'm sure you parents thanked God they had the money to adopt you, and God provided everything on this earth the businesses that they worked for used to build the building, make the products, run and operate them so there could even be anything or way to make money. I understand that money is a necessity to live in our society, but I just can't agree this at all, I can't make myself even type it. To me money is the bars on the invisible prison Satan's built around us, and prayer is so much more powerful than money to me, I just CAN'T look at it any other way. Sure I can't pray for a big mac or heart surgery and get it on demand, but I do value my relationship with God more than my own life, to be completely honest I value my connection through prayer with God more than my families lives when you get right down to it (Thank Him most of them know Him, still trying to point a few towards Him, so no hurry). Prayer and my ability to commune with our God is something money and ALL it can do for us in this world just can't touch. In my life and opinion anyway. I am not trying to "correct you" or even argue just to be right, but I just cannot agree, respectfully of course. I am sorry that you had to feel like this over someone's seeming true and sad truth.

I understand respectfully disagreeing and I appreciate that we disagree in a civil manner.

I'm curious though. If you see money as an evil prison with Satan as its source, I was just wondering about the motorcycle in your avatar.

Do you believe you should sell your motorcycle and just pray because having a materialistic relationship with something you value might get in the way of your relationship with God? I understand that God is above money in every way. The issue is more about how God can direct the USE of money rather than trying to say that money is more powerful.

I'm just curious about your opinion on such things if you see money as having a choke-hold on the world and that communing with God is the most important thing.

God is far above money. Therefore, He is also to be the driving force between what we choose to do with it, so what are everyone's thoughts about how we can better use such resources in order that God's will be done here on earth?

 

[Jimbone]

I understand respectfully disagreeing and I appreciate that we disagree in a civil manner.

I'm curious though. If you see money as an evil prison with Satan as its source, I was just wondering about the motorcycle in your avatar.

Do you believe you should sell your motorcycle and just pray because having a materialistic relationship with something you value might get in the way of your relationship with God? I understand that God is above money in every way. The issue is more about how God can direct the USE of money rather than trying to say that money is more powerful.

I'm just curious about your opinion on such things if you see money as having a choke-hold on the world and that communing with God is the most important thing.

God is far above money. Therefore, He is also to be the driving force between what we choose to do with it, so what are everyone's thoughts about how we can better use such resources in order that God's will be done here on earth?

I LOVE God for leading you to that question. That bike you see can't be sold. It doesn't work anymore. It didn't survive the wreak that took my right (dominate) arm like I did (only through Gods grace). I still don't have a ride because all I got out of this wreak was 1 less arm, and 700K in medical bills. Sister that bike lead me to the truth I've been telling you. I said I was a Christian before when I had that bike, but I wasn't. Read my testimony it's posted here and explains a LOT more about where my views come from. I'll put it like this, I wasn't raised in the church. Right now I could leave behind every worldly thing I own and not think twice about it if that's what He lead me to do. If you have anymore questions or doubts about my sincerity please don't hesitate to ask.

 

[gypsygirl]

to me this is somewhat of a simple issue. i can't blueprint plans to resolve massive problems far outside my sphere of influence and ability, but i can contribute, serve and give of myself and resources to the opportunities that reside inside of my "circle".

that means being subject to the opportunities that i can see that i can make a difference, however small or large my contribution might be in comparison to the actual need. maybe it's a donation for a need being collected for, or a person who needs help. someone who is heartbroken and needs encouragement, perhaps help taking a step forward. maybe it's serving in my church or maybe within my community. maybe helping a friend who needs some assistance getting back on their feet. maybe it's a need within my family.

there is no lack of clarity as to what the bible says about giving to others, helping the needy, serving others, and the value of giving what little you have, even when your "contribution" is small in comparison to the whole need.

the idea of simply praying and saying "God bless you" to people or causes in need and thinking that we are off the hook is as egregious to me who leave tracts and literature on restaurant tables instead of a full tip.

we are called to pray, to serve, to give, to show mercy to those in need, and we don't get to choose which of those edicts suit our preferences. yes, we need to pray, share, witness, and we also need to give of our resources as well. all of them.

great question, kim. : )

 

[gypsygirl]

to me this is somewhat of a simple issue. i can't blueprint plans to resolve massive problems far outside my sphere of influence and ability, but i can contribute, serve and give of myself and resources to the opportunities that reside inside of my "circle".

that means being subject to the opportunities that i can see that i can make a difference, however small or large my contribution might be in comparison to the actual need. maybe it's a donation for a need being collected for, or a person who needs help. someone who is heartbroken and needs encouragement, perhaps help taking a step forward. maybe it's serving in my church or maybe within my community. maybe helping a friend who needs some assistance getting back on their feet. maybe it's a need within my family.

there is no lack of clarity as to what the bible says about giving to others, helping the needy, serving others, and the value of giving what little you have, even when your "contribution" is small in comparison to the whole need.

the idea of simply praying and saying "God bless you" to people or causes in need and thinking that we are off the hook is as egregious to me who leave tracts and literature on restaurant tables instead of a full tip.

we are called to pray, to serve, to give, to show mercy to those in need, and we don't get to choose which of those edicts suit our preferences. yes, we need to pray, share, witness, and we also need to give of our resources as well. all of them.

great question, kim. : )

sorry, i didn't finish editing it in time.

i love that a widow who had so little to give, gave what she had in faith, and it was considered "more". i think sometimes people feel like if they can't eliminate a problem, they shouldn't bother. as if what they give doesn't count.

if we're giving only for that reason, that is a problem. i think obedience is a better reason to do it.

41 And he sat down opposite the treasury and watched the people putting money into the offering box. Many rich people put in large sums. 42 And a poor widow came and put in two small copper coins, which make a penny.[a] 43 And he called his disciples to him and said to them, “Truly, I say to you, this poor widow has put in more than all those who are contributing to the offering box.44 For they all contributed out of their abundance, but she out of her poverty has put in everything she had, all she had to live on.

mark 12:41-44

 

[seoulsearch]

MANY THANKS to everyone to sharing your thoughts and views here... I am re-reading some of them because I really want to digest and contemplate what you've said.

Please keep sharing! This has been on my mind all day and I appreciate the feedback here in the CC forums because it helps me to untangle and clarify my own thoughts.

Jim, I am very sorry for your accident, even if it did bring you closer to God. It's great that you're experiencing a deeper relationship with him, I'm just sorry for the tragedy of what brought it about.

Also, 20 extra bonus points to you for being so gracious in your answers, even if you and I have slightly different perspectives. THANK YOU for voicing what you feel WITHOUT being critical, judgmental, or condemning. Many kudos to you! (And blessings, too.)

 

[zeroturbulence]

All I know is that when money, science and doctors fail, all we have left is prayer.

And with prayer, anything is possible.

Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
(Mathew 19:26 NIV)

 

[CRC]

Steve Jobs had more money than God??!!!! Sickness is due to sin. Jesus is the cure for sin.(John 3:16) Stay the course!!! Science and research and medicine has limits! The expression " Almighty" is not rhetoric it is a fact!